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Role Playing (Games)

Journal Short Circuit's Journal: RPG: Restricting Access to Rulebooks 16

Journal by Short Circuit

I've heard of DMs in D&D restricting players' access to books like the Monster Manual. I imagine similar examples exist for other systems. Why do they do this, and is it really a good idea?

I've got a few ideas as to why the GM might do this, but I want to here from you guys. Specifically, if you were GM, why might you restrict access to rulebooks? Do you think it's a good idea in general?

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RPG: Restricting Access to Rulebooks More

RPG: Restricting Access to Rulebooks

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  • Player-Characer Was Not Meant To Know.
    Unless you are experienced doctor/zoologist/geek,you would never know detail about rare disease/animal/computer language in "real world"
    If some GMs doesn't want their players just opens CompleteManualofRareKnowledge and saps mood and atmosphere of their scenario/campaign,prohibiting some rulebook is perfectly justfiable.

  • Oh yeah... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by FortKnox ( 169099 ) on Wednesday August 04, 2004 @10:28AM (#9878732) Homepage Journal
    There used to be guys that would look up monsters and determine about how much life they had and added everything together and stuff. Pissed the GM off somethin fierce. So, being a GM, he made them always have more hps than they should. Pissed off the guys something fierce. When an argument came up, the GM apologized, and the guy would ALWAYS run into trouble.

    I don't think this is the best way to handle things, but it should be discussed before every campaign that the 'rules' of the game aren't necessarily to be followed. If you want to know the condition of the creature you are fighting, for example, you should ask the GM. The only reason there are numbers and dice is to make the game realistic. The players should have fun and enjoy the game... let the GM do all the math.

    Personally, I can't stand when someone RP'ing a farmboy encounters something like a minotaur and not only 'knows' its a minotaur, but 'knows' its weaknesses. A veteran gamer should know that he needs to be in the mindset/have the knowledge of his character, not the knowledge the player has.
    • More HP's? How mundane. Give that orc a breath weapon. Goblins with 18/00 strength. The possibilities are limitless for rules lawyers jackasses (I was one, BTW). When confronted:

      "This is a Role Playing game. Clearly, there is no way your farmboy could have that knowledge. Killing the minotaur in two seconds isn't fun. So, this is a mutant minotaur. See how everyone else in the group is laughing now that your head is 10 feet from your body? This is fun. It's a game. Deal."

      And then the minotaur beheads the
  • I haven't played paranoia, but the game system itself discourages player access.

    The best way to handle player knowledge is to a priori set rules about what you may or may not change. My personal rule when I DM is this: all rules are subject to change, but if I make a change, it is permanent (the world should be consistent).

    I frequently add monsters, for that very reason--that way no one could possible know what they are about to face! Works best that way. I rarely use canned adventures for the same re
  • If the focus of the game is on exploring, and encountering unknown hazards, then if the players know all that in advance, it takes the impact out of the game, in general.

    If the focus of the game is on how the characters react to events around them, then it doesn't matter if the players all know what it is.

    If the focus of the game is on killin' stuff and gettin' 'arder, then, again, it doesn't matter.

    That's a somewhat of a simplification, but it covers the main point. The most fundemental point is that n
  • I had a guy buy the 'anti-vile darkness' book and create a character out of it, cheating the entire way. There was no way I could cover all the material in that book plus all the others... he pretty much took advantage of that fact and built a lvl 7 character with an AC of 63 + a bunch of other stuff.

    One of the other PC's got really aggrivated because it was just being annoying and they couldn't get rid of him. We then reviewed the rules and found he was breaking a crapload of them... the Vow of Poverty
    • Ooh, that's always bad news. I'd never let a player build a character using rules I didn't have access to.

      Mind you, players like this are likely to not be invited back for further gaming as far as I'm concerned. AC 63? What a load of nonsense. My dragon character doesn't even have that!
      • was really fun when they went into a wild magic area and he tried to bully an orc.... the orc kicked him in the jimmy and he rolled a 1 on his reflex save...

        kevin: I doubt he'll hit AC 63 with his foot!

        /me rolls a few dice

        me :you fall down, stunned for 10 rounds grasping your crotch. you can't speak. you take 45 points of damage.
        kevin: !!! no way! You're cheating!
        everyone else: he's the DM. STFU.
      • A monk in the Epic game I'm running has an AC of 54. With Vow of Poverty, you might be able to get slightly above that (but not a lot, as you do lose magic items). I created a character with an AC 48, but he was 26th level (14 Monk/10 Kensai half water elemental).

        Of course, we're talking a 22nd level monk in a game that was designed to see if the Epic rules are broken (yes) and how to fix them. Your milage may vary.

        I don't mind if people use rules I don't have in front of me, as long as I look them o

        • Well, sure, at 22nd level these things become possible. But we're talking 7th level, here.
          • Kind of my point... a 7th level character has an AC better than a (purposely) min-maxed githzeri monk at 22nd level... Didn't the GM call him out on it first time he got attacked, at least? I would have scrutinized him a bit (the guys I'm with will min-max at times (so do I... but if we REALLY want to min-max, we play GURPS cyberpunk, where it's expected) but not outright cheat) for that.

            In the 13th level game I play in, the best AC is 36 (the Samuri when we buff his AC with special abilities) (well, 4

    • If someone creates a character using source material you don't have access to, why not respond in the same way ?

      For example, take Tordenkakerlakk. It was a one-time villain in a Spider-Man special a long time ago - a magical creature that would always take a new shape after being defeated. It would also develop an immunity to whatever killed it the last time - you couldn't defeat it the same way twice. It changed from a giant insect into a giant worm-like thing into a giant humanoid, and then into a drago

  • Because they're my damned books. You keep your grubby chip-grease slimed digits offa my books. You want to know what's in the GM's guide or my Monstrous Grimoire? Go out and buy one yourself or ask me and hope I'm not lying to you. Besides I have more fun INVENTING critters you'll never find in the books anyway or mutating the existing ones to make them more fun/interesting. You're definitely not getting a peek at my notes, you'll have to jot down your own if you want to know that the green-haired goblin wi
  • it's called the player's handbook for a good reason. it has the info the player needs to function.

    they shouldn't be browsing through the monster manual. that takes the edge out of new encounters.

    I haven't played d&d in years, but our dm knew we all had the books, so he threw some monsters at us from expansions, stuff we hadn't seen before. those were some good battles. we ran across some spellweavers, we were all WTF what are these things and why does my ass hurt so much? They were very very hard
  • Since about 1981 or so. stoped for a couple years (1984-188 or so, discovered computers!)
    I started out dm-ing AD&D, no bloody revised, no bloody second, err you get the idea.
    Been playing about once a week since about the time 3.0 came out. Mostly as a player, but I've been running a campain of my own since january about 2/3 of the time.
    Generaly we don't have the issue anymore. The main reason is the PLAYERS know it's more fun if they're not totaly shure what the monsters can/can't do. Even t
    • One interesting side about suprising the players. I had the group ask me once what the hell was up with a particular bugbear they fought at 5th level and had serious issues with. (a bugbear is an apropriate monster for 2nd level groups). I simply explained the reason the bugbear seemed to freak out angry is because that's what a 2nd level barbarian tends to do in a fight.
      The look on thier faces was a fun mix, despite be very descriptive of how 'he seems to swell up with his rage' or 'blind furry is pla

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