He described the distinction he was trying to make rather poorly. There are software professionals with university science and engineering backgrounds. There are also a lot of software professionals who code software, and some who design software, who lack a thorough grounding in scientific thought process. That grounding can come from a high-caliber university, an average college or university, or by having a good high school science program, or by self study. However, It is possible - common, actually - to practice as a software professional with a brief degree or trade program, self study, etc., and do quite well in many areas of software with a very limited grounding in hard scientific thought or education. Slicing by MIT / ivy / 4-year / 2-year etc., does not get at the actual distinction, although perhaps there are trends. Software professional is someone who gets paid to produce software (and related work products, such as requirements, test plans, documentation, etc.). Some of those professionals write beautiful UI/UX and others simulate climate, nuclear reactions, etc. I took the essence of what he is saying is that there are a LOT of software professionals with poor scientific reasoning in physical sciences - and that those without a solid scientific education typically will have a harder time drawing good conclusions about hard science topics. Tying it to Ivy schools was a bit snobbish and missed the crucial point. In response to the other point of the discussion, Bill Nye is a very well known science educator - Bill Nye, Ira Flatow, and Neil DeGrasse Tyson are probably the most well known living popular science educators. Sagan is probably more well known than all these, but is deceased. Hawking is well known, but his popular science education activities are more narrowly focused and not his primary job. Foremost, again, is a word that may imply accolades or quality within education circles, not directly relevant to popular education of adults not enrolled in school. Perhaps science and software people are struggling with language...? LOL