Defining Clicks and Click Fraud 78
abb_road writes "Google, Microsoft and Yahoo have banded together and created the Click Measurement Group, with the goal of creating a standard definition for a 'click'. The group will have some access to the three companies' click data, although the access won't be unlimited. The move comes in response to advertisers who claim that click fraud is costing them almost $1 billion dollars a year, and who have hit Google and Yahoo with lawsuits alleging negligence in fighting click fraud."
I *like* dupes. (Score:1, Insightful)
Re:I *like* dupes. (Score:2)
And you didn't really miss anything.
Re:I *like* dupes. (Score:1)
The guy is making a perfectly valid point.
All the people whining about dupes need to chill out cos you lot will also be the first to complain if you dare to miss the front page for a day or so.
I'm a paying subscriber and you know what I normally do if I notice a story I've seen before?
I move onto the next one.
Re:I *like* dupes. (Score:1)
Re:Might not be exactly the same... (Score:3, Insightful)
Not that Zonk, out wonderful poster, noticed this, as we can see from the fact that it isn't mentioned in the post.
Re:Dupe? (Score:1, Offtopic)
Re:Dupe? (Score:1, Offtopic)
Having wasted many days on this, if your customer uses Outlook, it *is* hard. Those that I could convince to run Thunderbird had it up and running out of the box first time. Outlook is a nightmare. It is a chinese puzzle. It does not support normal SASL (providing only NT passwords). It only supports STARTTLS (so it can use LOGIN passwords) on port 25. Whenever you change the SMTP port, it resets the IMAP settings to defa
perhaps they should checkout (Score:5, Funny)
Re:perhaps they should checkout (Score:4, Funny)
"Click Monkeys!!(TM) is a Ukrainian company and the giant tanker ship click farm we have stationed just outside U.S. waters off the coast of San Francisco is registered at a Ukrainian berth so we're not subject to any U.S. laws!"
I can't wait to hear about the upcoming joint venture between Microsoft, Google, Yahoo, and the U.S. Navy.
Re:perhaps they should checkout (Score:4, Funny)
how about this one then (also from the site):
Re:perhaps they should checkout (Score:2)
Re:perhaps they should checkout (Score:5, Funny)
Re:perhaps they should checkout (Score:2)
What is a click? (Score:1)
one click two click red click blue click (Score:2)
Re:one click two click red click blue click (Score:1)
KFG
Re:one click two click red click blue click (Score:2)
Left click
Left click
Left click
Right.
Re:one click two click red click blue click (Score:1)
Up click
Up click
Down click
Down click
Left click
Right click
Left click
Right click
B click
A click
Start click
Re:one click two click red click blue click (Score:2)
"Three click" - For newbies
"Four click" - For software that takes a long time to load
"Ten click" - For people who are expecting an important email real soon.
"Unlimited click" - Reserved specifically for "Ignore Retry Fail" dialog boxes.
Rich
great idea (Score:5, Funny)
Maybe afterwards they can put their noggins together and standardize what the definition for "is" is.
Re:great idea (Score:2)
They're going to whip them out, and see who has the biggest Click.
Clippy click (Score:2)
Definition of a `Click': (Score:5, Interesting)
Do this to many links that appear like they're counted.
Wait for the page to load (don't view it!).
Right click on the tab. Click `Close Tab'.
Congratulations, you have just ``clicked'' according to their definition. You also have just cost a site some $$ (and made some $$ for Google/Yahoo/Microsoft).
Advertising rocks!
Re:Definition of a `Click': (Score:5, Informative)
Just middle click on the link. Faster.
Stupid default settings for FF that are not the same across OS's...
Re:Definition of a `Click': (Score:1)
Re:Definition of a `Click': (Score:2)
Cool. This will save me some clicks
Re:Definition of a `Click': (Score:1)
Re:Definition of a `Click': (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Definition of a `Click': (Score:2)
Re:Definition of a `Click': (Score:1)
So what is a click? (Score:3, Funny)
Re:So what is a click? (Score:1)
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=193053&op=Rep
Re:So what is a click? (Score:4, Funny)
Re:So what is a click? (Score:2)
Re:So what is a click? (Score:2)
Re:FaE6orz (Score:1)
Irony (Score:5, Funny)
That's rich, advertisers are trying to sue for negligence and fraud. What's next, wives accusing their husbands of having a vagina?!
Does that mean... (Score:1)
You may be a victim of click counterfeiting.
Marketspeak Translation (and Full text) (Score:5, Informative)
How grave a concern is click fraud for advertisers?
There's a host of stuff out there that concerns marketers that needs to be cleaned up. It includes impression measurement, it includes click measurement, standardized contracts, so you know for us it's all a big picture of stuff that in order for the maturing of the medium needs to be done. And how big a deal is click fraud? We don't like anything that would give marketers concern, especially if it's a solvable problem.
Translation: We've got a lot of stuff to sift through, which we haven't even started on yet. But it's ok, 'cause the results would only scare people unnecessarily. ANd we don't want that
Advertisers say the search engines haven't done enough to combat fraud.
Search produces results. End of story. It produces results. My guess is that these advertisers would like to see any concern that might seep into the view that their management has, or anybody else. Because they know in their heart of hearts that this really works. It's in everybody's interest to clean this one up.
Translation: We haven't actually asked. We just kinda assumed it's a problem.
What exactly have the search companies pledged to do?
We're going to go forward with developing click-measurement guidelines that will address at a public level all the sort of subsidiary issues of that, which includes fighting globally invalid clicks and also click fraud.
Translation: We had a few ideas scribbled out on a cocktail napkin... but we lost it when one of the associates spilt her apple-tini all over it.
Did Yahoo!, Microsoft, Google, and others involved promise to give you unlimited access to their click data?
They have committed the time, the energy, the resources to see this through to a final industry guideline--one that's accepted by not just themselves, but by agencies and by marketers and by the advertising industry overall. Does that mean that they would bring to bear some data and other insights? Absolutely. Could they still have proprietary solutions of their own? Yeah, stuff that might be protected by their own (intellectual property), but they have committed the resources to help.
Translation: First, the asked who we were, then they laughed at us, then said absolutely not. We're coming up with some sort of backup plan though. :(
Media need to operate with transparency. There's marketers and agencies who are paying money for things. They need to know, what are they paying for? What does that look like? What is the standardized way in which that's being counted? And also ultimately, is that audited? Can we validate that (using a third party)? And so, in an industry that is now going to be close to $16 billion this year, it should be relatively obvious that we need to operate with the principles that all media operate under.
Translation: Ok, we just came up with our contingency plan: if we keep asking, and some point they'll have to say "yes", right?
What's the timeframe for creating the click-measurement guidelines?
I've learned through experience with standards I never make a commitment to timelines. It took us 14 months to do the ad-impression guidelines, which is kind of the last big one that we did. We don't really know what we don't know at this point. We could come to a conclusion and say "Geez, we're pretty close. There aren't any outside data--let's get it done." Or we could say, "Hmm, I don't think we're comfortable with that issue, let's dig deeper."
Translation: We have no idea.
What bodies will be involved in auditing, using your definition?
That will be really up to the industry to define that, so in the process of developing measurement guidelines we'll also be developing audit guidelines. That's how we did it in the impression guidelines, so I fully expect to do the same thing.
Translation: We're waiting for
Signal to Noise (Score:5, Insightful)
The real solution here, as usual, is the free market. Advertisers will decide where to spend their ad budget, and they either think this is a problem or not. The solution will boil down to convincing these (probably technologically savvy) ad people to buy ads. That's why having a standard is useful - it looks good. And judging by Google's profits, corporate wallets are voting yes to online ads. If click fraud was a real problem, they wouldn't.
Re:Signal to Noise (Score:1)
Oh, this is great.... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Oh, this is great.... (Score:2, Insightful)
Why risk the goose that lays your golden eggs?
--Q
Very interesting and difficult problem (Score:5, Insightful)
I have the impression that right now, click fraud is fought using statistical criteria to identify real and fake clicks. If you publish a definition of what is a real click, the definition has to be very good and clever, so that fraudsters cannot simply write code that generates fake clicks that satisfy the definition.
Re:S-to-N (Score:2)
Are you kidding? I've been waiting for the SNR to get up to 1:2 for several years. If you really demand a lower SNR, try myspace.com (just about any page).
I didn't click on this /. story. (Score:2)
The solution is easy (Score:1, Interesting)
In tv or newspaper they pay for the impression of the ads not from people going in the shop.
Re:The solution is easy (Score:2, Insightful)
This way no website can have a 100% click through ratio, and if they
Oh FFS (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Oh FFS (Score:3, Interesting)
So joe visitor visits my site and clicks through to the advertiser's page. With Pay Per Action, Joe Visitor must purchase the product right then in order for me to recieve credit. If Joe Visitor likes what he sees but decides to come back later after talking it over with Mrs Visitor, I don't get paid because he will inevitably go directly to the site rather than reload my site a baz
Re:Oh FFS (Score:2)
Re:Oh FFS (Score:2)
The most overused button on a browser these days is the back button as soon as most people realise they have fallen for yet another ad filled and information free page.
I can live with some ads, but they are far too cheap if advertisers were forced to pay a little more then perhaps they would spend on effective advertising. maybe even on good product information. I choose hardware carefully now if it hasn't got good linux support I will look for somethin
There already is a definition for a click (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Yay!!!! (Score:3, Funny)
That's "Gique".
Google ADsense has MAJOR problems!! (Score:2, Interesting)
Consider this...
They give you an account and tell you NOT to encourage your website visitors to visit the sponsors. How stupid is that?
They give you a google search box and and tell you NOT to encourage your website visitors to use it. How stupid is tha
Re:Google ADsense has MAJOR problems!! (Score:1)
What? Adsense pays out pretty big for the clicks that I get. I can see why saying on the site, "please click these ads, it will support my time investment and all you have to do is click an ad.", is NOT KOSHER.
RE: They give you a google search box and and tell you NOT to encourage your website visitors to use it. How stupid is that?
What? That's not stupid at all. Read above.
RE: Isn'
why not ... (Score:1)
Depends (Score:1)
I've got two words: (Score:1)