Where is the Real Ajax/Flex Revolution Happening? 89
andzik writes "Even with all of the buzz around Rich Internet Applications these days, using toolsets like Ajax and Flex, most sites that utilize these technologies seem to be incremental improvements, not revolutionary interface changes. Where does the Slashdot community feel the best opportunities are to substantially create different/better user experiences using RIA tools? What will be the killer app? Are we just not seeing them because the best improvements are being made to web based applications and not in the public space?"
On a related note, Vertigo asks: "Not so long ago everybody believed that it was a good thing to have the freedom to modify your software to suit your needs or to mangle your data in any way. But now that users are flocking to non-modifiable, one-size-fits-all web 2.0 apps like Gmail or Flickr, are we moving away from our open source ideals? Those services do provide many important benefits, but in the process of their enthusiastic adoption did we not loose sight of the most important issues?"
it's the cloud! (Score:5, Interesting)
One key question in this Ask is
Just my opinion, but I think the killer app may be out there already but in stealth form. It's mostly a question of discovery and trust, and I think both lurk right around the corner.
Just my anecdotal internet experience, but I'm migrating virtually all of my work into cyberspace and allowing internet services to manage my data and backup. I'm not completely there yet, but I've been a heavy gmail user for over a year now, and have almost forgotten how to use local pop clients (though I still do for peace of mind pop/download the e-mails for local storage -- I haven't gotten that far with my trust). And the sheer convenience of being able to "do e-mail" from any browser has been more beneficial than I'd predicted. I now have complete threads at my disposal whereas I used to find myself re-constructing threads dispersed across multiple machines (typically laptops "on the road").
Lately I've tried some of the on-line word processors and calendars, and yes even some of the spreadsheets (some of the on-line spreadsheets are very responsive and offer functionality 99% of excel users typically tap). They're not all there and ready for prime time yet, but they're getting close.
The word processors for my general use are already good enough that I'm willing to do my word processing on line and let "them" do the management. I wouldn't even consider (not that I did anyway -- I'm an OpenOffice user) any of the pricey Microsoft Word Processing/Spreadsheet options. Again, the side benefit, almost unexpected, is the universal access to my work with NO effort, just a reasonably current browser.
So, from my perspective, that's the "killer app"...: the security; the ease-of-use; the convenience; the cost; the true benefits reaped from a net where your data is created and managed in the internet "cloud" (sorry about all of the "quotes").
(As for the one-size-fits-all, I think the eventual internet app winners will be those who provide the functionality with the flexibility. And if you shop around you'll find these on-line versions seem to providing reasonable (maybe not complete, but reasonable) flexibility)
Re:untapped market (Score:3, Interesting)
You lost me. (Score:2, Interesting)
What users are you talking about? Those who use OSS or your typical Internet user?
Bare in mind that the internet, aside from the technical sites, has become a huge business, ecommerce, entertainment, and anything else that non-IT people want to use it for. The latter folks have no idea what OSS is. They just want thier music, porn, buy books, etc... And they'll use whatever canned software that is offered - they don't want to mess with code.
I guess what I'm saying (and what others have said) is that the internet and computers are just a home appliance now. Anyting that makes computers more of an appliance will sell BIG!
We just started with Ajax on our Intranet... (Score:2, Interesting)
I've gotten our applications to basically mimic a natively compiled application. Our default 'skin' is a Win2k look and feel, but I've already been tinkering with whipping up CSS designs to give us OS X looks and also some KDE looks. The templating is what gives us the most power. Automatic code generation is our best friend.
Anyone seriously working with Ajax/JS on the large scale really does need to use some kind of code generation mechanism for all of your logic definitions. The technology to power most of the cool functionality you'll need changes too rapidly to allow yourself to have a codebase that can't adapt to the changes. With 6 tools currently in production using our new framework ( that we released two weeks ago ), if we wanted to change our primary JS library ( prototype ) for whatever reason, I would change the JS logic in our 'logic generation' template and all of our tools would be up-to-date automatically.
It's really changed the way we do things.
-E
Re:Web apps non-modifiable? (Score:4, Interesting)
Web apps non-modifiable?
The source code that generated that HTML might not be modifiable. The php scripts of a GPL'd website can be modified by someone else and not have to redistribute the source because they aren't distributing the modified source. they have it sitting on some server somewhere not copying itself. Most web-apps don't even release their source code.. see digg.com, del.icio.us, gmail, etc. That's why there are open source equivalents of these.. respectively: pligg [pligg.com], scuttle [scuttle.org], and the Hula Project [hula-project.org]
Brett Smith of the FSF just email me today to notify me of the Affero General Public License [affero.org], which requires the source code of the site to be available to anyone who receives content generated by the site.
Re:And the problem is? (Score:3, Interesting)
For a major web-based intranet app I helped support, dealing with the Back button was a *MAJOR* headache (J2EE session objects, etc). So having something that makes the Back button do nothing is bad? No, I think a lot of developers would say it's probably a good thing...