Amazon Wants to Monitor You in Your Sleep, for Your Benefit (bloomberg.com) 75
Amazon.com has won U.S. permission to use radar to monitor consumers' sleep habits. From a report: The Federal Communications Commission on Friday granted Amazon.com Inc. approval to use a radar sensor to sense motion and "enable contactless sleep tracing functionalities." Amazon on June 22 asked the FCC, which regulates airwave uses, for permission to market a device that uses radar. The technology captures movement in three dimensions, enabling a user to control its features through simple gestures and movements, the company said in a filing. The capability, according to Amazon, could help people with "with mobility, speech, or tactile impairments," and it could monitor sleep with a high degree of precision.
Injecting ads in dreams (Score:5, Interesting)
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I think the first thing they will try is to see when we are most susceptible to dream manipulation, so they can inject ads in our dreams.
Unexpected Futurama
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Was it really all that unsuspected? Half the people who opened this thread probably Ctrl-Fed and looked for "lightspeed briefs."
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Yeah, that's not really possible.
Dreams do not have a sufficient basis in realty for any external mechanism to manipulate what we dream about to such a high precision.
Dreams are a result of how our own brain, interprets the noise of its own operation as sensory input in the absence of any external sensory data. Attempts to directly stimulate the sensory areas of the brain in an attempt to make people "dream" about specific things would be more likely to wake them up than cause them to see or hear the
Re: Injecting ads in dreams (Score:2)
The trick is to inject the noise during the day but there are aspects that Amazon's monitoring could aid in this process.
I think it's a Radiolab podcast that discusses a researcher seeking to induce a theme in a dream. He eventually found a way involving Tetris and waking the patients during REM.
There are some general take always from this for our discussion. First the dream content needs to be injected in a kind of puzzling way in the day. Second, monitoring sleep allows stimulation to lead one to have dre
That's not been proven (Score:2)
Yeah, that's not really possible.
Dreams do not have a sufficient basis in realty for any external mechanism to manipulate what we dream about to such a high precision.
Firstly, that statement has not been studied.
Secondly, Priming [wikipedia.org] probably works in some dream states. This also hasn't been studied, but it's well known that certain noises can cause you to wake up, so it's likely that the brain is processing some external information while asleep (it would be a survival trait).
The army studied sleep learning and came to the conclusion that it doesn't work, but learning is very different from influencing.
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Most of the past attempts were at useful things like dream-learning. But it turns out, you can't just play books-on-tape while you sleep and gain knowledge; you end up getting poor sleep and not learning anything. So they repeat these types of studies. Most sleep studies are on how much dysfunction is created by various ways to fuck up your sleep; how bad is this light level, how bad is this other light level, what if it is a different color, how bad is noise, etc.
What Amazon wants to do here is industrial
You're probably right (Score:2)
Clearly you know far more about what's not going on in the world than I do.
You're probably right. Anyone who uses Ad Hominem attacks instead of citing research is probably a poser.
It's the go-to argument for people who don't know *any* of the research.
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If that is interpreted as an ad hominem attack, it is only because the notion itself is absurd.
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Yeah, that's not really possible.
Dreams do not have a sufficient basis in realty
To be fair, neither do ads...
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>Dreams do not have a sufficient basis in realty for
>any external mechanism to manipulate what we
>dream about to such a high precision.
ipso facto, Amazon's interest suggests otherwise . . .
hawk, providing a rare correct usage of that latin phrase
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There are plenty of times when I can trace a dream back to something that happened to me the previous day, or something I've been thinking about that's going to happen. The dreams distort the reality, but they're not unrelated. I also have lots of dreams in which darkness turns into a semi-daylight, which are related to the fact that I don't get up with the dawn. And I've had dreams that incorporate a sudden sound in the real environment. So I don't think my dreams are entirely "in the absence of any ex
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I'm not claiming to be an expert on this sort of thing, but it would not surprise me if your experience is more of an outlier than typical.
That's not a criticism against you. People are different, and that's okay.
Barring either being artificially kept sedated or else being too overcome with exhaustion to wake up, external sensory input that d
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However, if you're going for the Bond villian-esque angle, here's something that is possible: People who would be willing (gullible enough?) to have and allow this technology into their bedroom probably also will have Amazon Alexa in their bedroom as well, in addition to multiple rooms of their dwellings. This 'sleep monitoring system' verifies that they're fast asleep, then their bedside Alexa whispers suggestions at them, like 'buy more from
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He's not CEO any more, stepped down last week. You need to adjust to Andrew Jassey, the new boogieman.
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Actually Jassey is a different sort of animal, who took AWS from "Let's try this, hold my beer!" to the 800 pound gorilla of the cloud industry. He's far more methodical than Bezos, while I don't expect him to mess with what works I don't think we'll see many more of the off-the-wall weird shit like the Fire Phone either. My impression is that he's not as tolerant of internal politicking either, which can only be a good thing.
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Well, we're going to just disagree on this I think. I wouldn't work there if I thought it was.
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sex monitoring sold to marking as well! (Score:3)
sex monitoring sold to marking as well!
Every breath you take (Score:5, Insightful)
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Or this: in a future that is dominated by neo-conservatives and their extremist fundamentalist Christian backers, your Amazon Alexa Radar Sleep Monitoring System detects (gasp! shocking!!) HOMOSEXUAL ACTIVITY! Better arrest them both and send them off to 're-educa
Yeah... (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Yeah... (Score:5, Interesting)
Interesting you scoff at Amazon while using a Facebook account to post. I mean, if there is one company not doing things for your benefit, it's Facebook.
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Not intended to be a burn but it seemed quite odd.
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Jim, I say this with all honesty, you don't need a Facebook account and you are better off closing your account entirely. Amazon is a dick but it's kinda besides the point if you are sucking off Facebook.
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Re:for "my" benefit (Score:2)
If it's for *MY* benefit then does that mean it can work without an internet connection? Does it mean that Amazon won't be collecting the data on it's servers? No, didn't think so.
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for "my" benefit. Pfft.
Obviously you've never had to do a sleep study. Brainwave cap, breathing monitor, IR camera to record movement, all done at a special sleep study clinic. Fitbit and smart watches all offer a sleep app to help monitor your sleep, which sometimes can eliminate the need to do an in-clinic sleep study.
Once they analyze you sleep patterns and breathing cycles, they can diagnose sleep apnea, restless leg syndrome, and sleep walking. If you put it in a newborn's room it can monitor for SIDS, apnea, and potentia
For better sleep (Score:5, Interesting)
1. You should only sleep in your bed. Don't read, eat, listen to music, and especially don't use your phone.
2. You should only sleep in your bed. Don't read, eat, listen to music, and especially don't use your phone.
3. You should only sleep in your bed. Don't read, eat, listen to music, and especially don't use your phone.
4. Darken your room. You want it as close to dark as you can. Cover your windows. Cover the LEDs. Recommend good electrical tape for this.
5. Go to bed and wake up in the same 30ish minute window.
6. Make sure room is cool.
7. Fan is recommended since it help keep you cool without raising the power bill too much and the white noise they create.
Might take a couple of months to implement, but you will be sleeping better. Do it long enough, and you won't need your alarm most days.
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For me I can either not read in bed OR take one single aspirin. I think the "Bed is for sleep only." thing is partly a matter of becoming uncomfortable spending too long in the same basic position. Not quite to the level of pain, but same mechanism as aches and same treatments.
The rest is advice I agree with. Also the whole "No caffeine six hours before bed." thing is WAY too generous. No caffeine twelve hours before bed. Which sucks. Hard. But it helps measurably.
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2. This is combing of various pieces of advice posted by medical professionals.
3. Don't listen to anyone older than 34. They just don't get it anymore.
4. Again, making it darker makes it easier to sleep. The darkness lets your body know its night and time to sleep.
5. Having a routine will help with this
6. A cooler room helps you sleep . The coolness lets your body know its night and time to sleep.
7. Evaporation of your sweat cools you down. That is the who
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1. Why the ageism?
2. Ever hear of First Sleep and Second Sleep?
3. You forgot to mention how awesome an afternoon nap can be. Especially in your twenties & thirties. You can stay up and party later and still be fresh when you get up early.
4 A simple blindfold is far easier than all the effort of darkening the room you prescribed, and your brain quickly associates wearing one with "I'll sleep now." Try a few and find a comfortable one, not just a cheap one.
5. Fans cost money to run all night. If you'r
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3. Definitely don't listen to 33 year olds, they're still just kids.
Jesus died at 33, you insensitive clod!
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Nobody told you not to stab yourself in the face with a knife. They only said it would be bad for you. You're an adult, we're still happy for you to make your own decision about it.
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"Go to bed when you're tired. Wake up when you're not." If I recall correctly from my zoology classes (probably before you were born, although your comment about 33 year olds may mean I'm wrong), most diurnal mammals and birds have a circadian rhythm that is slightly longer--by ten or so minutes--than the 24 hour day. That's not because they evolved on Mars, where the day is indeed slightly longer than 24 hours; I believe it is because an organism's circadian rhythm needs to stay entrained to the Earth's
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All good. Add no caffeine after 2, and exercise but not before bed. Start darkening the living space half an hour or an hour before bedtime. My sleep doctor called that "dusking".
There were sleep monitor devices already. My sleep doctor did not think they were reliable enough to be useful.
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Stop with the cool room bit. Some of us find the cool actually painful. Granted, you don't want it hot, but cool just hurts. Cozy warm is perfect.
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"you won't need your alarm most days": I often wake up a minute or two--literally--before the alarm would go off.
Of course there are those other days...
How much are they paying for the data? (Score:2)
Not just going to give it away for free of course. Oh let me guess, trading my data for "insights" into my sleep? Pfft
5G Nanobots (Score:3, Funny)
Creepy bastards (Score:3, Interesting)
I'm sure the creepy bastards that are promoting this creepy shite value their personal privacy as much as anyone. If not, then maybe its time for a reality show about what they do in bed.
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When there is a web site that livestreams the RADAR image from Bezos’ bedroom - with evidence that it is him and not a paid double, nor a recording, we can start to think about the possibility of considering taking this nonsense seriously.
Until then? No. Just: no.
Pop popcorn while you sleep! (Score:3)
You say radar, I say microwave radiation (albeit very limited). Regardless, if I take a bag of popcorn to bed with me, will it be popped when I wake up?
And so (Score:4, Interesting)
Sounds like one of those cool things 1970s science futurists prognosticated, completely ignorant of the spying nature for advertising categorization, or discrimination against the unhealthy.
...and More! (Score:5, Interesting)
Imagine them playing sounds while you sleep to advertise products as soon as you fall into the best sleep cycles!
Or playing sounds to put you into a more suggestible state during the day; lower your impulse control...
Getting hacked so some group has it subtlety interrupt parts of your sleep cycle so you sleep poorly for those... making your tired, weak, or crazy over time. Or controlling other IoT devices so the electrical fire begins only after you're fully asleep...or the "smart" stove turns on the gas when you are least likely to smell it. Pranks where you wake up hearing creepy sounds around in the house.
How about this-- you make intruder sounds around the house (hacked echos) when you detect their child is up late which encourages them to arm themselves and shoot their child by mistake. (hey, it happens already without any help.) Movie: victim almost falls for it, 2nd time does not, 3rd time they are unarmed and the killer gets them.
Micormanaging our lives (Score:2)
Novel or blingy wins over taking rational direct action. Human nature I guess.
I think many see these tools as fun distracting games, where you see if you can alter the numbers and get a feeling of control.
But do any of these "tools" actually ever help in the long run?
See you in hell Amazon (Score:4, Interesting)
because that is where you will be before I let any of your spyware into my home.
Just because you can, does not mean that you should.
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because that is where you will be before I let any of your spyware into my home.
Just because you can, does not mean that you should.
And you're fine with that, as long as you don't live in a multi-unit dwelling whose walls are penetrable by the radar. Your privacy might suffer collateral damage because your neighbour's device might spy on you.
What was that song again (Score:3)
Every breath you take goes big tech.
Yes, bathe me in radiation and invade my bedroom. (Score:1)
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bathe me in radiation
Oh, good grief. My folks knew a couple who lived across a field from one of the dishes of the innermost DEW Line radar for 40+ years. They died in their 80s in a car crash.
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This is a common misbelief. It turns out microphones do not emit radiation when activated.
If you were to place a small gemstone, perhaps attached to a ring, on your bedstand it would be a much more significant radiation source.
maybe? (Score:3)
Que the tinfoil hats (Score:2)
If you don't want your sleep monitored then don't buy the product and enable the eature.
Re:Que the tinfoil hats (Score:4, Interesting)
I can't help but chuckle a bit when I see comments like this. Right at the moment, yes, you can refuse to use the product. But once it gets a firm foothold in the marketplace, it expands its reach. And as it does so, the part of it that rapes your privacy is already "baked in". I assume you've heard of how police are now using those camera/doorbells create surveillance systems that span entire neighbourhoods. With permission, of course. Do you think that's how they were originally marketed?
So let's just take a look at this device...essentially radar to sense movement in one room, or maybe a whole apartment. And maybe, if you live in a crowded building, part of the apartment next door, too. I don't know what its capabilities are, but you can bet such a device won't become LESS capable over time. So then some bright spark at an insurance company offers a hefty discount to homeowners who install it, because it would actually make a pretty good burglar alarm. Then they start jacking up the cost of regular house insurance until your choice is basically to install the device or take a significant financial hit to keep your home insured. Then maybe your health insurance company offers you a bit of a discount if you're willing to let them monitor you. All it would take is just a little software tweak you'll never see on the device that is already part of your home decor. And maybe the people you work for want to protect their investment by ensuring their employees are make healthy life choices, so they start applying pressure.
And guess what. Before long, you have the option of installing one of these things in your home, or resign yourself to paying one or more corporations the part of your income that used to let you take a holiday somewhere nice. But, hey, it's your choice, right?
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I assume you've heard of how police are now using those camera/doorbells create surveillance systems that span entire neighbourhoods. With permission, of course. Do you think that's how they were originally marketed?
Yes. In fact, that is the main reason people buy them. It is the primary feature of the product.
What freaks people out is when they find out the porch pirates hacked somebody's camera, and used it to find out when the deliveries happened. That is that the unintended consequence that wasn't marketed. Not the "they say yes and give the police permission whenever they ask" part.
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I agree with you that people would freak out about having their camera hacked. However, this is a relatively rare phenomenon, and far from my experience. I know a number of people who have camera/doorbells, and not one installed them with a view to allowing police access to their devices. In addition, I am familiar with a real estate company that offers installation of a doorbell camera to home buyers even before the houses are built. They emphasize privacy and absolutely do NOT discuss providing police
Re: Que the tinfoil hats (Score:1)
You're the apoligist nutter, mate.
Everyone sane is against this.
Only you types always come crawling out of your human barns, to see conspiracy theorists everywhere, whenever somebody comes rattling at your house of cards of comforting delusions. Scared that your belief that your willful ignorance of the growing problem and your preventative complete submission to authority might all come apart at the seams, and you won't be able to handle it.
While there is a sane middle way, you're just a differnt type of c
Ho ho ho (Score:4, Insightful)
They see you when you're sleeping.
They know when you're awake.
So you better watch out or you will get coal in your next package.
Google sells this now. Really. (Score:1)
See https://arstechnica.com/gadget... [arstechnica.com]
Thanks (Score:3)
Can't sleep. Clown will eat me.
For whose benefit? (Score:2)
"Amazon Wants to Monitor You in Your Sleep, for Your Benefit"
For whose benefit?
Last I checked, Amazon wasn't in the "we do things because we love you" business.
Surely they don't see a way to profit from monitoring me in my sleep, no, that couldn't be it.
Uh Huh (Score:2)
If they want to see me when I'm sleeping and know when I'm awake, they'd better be prepared to show up with a sleigh full of toys and goodies. Otherwise it's a hard no.
Then there's the 300 lb Gorilla in the Room (Score:2)