Comment Re:I can never figure out what mine should be (Score 1) 909
Geez, you're a tense bloke. Doesn't look like all those vacations are doing you any good.
Yes, why else would I post it? You're dodging the point. A nice vague attack on my argument, that does nothing to refute it.
You analogy was vague. The proper analogy would consider both of us smoking and getting paid for that, with me smoking more, and you arguing that more of my smoke is not good for you and I should stop.
No, actually it's very clear that you believe that anyone unwilling to put ridiculous hours into their job and give up their holidays and other interests doesn't deserve that job. That's pure rubbish.
Sure, it would be nice if we'd all be hired regardless of our personal predispositions and will to work. But it doesn't work that way, and if it does, it's not very efficient. One thing about this, though, and I can't stress this enough, and you seem to ignore this - I never said it's alright to make people stay long hours and not give them vacation if they don't want too. That would be insane. As I said, there are some people that do preffer to work this way. They're happy and I'm happy. As a manager, I much rather preffer to have a staff of people like that, then average workers. If it would be someone like you versus a person like that, then unless your knowledge and experience is much highier than his, he would get the job.
Oh yes I "demand" they leave the job market. Thanks for misrepresenting me so well. I demand they stop pulling down the minimum standards. I don't mind other people work in IT. I don't mind competition. But how about not dragging standards down so there's room for other things in life besides work?
I'm sorry i misunderstood. You correlate work time with dragging standards down. There are people out there, who work long hours, which results in a dropped work efficiency. However, some people work efficiently non stop. Heck, I start being efficient after 11 hours sometimes. These people are worthy emplpyees. Hiring people who botch jobs because they're too tired, but are willing to work anyway for minimum wage? I wouldn't be interested.
And by your logic if enough people can be found willing to work for less money you too are out of a job my friend. It's called outsourcing. Or have you been asleep for the last few years? The problem with your simplistic "all hail the free market" approach is that worker's rights and standard of living declines with time, as there is always someone less well off than you willing to work for less just so they can eat!
You want to ban the IT folks in India from working, or what? Government market regualtions, that sort of thing? It's a natural process. It sucks, but it's there.
So your argument is that never taking a vacation is healthy and balanced. What kind of drugs are you on exactly?
So your argument is that never taking a vacation is healthy and balanced. What kind of drugs are you on exactly? I never said that. Take a breath, relax, and stop being an insulting prick. I said that in order to stay healthy, you need to put in some time excersizing. It works for me and many people I know. I don't vacation and don't need to. I relax after work by running and it balances the effectes of long work hours.
Who's telling who to get out of the job market now you hypocrite! I have a good job, that I enjoy. I work on design, development and support including after hours and 24 hour support at a major financial institute that is essential to the economy. I have a 35 hour week. I get one rostered day off a month. I get 4 week paid vacation. My salary isn't going to make me rich but it's not anything I'd complain about either. I also have hobbies and a social life. I'm into astronomy, fishing, chess, r/c planes if I get a chance. I take my girlfriend to see her parents 600km away occassionally, and socialise. I own and look after pets. I take time off to go to new places and see new things, or to be with family and friends on special occassions. Basically I have a life. Never having a vacation would mean I couldn't do these things. It's not a weakness to want to enjoy life beyond your job. It's not a weakness to want and crave vacations. What you're saying is that if you're not willing to work ridiculous hours you shouldn't be in IT. You're only worthy of a good job if you're willing to give up everything else that takes more than a weekend.
Thanks for all the details. Maybe we can be pen pals. Then again, maybe not. All I can say is you can work long hours and have multiple hobbies. Again, not all people are theseme. Some people need less sleep time and some do not. Some need to vacations, other do not. Some are sought after, some are not. As far as your "profile" of me goes, all I can say is taht it's kinda cute. You seem to have a basic problem understanding that not everyone is like you and doesn't need or want to be. Deal with it.
Yes, why else would I post it? You're dodging the point. A nice vague attack on my argument, that does nothing to refute it.
You analogy was vague. The proper analogy would consider both of us smoking and getting paid for that, with me smoking more, and you arguing that more of my smoke is not good for you and I should stop.
No, actually it's very clear that you believe that anyone unwilling to put ridiculous hours into their job and give up their holidays and other interests doesn't deserve that job. That's pure rubbish.
Sure, it would be nice if we'd all be hired regardless of our personal predispositions and will to work. But it doesn't work that way, and if it does, it's not very efficient. One thing about this, though, and I can't stress this enough, and you seem to ignore this - I never said it's alright to make people stay long hours and not give them vacation if they don't want too. That would be insane. As I said, there are some people that do preffer to work this way. They're happy and I'm happy. As a manager, I much rather preffer to have a staff of people like that, then average workers. If it would be someone like you versus a person like that, then unless your knowledge and experience is much highier than his, he would get the job.
Oh yes I "demand" they leave the job market. Thanks for misrepresenting me so well. I demand they stop pulling down the minimum standards. I don't mind other people work in IT. I don't mind competition. But how about not dragging standards down so there's room for other things in life besides work?
I'm sorry i misunderstood. You correlate work time with dragging standards down. There are people out there, who work long hours, which results in a dropped work efficiency. However, some people work efficiently non stop. Heck, I start being efficient after 11 hours sometimes. These people are worthy emplpyees. Hiring people who botch jobs because they're too tired, but are willing to work anyway for minimum wage? I wouldn't be interested.
And by your logic if enough people can be found willing to work for less money you too are out of a job my friend. It's called outsourcing. Or have you been asleep for the last few years? The problem with your simplistic "all hail the free market" approach is that worker's rights and standard of living declines with time, as there is always someone less well off than you willing to work for less just so they can eat!
You want to ban the IT folks in India from working, or what? Government market regualtions, that sort of thing? It's a natural process. It sucks, but it's there.
So your argument is that never taking a vacation is healthy and balanced. What kind of drugs are you on exactly?
So your argument is that never taking a vacation is healthy and balanced. What kind of drugs are you on exactly? I never said that. Take a breath, relax, and stop being an insulting prick. I said that in order to stay healthy, you need to put in some time excersizing. It works for me and many people I know. I don't vacation and don't need to. I relax after work by running and it balances the effectes of long work hours.
Who's telling who to get out of the job market now you hypocrite! I have a good job, that I enjoy. I work on design, development and support including after hours and 24 hour support at a major financial institute that is essential to the economy. I have a 35 hour week. I get one rostered day off a month. I get 4 week paid vacation. My salary isn't going to make me rich but it's not anything I'd complain about either. I also have hobbies and a social life. I'm into astronomy, fishing, chess, r/c planes if I get a chance. I take my girlfriend to see her parents 600km away occassionally, and socialise. I own and look after pets. I take time off to go to new places and see new things, or to be with family and friends on special occassions. Basically I have a life. Never having a vacation would mean I couldn't do these things. It's not a weakness to want to enjoy life beyond your job. It's not a weakness to want and crave vacations. What you're saying is that if you're not willing to work ridiculous hours you shouldn't be in IT. You're only worthy of a good job if you're willing to give up everything else that takes more than a weekend.
Thanks for all the details. Maybe we can be pen pals. Then again, maybe not. All I can say is you can work long hours and have multiple hobbies. Again, not all people are theseme. Some people need less sleep time and some do not. Some need to vacations, other do not. Some are sought after, some are not. As far as your "profile" of me goes, all I can say is taht it's kinda cute. You seem to have a basic problem understanding that not everyone is like you and doesn't need or want to be. Deal with it.
