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China Transportation Power

Tesla Investigates After Parked Model S Appears To Explode In China (cnn.com) 284

"CNN reports on CCTV footage from China showing a parked Model S bursting violently into flames," writes Slashdot reader dryriver. From the report: Tesla is investigating after one of its vehicles appeared to explode in China. A short video of surveillance footage posted on Chinese social media site Weibo (WB) showed white smoke emerging from what looks like a white Tesla car parked at a lot in Shanghai. After a few seconds, the electric vehicle bursts into flames and the clip ends soon afterward. The video, which was filmed just after 8:15 pm local time on April 21, appears to show a Tesla Model S sedan. It was posted on Chinese social media a couple of hours later and has since been shared widely. The clip attracted a mix of derision and outrage on Weibo. "Us car owners demand an explanation," wrote user Miao Hongyang. "Jeopardizing our safety in a moment's instant and the fact it ignited so quickly is something we will not tolerate." Another Weibo user registered under the name Your Dad, added: "One thing I've learned from this incident: from now on, don't ever park next to a Tesla.'"
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Tesla Investigates After Parked Model S Appears To Explode In China

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  • by sinij ( 911942 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @09:10AM (#58476712)
    If Tesla cars were prone to doing this we would have heard about this by now. As such, my conclusion that this is a setup by Communist Party of China to justify ban/tech extortion scheme as part of trade war with Trump.
    • If they were going to do this, why would they pick Tesla to vilify? Surely there are larger American companies in China.
      • by sinij ( 911942 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @09:15AM (#58476732)
        Exactly because it is Tesla - a) iconic US company b) not very likely to be defended by current administration. If they pick on "larger American companies" Trump might retaliate in a way that would actually hurt.
        • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

          If you want to push that theory then the US has already escalated well beyond this point by trying to extradite a senior Huawei employee and getting Huawei products banned in many countries. If China was going to play Trump's game they would't dick about setting cars on fire, they would start rounding up Microsoft and Amazon staff in China and blocking US companies completely.

          Remember that back in the real world China's strategy here is to simply wait Trump out (election next year).

          • by sinij ( 911942 )
            You have to consider that in a trade war between US and China there is a MAD (mutually assured destruction) that might even escalate into a hot war So they can't go all-out and have to limit to fighting proxy wars.

            China have done similar to Canada - where they declared canola imports 'contaminated with pests' and used it as a pretext to ban.
          • Remember that back in the real world China's strategy here is to simply wait Trump out (election next year).

            That's my strategy, too.

            I can't imagine what he'll be replaced with though. The democrats don't seem to have learned much from the last election.

            • by aitikin ( 909209 )

              I can't imagine what he'll be replaced with though. The democrats don't seem to have learned much from the last election.

              They learned to at least have a more open primary...a little too open, but that's besides the point...

        • by DarkOx ( 621550 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @09:58AM (#58476974) Journal

          So to restate; your theory is China chose a target you believe they think he does not care about as a way of retaliating against Trump...

          I absolutely believe the Chinese start little fires all the time to discover what they can get away with and gain insights into what a larger American response might look like. This could certainly be that (both literally in this case as well as figuratively). However I don't think its 'retaliatory'. I think the Chinese leadership as well as much of our own leadership believe our economies are quite tied together for the time being, and neither is going to rock the boat. If its anything other than 'shit-test' so to speak its for domestic propaganda use.

          The Chinese have a long term plan to unwind our economic relationship. I don't think we do and I don't think we will like the Chinese plan much. Which is one reason I strongly support Trump pouring as much gasoline and setting fire to US-Sino relations and policy because blowing things up now is waaaay better for us than it will be simply waiting around for China to make their move. I think if we acknowledged them as the cold war enemy they are and timed some aggressive trade restrictions to their economic cycle we do things to them like leave them with major production and housing overhang in cities and probably cause some quite crippling economic shocks; we'd feel them too but I think we could make them feel it deeper. Mix in a little propaganda effort of our own and maybe gin up enough civil unrest to cause some real chaos over there.

          However the window of opportunity to ensure American hegemony for the century to come is rapidly closing and loose cannons like Donald Trump are the best the average American has any real hope of getting elected. Sadly the rest of our political class is two stupid, cowardly, or actively seeking to sabotage America for their own gain to even admit there is a problem.

          • Agreed. At some point in the next few decades China is going to finally make its move. They are going try and take over the south china sea, will invade Taiwan and likely a few other things that aren't obvious now. Better to act now while they aren't ready and we have the upper hand than to wait for them to get to full strength. It's simple realpolitik.
          • by jeremyp ( 130771 )

            China did not start the trade war.

            China, like virtually all developed nations has discovered that you get richer by trading with people than by having wars with them, especially if they possess the weapons to level all your cities.

            As for American hegemony. That ship has sailed.

        • by jeremyp ( 130771 )

          Sooooo what you are saying is that China wants to extort something out of America in the trade wars but they deliberately chose a company that the administration doesn't care about?

      • by greatgreygreengreasy ( 706454 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @09:15AM (#58476742)
        It couldn't be because of the rise of electric vehicles in China, and the Chinese companies making electric vehicles who want to control the market. Nope, that couldn't be it at all. Absolutely not....
        • BYD alone makes ten times as many electric cars as Tesla does. Combined with other Chinese companies, it's probably 20 times Tesla's production. Tesla is very popular with 25-35 males in the United States, globally they're insignificant in business terms.

          • by dgatwood ( 11270 )

            BYD alone makes ten times as many electric cars as Tesla does. Combined with other Chinese companies, it's probably 20 times Tesla's production. Tesla is very popular with 25-35 males in the United States, globally they're insignificant in business terms.

            In 2018, I'm pretty sure Tesla outsold BYD's electric cars, though not by a lot. Either way, they're within a few percent of each other. Maybe you were comparing against all BYD sales (most of which are either gasoline or hybrid, not all-electric)?

      • If they were going to do this, why would they pick Tesla to vilify? Surely there are larger American companies in China.

        China has its own companies that are Chinese versions of Tesla. Since they import a lot of oil, China is very interested in electric cars. It could be that one of these companies made the video. It could be that an investor in one of these companies did it. It could be legit. I wouldn't necessarily conclude that the CCP is behind the video. They whip up the military and some of the population pretty constantly with the propaganda that the USA is constantly seeking to destroy them. I wouldn't rule

        • China has only the appearance of a "free market economy" In reality most large companies are partly if not wholly owned by the government, at the very least they are getting funding from a government controlled bank. Not to mention that the justice system (and secret police) are completely under the control of the CCP. No Chinese company would even think of pulling a high profile stunt like this without at least approval if not direction by the CCP
        • by parkinglot777 ( 2563877 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @01:28PM (#58478152)

          And I'm surprised that a surveillance camera is not that stable at all. Shouldn't a surveillance camera be mounted to the wall/ceiling? Besides, if it is moving, it should be smoothly moving to one direction back and forth? The video shows that the camera is moving a little bit as if someone is holding it. The shaking doesn't look like it is from lens adjusting because lens adjusting should be blur in and out but still stable. To me, this is someone making the video, not an accident.

      • If they were going to do this, why would they pick Tesla to vilify? Surely there are larger American companies in China.

        It's not the company, it's the product. Electric cars are a big deal in China right now, they don't want foreigners in there.

        Watching the video: It's a huge explosion. Nothing like a lithium fire.

        • "Electric cars are a big deal in China right now, they don't want foreigners in there." - Not sure thats correct, Telsa is expecting to be opening a factory in Shanghai to produce "will produce affordable versions of 3/Y for greater China." according to Musk's tweet
    • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

      Doubtful, given that Tesla is building a big factory in China which is partly Chinese owned.

      These kinds of catastrophic battery failures happen from time to time with Teslas, usually after they have been damaged somehow. Maybe this one ran over something.

      • by phayes ( 202222 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @09:29AM (#58476824) Homepage

        What better way to push Tesla into making concessions on obligatory tech transfer to Chinese Partners who can then move on to the Chinese BEV/Battery makers?

        That's a nice car you're making there, we wouldn't want any more "spontaneous" combustion incidents (that only happen "spontaneously" without any external cause to Chinese Teslas) to occur, now would we?

        Is this really far-fetched for a government that is openly hacking into every political and economic target they can?

        • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

          If they wanted the tech they could just pass a law mandating the transfer. As it is they only just relaxed the rules on joint Chinese ownership of western operations in China.

          It does seem far fetched that they would go to such lengths when there are easier options.

          • If they wanted the tech they could just pass a law mandating the transfer.

            The problem with this is it scares away other companies they may want to "transfer" in the future.

            They'd like everyone to try getting into China, then pick-and-choose the "good" ones to steal IP from, using the leverage of that company's already-existing Chinese market.

    • If Tesla cars were prone to doing this we would have heard about this by now. As such, my conclusion that this is a setup by Communist Party of China to justify ban/tech extortion scheme as part of trade war with Trump.

      Who left a Samsung Galaxy in the car?

    • If Tesla cars were prone to doing this we would have heard about this by now. As such, my conclusion that this is a setup by Communist Party of China to justify ban/tech extortion scheme as part of trade war with Trump.

      My dad was a volunteer fireman with a radio monitor in the car, and he sometimes got a call in the middle of driving somewhere else, and he sometimes drove to the fire directly instead of the fire station(*), and sometimes I happened to be in the car when this happened.

      I know first-hand that ICE cars sometimes catch fire and burn. They don't explode like you see on TV and the movies(**), but I saw one go from lit to completely-engulfed-in-flames in less than 30 seconds, which surprised me at the time. It wa

    • Awfully handy how the car is parked facing out, directly in tenspot the camera has the best view of... how many cameras does that parking garage have?

      • In China, security camera's are everywhere. There could be dozes of cameras in a parking garage. If something actually happens, you want to have some decent footage. It would be pointless to see someone breaking into a 20-pixel big car in the distance.

    • by GPS Pilot ( 3683 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @09:02PM (#58480478)

      In 1987, I parked a Dodge Omni owned by PennDOT. Soon, white smoke emerged from it. A fire had ignited under the hood. After it had burned itself out, we could see that all hoses and other non-metallic components were completely melted or turned to ash.

      In 2014, my coworker parked a Fiat 500 that she had rented from National. Soon, white smoke emerged from it. A fire had ignited under the hood. The Seal Beach fire department arrived.

      If either of these incidents had been caught on video, I don't think any news organization would be interested in them.

  • Every few weeks I see a New Report about a Car fire in my local area. A friend of mine had witnessed one with the driver still locked in the car, the flames in car fire are too hot to be able to help rescue the person. This is with standard Internal Combustion Engine cars.

    To hear about an Single Electric Car Fire across the globe, seems to show how much safer electric car technology is compared to IC Cars.

    Plus also it would be interested to see if there were any modifications done to it, outside the fact

    • by magzteel ( 5013587 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @09:25AM (#58476796)

      "To hear about an Single Electric Car Fire across the globe, seems to show how much safer electric car technology is compared to IC Cars."

      I don't think that's a clear comparison. The difference in the number of ic versus ev vehicles on the road is huge. My guess is we will see more of these as ev vehicle use increases. Im sure we will just consider it acceptable risk, just like fires with other products.

      • I don't think that's a clear comparison. The difference in the number of ic versus ev vehicles on the road is huge.

        It's too bad we can't do something like divide the number of fires by the number of vehicles to compensate for this difference.

    • Every few weeks I see a New Report about a Car fire in my local area.

      Where the heck do you live - Watts? I live in the Seattle area, which is fairly populous, and I haven’t seen a car fire in probably 20 years.

    • Every few weeks I see a New Report about a Car fire in my local area.

      I used to drive a 1987 Mazda RX7 Turbo 2. The 2nd gen models had a tendency to have engine fires later on in their life due to a stupid part they put on the fuel rail. The Fuel Pulsation Dampener was a spring that went on the end and was supposed to dampen any kind of vibrations on the fuel line. 10+ years into it's life though it would start to wear out and possibly leak gas into the engine bay. Some people kept fire extinguishers in their FCs in case of engine fire. One guy talked about how it saved

  • "Burst into flames" =/= "explode"

  • by sabbede ( 2678435 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @09:28AM (#58476812)
    A clip of CCTV footage showing a car coming aflame, that's what we have. No certainty that it is even a Tesla, no indication as to why or how it caught fire, but plenty of people are apparently excited to jump the gun. Arson, previous accident, and tampering have yet to be ruled out, but we still get to hear from idiots on how they won't be buying Teslas because of things they don't know?

    Among other things, this is a great example of why social media should never be reported on. It just amplifies idiocy.

    • Trials by media, which are admittedly less accurate, offer the advantage of being faster and more satisfying and lucrative to the various outlets which carry the trials. When trials by media aren't available, science by media is a good standby.

  • by 140Mandak262Jamuna ( 970587 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @09:28AM (#58476814) Journal
    The posted video had frames dropped and speeded up to make the fire more of an explosion than simple fire.

    Edited video posted a day before the self driving event and the earnings calls makes it suspicious.

    The previous incidents of "spontaneous combustion" turned out to have debris strike, and bullet fired from the back seat into the battery pack.

    This is a win-win scenario for the anti-Tesla activists. Any one taking pains to debunk it can be painted as a fan-boi. And by the time truth comes one no one would care, no news outlet will give the final report the same prominence these initial edited videos get.

    • by Holi ( 250190 )
      If you are talking about 20:15:20, I get your point, the time stamp seems to lose it's cadence for a second or so.
      • by TFlan91 ( 2615727 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @10:16AM (#58477066)

        If you play frame-by-frame, the video is without a doubt altered.

        The grey overlay is 100% fabricated. As the smoke starts to flow out from under the car, and AS it is doing this, the grey overlay starts to appear over the WHOLE video.

        Then "FLASH" an "explosion" (paired with some really weird music).

        • by religionofpeas ( 4511805 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @10:46AM (#58477266)

          Someone is filming a security monitor (presumably with their phone).

          The monitor displays a constant overlay with a time code. In the beginning the time code is white, but at the moment of the explosion, the software in the monitor sees so much light that it decides to switch the time code to black. Maybe there's a small delay involved, or maybe the difference in frame rate between monitor and phone causes some jitter, explaining the irregularities.

          • by Rei ( 128717 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @11:15AM (#58477444) Homepage

            So, second 19 is half the length of the others, and second 20 50% longer, at the exact moment when the fire bursts forth, by sheer coincidence?

            Be serious. Someone wanted to make this look worse than it was.

            • by religionofpeas ( 4511805 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @11:35AM (#58477548)

              at the exact moment when the fire bursts forth, by sheer coincidence?

              Not a coincidence. The sudden bright light from the explosion causes the playback software to change time code from white to black. It's possible that this introduces a small offset.

              But Let's say it was manipulated a bit around the 19-20 second mark. Does that really make a difference ?

              It's still a huge fire that develops within 10 seconds.

              And if the whole thing is faked, why make such an obvious mistake with the time code ?

        • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @11:48AM (#58477626) Homepage Journal

          Actually that's normal for those kinds of overlays. For some reason instead of putting a border around the text they check the brightness of the video under it and select either light or dark text to provide contrast. It's very common with CCTV.

          What does look odd is the dropped frame when the explosion happens, although again it could be the camera exceeding the data rate of a single frame or changing to a new file or something else. Without the original files we will never know.

    • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

      I agree it looks odd, but nevertheless EVs should be able to survive being shot without it causing a catastrophic fire in most cases.

      Mythbusters actually tested this aspect of "movie physics" where bullets make combustion cars... combust. They found that it's damn near impossible to detonate a tank of petrol with a bullet. Same goes for debris striking the underside of the car etc. Modern cars are pretty safe.

      Hopefully we can get EVs to the same level of robustness.

  • by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @09:37AM (#58476872)
    Comment removed based on user account deletion
  • Is it just me or does that phrasing suggest that something that happens to look like an explosion of some kind could actually ever be something else entirely?

    A short video of surveillance footage posted on Chinese social media site Weibo (WB) showed white smoke emerging from what looks like a white Tesla car parked at a lot in Shanghai. After a few seconds, the electric vehicle bursts into flames and the clip ends soon afterward.

    Can someone explain to me how what that footage caught is not *actually* an e

    • Yes, could be a deliberate setup to damage Tesla.

      • by mark-t ( 151149 )
        Even if someone deliberately put some kind of incendiary device in the car to have caused it, the only difference that would make is the *cause* of the explosion, not whether or not the car actually exploded in the first place.
        • But if the headline says "Parked Model S explodes", there's an implicit assumption that it was spontaneous. People already get carried away by assumptions, so there's no harm in being careful not to overstate the facts.

          • by mark-t ( 151149 )

            there's no harm in being careful not to overstate the facts.

            Other than that it can be confusing, you mean?

            The headline could also say "Released Security Footage Captures Explosion of Parked Model S", which by not using the verb "Explodes" together with a subject of "Tesla" does not create that implication at all, and states literally what happened, neither adding or taking anything away from the event.

            • "Released Security Footage Captures Explosion of Parked Model S"

              Would you feel that headline would be completely appropriate if it turns out to be a movie stunt with a prop, and that the "security camera" was in fact a regular camera, set up for this shot ?

              • by mark-t ( 151149 )
                You are right. It would be a mistake to refer to the footage as "security footage", because that further creates an assumption about the origin of the video. "Released Footage" would be better.
        • So if someone drops a lighted match into the gas tank of a car, would you argue, "the lighted match might be the cause of the explosion, but nevertheless it is a fact the car caught fire". ? Remember the incident where Dateline was using a couple of model rocket engines to spark the fire after rear ending Ford SUV? How many people still blame Ford, while Dateline continues to deny it was a staged crash for equivalent of clickbait of the earlier era?
    • by Skip Whiffle ( 1452747 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @10:04AM (#58476998)

      Is it just me or does that phrasing suggest that something that happens to look like an explosion of some kind could actually ever be something else entirely?

      A short video of surveillance footage posted on Chinese social media site Weibo (WB) showed white smoke emerging from what looks like a white Tesla car parked at a lot in Shanghai. After a few seconds, the electric vehicle bursts into flames and the clip ends soon afterward.

      Can someone explain to me how what that footage caught is not *actually* an explosion? What else can it possibly be?

      The video jumps directly from 19 to 20 seconds and they hold the 20 second frame for a couple of seconds, I’m guessing, to make it look way more dramatic. That little edit makes the entire incident questionable.

      • by mark-t ( 151149 )
        While I will agree that it does look suspicious... it is still nonetheless still an explosion.
    • It's hard to tell the difference between an explosion and a fast-growing fire. Gasoline isn't explosive, for example. Just really, really flammable.

    • Can someone explain to me how what that footage caught is not *actually* an explosion? What else can it possibly be?

      I see flames shoot out from under the car and then the car catches on fire. What did you see?

      It literally does not explode. There would be glass, plastic, and metal shrapnel everywhere if it did. Pack some TNT or C4 in the car if you want an explosion.

      I don't see any way to tell if the car self-ignited or if this was a staged event. Any pyrotechnician could stage what we saw on the camera.

      • Personally I am suspicious of how the "surveillance" camera points more towards the incident just after it starts

        The footage is of someone filming a monitor with their phone. After a few seconds, you can see the edge of the monitor on the left.

  • "Us car owners demand an explanation...Jeopardizing our safety in a moment's instant and the fact it ignited so quickly is something we will not tolerate."

    175,000 cars catch fire every year in the United States. And with China having basically three times more everything, I'm pretty sure their statistics are on par, so perhaps they can shut the hell up about what they will and will not tolerate.

    "One thing I've learned from this incident: from now on, don't ever park next to a Tesla."

    Oh, you won't park next to a Tesla? Statistically, they're one of the safest cars to park next to, moron. Good luck gambling with those ICE cars. I'm sure your ignorance will keep you safe.

  • TikTok effect (Score:5, Insightful)

    by nitehawk214 ( 222219 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @10:13AM (#58477054)

    I don't trust any video coming from China as not being staged anymore.

    • by Tablizer ( 95088 )

      I don't trust any video coming from China as not being staged anymore.

      The USA is falling behind in fake news and video productivity. We must mobilize the next generation of fakers and riggers so that we can compete on the global market for BS. We need to leverage cutting edge AI to generate BS at levels and speeds that no man has ever seen before. Okay, and women. To explore strange new ways to make BS. Let's make American BS Great Again. Invent brave bold malarky that you and your grandchildren can be prou

  • by schklerg ( 1130369 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @10:25AM (#58477116)
    I thought this thing ran on batteries.
    • If the battery is damaged and a run away reaction occurs in the battery a fire can start. The battery is covered by about 0.2 inches (10mm) of titanium shell so to penetrate the battery takes a significant impact. Previous fires were caused by vehicles hitting roadside debris that severely damaged the battery. In these cases you would have likely seen a similar fire with a gasoline vehicles as the same debris would have likely ripped the fuel line.

      There are hundreds of thousands of car fires every year in t

  • by ruddk ( 5153113 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @10:32AM (#58477168)

    Those were Tasla cars.

  • by Daralantan ( 5305713 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @10:46AM (#58477264)
    Is this part of Aggressive mode?
  • Why don't they just take a safety lesson from this incident and drive around with tanks full of gasoline?

  • by 93 Escort Wagon ( 326346 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @11:20AM (#58477468)

    How about we wait for at least a small amount of actual information before we start debating about this?

  • Stuff happens. Gasoline-powered cars also catch fire, due to fuel leaks and other problems. [reddit.com] I once had this happen to me: engine running, waiting at a traffic light, and...flames. High quality GM engineering back in the 1970s, details unimportant now, though it was...exciting...at the time.

    There's a lot of energy stored in a battery. It's entirely believable that an electric car could suffer a short and catch fire. We don't have enough statistics to know if this happens more or less often than for gasoline

  • [Comment deleted by Chinese Government]
  • The car was obviously hacked by Russians. So obvious.
  • Not so fond memories of white knuckle driving with a constant eye in the rear view mirror.
  • by DeBaas ( 470886 ) on Tuesday April 23, 2019 @01:27PM (#58478142) Homepage

    In the Netherlands yesterday as well. [culemborgsecourant.nl] Summary: fairly new Tesla burnt for as yet unknown reason.

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