If only the Navy had hundreds of years of experience with dealing with saltwater. If only somebody could invent covers.

Ah well. Scrap the whole project.

There's a great video clip, that I've never been able to find again, of Cheney, as Bush Sr.'s SecDef I believe, explaining in an interview why, after Gulf War '91, they didn't invade Iraq.

He talked about how it would be at least a 20 year thing, insurgency, blah blah, all the things that came to pass.

That's kinda my point. The US, unfortunately, has a long history of institutional racism, from the Alien and Sedition acts to WW2 internment camps.

Though I wouldn't go so far as to call them hypocrites, as products of their time.

My other point is that one doesn't need 200+ year old quotes to establish that torture is, wholly and unequivocally, wrong.

Well, I have two main objections to the use of torture as a method of extracting information. And for the purposes of this discussion, 'torture' is a fairly wide net.

The first is moral, and doesn't need a lot of explanation.

The second is that it plain doesn't work. Physiological response to high stress, for starters.

No, there are ways to get information that are a) far more ethical and moral, and b) far more effective.

Besides, as a citizen, you should be damn scared of seeing what your government is willing to do to people. A promise of 'Don't worry, we won't do that to YOU! Pinky swear!' is awfully cold comfort.

Lets have another quote, from an ever so slightly more recent document, with much wider scope.

âoeRepresentatives and direct Taxes shall be apportioned among the several States which may be included within this Union, according to their respective Numbers, which shall be determined by adding to the whole Number of free Persons, including those bound to Service for a Term of Years, and excluding Indians not taxed, three fifths of all other Persons.â

True. But by the logic of 'torturing some people saves lives,' then lets look at how many Americans died to terrorist attacks since the year 2000, versus how many died due to, say, other drivers being drunk.

Then, applying this logic, anybody pulled over driving, while intoxicated, should be tortured.

How does the fact that the author used a language he knew invalidate the language being successfully used on a large and busy site?

Do you advocate that all projects be written in a language completely new to the authors, to avoid 'bias?'

Boy, it's a good thing Linux avoids this kinda bullshit entirely!

Now, which Python distribution did I need to install for this app versus that app again....?

In fact the last time I remember a game being shoved out THIS badly broken was Vampire:Bloodlines and that one at least had the excuse of the developer going tits up.

There's a bit more to the story, but yeah. And worth noting that they then worked, unpaid, to put out a patch that fixed the worst of it.

Fantastic game, even though.

Let's face it, it is a merchandising excuse. Di$ney will have fresh Star Wars everything on sale. The movie will be guaranteed to have some cloyingly cute character which can be marketed to kids. Taco Bell and McDonalds will have special toys. They'l re-re-re-re-release extended cuts or special editions of the damned movies. Little children will have R2D2 pyjamas and underpants. And diapers. And sippy cups. And hats. And halloween costumes. Disney will eventually put out 9 more movies, of ever diminishing artistic merit. There will be friggin' Ewok porn. I'm nostalgic about the first series. I mostly liked the second series but it had some issues. But I tried to watch Episode I with my wife, and within five minutes of Jar Jar Binks appearing on screen she said "if he's in the rest of this film I'm leaving". So now if I want to watch it I'm on my own, and the pod racer scene is mostly how I calibrate my home theater. I honestly can't decide if I will see this or not. But let's not for a minute pretend this is being done for any reason besides the zillions of dollars Disney expects to wring from this franchise. If they were doing a billion a year in merchandising for Cars years after it was released, you won't believe the marketing blitz which will accompany this.

So, EXACTLY like the original trilogy?