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Comment Re:Gonna get flamed (Score 1) 668

"Load of bullhit". "Outer fucking space". Clearly, sir, you are an orator beyond my wildest dreams. Anyway, check: http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1365-2222.1988.tb02872.x/abstract :

Although other forms of allergic disease were described in antiquity, hay fever is surprisingly modern. Very rare descriptions can be traced back to Islamic texts of the 9th century and European texts of the 16th century. It was only in the early 19th century that the disease was carefully described and at that time was regarded as most unusual. By the end of the 19th century it had become commonplace in both Europe and North America. This paper attempts to chart the growth of hay fever through the medical literature of the 19th century. It is hoped that an understanding of the increase in prevalence between 1820 and 1900 may provide an insight for modern researchers and give some clues into possible reasons for the epidemic nature of the disease today.

Comment Re:Gonna get flamed (Score 1) 668

Natural immunity to measles (ie., getting the real thing) likely results in greater protection passed to the kids from the mother (can't give exact details but the wife is a biologist who's been involved in immune research in the past).

1. Immunity is passed through breast milk from mother to child. This is what your are thinking about.

No, it wasn't. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immunity_(medical) and search for "placenta". There is an open question (unless someone can point me to some studies) whether vaccine induced immunity results in passive immunity as well as infection induced immunity. This should be testable with the current population in the UK. So far as I'm aware, it hasn't.

2. It sounds to me like you are suggesting letting people get Measles. This is a preposterous position.

Where exactly did I say that? I am suggesting that measles is not - and in the west in say the 50s and 60s was not - the killer it is portrayed as. My preference would be to drop multiple vaccines; to vaccinate for measles later that the current 12-15 months; and to vaccinate against mumps and rubella later as needed based on an antibody test.

Comment Re:Gonna get flamed (Score 1) 668

Referenced in an other reply above: http://www.healthsentinel.com/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=2654:united-states-disease-death-rates&catid=55:united-states-deaths-from-diseases&Itemid=55 .... note that almost the entire drop occurs *before* mass multiple vaccination. Public vaccination may have been around for over a century; mass multiple vaccination has not. My point was that we *may* have reached the point where the costs of "improved health" outweigh the benefits. My views - not a pet theory - is based on reading, discussions with my wife (a biologist with experience in immune research), and logical deduction. I'm quite aware that correlation does not imply causation. But, hey, why bother with rational argument when you can fling out a few ill-thought-out points and a bunch of insults.

Comment Re:Gonna get flamed (Score 1) 668

By putting out mis-information like this you are part of the reason for the large number of deaths from measels. From the WHO.

  • Measles is one of the leading causes of death among young children even though a safe and cost-effective vaccine is available.
  • In 2008, there were 164 000 measles deaths globally – nearly 450 deaths every day or 18 deaths every hour.
  • More than 95% of measles deaths occur in low-income countries with weak health infrastructures.
  • Measles vaccination resulted in a 78% drop in measles deaths between 2000 and 2008 worldwide.
  • In 2008, about 83% of the world's children received one dose of measles vaccine by their first birthday through routine health services – up from 72% in 2000.

You clearly did not read the nature article as this is in no way a strawman. They did not just look at the relation between vaccines and MMR, but about negative effects of vaccines.

They found

We looked very hard and found very little evidence of serious adverse harms from vaccines

Stop putting out your own knee-jerk reactions and at least read the article you are criticising before putting out dangerous misinformation.

Note that I mentioned "the West". For measles death rates in the USA see http://www.healthsentinel.com/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=2654:united-states-disease-death-rates&catid=55:united-states-deaths-from-diseases&Itemid=55 ... (I assume similar rates in western Europe), note that the rate has pretty well flat-lined since the 1950s. Didn't you realise the point of your third list item "More than 95% of measles deaths occur in low-income countries with weak health infrastructures". Sure, if you have an inadequate diet and crap housing, then measles vaccination probably is a good bet. But otherwise? Anyway, you are latching on to measles. Check http://www.vaclib.org/basic/japanusa.htm ... "when Japan raised its minimum vaccination age to two years in 1975 the overall infant mortality rate improved" Oh, and in response to I'm so concerned about allergies that I'm willing to risk the death or serious illness of my child and many of the vulnerable children around him; I'm a fuckshit!! .... I have personally been hospitalised with Asthma, which in my case was 100% definitely allergic. Your concerns are indeed your concerns, but I object to my concerns being dismissed as those of a fuckshit.

Comment Gonna get flamed (Score -1, Troll) 668

OK, I'm going to get flamed for this by a bunch of knee-jerk vaccination good people, but WTF. First strawman argument: which did not find convincing support for the idea that MMR shots caused autism . OK, so a load of people latch onto autism as a reason against vaccination, but its not the only concern. A lot of people are more concerned about lower-level negative immune system responses, such as increased allergy rates. Note that allergy rates have risen roughly in line with increasing hygiene and health-care in general (eg., hay fever was virtually unknown before the mid-1800s). Hygiene and health-care - vaccines included - affect the immune system, and its quite plausible that there is a balance point (between killing all but the healthiest or luckiest and weakened immune or damaged systems) which may have been passed. I'm old enough to remember measle parties, clearly people in the 50s and 60s (in the West anyway) were not very worried about it. It was something your kids got, and the sooner the better. Why is measles becoming more serious? Natural immunity to measles (ie., getting the real thing) likely results in greater protection passed to the kids from the mother (can't give exact details but the wife is a biologist who's been involved in immune research in the past). Then there's the multiple vaccination issue. The ability to survive an infection is a neccessary survival trait and would be selected for. The ability to survive multiple simultaneous infections much less so. Anyone see an issue here? I'm not anti-vaccination per-se. I am against the knee-jerk vaccinate against everything policy that governments and pharma push. MMR. How many people get bad affects from Rubella - none, only the foetus, so test girls before puberty and vaccinate those who are antibody-negative. Similarly for boys and Mumps. And I have a particular downer on the majority unthinking reactions that seem common on Slashdot whenever this topic comes up.

Comment Government interference (Score 1) 462

When oh when will people realise this is the sort of government interference that is simply not needed. This is exactly the sort of problem that the free market will resolve. If this sort of attack ever happens, people can simply vote with their dollars and buy their electricity from another supplier. Then the generating and distribution companies will actually have to do something rather than get away with claiming that they are doing something.

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