Zune DRM Cracked 232
An anonymous reader noted that Zune Scene is reporting that the Zune DRM has been cracked with software now available that strips the DRM from Zune Marketplace tracks and those shared with WiFi.
fortune: No such file or directory
Microsoft is thrilled by this news (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Microsoft is thrilled by this news (Score:5, Funny)
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Fixed...
Re:Microsoft is thrilled by this news (Score:5, Interesting)
Big and Old Con that Never has Worked. (Score:2)
Actually, it might even increase sales, which all goes to show how DRM isn't good for hardware sales.
I doubt anyone will buy a Zune over this. A few might but it's just as big a con as the "get paid for sharing pirated music" story next to it. The bait is that you will use some kind of M$ subscription to build a music collection, then liberate it. The problems are that WMA is shit and M$ will break it. The same scheme has been available for previous generations of Windoze DRM players and all of them
I choose option C (Score:2)
Hmm, seeing as I choose neither the Microsoft-based evil or the Apple-based evil, if we're all choosing whichever evil suits us I guess mine is piracy? (Honestly what I tend to do is download music, then if I like it I go out and buy it in vinyl; some crazy-cool record companies are even offering free mp3 downloads with vinyl purchases, if one wants to do things enti
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Re:Microsoft is thrilled by this news (Score:4, Insightful)
Since DRM is about selling the customer _less_, how is it a surprise that DRM isn't good for sales?
Re:Microsoft is thrilled by this news (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Microsoft is thrilled by this news (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Microsoft is thrilled by this news (Score:5, Insightful)
Not really sure why anyone would total diss it other then hype/marketing/backlash/etc.. It's not like iTunes was a DRM free happy land when the Zune was launched either.
Interface was no worse then iPOD (seriously, I'd love to see someone that has actually used both try and claim the interface sucked or was somehow worse), storage for the price point was the same, Zune had bigger screen which was a feature I wanted since I use it for carrying around photos and listening to the radio as much as MP3's.
It was a decent product, sales have been so-so but nothing special. But it just gets too much flask IMO because it's MS and not Apple.
Hell, apple could probably launch a $600 phone with virtually no 3rd party apps and that can't even send pictures in text messages and people would probably buy it.
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Now there's a use for the Zune. Make a flask out of it. For one, it's not going to grab any attention and a non-functioning screen can just be explained as 'it's a Microsoft product and just like the Xbox, it doesn't always work right'.
LoB
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Re:Microsoft is thrilled by this news (Score:5, Insightful)
And seriously. You opinion on the interface was very convincing. It sucks because it sucks. What does it actually do worse.
If you pick the thing up you can navigate through songs/albums/artists/media/etc very quickly and easily. Hence, it doesn't suck.
Everyone's going to have a preference (though 90% of the ones I'm going to read about the zune I can rightfully dismiss as people that have no clue what their talking about). But I've yet to see the race between zune and iPod users finding music or using the device in other ways.
Oh yeah, and the better screen. I guess the specs are arguable. But "better" in most cases is subjective. Never had a problem with my screen, and bigger is better on a device of similar size. It's easier for people to see pics of my dog/cat/wife/car/whatever on the zune then it would be on a comparable iPod. In fact, I really wanted to Zen Vision W, but it was just a tad too big to be carried around.
But I know I know. Apple is great, MS sucks. Your statements were very thought out.
Here's why the Zune sucks (Score:3, Interesting)
Even aside from that, at time of launch it cost more than a simmilar iPod!
The only thing the Zune ever had going for it was WiFi. And Microsoft botched that up so bad it's ridiculous (why no Zireless sync? Why no wirless purchase of music?)
The fact that they went to the trouble and expense to include WiFi but not include these basic features people would WANT it for is ridiculous. and indicates they did not do
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It's a rebranded Toshiba MP3 that is actually a very nice piece of hardware, the software ontop is just fine. The music store isn't a great, but outside of that it'll ignore DRM completely. Meaning like most MP3 players your stuff off of CD or other MP3/AAC(without DRM)/etc just plays no questions asked.
It's fucking pathetic that people like you and the AC write crap like that becaus
The main thing wrong with the Zune (Score:2)
The iPod is the iPod. Love it or hate it. But there is an entire group of industries that have sprung up around it for cases, speakers, car adapters, microphones, software, so that when you buy an iPod, you have your choice of "stuff".
Along comes the Zune. It's kinda like the iPod, a little bit more Soviet looking, but for consumers, kinda the same. Except no comparable infrastructure like the iPod. So you're pioneer, but with no upside, becaus
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If I wanted an "in" thing, or something that was to be my "media center" is was right out. Though combined with a 360 I found it amusing if nothing else.
But when I was looking to upgrade my rio to something that did images music and radio, it was a good buy IMO and still worthwhile since it does what I want it to do well.
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LoB
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At last... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:At last... (Score:5, Informative)
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You mean by releasing a new device that isn't compatible with the old music and expecting everyone to buy their music again?
:-D
Piracy (Score:5, Informative)
Oh, wait. Never mind.
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Re:Piracy (Score:4, Funny)
And yet... (Score:5, Insightful)
Microsoft is not to blame (Score:2)
Re:And yet... (Score:5, Insightful)
The difference with the Zune's DRM is that it effectively allows music "rentals" through WiFi sharing. People can "squirt" each other a song then remove the DRM, effectively getting the song for free. Not much different than pirating off of p2p networks, but it does mean Microsoft has created an incredibly effective piracy device.
For the rest, I agree. Microsoft has tried to over expand, making itself irrelevant in quite a few markets. In the process, they've half-assed their position in their original market, alienating a lot of customers. I've had several more technical friends switch to Linux, and less technical friends switch to Macs in the time since MS has started focusing more on running everything than making a solid OS. Microsoft needs to seriously reconsider their priorities if they want to avoid becoming irrelevant in all of their markets.
Re:And yet... (Score:4, Insightful)
What is this magical, mystical time period you're talking about where making a solid OS was a successful MS priority? '99-'02? Hadn't they already started with the branching then? (e.g., MSN?)
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I knew somebody was going to point that out. I don't really think Microsoft was ever as focused as they should have been on making a solid OS, even when that was their only goal. In more recent years, I've been wondering why on Earth MS is trying to compete in a certain field.
MSN was the beginning of Microsoft over-expanding. Then trying to compete with Google in search has always struck
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Afaict microsofts main profit centers are windows desktop and office. MS therefore ttries to crush anything that threatens those products. Maybe this is a bad strategy long term but the stock market only really cares about the short term.
Looked at in this light IE (particularlly free IE) and MSN are reaction to netscape and googles threats to make the desktop OS irrelvent. The XBO
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A bit of MSN history... (Score:2)
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1985--1989 [wikipedia.org]?
(oh, wait, you said "successful")
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It's so bloated and uses so much memory it would sink like a stone...
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Alright! (Score:5, Funny)
Isn't technology awesome?
Re:Alright! (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Alright! (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Alright! (Score:5, Funny)
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I'd just like to point out that this is totally fallacious, as being able to get a joke has absolutely nothing to do with its inherent humor content.
So, a message to those humorle
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Look here. (Score:5, Informative)
It doesn't solve the problem (Score:5, Interesting)
The same thing will happen with our parents and most people. The solution is buying products that are open and DRM free in the first place.
It might (Score:3, Funny)
Could someone clarify? (Score:2)
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He's talking about the poor Joe Six Packs who got a Zune for Christmas because the iPod was sold out.
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Wait, what?
Surely you meant he'd get an iPod. If he'd gotten a Zune, Joe Sixpack likely wouldn't even be able to succesfully install the software... [engadget.com], never mind get to the point of actually downloading any songs.
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Six Pack Joe with a Zune doesn't care about DRM (if he did he wouldn't have purchased a Zune, now would he?). Six Pack Joe assumes that DRM is the way things are, and accepts it because his music player is not the center of his universe. Like it or not, this is the way the majority of the public feels.
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We hardcore and tech savvy users usually crack, mod or unlock any device we got ours hand into (Ipods, cell phones, DVD Players, Apple TV, etc) but it doesn't solve Six pack Joe's DRM problems. He will get a Zune, won't bother or know how to crack it and play along MS and MAFIAA's rules.
The same thing will happen with our parents and most people. The solution is buying products that are open and DRM free in the first place.
I don't think it happens to our parents and friends. My friends and family know I am tech savvy. They always ask me for advice about buying different things, using software and whatnot. The result is almost 100% Firefox usage, my mother and sister are on Ubuntu, they use Google docs with Open Office, my friends avoid DRM ridden hardware or software. I did show my sister how to rip CDs in mp3, how to burn CDs, even how to download stuff she wants. She is happy with some random hardware mp3 player without an
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http://www.gp2x.co.uk/ [gp2x.co.uk]
I'm thinking about getting one.
Marketshare and cracking (Score:5, Interesting)
For years now we've been hearing that Mac OS X is less vulnerable to viruses and cracking because it has a far smaller marketshare than Windows. The argument is that nobody bothers with OS X because of the smaller marketshare. Although Zune DRM is being cracked for a different purpose, it does make me wonder if marketshare is much of a factor in decisions regarding which systems crackers attempt to defeat.
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Re:Marketshare and cracking (Score:5, Insightful)
I don't think so. That may have been the case when 10.0 or 10.1 came out, but at this point Macs are more common. Combined with the perception of security (and the Apple ads touting such), the Mac is a very nice target. If someone was able to make a good Mac virus that didn't require security authentication or other such things, they could get a lot of press (and probably a very easy shot at a good position in computer security). I'm sure there are plenty of people trying.
The Zune took so long because most people don't care. The average consumer doesn't care (or doesn't know that they should), and they bought an iPod anyway. The average techie (who does care) either bought an iPod, or probably doesn't buy DRMed music. Doing this is an interesting challenge, but it doesn't have the motivation behind it of cracking the DRM on the largest selling player and music store.
The market share thing for OS X is a myth. It's not perfect, but it is more secure by design than XP (Vista was supposed to improve that, I don't know how good a job it really did, I haven't looked). The Zune just wasn't a very temping target, so this took a while.
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Viruses are no longer common. People who exploit systems today do it for profit. The days of some kid sitting in his room and cracking Windows are over. That kid is either cracking DRM (and there are oh so many targets, from the iPhone to the TiVo) or getting paid to run spam zombies.
My Linux box encountered some 100,000 dictionary-based SSH attacks per day before I disabled password authentication. Run a packet sniffer on a public network some time. You may be su
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Things like viruses / malware, on the other hand, are (sadly) these days done for almost entirely commercial reasons: zombifying machines to act as spam relays se
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Windows is so damned insecure and targeted by viruses, trojans, etc. because of it's poor design. The argument that Windows is attacked the most because of market share is absurd. Windows
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OSX, linux,solaris and other unixes don't have as many viruses and problems because of HOW THEY ARE DESIGNED. it's not easy for a rogue program to elevate it's privileges to superuser like windows does. Nor does any other OS encourage the user to run as administrator all the time like windows does.
Windows and DOS has ZERO security to it compared to everything else. If in a unix box I run an app that wants to install files in the system area, I have to give it admi
Marketshare is not the big problem with Windows (Score:2)
No.
OS X is less vulnerable because its components expose a much smaller surface area to attack.
OS X is attacked less often because it has a smaller marketshare.
These are both in OSX favor, but it's the first that is the really important one. Yes, black hats preferentially target the more popular platform. But they don't *exclusively* target it... if that were the ma
The link to FairUse4WM for Vista and Zune (Score:5, Informative)
FileSend [filesend.net]
zUpload [zupload.com]
Files-Upload [files-upload.com]
zShare [zshare.net]
QuickSharing [quicksharing.com]
SendSpace [sendspace.com]
ShareBee [sharebee.com]
MD5 hash 0d5eaa7f8010e1293221a320943adb7e
Via:
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=127943 [doom9.org]
Nice try Microsoft (Score:5, Funny)
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oh no! (Score:5, Insightful)
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DRM exists entirely for the protection of the RIAA, not Microsoft. This will only increase the popularity of the Zune. An mp3 player that can share files over wifi with no restrictions, sign me up. I can't see Microsoft being too proactive about locking down the DRM again.
Oh, certainly -- until a pair of RIAA exectives sidle up to Steve Ballmer in a few weeks time, asking how he'd feel about all tracks under the Universal and Sony labels being immediately and unilaterally withdrawn from the Zune marketplace. Upon which, sadly, MS will inevitably jump back into line ahead of the tip of the RIAA's whip, and back to full antipiracy proactive mode before you can say "DevelopersDevelopersDevelopers!"...
Its a ZUNE though. Who cares? IT uses WMP .. eww! (Score:2)
Oh yeah DRM cracked? Who didnt see that coming? DRM is dead. Its a stupid idea to rally your share holders around. The real truth is, the people have spoken and we dont want DRM
Re:Its a ZUNE though. Who cares? IT uses WMP .. ew (Score:2, Informative)
You can turn this off. Its just as easy as it is in iTunes, which mangles all your music as well by default.
Anyone emailed them yet? (Score:5, Funny)
I think two of them were non-techies, so they may not know.
yay (Score:5, Funny)
Now all we need is somebody with a Zune... (Score:2)
Zune, zune, zune!
Piracy - the *other* way to grow market share (Score:2)
--
Toro
pros and consequences (Score:3, Interesting)
I use a zune, mainly for the subscription model, the player is nice for some things but there are times I'd rather use my sony ericsson phone because its a lot smaller, heck, i use it sometimes although that's limited to my none-zune marketplace content... My zune is more used in my car and at my desk. But I take it with me elsewhere at times because of the greatly expanded content I have access to on it. at least till now, where this would allow me to listen to it on that device. I'd happily keep paying my subscription fee if I had a means to listen to it on the device of my choice. You know, like that playsforsure concept...
Breach of Their Contract (Score:4, Interesting)
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Oh wait, wrong decade. You're letting the terrorists win!
Re:Is Secure DRM Possible? (Score:4, Insightful)
The problem with DRM, in a nutshell, is that you ultimately have to provide the keys for accessing the content to the end user. All DRM, no matter how it's designed, is at the most basic level just security through obscurity. Since decryption keys have to be provided to the end user it's just a matter of time before one of the (potentially) millions of users worldwide manages to find those keys and figure out how to make use of them. Companies spend more and more on trying to restrict access to those keys, and now to revoke compromised keys (think AACS), but even that's a losing battle. Companies spend tons of money and some teenaged hacker in Russia still manages to crack the encryption fairly quickly. It's a no-win battle for the companies. They just haven't admitted defeat yet.
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As far as key revocation goes, I think the guys over at Doom9 have shown that the AACS attempts at this are lacking as well. They've b
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That works until they start using SSL cert pairs, or any other public key encryption method. Then you're back to slogging through with a
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Your analogy doesn't work. Online games are unpirateable because they are interactive, and require constant access to the server. Media files are different. Regardless of how the keys are stored or transmitted, the user's software needs to be able to send decrypt
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Nothing prevents you from recording your WoW session.
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Re:Beyond Me (Score:5, Interesting)
I really kind of liked the Zune. To my surprise it wasnt' that ugly brown color. All my (non-DRM) music played just fine, and I even kind of liked the way the Zune sounded with a pair of the $40 JBL 210 reference ear pods. The videos played well and the interface was acceptable. Battery life was pretty good.
I didn't try the wifi stuff, but the unit I tried compared nicely with the 30gig iPod.
I'd never buy one myself because I make a concerted effort to avoid giving Microsoft my business, but it wasn't the horrible crap that I'd been led to believe by that group of people who only seem to post at Slashdot when the issue turns to something having to do with, or competing with, Apple. I have heard that if you look at those people out of the corner of your eye you only see a black silhouette of a dancing gen-Y'er with fake dreadlocks.
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Re:Beyond Me (Score:5, Insightful)
that was turned into a turd by the software that it runs. They took the decent software inside and then shoved DRM in by the heaploads. Making it a turd.
That makes it the horribly piece of junk.
Once it's cracked and a 3rd party firmware can be installed to run it, I'll be buying 2 or more of them. In it's current DRM and windows Locked state, nobody wants it.
Microsoft catered so hard to the RIAA and MPAA organized crime families that they ruined the product.
it's like the microsoft keyboards, they are actually awesome, but nobody would own one if they refused to type words or phrases that were on a banned list.
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Sounds like Microsoft got cheap. Too bad.
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If you want a SERIOUS keyboard, go for an Unicomp [pckeyboard.com] or a Matias. [matias.ca]
As a proud owner of a brand-new SpaceSaver from Unicomp, I have to agree. Worth every penny, though the postage cost me as much as the keyboard itself.
Wouldn't know about characters fading, though; mine's a blank, like Das Keyboard.
Re:Beyond Me (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Good news, if of limited use... (Score:4, Funny)
You probably have daltonism. (Score:2)