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Journal pudge's Journal: Yousef Islam 29

Journal by pudge
<User1> A plane was diverted so a dangerous passenger could be detained & deported
<User1> the Artist formerly known as Cat Stevens
<pudge> ooh yeah
<pudge> i read
<User1> I want to see Muzak, Inc. being shut down for supporting terrorism
<User1> every time they play "Morning has Broken", it buys a bullet for Al-Queda
<pudge> heh
<pudge> i have several Cat Stevens records
<pudge> er, CDs
<pudge> NP: Morning Has Broken - Cat Stevens (Teaser And The Firecat)
<pudge> if Muslims can like some of what Jesus said while disagreeing with the rest, i can do the same with Cat Stevens :)
<User1> hehe. moral relativism rears its ugly head
<pudge> "yeah, i dig Christ's older stuff, but after his transfiguration, not so much"
<User1> hehe
<User1> I liked him when he was still underground
<User1> but ever since he took off, it's just ot my thing anymore
<pudge> he's such a sellout
This discussion was created by pudge (3605) for no Foes, but now has been archived. No new comments can be posted.

Yousef Islam More

Yousef Islam

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  • I liked his stuff before and after. Christs problem was that he stopped touring. I hear now he just kinda hangs out with his Dad (and yours, and mine), and end enjoys being perfect.
  • <User1> every time they play "Morning has Broken", it buys a bullet for Al-Queda

    To be fair, he was only giving money to Hamas. And Sheikh Abdul Rahman.

    Meanwhile, CAIR weighs in with an announcement that "When internationally-respected Islamic personalities like Yusuf Islam..., it sends the disturbing message that even moderate and mainstream Muslims will now be treated like terrorists." Which, once again, raises the question of who CAIR does not consider "moderate and mainstream" -- from past announc

  • Funny dialog.

    I too am a big fan of Cat Steven's music.

    One of those music channels broadcast a biography of him a few years ago. Maybe it will be repeated now that he is in the news again.

    IIRC the bio piece said his conversion was a reaction to the stress of being a celebrity and being on the road. Well, provided he doesn't hurt anyone, it is a better reaction than drug addiction of serial bad relationships.

    Now what about those donations? I gather the reason he was on the watch list is that he don

    • Now what about those donations? I gather the reason he was on the watch list is that he donated some money, $10,000 I heard, that ended up in the hands of Hamas. Hamas is one of the violent Palestinian groups.

      I don't know about his donations ... to me, it is inconsequential. If he has made such donations, he should be on the watch list and perhaps kept out of the country. If not, then he should fix the record. Things like this happen all the time, and I don't really care.

      I've been on-topic so far, ha
      • I believe him. I have no proof one way or the other, but I'm inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt.
        In all other aspects of law, the prosecution would need to prove that Yousef gave money with the intention of supporting terrorists, or otherwise acquit him on grounds of "reasonable doubt", but reason has gone out the window in the "war on terror". Sucks to be anyone on some crusader's shitlist.
        • In all other aspects of law, the prosecution would need to prove that Yousef gave money with the intention of supporting terrorists, or otherwise acquit him on grounds of "reasonable doubt", but reason has gone out the window in the "war on terror".

          Well, in that alternative, we would put him in jail pending trial for the accusation. I think he would prefer deporation.
        • In all other aspects of law, the prosecution would need to prove that Yousef gave money with the intention of supporting terrorists ...

          I'm not at all sure about that: it is established legal doctrine that 'he who wills the means wills the end'.

          If I place a bomb on an airplane to kill my mother-in-law, I cannot escape responsibility for the deaths of or injuries to all other people on board, even if my intention did not directly encompass them. The question in such case would rather be the extent of causa
          • Comment removed based on user account deletion
            • In an argument concerning legal matters, the term cause will, unless explicitly stated, tend to be limited to causes that are legally relevant. In Common Law terminology, this is often referred to as proximate cause.

              In legalese:

              Proximate cause is defined as that which in a natural and continuous sequence, unbroken by any efficient intervening cause, produces the injury, and without which the result would not have occurred. (From Union Pacific Railroad Company et al. [state.ar.us] )

              Or more in layman terms:

              Proximate c

              • Okay, but did Yousef give the money directly to Hamas, or to an organisation that then passed it on to Hamas?

                I haven't read anywhere the answer to that question, but I'll follow any link you post here.

      • If not, then he should fix the record. Things like this happen all the time, and I don't really care.

        You mean like Ted Kennedy? [canoe.ca] It was reported widely that he too made the watch list -- one of several congresscritters who made the list.

        So how is it that they stopped Ted Kennedy every time, but they failed to get Yousef Islam? I knew an Egyptian guy, in University, and the secretary for our department was very cross with him. Filing his paperwork was very difficult because there were three or fou

        • So how is it that they stopped Ted Kennedy every time, but they failed to get Yousef Islam?

          Why are you asking me?

          Well, in the McCarthy days, pointing fingers at your former associates used to work.

          That has what to do with anything, exactly?

          This article says he re-recorded "Peace Train" last year. That doesn't, on the surface, sound like the actions of a war-monger.

          If the charges are to be believed, he donated thousands of dollars to Hamas. That doesn't, on the surface, sound like the actions of a
          • My mention of Ted Kennedy was an attempt at levity. IIRC he had to personally phone Tom Ridge to get off the watch list.

            If the charges are to be believed, he donated thousands of dollars to Hamas.

            You are absolutely correct, a direct donation to Hamas would be extremely hard to explain. But a person could innocently make a donation to a legitimate sounding group, that diverts funds to Hamas. Or an NGO whose British end was totally legitimate, might hire local guys, who, unknown to both Y.I. and the

            • You are absolutely correct, a direct donation to Hamas would be extremely hard to explain. But a person could innocently make a donation to a legitimate sounding group, that diverts funds to Hamas.

              Sure. That is why I would not convict him even if it is true he gave this money that got to Hamas. But I don't want to let him in unless I can be sure he didn't know.

              Well, it looks like the occupation of Iraq will require the help of other nations. And giving the appearance of high-handedness could be costly
            • Bush once accidently gave money to Planned Parenthood, who is cheifly known for giving abortions though they do other things. I do not know how you accidently give money to a group who you oppose, but apparently it can happen.
              • Sure, I already acknowledged that it is possible. But since we cannot know whether it was an accident with Islam, it just seems to me we are right to play it on the safe side. We have no obligation to allow him into the country, and there are unanswered questions, so why risk it?
                • I agree completely. Also if this is the case of an accidental donation to a terrorist organization, then our actions have the benifit of telling people if you plan on coming to the U.S. you should make sure the money you donate does not go to terrorists. Course the whole thing could just be a some sort of huge papper work screw up on our part. I reserve judgement on all parties until more details come out.
        • I came across thiscontemporaty account [nytimes.com] of Y.I.'s support of the Fatwa againt Salman Rushdie.
  • I really only like cat Stevens by proxy through Ugly Kid Joe
  • If you people remember in 1990 the first gulf war when Saddam used all the westerners as human shields (hostages), Cat Stevens went for a peace mission to Iraq and freed all the English hostages, does this looks like a terrorist act? If Washington has evidence that he is helping the terrorists why he is not arrested?
    • does this looks like a terrorist act?

      Yasser Arafat was given the Nobel Peace Prize; does that sound like something given a terrorist? Well, we know he IS a terrorist, regardless.

      If Washington has evidence that he is helping the terrorists why he is not arrested?

      Because the evidence is not strong enough for conviction.

      As I already wrote: "Sure, I already acknowledged that it is possible [he did nothing wrong]. But since we cannot know whether it was an accident with Islam, it just seems to me we are
      • Do not get me wrong I am not trying to defend him because he a Muslim or Imam or even a Martian, What I think is all the Muslim clerics are the real criminals I even wrote an article about it check it out here. http://www.ladybird.oxfordhost.co.uk/b2evolution/b logs/index.php/2004/09/06/what_s_wrong_with_the_mu slims_1/ [oxfordhost.co.uk] But the guy (Cat Stevens) is not doing anything wrong otherwise he will be arrested long time ago by the MI5 just like the other Imam (ABU-QATADA) (try to Google the name for a full stor
        • But the guy (Cat Stevens) is not doing anything wrong otherwise he will be arrested long time ago

          No, he would have been arrested if there was *sufficient evidence* he was doing something wrong. Just because there is not suffcient evidence, does not mean he didn't do anything wrong.

          why not give him a chance

          I asked you first: why risk allowing him in?

          give the Muslim in the US a chance to hear a peaceful message at last

          They hear peaceful messages a lot in the U.S. The overwhelming majority of Musli

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