Tesla Unveils Model S Plaid: 520+ Miles, 200 MPH, and 0-60 MPH In Less Than 2s (electrek.co) 191
In addition to promising a $25,000 Tesla, Elon Musk unveiled its Model S Plaid, the new highest performance version of its flagship sedan. Electrek reports: The electric car is going to have over 520 miles of range, 200 mph top speed, and 0 to 60 mph acceleration in less than two seconds. The automaker lists the following features on its website:
- Quickest 0-60 mph and quarter-mile acceleration of any production car ever
- Acceleration from 0-60 mph: less than 2.0 s
- Quarter mile: less than 9.0 s
- Tri Motor All-Wheel Drive
In a quick video, Tesla briefly revealed the latest Model S Plaid prototype design. This new prototype appears to be significantly toned down versus the prototype unveiled last week and looks closer to the current Model S. Tesla is now taking orders for the vehicle, and it unveiled the price. It starts at $139,990 before options. Musk said that Tesla brought the Model S Plaid prototype to the Laguna Seca racetrack last weekend, and they achieved a 1:30 lap time. Last year, Tesla completed a lap in 1:36.55 with the prototype Model S Plaid. What about the $25,000 Tesla? Well, thanks to its various battery innovations, "We're confident we can make a very, very compelling $25,000 electric vehicle, that's also fully autonomous," Musk said. "And when you think about the $25,000 price point you have to consider how much less expensive it is to own an electric vehicle. So actually, it becomes even more affordable at that $25,000 price point."
- Quickest 0-60 mph and quarter-mile acceleration of any production car ever
- Acceleration from 0-60 mph: less than 2.0 s
- Quarter mile: less than 9.0 s
- Tri Motor All-Wheel Drive
In a quick video, Tesla briefly revealed the latest Model S Plaid prototype design. This new prototype appears to be significantly toned down versus the prototype unveiled last week and looks closer to the current Model S. Tesla is now taking orders for the vehicle, and it unveiled the price. It starts at $139,990 before options. Musk said that Tesla brought the Model S Plaid prototype to the Laguna Seca racetrack last weekend, and they achieved a 1:30 lap time. Last year, Tesla completed a lap in 1:36.55 with the prototype Model S Plaid. What about the $25,000 Tesla? Well, thanks to its various battery innovations, "We're confident we can make a very, very compelling $25,000 electric vehicle, that's also fully autonomous," Musk said. "And when you think about the $25,000 price point you have to consider how much less expensive it is to own an electric vehicle. So actually, it becomes even more affordable at that $25,000 price point."
Spaceball Reference (Score:2)
Re:Spaceball Reference (Score:5, Funny)
But not referenced in the article or is Spaceballs just that popular
Popular in general? no.
Popular here? Are you kidding? Being bilingual on this forum means you understand both Klingon and Vogon.
Of course we know how fast Plaid is. And yes, some of us have even survived a poetry reading.
Re:Spaceball Reference (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Spaceball Reference (Score:4, Funny)
This would also explain why I’m surrounded by Assholes.
FTFY
C'mon now, at least acknowledge the family name.
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Arsoles? [wikipedia.org]
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Arsoles? [wikipedia.org]
Perhaps I should clarify now.
Mel Brooks is the American actor and director behind Spaceballs, the movie that birthed all of the Plaid and Ludicrous Speed references. In this movie, they speak about assholes. Or more specifically, Assholes. (I won't spoil any more.)
Douglas Adams is the genius writer behind H2G2 and the "Don't Panic!" references. Arseholes is the British slang term for assholes. The aforementioned actor/director is not British nor is the movie, so not quite sure why I was corrected.
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Oh freddled gruntbuggly,
Thy micturations are to me
As plurdled gabbleblotchits on a lurgid bee.
Groop, I implore thee, my foonting turlingdromes,
And hooptiously drangle me with crinkly bindlewurdles,
Or I will rend thee in the gobberwarts
With my blurglecruncheon, see if I don't!
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Carnegie Mellon alumni are so vain, they thought the name was about them.
Alunmi would imply we're talking to the older generations as well. Rather sad that this is the way I'm reminded of my age now; explaining cheesy pop culture references to seemingly everyone these days who didn't catch one of the 4,502 hints the billionaire nerd has dropped in his products.
I mean seriously, "Ludicrous Speed" has been a thing now in Teslas for years. The first few hits of an online search explains both "Ludicrous Speed" and "They've gone to Plaid!". Was it really that hard for people to fi
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It had better be a spaceballs reference. Or spending $140K for a car painted plaid is going to piss off a lot of rich customers.
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Spaceballs Joke? (Score:2)
Re:Spaceballs Joke? (Score:5, Informative)
Well considering their previous top speed upgrade was called, "Ludicrous Speed," I'd say an homage is a safe bet.
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That would be true of any vehicle, though. Attempts to stop at top speed without at least some form of decelerationary period usually end...poorly [youtu.be]...
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It could be worse. [youtu.be]
elon please (Score:2)
I don't want it to be autonomous
you keep working on that but please do not hold EV adoptability hostage with it you jerk
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$25K is cheap. The Nissan Leaf starts at $31.6K, and I've never heard anything good said about it. I wonder if Tesla can pull that off and if so what it would be like. Obviously it won't be a Model S.
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https://www.quora.com/What-is-... [quora.com]
Re:elon please (Score:4, Informative)
Meanwhile, as has been pointed out to you repeated times, with numerous examples linked, and which you can verify for yourself, the SR- is available for $35k off-menu. It's a software-downgraded SR+. Offmenu to discourage people from buying it because they get less profit on it (since it's the same hardware as the SR+).
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I don't want it to be autonomous
Then don't put it into autonomous mode. Problem solved.
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I don't want it to be autonomous
Then don't put it into autonomous mode. Problem solved.
Or for that matter don't even buy it. It costs $8K extra which if you got it would be 24% the overall price of the car.
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Musk doesn't know what "fully autonomous" actually means. If he does, he's lying. Again.
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> I don't want it to be autonomous
It's not, unless you pay for that extra option
Here we go again... (Score:5, Funny)
"We're confident we can make a very, very compelling $25,000 electric vehicle, that's also fully autonomous, and includes a nubile supermodel at no extra charge"
Re:Here we go again... (Score:4, Informative)
To be fair, $25K can buy a fairly nubile supermodel. For at least one day, anyway.
And if you have one, who wants to drive?!
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Are there supermodels who are NOT nubile?
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They missed the $35k target, and they are going to miss the latest full autonomy target (December 31st 2020). Do investors actually believe this stuff any more?
There are already decent EVs in the $25k bracket. The Leaf 40, MG ZS EV, Zoe, Ioniq.
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I have a Zoe. It doesn't cost $25k! It's a lot more than that. Per month, it can be pretty cheap though
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If you look around you can get a pre-reg new one for around £25k including taxes. The exchange rate is bad at the moment but it's in the bracket.
As you say they offer some silly deals if you lease or do finance.
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and includes a nubile supermodel at no extra charge
Well you may want to charge it before putting it in Plaid mode or you won't get very far.
"fully autonomous" (Score:2, Interesting)
"fully autonomous"
Haha, no, not without LIDAR it isn't.
Re:"fully autonomous" (Score:5, Interesting)
You seem to be of the impression that LIDAR is the only way to generate point clouds, and that it doesn't generate faulty point clouds in adverse weather conditions?
Lidar and high-resolution premapping are the two main cheats a company can use to try to make them look further ahead on general autonomy than they actually are.
(All of this said: I have no expectations of general autonomy any time soon. Eventually, yes, but I'm not holding my breath)
(That said: Autopilot, as it is - paired with a human - is friggin' magic. Back when it was optional I wouldn't have even bought it, but it became standard, and now it feels like stepping back into the stone age to drive without it)
520 miles / 800km range (Score:4, Insightful)
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Although this range is obviously not going to hold up to hard driving, I still take this as an encouraging sign that electric vehicles may actually be able to complete Grand Prix events on a single charge in the not-too-distant future, and F1 can move over for Formula E, which is where the manufacturers actually want to dump their money. Strategically, how is a car that doesn't refuel during the race any different from one that doesn't charge during the race, aside from one getting lighter and the other not
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Indeed, EV makers still have to make design effort to damp sound from their powertrains. I love the sound my Model 3 makes when I floor it - it's not loud, but it's like a sort of soft "sci-fi jet turbine" sound as you get pushed back into your seat. Don't add fake "vroom"s... just amp that up if people want louder vehicles at races!
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For most people it's a waste of money. Like dragging around a trailer full of gas in your fossil car.
Unless you regularly do 8+ hour non-stop journeys you might as well save yourself a small fortune and take a nice break while you charge, and splash some of the cash you saved on a fancy meal.
Anyway it remains to be seen if it's even true or not, until it's in the hands of customers this is just another Elon Musk promise that's not worth the electrons he tweeted it with.
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The fossil crowd will just find some other thing to complain about. Range is reduced when towing a 5 tonne trailer, it's more expensive than my 25 year old pick-up, my remote cabin in the woods is range+1 mile...
Prepare for itemized issues (Score:2)
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However, their progress has been amazing. 10 years ago, before Tesla's Model S, it seems like every auto manufacturer conspired to build EVs to be as unattractive as possible. They looked like penalty boxes (Leaf) or clown boxes (BMW i3) or both, with very short range, and with outrageous pricing. As expected, such projects were stillborn.
And then lo and behold, Tesla proved to everyone that it's possible to build an EV that looks like a normal sedan, and with a pretty good range, so that even a traveling s
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4) poorer people will not buy these because they dont have homes/chargers.
No, poorer people will not buy these because they can't afford to spend $140K on a car.
Wind Turbine (Score:2)
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We'll file that idea with the perpetual motion engines. Thanks for applying.
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I think they should add geothermal power plants to the cars.
Tires and 200 mph (Score:2)
So if it can do 200 mph it'll have to have ZR rated 200 mph tires. They will cost a lot and will sacrifice other attributes in order to be safe at that speed.
That is one reason cars have speed limiters, otherwise you saddle EVERY purchaser with the cost of the high speed rating tires. So I suspect 200 mph will be an extra cost option, all other Plaids will be deliberately crippled.
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On a $140k vehicle, I'm thinking the cost of replacement tires is, well, and afterthought.
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Musk focussing on the wrong thing. (Score:3)
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Tesla really needs to switch to pouch cell batteries to get the cost down. Theirs are expensive and lower energy density. They have some small advantages in terms of power output and charge rate, but as you say nobody cares about that down at $25k.
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Meanwhile, most EVs from other automakers are sold at a loss, and the few non-Teslas that earn a profit have small single-digit margins, while Tesla has 20-25% margins, on EVs that out-stat their price competitors. But I'm sure they could all teach Tesla a few things about making EVs affordably. (/eyeroll)
Re:Musk focussing on the wrong thing. (Score:5, Insightful)
There is a lot that can be done with electric motors to accelerate quickly, and not "burn rubber." Musk has talked about how his cars can detect the folding/ripple in the sidewall of tires just before tire slippage from acceleration would occur, and then back down the applied power.
Carrying a "larger than needed" electric motor only costs you in terms of perhaps a little bit extra weight. When not accelerating quickly, the larger motor doesn't consume more electricity for simply being larger.
I like Musk's approach to electric vehicles. He is working hard for a zero-compromise electric vehicle. He wants to make an electric vehicle where I give up nothing, only gain, by switching away from my internal combustion engine car. I deeply appreciate that approach. I wish more people who wanted to change the world took that approach, instead of trying to berate or gilt me into the decisions they wish I was making. Just make something that's so obviously 100% better than what I'md doing to day that I'll want to do it. And hidden inside that is the change you want.
Thank you Elon for showing the world on what healthy revolutionary change looks like.
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And it will be "fully autonomous" using their not-yet-existing Level 5 autonomy package.
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And it will be "fully autonomous" using their not-yet-existing Level 5 autonomy package.
Also forgetting the software package that lets the brakes function, $2k, the software package that lets you open the windows more than half way, $2k, and the "service" that doesn't send law enforcement your daily speed and tracking log, $2k/mo.
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Real car companies don't lock out features that the car physically has and then charge you thousands to access them. You want an extra 100km of range, no problem, we'll unlock that feature of your car for $5k. Real car companies don't have mandatory OTA updates that actually change the features of your car. Tesla is like Windows for Autos. They own your car, you just pay them to use it.
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Great reporting
Well, it was announced at the event. Reporting it certainly seems fair.
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They already have an operational pilot line, so I have no clue what you're talking about.
That said, see below.
Re:$25k Tesla? (Score:5, Informative)
Hmm, meant to reply to a more appropriate spot below, but people are talking about everything but batteries elsewhere, so I guess I'll reply here.
This was not "Plaid Day"; this was battery day. It was all about unveiling Tesla's new production line and the tech behind it. Let's start by getting the above out of the way: yes, they already have an operational production line producing cells. But at the same time, let's counter: it's a pilot line. Apart from being only designed for 10GWh/yr (vs. the design spec of 20GWh/yr for mass produced lines... although 7x more than the current lines at GF1), it currently only runs intermittently and has a very high scrappage rate. The plaid prototypes they're testing use the cells from the line, but they don't plan to even be up to Plaid-deliveries scales until a year from now. But let's reiterate: not only do the batteries exist, but a line to mass produce them exists.
The new approach is highly radical on a lot of fronts, but in particular the raw materials. But more in a bit. The net results are:
Range: +54% (+16% cell design, +20% anode material, +4% cathode material, +14% cell/vehicle integration
$/kWh reduction: 56% (+14% cell design, +18% cell factory, +5% anode material, +12% cathode material, +7% cell/vehicle integration
Capex reduction/GWh/yr: 69% (+7% cell design, +34% cell factory, +4% anode material, +16% cathode material, +8% cell/vehicle integration
The individual components:
Cell design: the cells are a large format tabless cell. Normally cells contain tabs for drawing out the current; the film feed has to constantly stop and restart to bond the tabs on. Current also has to spiral the entire length of the jelly roll, and peak heating is in part in the core. The new design uses laser bonding to generate what are effectively mini-tabs bonded together on the top and bottom of the finished jelly roll; it's really beautiful. Current flow is top to bottom, a vastly shorter flow path. As a result, they can vastly increase format size, which increases max energy density and power density, without a meaningful thermal impact (e.g. limit to peak charge rates). [twimg.com]
Anode material: graphite is out. They're going to silicon, which is nearly as high anode energy density as lithium metal, and an order of magnitude higher than graphite (decreased only by the encapsulator). But that's not the crazy thing... their silicon raw material is not anything expensive like nanowires, or even high purity silicon, but just ordinary metallurgical silicon. They use a process to encapsulate powdered metallurgical silicon particles in a polymer coating, so that when particles fracture (which silicon does when charging), they remain in contact with each other, and it also protects the SEI from breaking. To put it bluntly, their main anode material is minimally-processed sand.
Cathodes: cobalt-free. Using novel coatings and dopants to achieve it. Doesn't seem to be single-crystal cathodes, however, as were speculated. They're using a flexible approach to deal with supply scaleup issues - high-nickel for density-needy tasks like Cybertruck and Semi; nickel-manganese for long-range passenger cars; and iron for mid-range passenger cars. The most mind-blowing thing to anyone who follows the industry is they're not using nickel sulfate; they're using plain old ferronickel. This changes everything. I mean, forget about HPAL.
(A big thing which they repeatedly drove home was eliminating atavistic cruft.... e.g., take raw material A, convert it to B, send it to someone who converts it to C, to someone who converts it to D.... and so on, and go to as direct processes as possible)
Lithium: while they apparently plan to also use lithium hydroxide from spodumene - in particular, they had a dot on the massive deposits Piedmont owns in North Carolina (reserves several times larger than the
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No mod points, but thanks for the informative post! I find your info on lithium especially interesting.
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"Seriously, WTF is wrong with some of these commenters?"
They lost a few times drag-racing and losing against Teslas with their gas-guzzling super-cars.
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You'd be surprised how often they lost to a Nissan Leaf. Seriously.
Their fossil might have a 5 second 0-60 when new but by the time they bought it used and with their ability to shift through the gears... Well the Leaf often left them behind in my experience, and it was hilarious. The noise their cars made, the strain and the groaning and grinding!
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It's like Tesla is shooting for G-forces that a fighter jet pilot might endure.
There's no need to be melodramatic; going from 0 to 96.5 km/h in two seconds means experiencing only 1.67 g. Figther jet pilots experience several times higher acceleration.
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When a car accelerates fast enough to disrupt the blood circulating in your body, that's too fast. It's like Tesla is shooting for G-forces that a fighter jet pilot might endure.
Blood circulation and blood pressure are not meaningfully affected until close to 3G, which would require just under 1s 0-60 time. This Tesla would cause forces closer to 1.5G. At that speed you will start to feel heavier in your seat and in your extremities but aren't reaching speeds where you need harnesses or are at risk of passing out.
Roller Coasters often reach acceleration of 4-5G for short periods. This is the best comparison I have for riding passenger in a Tesla under insane mode. I felt like I was
Re: 0-60 in 2s??? (Score:4, Insightful)
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How fast from zero to fast enough to kill a pedestrian? I'm guessing tenths of a second.
Won't be fast enough until Grandpa wanna-be-sports-driver can actually black out from the acceleration and kill people with the car. Driver "wins" by technical no-fault.
To your point, I don't even know why this thing is street legal. It's going to be scary when they capture the attention of the 17-year old Lambo crowd. Instant torque isn't always a good thing on public roads, especially bolted to a teenage driver.
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I think 1.37Gs. About what you would get in an airplane holding altitude at a 45 degree bank. At 60 degree bank you would get 2 Gs.
Not that much really, but you will feel it.
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I had a Lotus Exige that would do 0-60 in about 4.3s. From my Vbox Performance box, I would pull about 1.2G, and about 1.1G lateral on corners.
You would get thrown back into the seat, even with the 5 point harness. It's fun, and not really uncomfortable.
Not even close to harmful (Score:3, Insightful)
Uh... is that even safe? How many G-forces is that? Wouldn't people pass out?
0-60 in 2.39 seconds is "only" 1.14g [jalopnik.com], so basically like laying down. It's just you aren't use to gravity suddenly flipping like that so it feels like much more force.
That same article mentions a dragster that can do 0-60 in about 0.86 seconds is 5.3g, which is totally doable.
Now as to the ability of the drive being ablate control that kind of acceleration... safe as long as there's traction control so the possible acceleration doe
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Gravity doesn't flip, it still pulls down at 1g as the car pushes you forward at 1.14g. So the magnitude of the sum is... what... a little over 1.5g.
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From all the videos I've seen of passengers in their first Model S launch, anything over 1g acceleration forces your face into a shit-eating grin... at least the first dozen or so times.
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The fact that your autocorrect changed "able to" to "ablate" suggests you write about this sort of thing a lot...
Re:0-60 in 2s??? (Score:5, Informative)
Not terribly much. gravity is much stronger than most people think.
60mph is 88 feet per second.
gravity is 32 feet per second per second
At 1G it would take you about ~2.7 seconds to reach 60mph.
At 2G it would take you ~1.4 seconds to reach 60mph.
0-60mph in 2s is ~1.4G.
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Re:0-60 in 2s??? (Score:4, Informative)
None of this is about practicality; it's about rich people showing off their ability to buy and play with the coolest and most expensive toys (and the rest of us getting to watch Tesla push the edge of what's technically achievable given a large budget and a spare-no-expense attitude).
The practical people will buy a more reasonably priced Model 3, or perhaps a Chevy Bolt or similar.
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Yeah, I'd buy a Nissan Leaf before I stooped low enough to tolerate that kind of quality.
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Detroit (Score:3)
Good to hear that the old Detroit attitude of 'slap them together and let the customers sort them out' is alive and well.
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See, that's the thing. A cheap econobox will have panel gaps that are virtually spot on. Sure, a Rolls or other such vehicle will have the gaps perfect (because it's expected to be), but the thing is, even a cheap econobox doesn't have gap issues that Teslas have.
And that's saying something - the cheap econobox is cheap, and yet the gap
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People love to dump on the Leaf and to be fair the original wasn't a looker, but the new one looks like a normal car and it's a pretty good deal really. The 40kWh version is very cheap, you can get a decent spec one new for around £20k and it's fine even for occasional long journeys. The 62kWh model can be had for around £30k.
They have a decent amount of space, nice ride, autopilot etc. The interior needs updating but for the money they are pretty good.
Re:$25k and . . . . . (Score:4, Informative)
This is so much nonsense. My car's trim was perfectly aligned; the same can't be said for my last car. The only "problem" I had wasn't with the car, but with one of the two charging cables not liking my home wiring. They swapped it out for me without even needing an appointment. I also asked them to adjust the touch sensitivity for the charge port finger sensor for me, which they did quickly.
Only "maintenance" since that point has been adding wiper fluid.
Results from the Bloomberg owners satisfaction survey [bloomberg.com] (order: "very satisfied" / "satisfied" / "neutral" / "unsatisfied" / "very unsatisfied" -> Total unsatisfied):
Buying process: 74,5% / 15,2% / 5,3% / 3,1% / 1,7% -> 4,8%
Service centres: 54,7% / 21,1% / 18,8% / 2,8% / 1.9% -> 4,7%
Mobile service: 84,0% / 12,6% / 1,8% / 0,9% / 0,6% -> 1,5%
Initial quality: 59,8% / 19,3% / 18,7% / 1,5% / 0,7% -> 2,2%
Ongoing quality: 60,4% / 19,8% / 17,0% / 1,9% / 1% -> 2,9%
Order: "strongly agree" / "agree" / "neutral" / "disagree" / "strongly disagree" -> Total disagree:
Would recommend to friends or family: 92,6% / 6,2% / 0,6% / 0,3% / 0,3% -> 0,6%
Would buy again: 90,3% / 7,9% / 1,2% / 0,4% / 0,3% -> 0,7%
Has exceeded my expectations: 81,6% / 16,0% / 1,8% / 0,3% / 0,3% -> 0,6%
More reliable than my previous cars: 55,8% / 21,6% / 20,1% / 2,0% / 0,5% -> 2,5%
These are numbers most automakers would kill for. The only things that needed improvement at the time of the survey were time to repair (average for the past three quarters then 14,4 / 14,4 / 17,9 - although anecdotally, shorter now - vs an industry average of about 10 days), and customer service, whose satisfied / unsatisfied ratings were: 39,0% / 23,8% / 24,3% / 8,3% / 4,7% -> 13,0%
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25 hours of your own time to fix the horrendous panel gaps that Tesla refuses to fix
Oh no panel gaps. What will we do! Tell you what, if you don't like the look of the car, don't buy it.
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My model 3 had the glass roof misaligned by 2.5 mm - was replaced for free. All the other panels are spaced just fine.
The three other Tesla owners i know don't have any complains about their panel gaps and also they don't know anybody else who does.
At this point i'm curious to see with my own eyes a Tesla with misaligned panels - maybe Elon Musk has somehow decided to send only the best cars in my area and everybody else gets bad ones ?
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range anxiety
Try some noise canceling headphones to muffle the other shooters.
Re:520 mile range AND 9 second quarters? (Score:5, Insightful)
So you had a Porsche and a Prius in the same car, and you were unhappy about it? You could swap between the two at will, and that was an issue?
That's a problem that I can't possibly fathom. It puts first world problems to shame.
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To be honest, getting half your rated range when driving balls-out is actually pretty damn impressive and you have no right to complain.
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Because thatâ(TM)s why I didnâ(TM)t like my p90d, it had a 300+ mile range and could do 10 second quarter mile but if I drove it like a car that could do a 10 second quarter mile I got about 170 miles. If I drove it like a Prius I could get almost 300 miles, but I didnâ(TM)t pay six figures to drive slow.
Don't drive on public roads like you're in mad max, OK? Get on the interstate than cruise at the speed limit until you reach your turn off.
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as opposed to a gas car, which gets its rated MPG even when you drive it balls-out.
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EVERY car on the market can brake as quickly as the coefficient of friction allows, including city cars with drum rear brakes. Brakes may overheat if doing that multiple times in a row, but there's no good reason to do that in normal traffic. If this Tesla will stop faster than a Toyota Aygo, it will mostly be because of better tyres.
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Last we knew, it was Goodyear Eagle F1, replacing the previous Michelin Cup 2R tires. But yeah, massive track tires, about as track performance optimized as you can get without ruining wet performance (e.g. not slicks).
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It seems to me that you might own the title to a Tesla but you only really have a license to operate. Tesla could send out an update to brick your car. That tells me that they are in control. Sorry... Elon Musk is in control of your car.
Not for me thanks.
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You mean like every smartphone in existence?
You're free to disable the mobile connection if you're paranoid about Big Brother or hackers. Of course, it means no updates and no realtime data.