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Amazon Is Permanently Closing Eight Cashierless Stores (cnn.com) 148

Posted by BeauHD from the cost-cutting-efforts dept.
Amazon is permanently closing eight of its 29 Amazon Go convenience stores that offer customers the ability to shop without any kind of checkout process. From a report: Amazon debuted the Go store in Seattle in 2016. It hailed the stores as the future of shopping, especially for convenience stores in busy downtowns of major cities. At one point Amazon expected there to be hundreds if not thousands of the stores nationwide, according to published reports that were never confirmed by the company. But they never lived up to those expectations.

[T]he closings, first reported by Geekwire, are another sign of cost-cutting efforts at the online shopping giant. [...] The stores being closed include two in downturn Seattle that had already been shut on a temporary basis, leaving five in the city. In addition it is closing two in New York City and four in San Francisco. The six closings of stores still operating are due to take place April 1. In addition to the 21 Amazon Go stores that will remain, there are two locations in New York that the brand shares with Starbucks.
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Amazon Is Permanently Closing Eight Cashierless Stores More

Amazon Is Permanently Closing Eight Cashierless Stores

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  • All those non-cashiers, now out of work (Score:4, Funny)

    by blastard ( 816262 ) on Monday March 06, 2023 @10:12PM (#63348977)

    How will they survive.

  • has anyone tried one? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by danda ( 11343 ) on Monday March 06, 2023 @10:14PM (#63348981)

    I, for one, don't see the appeal.

    But then I prefer to pay cash, avoid loyalty programs, and not be tracked even at a regular grocery store.

    these amazon stores seem like a tracking bonanza.

    • Re:has anyone tried one? (Score:5, Informative)

      by Your.Master ( 1088569 ) on Monday March 06, 2023 @10:29PM (#63348997)

      I have, and it was actually wonderful. It's enormously easier to just walk in, grab what you want, and walk out, without having to be gated by a checkout system whether it's manned or unmanned. I imagine they're banking on the idea that it's psychologically easier to just walk in for a single item and not feel like you have to make the trip "worth it". It was also a much better organized store than any in the area, which I presume is basically required for the tracking to work. This results in a complete lack of lines. Also, during the earlier days of the pandemic when people didn't know much about how it spread, I appreciated that I literally never had to touch anything other than the food I was literally buying: no doors, no credit card reader, nothing. The only sort of gating is that upon entering you kind of have to hover your palm above the device (there's an alternate mode where you use a credit card).

      The only downside is that it is smaller than my regular traditional grocery stores, and while it makes up for that somewhat by better organization and presumably better logistics that let it restock just in time so it doesn't need huge amounts of spare space, it's just still not got the same selection. So my pattern became little shopping trips there, big (or very specific) shopping trips at the larger stores.

      I can't stress enough how much easier it is to just walk in, grab something, and walk out, without having to handle anything. You can still see and cross-check the bill on your Amazon account. I double-checked more carefully than I do when a human is scanning things, but it was always right.

      It's unfortunately been closed for over a year now.

      Yes, you will be tracked in the same sense as you're tracked if you buy stuff at Amazon, who knows your address already. And I don't relate at all to wanting to use cash, that's a hassle. I appreciate the privacy difference, but I don't really care if a bank can tell that I buy groceries at an address close to my house. I'm not trying to diminish your concerns, but I think you're well outside the norm.

      • I double-checked more carefully than I do when a human is scanning things, but it was always right.

        This to me is the interesting question of just not how accurate it was but if it was also easy to trick, I wonder what the shrink was in this store versus a normal store, if it's at least equal I could see the appeal, maybe they'll license the tech to other retailers instead. If they have the stats to back it up might be worth, or the development is just too expensive for the concept. Appreciate the informative post.

        Also curious, did they sell produce and if so how? All pre-packaged?

        • Just an observation, it appears the Amazon stores, much like the Walmart store closings in the news....are leaving crime ridden big cities, that are letting shoplifters do as they please.

          • Correlation causation, is there a report to back up that reason and that goes to my other point, are the shrink levels more/less/equal to a traditional store model and which cities are we talking about?

          • The prevention of shoplifting is more complicated than it seems, and shoplifting itself may not be directly related to other kinds of crimes. Simply having more security guards, for example, can actually make things worse if shoplifters see it as more exciting to steal in front of the guards or if they see it as presenting an opportunity to really 'get back' at the store for some reason. (See, for example: https://onlinelibrary.wiley.co... [wiley.com]).

            The notion that big cities all have lots of crime is also mistake

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by danda ( 11343 )

        thx for sharing your experience. I get the convenience factor, as yeah, lines suck.

        some q's:

        1. I guess there is some kind of initial setup/registration required. What is that process like? You mention that you just need to hover your palm over a device, so I guess you previously gave them some kind of palm print?

        2. Does the store offer fresh produce? I mainly buy fresh fruits and vegetables, which are often sold by weight, and one can usually pick through them to (hopefully) find the good ripe items

      • I have, and it was actually wonderful. It's enormously easier to just walk in, grab what you want, and walk out, without having to be gated by a checkout system whether it's manned or unmanned...

        As we continue to watch automation remove the lower rungs from the Ladder of Success, creating the socialist programs to sustain the unemployable at ever-increasing numbers, tell me...is a 300% increase in price in stores like that still going to be "wonderful" for you and everyone else paying the ultimate price for that convenience?

        Manned vs. unmanned, depends on whether you enjoy paying a lot more in taxes or not.

    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward

      It hailed the stores as the future of shopping, especially for convenience stores in busy downtowns of major cities.

      And once again, a company with incompetent management gets bitten in the ass by their refusal to acknowledge reality.

      Hey, guess where there is *A LOT* of crime. In the downtown area of major cities. Guess who loves the idea of a store with no employees. Criminals? What? I am SHOCKED!

      They will never admit it, but I guarantee that these stores are being closed because they have a huge amount of theft.

      • These stores were exceptionally good at theft control. If you attempted it there was a security guy hiding in a room at the exit who'd pop out as you walked to the door.
        • Where I live we get 15 kids who walk in in a group and 2 are designated stealers while the other 13 are there to be decoys so no one knows who took what. Is there some sort of turnstile so only one person can enter at a time?

          • How do you steal when they just charge your account for whatever you took?

            You can't get in without a pre-authorized payment method on file. Good luck disputing the charge when they have you on camera checking in, taking the item off the shelf, and leaving. If you force your way in, security has you trapped and can easily deal with you -plus it is all on camera, so easy case for the DA if you get violent.

            • If there is a cluster of 10 people blocking the camera how do they know who to charge? I guess it depends where the camera is.

              • I wondered how this would work when they announced the idea.

                Security experts (as well as random internet personalities) tried to screw with the system and see if they could make it fuck up... it worked amazingly well. There are A LOT of cameras. Many angles on every item on every shelf in every aisle... their system has been close to foolproof.

                There are articles about it, from the technical perspective of the implementation team, and from the perspective of various people trying to fool it . Google for t

                • Ok.. so you're saying with the maximum number of people allowed in the store it would be impossible for them to cluster around and obscure who is taking the product? I could see it being difficult for one person alone in the store to hide from the cameras.

                  • I'm not saying anything is impossible.

                    I am saying that people have tried to find ways to make it screw up -and none have publicly reported success.

                    I did read about some issues in the early closed tests, but nothing once they opened to the public. This could be because Amazon kept it quiet, or because the successful thieves didn't want to announce what they had found. Or maybe... the system works.

      • Oddly, all their locations are in the urban cores of liberal coastal cities.

        These areas have higher levels of petty crime and more hostility to labor-saving innovation.

        They should have more varied test sites if they really want an objective test of the concept.

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by danda ( 11343 )

          Oddly, all their locations are in the urban cores of liberal coastal cities

          uh, it's amazon.

          Just review the books and videos they censored/removed the past 5 years or so and their bias becomes self-evident.

          (I'm not sure a list exists (probably does), I've just personally witnessed them removing content because they didn't agree with it, as per their own statements)

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Entrope ( 68843 )

      There is an Amazon Fresh across the street from my workplace. A bunch of my coworkers (mostly the 20-something crowd) go there often. I went once, for novelty's sake, and decided I'd rather walk or drive somewhere that wasn't festooned with cameras, even if it takes an extra 5 or 10 minutes if travel each way.

    • But then I prefer to pay cash, avoid loyalty programs, and not be tracked even at a regular grocery store.

      So, how is the witness protection program these days? (I kid)

      I've saved significant amounts of money using cash back and loyalty programs. In fact, Target's 5% off everything is nearly like not having to pay sales tax (and before someone says "Target is overpriced", the discount stacks with competitor price matching).

      Bragging that you overpay for everything really isn't the flex you might imagine it to be, but then again, this is Slashdot not Slickdeals.

      • In fact, Target's 5% off everything is nearly like not having to pay sales tax

        Wow...where do you live where sales tax is only 5%?

        Honest question.

    • I, for one, don't see the appeal.

      Well have you tried one?

      I stopped by a few years back in Seattle. It's very cool, you just go through, pick up whatever you want, and go on your way. No fumbling with a hand scanner, waiting in line for a cashier, or waiting in line for a self-checkout kiosk before taking longer than a cashier would to scan everything.

      It is a bit creepy but they're not really getting any more information than they would from online shopping.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by danda ( 11343 )

        no, I haven't tried one, that's why I asked if others had, to share their experiences. as you did, thank-you.

        You say you went once, so I have to think there was some kind of one-time setup/registration involved as well, yes?

    • But then I prefer to pay cash

      I have had the same 20EUR banknote in my wallet (and the only note in my wallet) for over a year now. I honestly can't remember the last time I handled cash locally and the only reason I handled cash when abroad was to get money out of the machine to try and get it changed into one of every denomination for the wife's world currency collection.

      I have much bigger things to worry about than the supermarket knowing that I like Jack's Smokey BBQ Sauce.

      • I haven't had cash in my wallet for over a year and it took 2 years to spend out the $300 I pulled the last time I went to an ATM. Cash is inconvenient as well as filthy as fuck and disgusting to touch if you think about where it's been and how many others have done god knows what with it.

        • I haven't had cash in my wallet for over a year and it took 2 years to spend out the $300 I pulled the last time I went to an ATM. Cash is inconvenient as well as filthy as fuck and disgusting to touch if you think about where it's been and how many others have done god knows what with it.

          I will be HAPPY HAPPY HAPPY to take all that nasty, filthy cash off your hands my friend.

          Of course I do use CC's for online purchases, no way to get. around that, but I really do like using cash, particularly for buying

          • I get why you don't want your vices in a database but seriously, cash is really ick.

            Poor girl at the pharmacy last week was handed a pile of coins by the woman in front of me. She was clearly grossed out and immediately scrubbed her hands thoroughly with the nearby sanitizer. With good reason for both.

            I put my credit card in the reader, took the bag she placed on the counter, no one touched, everything was clean and we were both happy.

            • Poor girl at the pharmacy last week was handed a pile of coins by the woman in front of me. She was clearly grossed out and immediately scrubbed her hands thoroughly with the nearby sanitizer. With good reason for both.

              Wow, that is indeed very interesting.

              If I might, may I ask in what part of the country you live?

              I've never seen a reaction to that before for handling cash...I see people using cash all the time in stores around here and I never have seen even the slightest of negative responses to handlin

              • I'm in Florida but when I was in California for years everyone paid with cc whenever possible, too. Don't generally see tips or cash on tables, etc.

                In this case the most likely reason for her buying her meds in change was she's a drug addict and doesn't have any cash. That was spare change she got together for her pharmacy trip.

                In that case, doubly so on the yuck because the poor girl now has to deal with coins that have been in even more horrible places than usual.

                • Don't generally see tips or cash on tables, etc.

                  Thanks for the info.

                  Interesting one here...even when I pay for meals out with a CC, I always try to leave the tip in cash....to help the server not have to declare everything.

                  I remember my days as a server and bartender and cash tips were always what I wanted.

                  I forget how much you "had" to declare....something like 10% of your total sales at the end of the night.

                  If it is documented on a CC....no getting around that, but cash...well, if you were were makin

                  • I'm a good tipper but it's all cc. I simply don't have any cash.

                    Maybe once a year or so I hit the ATM and it lasts another year or so.

                    With cash tips were you concerned about anyone (other workers or customers) swiping the tip before you could get to the table?

      • I have much bigger things to worry about than the supermarket knowing that I like Jack's Smokey BBQ Sauce.

        It's not so much the BBQ sauce (although it might be if it has a lot of sugar in it)....But the whole picture that the store gets of your consumption.

        Let's say they build a profile on your less than healthy purchases....you regularly buy a lot of hard liquor and beer at the grocery store? You tend to buy a lot of salty, sugary high calorie foods? Lots of sodas?

        All that unhealthy food regularly bought

    • It's clearly intended for Amazon fans Mark up the price, then remove the mark-up if you're a Prime member. All groceries with a 10 day return policy, just ship the milk back in the supplied envelope. Guaranteed you never have to talk to a cashier who looks poor.

      And the news of these stores closing just confirms that Amazon is not just putting competing stores out of business but is willing to destroy its own stores in its war against retail.

    • No checkouts. No queues. You just pick up what you want and walk out. How can you not see the attraction in that?

  • Since Covid killed the 24-hour grocery store, I was really hoping this concept would've take off. Yeah, I know not being able to grocery shop in the middle of the night is the epitome of first world problems.

    • It isn't so much Covid that killed it, it's the decline of societal civility. These stores were seeing so many crime problems at night with shitheads, they were just looking for an excuse to trim their hours. Covid gave them that excuse.

      • I'm probably alone on this, but I'd actually subscribe to Walmart's paid membership if it granted after-hours access to the stores. Solves the scumbag problem and they get some profit out of the deal to boot.

        • If WM offered 24/7 access for a paid membership, I'd definitely see about that. Bonus points if they have some type of eatery of coffee shop going there, because where I live, even the old tried and true Denney's and IHOPs are not 24 hours anymore. I don't really blame COVID for that, but the rent hikes which make it impossible to afford to work at a restaurant in any sizable city.

    • My local Winco is still open 24/7.

    • Winco and plenty of Safeways are doing just fine where Im at.

  • What's not being said? (Score:3)

    by schwit1 ( 797399 ) on Monday March 06, 2023 @10:47PM (#63349021)

    Maybe they are closing for the same reason Walmart is pulling the last of its stores from Portland. Theft.

    • Re:What's not being said? (Score:5, Interesting)

      by ccguy ( 1116865 ) on Tuesday March 07, 2023 @01:16AM (#63349201) Homepage

      Maybe they are closing for the same reason Walmart is pulling the last of its stores from Portland. Theft.

      No, it's just that these stores are extremely expensive to operate. All the cameras, GPUs, power, network, etc... the economics just don't work. And on top of that, in order to make the customer believe they never fail, they do have manual checks (which is why sometimes you get the receipt immediately and some times it takes 15 minutes).

      Also, they (same with competitors BTW) never got them to work at scale, and I by scale I mean number of people that can be at the store at the same time, square meters or even number of SKUs.

      I worked at one of their competitors for a while, BTW, so I saw some of the problems first hand.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by danda ( 11343 )

        competitors... others are doing this no checkout thing?

      • No, it's just that these stores are extremely expensive to operate. All the cameras, GPUs, power, network, etc... the economics just don't work.

        Cameras, GPU power and networks are all far cheaper than paying even a single minimum wage employee, even in places like Europe where power is expensive. Equipment is a sunk cost for infrastructure. They are expensive stores to build, but not operate. In fact being cheap to operate is one of their primary drivers. You run a skeleton crew and only employ people to restock shelves at the end of a shift.

        I worked at one of their competitors for a while, BTW, so I saw some of the problems first hand.

        Problems exist for every new development, none of them are insurmountable. Nothing works at scale, until it

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by PPH ( 736903 )

      No! I simply don't believe that [youtube.com] would ever happen.

    • Probably, also cashless stores don't make too much sense when local cities are creating laws to force them to accept cash.

      https://abc7news.com/consumer-... [abc7news.com]
      https://www.geekwire.com/2019/... [geekwire.com]

      Don't get me wrong, this was just before the pandemic. During the pandemic, many stores and restaurants were allowed to go cashless even in those cities.

  • They seem to be repositioning. Puyallup, Washington - which is surprising to me, because Puyallup is a small-ish town smack dab in the middle of Boeing-driven suburban sprawl. Not a lot of density, in other words.

    Doubly-weird (to me, anyway) is that they're advertising stuff like made-to-order breakfast...

  • San Francisco stores were not cashierless (Score:5, Informative)

    by CommunityMember ( 6662188 ) on Tuesday March 07, 2023 @12:08AM (#63349109)
    The ones in San Francisco were required by a city ordinance passed shortly after they first opened to accept cash due to complaints from advocates of those that do not have a bank account. That resulted in a few people having to (mostly) sit around all day in the store on the possibility someone would come in and want to pay cash. That clearly impacted the financial advantages that having a cashierless store might offer. That, plus the fact that working from home has substantially reduced the breakfast/lunch/dinner shopping, with no substantial increase expected in downtown San Francisco any time soon (if ever), probably makes closing those stores a good choice.
    • And more like a tech demo and research project. Like all tech focused companies Amazon is cutting back because the Federal reserve is trying to cause a recession by raising interest rates, ostensibly to reduce inflation but it's funny how they didn't care about inflation until it started to affect Wall Street... I mean nobody complained about my rent going up 8 to 10% every year and that's been going on for 10 years now. And they haven't done a damn thing about the cost of healthcare or education.

      • *eye roll*

        The cost of healthcare was the entire reason for Obamacare.

        The cost of education is why the Feds took over the student loan programs decades ago.

        True, no one cares about your rent. Rent control is a dismal failure and what else can the government do about private rental housing agreements? I'm sure there is some class warfare+socialist answer you have in mind. Move to a cheaper place or get a better job.

        What caused the Federal Reserve to start raising rates is a few things:
        1) rates were ridicul

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by pz ( 113803 )

          You forgot to add what may be the primary driver of inflation at the moment:

          4) The US government dumped vast amounts of money into the economy to make sure it didn't completely collapse during the pandemic. There was every expectation that the eventual outcome would be inflation.

          And then the two contributing factors made things worse:

          5) The global supply chain failure.

          6) The Ever Given crash.

          • I did strongly imply (4) when I talked about printing cash but yes I didn't mention (5) but that's entirely because of the global response to Covid which is a whole other story.

            I'm not sure what you mean by (6)?

            • Re: (Score:2)

              by pz ( 113803 )

              The Ever Given accident put a serious monkey-wrench into the global supply chain over and above the COVID-related issues. If it alone didn't sow the seeds for inflation, it added plenty of nice, rich fertilizer. We saw an immediate rise in prices related to the incident, but the knock-on effects reverberated for many months.

              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]

              I would speculate that overall the costs of shipping have risen since the incident as the insurance companies need to recoup their losses, and the ship

        • >What is socialism's answer to high inflation?
          Perfect Socialism has 0% inflation. Inflation is the rate you are paying investors for their investment: inflation is just the way we measure the interest you make on the investment. Perfect socialism would have no investors (no one who expect a return beyond 1:1), thus no inflation.
          Concentration of wealth in investor's hands is one problem, and the *growth* of that horde of wealth is another: inflation. Even if most of that money were to make it's way back i

          • Why would socialism have zero inflation? Because you wouldn't have a functioning economy because humans don't act like that. Humans are greedy and selfish and want more. We are born that way. Babies don't give their candy to other babies. In a society where everyone shares the results of labor equally there will always be those who produce more than they get and will be pissed off at the people who don't produce as much (because they're lazy, not disabled and helpless) and the things quickly grind do

    • Why does requiring the store to accept cash payments require additional cashiers? Why couldn't they have a machine accept the occasional cash payment?
      While the bill collectors on many snack vending machines are notoriously slow and unreliable, the ATMs at my primary credit union have been able to quickly accept and process stacks of bills (and paper checks) for well over a decade (without requiring envelopes or deposit slips). Obviously, there is a cost to purchasing and maintaining these machines, but I

      • Why does requiring the store to accept cash payments require additional cashiers? Why couldn't they have a machine accept the occasional cash payment?

        Theft. The whole problem with this is not the method of payment but keeping people honest by ensuring they can be billed in a CNP transaction to their credit card.

        In the Netherlands this is a problem for these stores. They *require* people have credit cards, ... in a country where less than 20% of the population does. Debit cards or other forms of cashless transactions are not accepted since the system depends on the ability for the vendor to unilaterally bill you a specific amount which can't be done easil

    • I imagine you've hit the nail on the head. The problem is that they basically exclude a massive potential customer base - those who don't have/want to use an Amazon account. It does sound like a neat system, but I don't find normal convenience stores that difficult to use. I don't have an Amazon account, and I wouldn't sign up for one just to get access to these stores. So they're trying to operate a much more capital intensive operation that appeals to less customers.

      Maybe in another decade when the tech

      • And Costco excludes the potential customer base of anyone who doesn't care to pay $50 or whatever per year and carry around the membership card. BFD. Not every store is targeted at every single person in the world. And that is OKAY!

        I thought Amazon Go was a neat idea from the outset. And when they opened a location between my old office and MUNI station, I was sold. It was a super convenient way to pop in and grab a quick drink or sandwich... the latter were of significantly higher quality than at mos

  • Shocker (Score:3, Insightful)

    by anoncoward69 ( 6496862 ) on Tuesday March 07, 2023 @12:37AM (#63349147)
    Base most of your stores around tech hubs and wonder why business goes to shit when covid WFH gives people an excuse to flee from these overpriced shit holes. Perhaps they should have experimented with some of them in the flyover states as well. I wonder how those would be doing in comparison?

  • They tried to replace bodegas, but what we really needed was better vending machines.

  • Your Freudian slip is showing.

  • We are in the age of giant tech companies are trying to dictate the future by throwing technology at it. We are seeing failure after failure by companies thinking they are smarter than most and people just don't know what they want, or how willing they will trade their privacy for these conveniences.

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