You said:
Nationalisation without compensation is just a nice way of saying theft by the government. It makes no sense, since the stockholders did nothing wrong and the German government did nothing to deserve free shares in a company. I also highly doubt that German law allows for such a thing. Also, its "wagen", nog "wagon". They don't make railway equipment.
My reply:
Sorry about the misspelling. If you want to engage in a pedantry dick size war, be prepared to be crushed. (E.g., you're obviously not American. In American English, railway equipment is a "car", not "wagon". A "wagon" is a children's toy, a landscaping, farming, and construction tool, or a police van.)
Making the victim of a crime whole is not theft, it's a remedy to theft. Since the victim here is the public at large (not just the buyers of the cars), in order to make the victim whole, the German government stands in their stead. The shareholders are owners of a criminal organization, and thus responsible for the actions of that organization.
You said:
Yes, let's punish people for crimes committed by others, of which they were not even aware until last week. Very fair and reasonable... I would propose to only prosecute those who were actually involved instead of people who are already punished heavily for something in which they had no part.
My reply:
These people SHOULD have known. It was their JOB. If they didn't know, it is because they intentionally did not, which is as culpaple as the action in a corporate governance situation.
You said:
Retrofitting at VW's cost actually makes sense and I would support that. A buyback would be disproportionate, however.
My reply:
Let me clarify by "buyback" it would be at the depreciated value of the car, not the original price. The owners should be made whole (which may in some circumanstances require slightly more than depreciated value, but still not original value), but not more than whole. The goal is to get the polluters off the street.
You said:
[In response to my holding the German government responsible]
But only in the same way the Peruvian government and your neighbour's dog did. They were not aware of it and they have done nothing to support it.
My reply:
By allowing the corporation to exist as a legal entity they sanction its adherence to certain levels of performance, including that of not being a criminal organization. By failing in this duty, the German government also becomes culpable.
You said:
This is even more absurd. Neither the German government, nor German people who have saved up some money have had anything to do with this.
My reply:
The government IS the people, remember civics 101? Oh wait, that's right, you're not American, so this may not be automatic for you. But it is the underlying myth for all modern representative democracies, which you likely are a citizen of, since your level of English proficiency would seem to be native; so you should be aware of this, especially if you are expounding upon the nature of culpability, macroeconomics, and so on.
That it should be the wealthy that pay is because a) they're the ones that have money; b) there is a strong argument to be made that they also are transitively culpable; c) it probably wouldn't come to this; and d) from a utilitarian standpoint it minimizes the harm caused, as the utility of a Euro to the wealthy is considerably lower than the utility of a Euro to the poor.
You said:
f anything, it would make more sense for the American government to pay, since it is their idiotic emission standards that are extremely strict with regards to a modest pollutant while being very lax in other, worse pollutants just because that happened to disadvantage foreign manufacturers are what led to all this in the first place
My reply:
Wrong again. Those are the rules of the marketplace, whether they are reasonable or not. If you want to play in a marketplace, you observe its rules. If you don't want to play by those rules, you don't enter the market.
Your assertions about the utility and purpose of the regulations are exactly that: assertions. Back them up, and you might have an argument. In fact, nitrogenous emissions from diesel engines is a major problem. They are the primary component of smog; you know, that brown stuff that surrounds major cities and highways? And causes many respiratory problems, even for healthy adults? What are the other pollutants that are being ignored? Provide some evidence.
In summary: You obviously missed the very first line of my post, which said IMHO. You're allowed to have an HO also, but you're not allowed to use your HO as an argument against mine. If you feel my HO is wrong, you need to provide evidence that it is wrong, not merely assertions of your HO. If you simply want to assert your own HO, be my guest, but in your own post, not mine, Anonymous Coward.