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Journal munger1101-8's Journal: Caught on camera 36

Journal by munger1101-8
Since so few of my students in section 18 actually managed to make it to class today, I thought I'd reward them by letting them pick the class journal topic for this week. The topic: cameras for speeding tickets. In the future, you may get your speeding ticket in the mail--no police officer would need to pull you over. Instead, patrol cars would be equipped with cameras that could snap a photo of your license plate, and the ticket would simply appear in your mailbox a few days later. See the Charlotte Observer story for details.

This, of course, leads to many more questions. Would/should such a violation go on your record? Could/should you get points for tickets-by-mail? Should/would it affect your insurance bill? What about the future? Does this pave the way for privacy-invading cameras on every street corner? Could you some day be fined for littering, jay-walking, or even public drunkenness, simply because it was caught on camera?

Please post at least two comments on this topic by Friday, February 21. At least one of your comments should be a response to someone else's comment.

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Caught on camera More

Caught on camera

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  • You mentioned having privacy in public streets. That is an interesting point of view. Can you expect things you do in a public place to be private? Using speed traps and camera on public roads only stops people from breaking the law, if you follow your own laws there is no problem. If you break those laws you should be fined for the crime. If you have a problem with getting caught for crimes on a more regular basis, you need to ask yourself if you agree with the law in the first place. The laws in America, including speed limits, are there because the people living in America want them.
    • I totally agree with what you have said. If you are following the law in the first place you shouldn't have anything to worry about. And I think you make a good point, laws are not just put here mysteriously, the "people" put them there. And most laws, believe it or not, are there for our own good.
    • I agree mostly with what you are saying, but your punishment seems that of a socialist society. Sounds like you have been brought up by Karl Marx... There always needs to be inefficiency in a system even if it's the law inforcement system. This country you live in today strives on inefficiency. Just look at the three branches of government. We have the police force that enforces the law, but we have the judicial branch to keep the police force in check, or at least on the fair side. You should at all times be given the opportunity to explain yourself, even if you are guilty... [If you have a question about the inefficiency of the US government email me!]
  • I do not agree with the idea that police should use cameras to ticket speeders. I think that allows for more errors and false accusations. I also see how this could interfere with driving...what ever happened to ten and two....if a policeman is having to aim a camara so that he or she gets the speeding car, they can't be fully paying attention to the road. I also have seen many cases where the photo's for stop lights have been unclear and not even helped to solve the problem. I think they should fix the srop light cameras before going to another problem. I also think that being able to talk to the officer is something that some people need to do in some cases. For example what if a woman was pregnant and was being rushed to the hospital, if a police officer was able to stop the car, they would possibly not get a ticket and even be of assistance, if not they would jsut get a ticket and have to go through difficulties to get it dropped. I think that they should stick with ticketing on the road. It may be easier for the cop but i think that it would be better for saftey and keeping innocent people from getting uneeded tickets. Also the tickets should not go on record with the license or insurance until proven guilty of speeding.
    • I agree with your statement saying that what if someone had a good reason to speed. I guess that falls under the disadvantages of having these cameras, but I believe that this is just a minor disadvantages and the advantages ( as of right now ) out weighs the disadvantages. Even though their are a few disadvantages of this I think that it is still a good idea to have them.
    • I agree with what you are saying about this allowing for more false accusations and more errors. If the police aren't actually catching the person themselves and giving them the ticket then everyone is going to try to get out of the ticket. The police might even catch someone that wasn't speeding on accident or get someone that was driving someone else's car and then the person whos car it is will have to take the blame for them. If the car belongs to a couple and they only have one car, how are the police going to know which one is driving? The answer is, they probably won't. Some people who get the ticket in the mail are probably just going to try to get out of it or they are just going to say that they didn't get it and just not ever pay. I just think that his is rediculous and it is going to cause more and more problems.
    • I do not agree with this idea, since it might lead to too many errors, getting points for tickets-by-mail will not be faire either since the camera will not take picture of who is driving the car, yet it will take the picture of the car number. So why would you get points for something you did not do, and your friend or even one of your family did! about the insurance, I do not think that kind of tickets will affect your insurance at all, because the insurance gets higher when you get in an accident because they will have to pay you for the car.
  • I think we might need cameras in the larger cities to police the illegal activities that commence. I do think if we allow this to keep going in the way it's going, then someday, we might have a problem with the government trying to put cameras everywhere.... even private areas. This is the only thing I see wrong with it, is that it opens a whole new door for the government. There are a lot of disadvantages and advantages to having the cameras everywhere instead of actual police officers, it goes both ways, it just depends on what the average American is willing to give up.
    • Bond brings up a good point about putting cameras in private areas. That is the only that the government may take advantage of. If they think they can put them wherever then they may end up in dressing rooms or bathrooms out in public. That would be a violation of the civil rights. And does this invade our civil rights when they are put out in public? I believe that in some sense they do intrude upon our right even though they are in public.
    • I totally agree! I also see both the postive and the negative side of this issue, but I also believe it hurts our personal rights to freeedom if we allow cameras to be everwhere.
  • I feel that lawbreakers should be punished using whatever means necessary to catch them. However, in this case I feel it would be completley wrong. By receiving your ticket in the mail, you have no way of defending yourself. By the time you receive the ticket, you wont even remember what you were doing that day. This would completly take the judicial system out of traffic offenses, and this is sometimes the only thing keeping law enforcement in check. What is to stop a police officer from taking a picture of someones car who he doesnt like, then slapping them with an enourmous ticket?
    • I think you made a good point. Police officers may save lives and catch bad guys, but they too can be bias towards certain people and certain cars. I think that the cameras don't show enough evidence of the crime. And if government start using camera's for speeding then they might start using camera's for everything else. This almost seems like the book 1984. Invasion of privacy in violation of the American rights.
    • Such mistrust for your law system, what is there to stop that cop from giving a ticket for littering to someone he does not like, or any other crime? You also have the wrong idea of how this system is set up, the cop is not sitting in his car with a radar gun and Kodak disposable camera, they are fully automated systems with the cop just monitoring it to make sure it is running properly and is not tampered with.
    • I agree with what this guy is saying. I think tickets-by-mail is a really bad idea. While it might save time for the driver and make the cop's job easier, in the end it's simply a disadvantage to citizens.
  • It is always something new that the city wants to enact. I do not think they should spend their time and our money worrying about speeding cameras. Wouldn't you think they would be more concerned with other crimes that were going on? Last month in Huntersville, where I live, 4 cars were stolen from the Park and Ride...a half a mile from the police station. Did they stop that crime? No! I'm sure glad that these new cameras we might get will stop the speeders though!Speeding can be a serious crime if you get into an accident, but come on, even police officers can be caught going over the speed limit sometimes! Exactly how fast over the speed limit are you going to have to be driving to be issued a ticket?? Plus it will be IN THE MAIL for cryin out loud. I have heard a little bit about the city officials wanting to implement this, but it wasn't until I read the article that I completely disagreed with it. I really think this is a ridculous idea. If this is passed, we can think of police officers as hall monitors. The only job they will have is to sit at a light monitor us drivers, send our information, then we will recieve a ticket via the mail. How efficient!!!
    • I totally agree with you. In a way these camaras are making police less invovled in their job and exactly like hall monitors. Not that they don't do other things to protect us but in many cases i see police officers causally speeding too. I do believe that speeding causes accidents and is serious but i do think that there are other more serious crimes that could be fixed before speeding.
  • I do agree with the idea of putting up cameras to catch speeders. I am sure that you have seen a car fly past you and said, "Where are the police when you need them?" This is the solution. The police could spend time doing other things than patrolling the traffic to make our cities safer. As far as the privacy issue goes, if it is private then you don't need to do it in public. Maybe these cameras would be able to catch other crimes as well, such as robberies and car-jackings, and not only speeders.
    • I have when in that situation, where you think to yourself, "Where are the police when you need them?" It was a good point to say that police could spend time doing more important things. Catching bigger criminals than just speeders. I completely agree with the comment on you shouldn't do private things in public. I don't think some people comprehend the difference between private and public. With a few tickets in their hand, maybe some people would realize that then need to stop what they are doing!
    • well, it might be a solution for those that drive too fast and the police couldn't catch! but you did not think of something else! would this speeding ticket stope a crazy drunk driver? the answer is no! and this drunk driver could kill someone befor he gets this ticket at home! yet there should be police in the street to catch them and the camera to proove. because the police will stope this drunk driver befor he/she get in an accident and kill someone, but the camera won't.
  • I think that it is a good idea to have these cameras because it is very beneficial to the police officers. As a matter of fact, me and an friend of mine were just talking about this subject. By having these cameras on the streets it gives the cops time to focus on other crimes that are more serious such as drug dealing and murders. I look at it as being very time consuming for them and it may just reduce the number of car accidents out there that is due to speeding.
    • I could agrre with this statement. But like some of the others students pointed out this would give the government some leave way to just start doing things that we as a people would not agrre with. Don't you think that the government would take advantage of this situation?
  • I have mixed feelings about getting tickets through the mail. It's a good idea because getting pulled over is a nuisance. The driver could be rushing to work or speeding because of some emergency. On the other hand, getting pulled over is embarassing and nerve-racking, giving drivers an incentive not to speed so they won't have to go through that. It's also a bad idea because the ticket could get lost in the mail or the driver may not remember the incident.
  • I have already had my experience with these "camera tickets." Because of the Safelight Program, I have received two tickets in the mail. I see the positive and negative side of this issue. Ofcourse I did not enjoy getting these tickets, I was violating the law, whether a police man was there to catch me or not.I do see how these tickets can be inaccurate. I also see how this would give officers more time to focus on bigger problems. I am just scared this will lead to a much bigger problem than we realize... how will our country pride itself on personal liberty if we have cameras everywhere, and does that infringe on our personal rights?
    • I agree with what you had to say. I personally haven't gotten a ticket because of the Safelight Program, but I have seen them at intersections. In some cases, I think that they can be more harmful then they are helpful. I have noticed that then a person starts through one of these lights, and it turns yellow, they speed up, not really paying attention to what's going on in front of them. I personally have almost been rear ended because of this.
      • "I have noticed that then a person starts through one of these lights, and it turns yellow, they speed up, not really paying attention to what's going on in front of them. I personally have almost been rear ended because of this." Wouldn't that be caused more by the driver and not by the cameras? I commute to UNCC every day up and down 85 and 27 and I see alot of this going on. There are many people in my humble oppinion that need their driver's licences taken away because of wreckless, careless, or drunk driving and the sad part is it always happens when the cop is never around or sometimes the wreckless driving ends up getting an innocent person hurt. And in reply to first post above the one I replied to, I agree with the inaccuracy that would inevitably come with the cameras, but I dont see how cameras at a few interections or areas of road around town would invade or infringe upon a person's rights. The road is a public place, if you have something that private you dont want videotaped at an intersection its probably best left or done at home.
  • It is the police's job to catch and pull over speeders, not the camera's. But in certain places maybe using camera's would be alright. For example, police could be allowed to use camera's in areas of Charlotte where there are a lot of fatal accidents caused by speeding. However, I do not think there should be camera's anywhere and everywhere. That would seem to invade people's privacy and most people would be against the idea. Then there is always the problem of not getting to explain your reasons for speeding if it is just caught on video camera. Many times people have sensible reasons for speeding and officers can be very understanding if the reason seems valid. My only reasons to support this idea is if using camera's in certain fatal crash areas proves to save lives, then maybe Charlotte should consider using it in more places.
    • I certainly agree with you on not having cameras to catch speeders. Some people can have a reason to be going a bit fast too, so by having communication with an officer you can justify yourself. Still, how would the placement of cameras in certain intersections help save lives? The cameras could only watch the cars on the roads. If cameras were to be put places, I think they should be installed by major crimes areas, besides just speeding, maybe even at an intersection by shops that were vandalized often. Even those kinds of cameras could be taken as "invading privacy" though.
  • In one way I think this is a great idea. We definetly need a way to make people slow down. Police would be able to catch 3 or 4 cars in a matter of minutes, rather than just one. It always sucks when you know there were several other people driviing much faster than you, but you are the one that gets caught. Just your luck. On ther other hand I'm known to speed, I'm very impatiant. However, I'm not a crazy driver. I tend to find those that drive the speed limit are always making stupid mistakes like changing lanes without looking. I wish they could give tickets to people that just don't know how to drive! I'm lucky just because I pay attention to these stupid people. I may drive fast but, I'm a good driver. All we need to do is ticket the Bad drivers, not just the speeding drivers.
  • I think that this is going to cause more problems in the long run. This is supposed to keep everyone from not speeding but instead it is going to cause many people to become very angry. People will argue that this is affecting our privacy. Cameras catching only your speed could lead to the government putting more cameras everywhere. If you do get a ticket in the mail saying that you were speeding I think that you should only have to pay it. I don't think that it should effect your insurance or the number of points on your license. I think that this is unfair to begin with anyways and they don't need to make it too strict if they are going to do it. It is kindove like the ticket that you get when you run a red light and a camera sees you. You get the ticket in the mail and all you have to do is pay for it. Since the police aren't acutally catching you speeding, then I don't think that they should give you a court date and make your insurance go up and things like that. This is going to just cause more trouble and work for all of these people. Most people will take it to court to try to get it dropped and they will end up getting it dropped because that is what happens with the seat belt tickets.
  • I think that putting cameras up to catch people speeding is wrong. That's one of the reasons why we have police. I know that if there were speed cameras, the police would have more time for other things though. I just think that it's going against our rights as Americans. I think that there is just too much gray areas were the camera could be wrong. Like someone else said, what about the pregnant lady? What about driving too slow like for a funeral? Will you get a ticket for this too? I knew a girl in high school whose family got a ticket sent to them in the mail, because her family went through a red light at one of those Safelight cameras. There is just too much confusion about this subject, and I think it would be best if we didn't get speed cameras.
  • I think that this whole situation can lead to a disaster. I think that this is an invasion of privacy. What ever happened to innocent until proven guilty? LOL. This is not a good thing at all. This whole scenerio is rather scary to me because it used to be that you would not speed unless you saw a cops car but now I would even be cscared to speed anywhere.
  • I think cameras might be a good idea. Although it makes my chances of getting a ticket a lot greater, i still think they should try it. If there is any chance of it saving lives they should at least see how well it works. And if it happens not to work out then they can always stop using them. I don't see why people would have a problem with it, I mean if you are driving like you are supposed to then you shouldn't have anything to worry about.
    • yeah i totally agree with you. people should be driving like they are suppose to. This would help that issue. The chance of getting a ticket would be more of a chance that now but it might would help in the long run. this system could help identify the guilty and the innocent in a reck and such like that.
  • I understand the speeding problem is present and the idea of cameras taking pictures of speeders is good on paper, but, given our economical situation, bad in practice. I actually agree the whole system is a good start. I am not saying it will be perfect, but it will be perfected later on, unless the world ends first. The one aspect of this camera deal is, that most of our police force at this moment is patroling the streets. If cameras are in place that police force will be cut in half if not more. Our economy is not exactly booming at the moment, pissing off alot of patriotic citizens, who get laid off cause a machine took over their job position, will not help the situation one bit. Maybe this system can be installed right now for several reason: to test if it works, to get it tuned to work properly in our city, just to give the ctizens some time to get used to the system, or the last and best reason is to give the people, like me, time to find ways around the system. Thats usually the best option...
  • I really do not see a problem with cameras taking pictures of things that happen on the roads, intersections, or parkinglots. As long as your obeying the laws when driving on the roads there shouldn't be a problem. Cameras could be a good thing since they would catch alot of crimes on tape, even the ones they didn't entend like carjackings, muggings, etc... video tape is strong evidence in court and catching someone in the act would also help speed up the trial process. The only thing that I see causing a problem would be a missprint somewhere when mailing the ticket, somehow someone would get another person's ticket, or if someone stole your licence plate/or car and then you would end up getting the tickets even though it wasnn't your fault.
  • I think they are a good thing to have as long as they are being used effectively and responsibly. If you are speeding then it's only right that you get a speeding ticket or running a red light. Although it does take away from the policemen's jobs. If they do this police officers could be out of a job. It takes away from contact with the public for them as well. It's good in that people will learn to obey the law even when the police aren't around but it's bad in a way because it takes away contact and jobs.

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