I think this may be the biggest surprise of my life. I tend to avoid internet message boards, and I don't interact with people as much on the internet as face-to-face. I posted what I thought was an innocent article:
I recommend two books here:
The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order, by Samuel Huntington [amazon.com]
The Great Human Diasporas: The History of Diversity and Evolution, by Luigi Cavalli-Sforza et al [amazon.com]
Once humans evolved from apes, they went through several stages to create modern humans.
After that, modern humans underwent more aggressive development. This differentiated population groups.
Much like different programming languages are optimized for different tasks, but you can create just about anything in just about any language, human populations are different based on the optimizations that came about through their branch divergence.
This creates ethnicities, nationalities, and clines as mapped by Cavalli-Sforza.
Huntington points out that most of our modern wars have been caused by the nation-state, or an "imperial" grouping by politics that crosses these optimization lines, and suggests that as the superpower age winds down, people will identify with their optimization more than abstract and often illusory political concepts.
This is especially useful in understanding the difference between Georgia, Ossetia and Russia. For those who live in nation-states of an imperial nature, like the United States, Canada, Russia or UK, it's hard to grasp this, but not every country views itself as composed of generic people.
They view themselves as an organic nation, a notion which we may quaintly call "tribalism" yet seems to unite people with values more solidly than financial or political motivations.
The future will be determined by the struggle for these organic nations to define themselves.
All IMHO.
Then, out of nowhere:
I never thought the race-war bozos would make it onto /. It's the usual propoganda: Name check someone prominent (who didn't say anything in support of your argument), add some bogus theory with no support (but imply that it comes from the famous names), through in a little kernel of plausibility (hey, there's racism right? Maybe we are all genetically pre-disposed to hate each other), and stir.
Much like different programming languages are optimized for different tasks, but you can create just about anything in just about any language, human populations are different based on the optimizations that came about through their branch divergence.
See? Hmmm ... seems plausible. But think: Maybe I'm different based on the country I was born in, the way my parents fed me, raised me (the fact that I had loving parents), their wealth and social connections, the forces and choices that formed my personality. My education, the books I read, what I chose to study, my teachers and role models, how hard I worked at it, how well I networked, the career and jobs I chose, the person I married, the city I live in ... Where does this genetic optimization come in?
I recommend the same books as burnitdown, only you should read them and not just name-check them. I read Huntington's Clash of Civilizations [foreignaffairs.org] when it was first published in Foreign Affairs. It says nothing at all about genetics or "optimization", only super-national cultural groups called 'civilizations', which are genetically diverse (see list here [wikipedia.org] ). You can read more here [wikipedia.org].
I haven't read Cavalli-Sforza, but The Economist seems to think [wikipedia.org] that his work challenges the assumption that there are significant genetic differences between human races, and indeed, the idea that 'race' has any useful biological meaning at all. Hmmm ... that seems opposite the ideas that burnitdown cited.
So Burnitdown is just talking out of his backside, start to finish. There is no outside support for it at all. I can't even imagine how it applies to Georgia, Russia, and North & South Ossetia. Does anyone know closely their populations correlate genetically? And why, on that basis, would South Ossetians want Russian more than Georgian citizenship? What the heck is 'Russian' genetically, anyway -- the country stretches from Europe to the Pacific; are they really genetically homogeneous?
Whenever I read something like this, I always try to remember: Think of the people who promolgate this theory of inevitable race-war hatred: From Milosovic to Bin Laden (who rails against Jewish people) to the Rwandan Hutu extremists to the KKK to, yes, Adolf Hitler. What have they accomplished? Then think of those who say that humans can integrate and live together regardless of supposed 'race', from Thomas Jefferson to Abraham Lincoln to Martin Luther King Jr., to Mahatma Gandhi and almost any current leader of prominence. Who has been more successful? Whose side would you rather be on?
Did you know that by the 3rd generation, most immigrants to the US marry across 'cultural' lines? Did you know that the rate of interracial marriage has increased ~700% in the US since 1970 [1] [wikipedia.org]?
The comment I made went from +5 to 0 within an hour. One poster even apologized for modding it up as he reversed his mods. People couldn't get away fast enough.
My question is, where did my post talk about race? It talked about European ethnicities, specifically in the context of the (then current) war in Ossetia, which is a war between three different nationalities (Slavic Russian, Ossetian and Georgian) over inclusion in two nation-states (Georgia and Russia) presided over by two nation-state superpowers (USA and Russia).
Where did I ask for a manic debate about race?
Since then, things have calmed down, but the debate still rages.
One poster rather sensibly pointed to the history of European tribes. Another pointed out that multiple factors may condition the transition from the nation-state. Someone else pointed out that denying biology where humans are concerned is trendy but not accurate. Someone else wanted to talk about whether the Scots and Irish were dumber than the English. Finally, Ghandi got called a racist and so the debate wound down.
I don't know how I got into the middle of this one, but it's fascinating and horrifying at once. Horrifying that even in the 21st century there are things we cannot discuss for fear of offending others, even if discussed scientifically. Horrifying that anything bordering on these, even innocently, is tagged RACIST by some people who seem to be dismayed at the way their lives turned out, and want to hurt others who aren't so bitter. Fascinating in that we have what's basically an ethnic war in South Ossetia, a half-black candidate for US President who is struggling with how to define himself racially to voters, a debate over the changing demographics of the USA and yet we're still fumbling over these topics.
I never wanted to be in the middle of it, but now that I have been, there's you two cents: I'd like to talk about the differences between European ethnicities without having this insane debate over taboo topics borne of personal fears interrupt the flow of conversation and scare off participants.
We don't take censorship from our government. We don't take it from the RIAA. We won't take it from our ISPs. Why, in the name of Galileo and the Salem witch trials, do we then impose it upon ourselves?