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Optical Microchip Breakthrough In Canada? 62

_J_ writes: "The Toronto Star has This Article on their Web site about method to "trap light." Since they call it a break-through to making an optical system it implies that light can be stored in a type of memory. I hope that this implies light-using logical gates." While this sounds like one more Holy Grail Found! announcement, the work that professors Ozin and John (mentioned in article) have done makes it sound like they're no slouches in the photonics or nanotech departments.
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Optical Microchip Breakthrough In Canada?

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  • > Also, since photons do not posses charge, they can not be interfered with by any kind of static electricity, magnetic fields, etc. Their signal stays truer.

    A photon is an oscillating series of electrical and magnetic feilds. Static electricity is an electric feild, which would affect both. Not quite as much as an electron or it's associated EM feild, but both nonetheless

  • This could be the first step towards a viable petrification technique.

  • hey, what's the name of that? Sounds interesting and I wouldn't mind reading it.

    thanks
  • by Dust Puppy ( 63916 ) on Saturday May 27, 2000 @03:50AM (#1043733) Homepage
    > Electrons don't travel at the speed of light,
    > they have mass and therefore they travel
    > slightly slower then the speed of light.

    But it isn't the speed of the electrons that counts, it's the speed of the electrical signals, which is much faster. It's similar to a wave in a tank of water, which travels faster than any particular little blob of water travels.

    The real advantages of optical technology are that they can be made much smaller because photons are bosons and electrons are fermions. Two identical bosons (such as photons) can be in the same place at the same time, but two identical fermions (such as electrons) cannot - this is the known as the Pauli exclusion principle.
  • Here is an aritcle with more details on the work being done:

    http://newsbytes.com/pubNews/00/149716. html [newsbytes.com]
  • Electrons DO NOT travel at the speed of light. However, an elecric current does. All that happens is that the elctrons pass the charge from one to the other. At the speed of light. Therefore, an optical processor wouldn't be faster that a normal one because of extra speed moving the data. (Although it would be pretty cool for other reasons...think no cooling problems)
  • Uhm, it's called Light of Other Days.

    Duh.
  • He does have a point there. There have been a number of "breakthroughs" in the past decade that have seen no practical application, or have been thusly disproven (read: Cold Fusion).

    There breakthrough still has not gone through any scientific testing (or it at least was not reported) to backup their claim.

    Most great scientific breakthroughs have actually been exposed to rigorous experimentation by thrid parties to prove or disprove their validity. This is the driving force behind the scientific method. The ability to recreate results, no proof of this is mentioned anywhere in the article.

    So while as tempting and wonderful as this sounds I am chalking it up to some sensationalistic science. But I do hope that when it comes up to experimental review of the process that it does stand up to it.

  • by SETY ( 46845 )
    No one get too horny, there is still lots of work to do. Yes it hot, but....
    Thats just my opionon after hearing a talk by the student mentioned in the article. That was a couple of months ago, so maybe somethings changed.....

  • When those scientific types want to impress me with the gravitational scariness of a Black Hole, they always stress that not even light can escape.

    How do we know that these so-called "Photonic" scientists aren't actually creating black holes with the intention of destroying the world? Has anyone checked to make sure that they aren't under alien mind-control?
  • I always had a soft spot for Sapphires, actually. Dilithium and Blessed Luckstones too.
  • We haven't slashdotted a precious stone yet.
    We may slashdot a precious stone, not opals, but most likely small saphirre posts used to bend light into sharp 90 degree angles. There was an article in Science about 2 years ago about some researchers developing these posts to bend light sharply. Fiber optic cables can't make sharp turns.

    The opals mentioned in the article won't be precious stones. They were growing pores in silicon, creating opals composed of silicon. Opals, by definition, are materials that transmit light and contain small pores of diameter approximately equal to the wavelength of one color light.

    For example, create saphirre with small 500 nm diameter pores. Now when you shine light through the saphirre, most of the frequencies of light transmit straight through the material, except for green light. Since the wavelength of green light (500 nm) is the same as the pore size, the pores scatter the green light. This gives the opal a glowing green look. For other colors, you make pores of size equal to the wavelength that you want the opal to be.

    In this article, they talk about making pores in silicon, so the opals would be made out of silicon...hardly a precious stone.

    --
  • by cjmilne ( 38848 ) on Saturday May 27, 2000 @09:15AM (#1043742)
    So the Star's article is completely devoid of details - it's a newspaper ! I'll add a few more details so people can get as much information about this topic as they want. First and foremost the latest issue of Nature [nature.com] has an article entitled "Photonics: Opal appeal" specifically about this breakthrough (subscription required). The catch phrase used is a "three-dimensional photonic bandgap material". The team that's accomplished this is a bit more international then indicated so far, consisting of a Spanish team [icmm.csic.es] making the opal template, Geoff Ozin's [toronto.edu] group filling the lattices & then dissolving the template, Henry VanDriel's [utoronto.ca] group performing the laser experiments, and Sajeev John's group [utoronto.ca] providing the theory framework.

    For those of you who just want pretty pictures, here [icmm.csic.es] are some images of the opals.

    Here's the ultimate resource [nec.com] for photonic bandgap materials.

    So that should give you more then enough to visit & read. Basically what these materials do is prevent propagation of light of a specific frequency in 3-dimensions. The 'bandgap' of the light can be controlled during the fabrication process allowing these things to block different frequencies. So you could imagine placing one of these materials into an optical fibre & selectively blocking one of the data streams but allowing all others to pass through unimpeded. The current breakthrough is twofold, first these aren't imaginary, they've been made & tested and they aren't decades removed from insertion into optical networks, they're months or years from it, second, this is the first example of a 3D PBG material, previous versions have generally been 2D. One of the neater experiments performed involved putting liquid crystals into the opal holes & then by putting an electric field across the liquid crystals, controlling the transmission through the crystal. A variable transmission photonic bandgap device. Light is fast, electrons are slow, an all optical network would be blazingly fast & these devices bring us a step closer to making that happen.

    CJM
  • Try Sajeev's homepage [utoronto.ca] and read about Photon Localization and Photon Band Gaps. He invented the theory that in certain disordered systems band gaps can exist for light, meaning that it does not propagate and is trapped/localized.
    Prof. John was on my thesis committee but my work was on other stuff.
  • I am one of the authors of the work that Geoff Ozins techniques [nature.com] are based on (Synthesis of Macroporous Minerals with Highly Ordered Three-Dimensional Arrays of Spheroidal Voids. Holland, B.T.; Blanford, C.F.; Stein, A. Science 1998, 281, 538-540 [Abstract [sciencemag.org]] and Synthesis of highly ordered, three-dimensional, macroporous structures of amorphous or crystalline inorganic oxides, phosphates, and hybrid composites. Holland, B.T. et al. Chem. Mater. 1999, 11, 795-805 [Abstract [acs.org]]).

    In addition to the technological limitations of photonic computing, we are a long way from fabricating these materials on a length scale that will work for even a rudimentary application, such as a waveguide. As the article states on the first page, their silica structure has "a typical single domain size of 100 um". The templates are brittle (they are essentially artificial opals) and the defect control is nearly impossible. Defects in the material grossly affect the behavior, that is, whether they behave like a photonic band gap material or a waveguide or whatever.

    I think another promising route that isnt mentioned here is covered in Fabrication of photonic crystals for the visible spectrum by holographic lithography Nature 2000, 404, 53-56 [ Abstract [nature.com]. Free registration required]. Rather than using an opal for a template, they have complete control over the shape of the void lattice by the holographic interference of several lasers in a polymer matrix which is replaced by a high refractive-index semiconductor.
  • This is a relatively simple thing to do. Take your ronco flashlight out in the front yard, point it up at the sky, and in morse code, tap out "hello world". Write down the time you did it. Your message is now "stored" in a physical medium. All you need to do to retreive it, is to calculate how far its traveled, and go stand in front of it to read it. Same principle applies if using a fiber loop instead of pointing it straight up. Yes, you will need to refresh the signal now and then. ok. means for doing so has been in steady use for 40 years. Steve Ruyle
  • There breakthrough still has not gone through any scientific testing (or it at least was not reported) to backup their claim.

    In defense of their work, the phenomena that they report have been adequately demonstrated in the paper and have been duplicated by other groups. Their work is subject to peer review and the reputation of the scientists is quite high. Therefore, I don't think that the validity but the short-term usefulness is in doubt here. However, as other posters have commented, I dont believe that this work is as much of a breakthrough as it was touted in the media.
  • After refining and a few lithography steps, an experimental silicon wafer is usually worth tens of thousands of dollars.

    And that's NOT including all the times the construction may have failed.

    So, when they do finally get a porous silicon wafer, it will indeed be a precious stone!
  • umm, yeah.... sorry, but why do you think the speed of light is called "c"? it is a constant (2.99792458*10^8 m/s). also, light the electrons in the form of electromagnetic waves travel at c (10 m/s is nowhere close). You are correct about the frequencies, but all electromagnetic waves travel at the same speed, regardless of speed. the medium only shifts the wave-form. Isn't it so much fun to probe the intricacies of quantum physics? Please learn some more physics, correcting posts like these really bores me...
  • You are right.

    In an effort to redeem myself, I found a really interesting and readable web page [pbs.org]. According to it...
    Precious stone:

    "A gemstone that, owing to its beauty, rarity, durability, and hardness, has the highest commercial value and traditionally has enjoyed the highest esteem since antiquity; specifically, diamond, ruby, sapphire, and emerald (and sometimes pearl, opal, topaz, and chrysoberyl)."
    So silicon might still not be precious because of the "has enjoyed the highest esteem since antiquity" bit. The article is a little vague about what exactly a gemstone is, but Silicon fits the descriptions of a Gemstone on the page. As our computers begin to operate on light in the future, it'd be good to know the value of stuff is inside 'em.

    I would love to have a ring with an exposed silicon chip instead of a gemstone. I know that current manufacturing processes would make it nearly impossible (hence, REALLY expensive), but having an entire ring from a single crystal of Silicon would be way COOL!! (just for geekiness purposes)

    --
  • What kind of heat would a chip like this produce? AFAIK that is the bottleneck holding back raw MHZ.
  • Good-natured ribbing, that's all. I'm in the USA, and our neighbors to the North get almost no credit for some of the Insanely Great things created or produced there. So, I was just teasing... and wondering how long after this thing becomes a production-line reality that everyone would just assume it was a product of the USA...
  • by KIngo ( 168933 ) on Saturday May 27, 2000 @03:54AM (#1043752)

    Material research has a strong component of wishful thinking and future projections. So many things don't work out because of a few insurmountable details. You need strong sources of motivation to pursue the dire road to success.

    In their reasoning and justification of their work, these guys live at least 10 years into the future all the time. The referenced article was probably written by someone who took all their statements at face value. It looks to me as if they still have a long way to go. That's not meant to diminish their merits - these scientist are certainly top notch researchers and their results are truly very impressive. I just don't think they have delivered an imminent disruptive technology.

    It's commonly accepted that the existence of a laboratory setup does not guarantee the technological and economical viability of any particular solution in the real world. I would start preparing for an imminent disruptive technology if a successful prototype system did exist. Yet, I don't have the feeling that there are even useful laboratory setups of the presented kinds of photonic devices. It rather looks like promising basic research.

    As for the all photonics claim, I think the notion should be scaled down a little to be less prone to misunderstanding. To many people, it sounds like all photons, no electrons. I don't believe there is such a thing within our technological reach. Photons are bosons and interact extremelyweakly. That's not a very good basis for a computing device. Fortunately, photons can be converted into excited states of electrons which are fermions, interact in many ways, and can be used to produce logic gates.

    That leaves us with a possible extension of the present use of photonic devices from lines of communication between nodes on a network to nano-lines of communication between old-fashioned electronic gates. And that's certainly not going to happen very soon. So, sorry my friends, no reason to get all excited.

  • by Nanaki_Seto ( 193111 ) on Saturday May 27, 2000 @03:59AM (#1043753)
    A quick physics lesson. Many people here seem to think it's the speed of the the particle that is important: it isn't it's the ability to change the frequency and amplitude in a given ammount of time. These changes are what carry data.

    electron drift: in average high conducting wire and given a good sized (120v) voltage, this speed is roughly 1m/10min. Not exactly something to transfer data with eh?

    EM pulse speed in a wire: 2.997 * 10^8 m/s > EMPS > 2.997 * 10^7 m/s. The frequency can be changed quite easily and quickly

    Photon speed: Depends on the medum, but 2.997*10^8 >= PS > 2.997 * 10^7 m/s (note this low is an estimate, it might go down to 10^6, but definetly not lower. The frequency of group of photons can change much easier and quicker than that of a EMPS caused by a series of electrons lollygagging in a wire.

    This oscillation is what gives them the data transfer speed. This isn't quantum physics, it is taught in the second course of intro physics (not conceptual, but actual) in colleg. Also known as the first E&M course
  • by Ian-K ( 154151 ) on Saturday May 27, 2000 @04:02AM (#1043754) Homepage
    Well, I'd guess that there will be a lot smaller heat dissipation. Correct me on this, but I assume that since they have no mass (only energy), they have 0 resistance.

    So, the term "cool computer" will probably take a whole new meaning I guess.

    However, I am no that excited on the subject. For one thing, I certainly do not posess such knowledge to question their theories.

    What worries me, though, is that I kind of expect to be quite a few years before we could get our hands on one of those thingies. Think of the economics.

    Suppose that in a month's time Mr. Ozin somes out and says "I've got a processor ready, architecture, ISA, layout, blueprints, the whole lot. Along with exquisite details on the manufacturing process!" (ok, it's not his job to design the processor, but let's say that somehow he got one ready from some processor designer at his uni)

    For one thing, all the major corps will jump on it immediately (IBM for example). But the manufacturing process will be a new one and it's gonna be bloody expensive to make them and not the most efficient.

    Another reason they're gonna be *really* expensive, even if the manufacturing process is just 5% more expensive than current practices: the corps so far have spent billions on investments in both product development and the respective manufacturing infrastructures. And they will want to milk that cow first on us and THEN, in a few years' time, introduce the optical chips as the high-prestige ones with equivalent prices... :-/

    No need to rush. Even a company rushing to beat the competition (take AMD for example, my favourite) will be held back a bit. No manufacturer is gonna make such big jumps.

    A bit off-topic, but think about it. I wouldn't expect this technology to become mainstream anytime soon (btw, does the word "military" ring a bell??? I'm sure they'll want it first)

    Trian
  • by physics-boy ( 24181 ) on Saturday May 27, 2000 @06:13AM (#1043755)
    I'm dissapointed with the lack of technical detail
    in the article. I'm still trying to figure out
    what is so novel about this. There has been an
    aweful lot of work done for years now on trapping and guiding light. The big issue is efficiency.
    The most promising technology I have seen for
    photonic computing is guiding along defects of a photonic band-gap in a photonic crystal. This is
    lossless guiding!!! Thats right, no photons can
    escape! This research is lead by Joannopoulos at MIT http://ab-initio.mit.edu/photons Pretty
    interesting possibilities since a photonic crystal
    restricts photons of a given wavelength range from
    propagating throught the material. A defect in
    the 'crystal' allows the forbidden light to be
    guided along the defect without leaking into the
    bulk. Light can even be guided around right
    angles without loss.

    So we have the pipes, now we need the light
    equivolent of transisters. But thats coming.

    Jeremy
  • A spokesman for the institute said John, Ozin and a student of Ozin, Emmanuel Chomski, hold the intellectual property rights to the development.

    ''Clearly, every major corporation in the world is looking at this,'' Ozin said. ''The question is, where do we go from here?''

    GPL.

  • in case you haven't seen it here [boisestate.edu] is an excellent explaination of how nearly unlimited bandwidth is a solution to many problems. I suspect similar things could be done on chip using optics rather than electrons (ie think 50,000 parallel processes)
  • There's a Sci - Fi story about a similar thing, glass with such complicated transitions that it takes years for light to pass from one side of a pane to the other. So people leave it near beaches, forests, mountains for years, then sell it to city dwellers. Good story.
  • by ckedge ( 192996 ) on Saturday May 27, 2000 @04:39AM (#1043759) Journal

    Oooh, I'm impressed. Slashdot already has links to the homepages of the two main subjects of the story of interest. Within which details of what is likely being talked of in the Toronto Star article can be found. I wish I had noticed that before I did all that searching.

    Anyways, you'll notice that the publications start back in the early 90's. The 'new' thing they've discovered together might be what is talked about here [utoronto.ca], and is more clearly described here [utoronto.ca] and here [photonicstechnology.com] (Sajeev John's page contained links to this stuff...).

    It's just a new way of making something that's been researched for the past 10 years [earthlink.net], photonic band [nec.com] gap materials [univ-montp2.fr].

    I haven't seen anything yet to tell us if this is such a better way of making this class of material that it counts as a 'revolution'. We have to find someone who knows a lot more about the current state of the art in creating photonic band gap materials and get this person to analyze this new method and it's results, to tell us if it's a significant advance, or what it's advantages are.

    AKA: More peer review please.

  • (/. won't accept empty body)
  • by Spankophile ( 78098 ) on Saturday May 27, 2000 @04:40AM (#1043761) Homepage
    I was always under the impression that the big advantage light would have over electricity would be in the size of the circuits.

    With current chip technology, people have estimated all sorts of physical limits to how small we can make chips because of interference and such. Two wires (or etched copper or whatever) have to be physically seperated - but you can have two beams of light cross at a point and it wouldn't affect either "wire." In fact, it would seem that you could have two photon channels in completely oposity directions, but sharing the same space, and it would still be alright.

    The advantage would come from being able to make insanely small chips, or chips the size we have now with a LOT more stuff on 'em.

    --Me
    I have a sig, and this statement is false.
  • by Anonymous Coward
    I actually worked at Ozin's lab for one year in the early 1990s.

    I haven't touched chemistry since I went into computer science (so I'm very rusty!), but I still remember the fundamentals of what he was trying to do.

    Basically it works this way. You've heard of quantum confinement from your physics class, right?

    If you choose your materials appropriately, you can quantum confine line in 1 dimension. These "quantum sheets" are often used to generate microlasers. You can also quantum confine light in 2 dimensions, you get "quantum wires" -- I can't remember if these had any use. Finally, if you quantum confine things in three dimensions, you get a "quantum dot". Essentially, a quantum dot has the same properties of an atom, but since it's made of designer materials, we can change their properties. This is what Ozin's work deals with.

    So what does a quantum dot buy you? Nothing by itself. You need an infrastructure. That's where the zeolite comes into play. The zeolite has a nice regular matrix structure with holes of identical size. If you fill the holes of this structure with the appropriate semiconductor you have a quantum dot matrix.

    Here's where it gets exciting. Due to quantum confinement, the quantum dot matrix absorbs light
    until it reaches the energy level of one of the discrete quantum frequencies of zeolite cavity. At that point, all the dots release photons of pricely the same frequency. If you continue to add higher frequency photons, the quantum dot matrix will absorb it until the next quantum frequency. We've turned continuous spectrum into discrete light in a very controlled way.

    So what are the uses? Optical switches, filters, and amplifiers are the obvious uses. It's also able to turn the continuous spectrum into a discrete spectrum. The material in the matrix is very flexible so you can adjust it to your needs. You can even dope some or all of the matrix elements or even create a matrix of mixed elements if you're looking for other properties.

    Anyway, you get the idea.
  • How will this affect my toilet?

    --------------------------------------------------

    I know what you're thinking, but this is NOT a troll, it is a legitamit question, and I don't think that people quite realize how much of a breakthrough mirochip-toilet technology can be.

    Just imagine the possibilities:

    You'll have to use your hands to flush ever again! The whole defecation process will be completely automated. All you'll have to do is sit and squeeze, your toilet will do the rest for you.

    Imagine a toilet that talks to you AS your feces drop into it. Well with recent AI and microchip advances (such as this one) you can!

    Toilet: Looks like your having some trouble there, bob, would you like some jet-streams?

    Bob: THANKS! TOILET! That would be great!!!

    Another implementation of smart-toilet technology would be a medical one. Your toilet would examen your stool for toxins and other abnormalities, and catch potentially diseases before it's too late!

    And lastly you'll never have to stop playing Quake when nature calls , EVER AGAIN! Because your smart-toilet will have a built in keyboard and monitor, you can finnally play quake AND defecate AT THE SAME TIME!!

    Isn't technology wonderful?



    ----------------------------------
  • I would imagine that a CPU based on travelling light would run much cooler than its electron moving cousins. That of course, would be a beneficial thing.
  • United Press International, April 7, 2000 p1008097u1944
    Optical microchips promise speedy communications.
    Full Text: COPYRIGHT 2000 United Press International

    WASHINGTON, April 6 (UPI)

    Scientists at the University of Washington and University of Southern California have developed an experimental optical microchip that can run up to 10 times faster than the speediest electronic devices today.

    They say the higher speed and capacity of the new devices could potentially revolutionize telecommunications, data processing, sensing and display technologies. An article on the device appears in the April 7 issue of Science.

    The devices, called polymeric electro-optic modulators or "opto-chips, " translate electrical signals such as those used by televisions, computers, telephones and radar, into optical or light signals at rates up to 100 billion bytes per second, or 100 gigabytes.

    Although the devices are microscopic in size, they can achieve information-processing speeds up to 10 times faster than current electronic devices, and have a greater bandwidth to transmit more information more quickly. The devices also require a fraction of a volt of electricity to operate, or less than one-sixth the electricity needed by today's electro-optic crystals.

    The new modulators bridge the current world of electronics and the coming world of much faster, optical devices by translating electrical signals from a computer or other electronic device into optical signals for speedier information transmission. At the receiving end of the transmission, another modulator will turn the optical signal into an electrical signal for use by a computer or other electronic device.

    "Optoelectronics will be the technology of the 21st century, just like electronics was the technology of the 20th century," Larry Dalton, a professor of chemistry at both the University of Washington and the University of Southern California, and co-author of the Science paper, told United Press International.

    Dalton added that he doesn't expect optical-only devices to be in wide use any time soon. But there will be a move to hybrid optical and electronic, or optoelectronic, devices that will prevail for a long time. The new modulator, he said, can be used with today's electronic devices, so it is not necessary to spend a lot of time reengineering them.

    Dalton said the real breakthrough was in creating a new material that doesn't impede the speed of light transmissions at the frequencies required for high-speed communications. Dalton and his colleagues changed the shape of organic molecules called chromophores to decrease electrical field noise. The chromophores were embedded into a polymer matrix to form the modulator.

    Other researchers have previously tried to exploit the speed chromophores allow, but they ran into problems controlling the interactions between the electrical fields of the chromophores that sapped their efficiency. Dalton said he changed the shape of the chromophores from elliptical to cylindrical so there was less interference.

    "This is the highest speed demonstrated today," said Ray Chen, a research scientist at the University of Texas at Austin's Microelectronics Research Center. Chen expects the technology to find its way into military, security and business applications within five years.

    He added, "In this millennium, from 2000 to 2020, the engine driving the economy will be optical technology. Dalton's work provides a good vehicle to approach fast optical speeds."
  • by bauble ( 158413 ) on Saturday May 27, 2000 @06:27AM (#1043766)

    I just wanted to address a couple of issues that seem to come up repeatedly (and sometimes incorrectly).

    Heat: It's not obvious that optical computers would not have the heating problems the electon-based ones have. Sure, it wouldn't be based on the same mechanism (resistance), but you still have the problem of absorption. The same process by which the sun heats up your car in the afternoon would be a problem here.

    Any time you shine light through something, some of it is transmitted, some is scattered and some is absorbed. The last two will cause signal losses and absorption will cause heating.

    Heating may not be the biggest hurdle, but it will still be an issue.

    Electron vs Photon speed: As a number of people have pointed out, wires to not carry signal at the speed of the electrons. A good (medium level) analogy to understand this is marbles in a plastic tube.

    Let's say I have 100ft of plastic tubing full of marbles. We decide that every second, I'm gonna push a marble in my end (1) or I'm not (0). That's a 1bps data rate. Now, the speed at which the data travels is 100ft devided by the time between when I push on a marble and when one falls out the other end. Obviously, that's gonna be pretty fast.

    The point is that the bit gets from one end of the tube very quickly even though any given marble will take a long time to get from one end to the other. Similarly, the electrons can carry information faster than they actually move.

    (Disclaimer: This analogy is correct only in the sense of this last paragraph. I am not claiming otherwise)

  • Yes electrons travel slower, but there is an
    additional problem: On a computer chip the
    transfer of information is slowed down further
    by the line capacitance and line resistance.
    The capacitance is proportional to the distance
    of the wires to each other and to the length of
    the wires. The resistance is inversely
    proportional to the width of the wire.

    The time constant is determined by R*C. So
    all three factors slow down signal propagation
    as you move to smaller geometries/higher density
    on the chip.

    As for transistors - they can switch pretty fast
    anyway - the delay is practically all routing.

    The trick of course is to achieve high
    integration - you need to be able to manufacture
    highly integrated optic.

    Interesting yes, but I believe it when I see it.
    (Fair enough considering that it's optic. :)

  • Eeegads ... No!

    A typical Compton wavelength for an electron is _much_ shorter than the comparable Compton wavelength of a photon.

    This is why electron microscopes are used for incredibly resolving incredibly fine features (and not optical microscopes). Resolution liminiting wave effects creep up at much higher resolutions when using an electron microscope.

    In order to get a photon whose wavelength is comparable to the typical Compton wavelengths of an electron, you are talking high energy photons (X-rays ).

    In an all optical microchip, the photons would be piped around the chip in dielectric waveguides (essentially optical fibers). The cross sectional sizes of the dielectric waveguide are to be on the order of the wavelength of photon being transported (esp. if you want/need single mode transmission).

    To pack these optical equivalents of wires with the same density as you would expect to find on a modern electron based processor, the wavelength of these photons would be well outside the optical spectrum.

    However, if you don't believe me, calculate the energy / frequency for a photon whose wavelength is much smaller than feature sizes on modern microchips. (Hint: modern etching processes use deep ultraviolet light).

    All optical microchips do have quite a few benefits. Compactness is not one of them.

    Kevin

    P.S. Before anyone objects on the grounds that you can just use higher energy photons, X-rays and deep ultraviolet light are very difficult to generate and control (esp. in a semiconductor medium). As such they are completely unsuitable for use in an optical microchip.
  • Your thinking too two dementionaly. You have to take into account speed and bandwidth (not the same thing). (God...I feel like I'm back in the days of explaining to a client why a P66 is faster then a 486DX2-66) ;)

    Think of it this way. I have two water pipes both with the exact same amount of pressure moving the water inside them (speed), but the difference is one pipe is and inch wide and one is a foot wide (bandwidth) now at the same pressure (speed) which do you think is going to move more volume of water (data)?

    Although in this case the difference is many orders of magnitude more pronounced so perhaps an example of a pipe one inch wide versus one mile wide would have been more in order. Remember, photons can not interact with anything exept themselves, so it is possable to run multiple data streams in the same physical space. A piece of fiber the thickness of a hair can have several hundred signals on different wavelengths all riding in the same physical space at the same time with zero crosstalk and zero signal loss.

    Thats not even touching on the fact that the usable freqencies withing a stream of light contain much more usable freqency then in an electronic medium where your range is constrained by EMI problems and signal loss over distance

    So now we have an increased usable frequency range and the ability to run multiple signals over the same stream with no EMI conserns. This results in optical technologies being several orders of magnitude faster then equivalent electronic technologies. To be honest I can't quite figure out why this thread is even taking place. I mean, come on, you all except without question that fiber provides a fatter, faster pipe then CAT5, so why is this such a strange new consept that requires debate


    --
  • I'm not directly involved in this field but some of my work is related to stuff that Ozin does, so I'm sort of a peer.
    The second link you provide does reveal why this is a breakthrough.
    Up until now, a lot of people have made photonic crystals, which allow precise control over the propagation of light, but this is the first report (to my knowledge) of a photonic crystal which can be modulated, as they say by applying an external field. This is key to fabricating dynamic structures (i.e., circuits) as opposed to static structures (i.e., simple block of semiconductor). Of course, there may be numerous difficulties to overcome before this technique can actually do some processing, and it may be superseded by some future discovery, but it is a very important advance in this field.
    The fact that they published in Physical Review Letters is also an indication of the importance, to a broad audience, of this discovery.

    gd
  • What is up with the moderation? The numerous factually incorrect things being moderated up is disturbing. I'll stick out my neck for being a troll but this is not insightful.

    Electrons do not travel anywhere close to the speed of light in a material medium.

    In electron positron colliders maybe, but not in a microchip.

    It has already been posted here that the drift velocity of an electron in a solid state medium is quite slow (really really slow).

    Also, the interaction of a photon with matter (and a photon traveling in a material medium) can be influenced by static electric fields (ferro-electric materials), magnetic fields (ferro-magnetic materials) and numerous other effects (non-linear photon iteractions).

    Kevin

  • There is no better way to end a prayer... in Jesus' name, Amen. I have no fear but fear for God. That is why there is still hope to return to a better country, united by good people. The moderators of slashdot.org are kinda strange. I have seen pornographic posts receive "score: 3 funny" when they should've been "score -1: offtopic" I get bad moderation simply because I have they keyword "NRA" in my userID. I have put together a theory that the people with moderation privileges on slashdot.org are not good people.
  • The speed of electricity is not governed by the speed of individual electrons. IIRC, they only drift a few millimeters a second. The important effect is more like those executive toys with the five steel balls on strings that swing back and forth. The force is transmitted through the balls, at a speed which is unrelated to the speed at which the balls themselves move.
    --
    Patrick Doyle
  • No, speed is the main advantage photonic switches can give. The structures will have to be atleast the same size as the wavelength of light, not shorter, to do useful, controllable processing of information represented in photon states or streams. Given that microlithography is already heading into 130 nanometer range, and is likely to go further into 90 nm pretty soon, the size of the switches (MOSFETs in case of silicon electronics) is going to be much smaller in silicon, whereas in photonic switches case, the size of the switch will have to be _atleast _several wavelengths of light, which would likely mean several hundred to several thousand nanometers for near-UV to far IR light (which seem to be the only parts of the lower-wavegelnth EM spectrum that we have technological control over as far as modulating and manipulating its flow.

    Compare the size of the original prototype of the various transistor structures with the size of a typical photonic switch setup today.

    Another comparison that should help is that between the crystal structure of silicon and the structure of a photonic bandgap crystal. The latter is several orders of magnitude bigger in terms of the unit cell size and is very much composed of a material with an ordinary crystalline structure, making use of gazillions of the crystal unit cells to create one photonic-crystal unit cell.

    Hence, size of photonic bandgap devices is not going to be much smaller UNLESS the researchers figure out a way to make them fully 3-D (silicon electronics is 2-D or "planar").

    rs

  • This is actually quite a revolution - try imagine CPUs running on the speed of light? gives a couple of ideas about the Future -Sts
  • This article was pretty sparse on technical details...all it said that there was some kind of silicon material coating microscopic bubbles in opals. So is the way that they store a piece of information by trapping the little photons in the bubbles, where they bounce around a few hundred trillion times, until they are allowed to go free?

    I feel sorry for those poor photons, trapped in their little opal bubble cages.

    On the other hand, if they ever built a server out of these...we could /. it. We haven't slashdotted a precious stone yet.

  • Well...

    Something went wrong.

  • Interesting to see another possible technique to exploit a natural physical structure for our processing needs. It'll be interesting to see if there are any other mineral deposits out there that will contribute to our computers in the future -- anyone have a favourite mineral they'd like to bet on?

    If this technique does become feasible for processing, does anyone have any idea what theoretical limits there might be to speed of processing? First generation devices are probably likely to be little better (if any) that existing silicon-based ones, but then silicon is quite mature tech, nowadays.
  • But everyone knows the best way to transmit data is through bio-neural gel packs, cus they organise data so well. And as for processing it? well, duh! no trapping photons, you simply put a big Itanium bugger inside a low-level subspace field... allowing the electrons to move faster. Some people, eh?
    --
  • Computers already work at the speed of light they are based on EM pulses the travel along with the elctrons. The EM Pulses move at the speed of light, and they are what cause the data transfer. They use change of frequency and amplitude to send signals. The data definetly isn't transfered with the electrons themselves. These things move at a rate most easily measured by minutes per meter. -Jim
  • by Glowing Fish ( 155236 ) on Saturday May 27, 2000 @02:07AM (#1043781) Homepage
    Electrons don't travel at the speed of light, they have mass and therefore they travel slightly slower then the speed of light. In practice, an electron is 10-30% as fast as an electron.

    Also, since photons do not posses charge, they can not be interfered with by any kind of static electricity, magnetic fields, etc. Their signal stays truer.

  • The article referenced "Growing" the silicon in little holes. This seems unusually cruel. Reminds me of the way the little baby cows are raised for veal.

    I propose :

    SETS . Slashdotters for the Ethical Treament of Silicon.

  • Photons travel at the speed of light. Electrons travel at the speed of light. The speed of a system should not depend on which of these are used. Is there something I am missing? Are there intricicies to the matter which make opticle better? Would one method produce less heat than the other? Or is it all hype because its just something new that people can have optimism about? If children can ask, then so can I: Why?

    Ibag
  • Well, actually, no, electrons do not travel at the speed of light, it depends on the material they are moving through. Thats why your brain, even though it uses electrons for data transfer, does not work at the speed of light. Same thing with silicon/copper/etc. But optical circuits, well, this is gonna be cool.
    This is gonna be really revelutionary.

    Patrick
  • Actually the most compelling reason is the HUGE bandwidth available in the optical frequncies. Although electrons have a large frequency range, light, because it doesn't interact with itself can transmit at all the frequencies available at once. Additionally you can do interesting things with the wave nature of light, interferrence, holography, which are not as easy to do with electrons because their wavelength is so much shorter.
  • How about a Free the crystals capaign.

    They have feelings too. It's not right to farm them. We must set them free,

    Actually it does bring new meaning to the whole pet rock thing of the mid 70's.

  • Photons travel at the speed of light.
    Yeah

    Electrons travel at the speed of light.

    No

    The speed of a system should not depend on which of these are used.Is there something I am missing?

    Yeah

    Are there intricicies to the matter which make opticle better?

    Yeah

    Would one method produce less heat than the other?

    Yeah

    Or is it all hype because its just something new that people can have optimism about?

    No

    If children can ask, then so can I:

    Hmmm, i guess that one makes as much sense as the rest of your post.

    --
  • I'm all for a few keg parties to rais funds

  • from what I remember in Physics, in a standard, high conducting wire, electrons travel, a meter every ten minuts on average (it's the drift velocity that matters) speed of an individual electrono is irellevant
  • In an optical device, which is made up of some form of material, photons do not travel at the speed of light. e.g in glass photons travel at ~2/3 of the speed of light in vacuum.

    In an electronic device, electrons travel at ~10 m/s, nowhere near the speed of light. Signals travel in an electronic device as electromagnetic waves, which are the same as light.

    The actual advantage of optical devices is that the wavelength of the signal carriers is smaller, so faster switching is possible, if you can work out how to do it, and there's no problem with interference from external fields.
  • ahhhh, finally someone who knows how this stuff works. Let's give these people a physics lecture (I remember having to explain this to my dad, who thought it was the SPEED of the electrons that made these things so fast :) -Jim

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