Let's not forget that it's also a thermostat which is "smart" enough to call home (its home, that is) and report on your your thermostat settings and other activities that might be deduced from interaction with the device.

Some people think it's stupid to worry about such things. I think it's a "foot in the door". Remember, Nest was going to be part of a complete home "system".

What, you think Google is magic, or prescient?

Google has had A LOT of bad ideas. And went on to implement them, only later to realize they were bad ideas.

The thing about Google is that it (or Alphabet) is big enough that it can afford such failures... no matter how much it costs the rest of us.

That's the funniest typo I've read in a long time.

Besides, we have the documents leaked by Snowden, which revealed what they revealed. And as a result we know that we were lied to, and deceived, and criminally abused, over oh so many things...

Good intentions do not make up for that. Professionalism doesn't make up for that. Nothing, in fact, makes up for that.

Yes, in fact it does.

No, but yours appeared to be, from your comment: "I'm not saying the story's wrong, but could you have found better sources than the Daily Caller and Zerohedge?"

It's a free country. Assume away. It won't get you anywhere, but I will defend to the... uh... change in my pocket, your right to do so.

Wait a minute... didn't you just imply that the source doesn't matter? You just got done insulting me for having that very attitude (albeit incorrectly, as I actually stated the opposite). Right up there, a few lines above, in quotes.

You leave me with little choice but to just repeat what I said before: I'm sorry your delicate eyes were offended by all that nasty material you had to be exposed to for the 10 seconds it took to find the link to the actual, unbiased source.

Yours must be a very hard life, with all that offense going on all the time.

Doesn't anybody remember that Cisco did this with their Linsys routers? In order to set up your own router, you had to do it via a webpage on Cicso's servers, and from what I understand, it also called home a lot when it didn't need to.

I doubt I have to say here: that's not what I want in a router.

I never did find out what became of that situation. All I know for sure is that I don't buy Linksys products now.

There's a link to the actual court ruling, so what difference does the source make?

What's the matter, your delicate leftist sensibilities were bruised by having to wade through "offensive" material to find the link?

The idea that Obama has been "reasonable" I find downright laughable.

I don't blame him for the things he tried to do and didn't.

It's what you seem to think are the "little" things, regardless of how his administration brought them about: a huge increase in mass surveillance, foreign policy seemingly designed to aid the enemy, and... how many crimes? That we know of?

Let's see. There was Clapper lying to Congress, Lerner lying to Congress, Holder lying to Congress, McCarthy lying to Congress, Holder in Fast and Furious, oh... and now a Federal judge has caught DOJ attorneys lying about the government letting in 100,000 (!!!) immigrants it never had any lawful authority to let in, and knew it.

That's just off the top of my head. How many other broken laws and Constitutional violations can we find if we really look? ALL of those people lying to Congress were direct employees of Barack Obama. He appointed them, he told them what to do. That's his job.

Let's not forget bombing whole families from drones, in violation of both U.S. and International law.

Maybe you don't think that's doing a lot. I do. And that's only a fraction of it... just SOME OF the things we've caught them at.

Sadly, Obama has done lots of things.

And I, for one, am grateful for an "obstructionist" Congress in his case.

Yes.

For that matter, I'd like TFA to define "progressive". I'm not sure it's really being used as it should.

For example: Obama and cronies are "Progressives". Yet under their administration, income inequality has gone up considerably, gender pay gap is a big issue again, racial tensions are at a decades-long high, etc.

Maybe if we're talking about Progressive ideals, rather than what it's really like to live under Progressives, then it might make sense.

Oh... and he's tried to pull the "creationist" thing on me, too, like he did you.

Same sh*t, different day. One thing I will say is that his distortions, while very tiresome, tend to be pretty predictable.

You already have evidence of his stalking behavior.

You make up your own mind whether you think the rest of what I wrote is "libelous". :o)

Yep. There you have it.

Off-topic: I was looking through some old posts, and see you ran into "khayman80" and some of his cronies.

Sorry about that. But if you do so again, you should be aware of his tactics. He has been known to distort old comments out of context, resort to personal attacks, and otherwise do whatever he felt would discredit or get the other party to shut up. I have archives full of him doing that kind of stuff. I've had to put up with his BS for years.

He even tracked down who I was, followed me to other forums, and tried to attack me there, too. Apparently just because that's the kind of guy he is.

It's usually just irritating but he's been pretty nasty at times. Be warned, and I suggest keeping copies of everything in case he goes too far. He has, more than once. A paper trail could be useful in that event.

Don't back down.