Get a Free MIT Education 251
dhollm writes "Well, at least the course materials will be online, for free, for all.
The article gives a brief description of the program (evidently costing MIT $100M over 10 years) and the key drivers behind it. So start reading up!"
My question... (Score:2, Interesting)
I had to settle for CUNY instead.
Re:My question... (Score:2)
Old News (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Old News (Score:1, Interesting)
Big Deal indeed ! (Score:2, Funny)
1 - Getting there on time (late riser / late Quake player, pick your choice 8)
2 - Finding the course I missed from a friend, or fiend, or anybody who got it, AND/OR reading this filthy writing (mostly mine 8)
Now I don't know about you, but... this would have been a life saver
Re:Old News (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Old News (Score:2, Informative)
Ballsy Move (Score:2, Interesting)
I supose this would be interesting if I'm interested in a certen subject and want a bibliogaphy or some slids on it, but only an idot would try to get a real education by only reading the course meterial
Re:Ballsy Move (Score:2, Insightful)
There was (and all too often, still is) the time that the only way to be informed was to teach it to yourself. I know that because that's how I learned computers! I was the only person on my block (actually, within most of the school) for over a decade that could do anything with a computer. 100% self taught from books. Now I help others use computers.
The problem with learning by being taught is that you only learn what the teacher has to tell you. And unless your teach has a photographic memory, that means you end up with less of an education. I always tell anyone I help who wants to fully comprehend the subject to read books on it. I make mistakes even when I teach people how to do things. I don't think that makes me a bad teacher -- I think it just proves I'm still learning how to do my job.
I believe a "real" education comes neither by rote, nor by hearing example cited. It comes from trying, doing, and being. You lean the "real" answer by correcting your mistakes. If you don't make mistakes, you aren't learning difficult enough subject matter.
Just my two cents.
But does it count ? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:But does it count ? (Score:2, Interesting)
I still think employers would look upon this in a positive way. I know people who graduate putting all kinds of crap on the resume that they never really did or don't really know anything about. I guess they don't get called on it much because I haven't heard many horror stories.
Just my 2 cents.
Re:But does it count ? (Score:4, Insightful)
Of course not! (Score:2, Insightful)
If it WERE the same thing, then putting this information out there would instantly put MIT out of business.
Yes it does count ... (Score:3, Interesting)
When I interview people, I certainly look to see if they have a degree, but frankly, as long as they have the right attitude (the dominating factor really), and can answer the majority of my technical questions, then they have an excellent chance of getting employed.
If reading the online material from MIT lets you answer my technical questions, well then that's good enough for me.
Re:But does it count ? (Score:3, Insightful)
Besides, it's all about the free passage of knowledge, right?
Well, it should be!
Re:But does it count ? (Score:2)
Well, there always is the Degree in Photoshop. Commit fraud to prevent being called fruadulant, now thats a great Catch-22.
doesn't matter (Score:2, Interesting)
Students at other universities worldwide can use it as an additional reference. Those of us (sniff sniff) who have graduated and are working can look up that algorithm or data structure that we don't quite remember accurately (probably because of the hangover from the night before).
Not that I can throw away all my textbooks, but this is pretty sweet.
Oh, and as for job eligibility, again it's not about the degree...everyone that can afford to go to college should, just because of the enriching atmosphere and the chance to meet smart girls^H^H^H^H^H people.
Re:But does it count ? (Score:3, Insightful)
Take two people, who graduated from the same program a year apart and have relatively similar work experiences. Suppose one can talk intelligently about a subject that does not show up on his transcript, and explains that he was motivated enough to learn it on the web from MIT. The other is unable. Who do you think looks better to the company?
In addition, the web page also mentions that this is a good reference for other colleges and universities. Want to know how MIT teaches a difficult concept? Just look itup on the web.
I applaud MIT's effort; this is truly a move that can only help mankind.
Re:But does it count ? (Score:2)
Getting through college and having that diploma is also a statement about your ability to get through college. It speaks to time management, ability under pressure, ability to interact with others, etc. In addition to saying something about what you know, that piece of paper tells potential employers that you have the determination to be dedicated to the long hall and aren't just some flaky high school kid.
Getting an MIT education online would be an impressive feat, but there are still other questions. Without grades did you cut corners on your studies? Are you doing it to avoid social interaction? Did you learn to manage long term projects and research?
Clever knowledge isn't the only skill that counts in this world.
Comment removed (Score:5, Interesting)
YOUR DIPLOMA IS WAITINIG!!! (Score:2, Funny)
j/k...
Guess what my new homepage is? (Score:4, Interesting)
MIT's got a site up on it. (Score:2, Informative)
I like it... I can't wait for the Linguistics curriculum to go up.
--brian
Next Step (Score:1)
Re:Next Step (Score:3, Interesting)
MIT is careful to point out that the OpenCourseWare project is not a distance-learning initiative. Indeed, according to Hal Abelson, a professor of computer science and engineering who served on the committee that developed the idea, OpenCourseWare represents a repudiation of distance learning. "It's a large effort at MIT that says, 'We're not going to do distance education,'" says Abelson. "It really is making a statement about what the university is about and what it's not about."
Also, the government isn't paying for this, since MIT is private.
I am amazed that you think that professions that don't need lab environments don't need campus based training. Would you want to pursue a history/English/law/religion degree without spending actual classroom time with your teacher and fellow students?
I took advantage of the fact that for many of the university courses I took were on-line. Not only were all the course materials on-line, but the lectures were too. So I would often sleep in and then catch class on my Mac Performa while eating lunch. Guess what? I really regret doing that. I wish I could go back and kick myself in the head and make myself go to class. I did fine in my classes but I missed out on lots of interaction, and the ability to ask a question in lecture.
Besides, Prof. Nick Parlante would always wear plaid to screw with the video compression. :)
Distance learning (Score:3, Interesting)
This is because the american university system is closer to school. The German system is to have the professor go to the board or slide projector and to give his performance for 90 minutes. This is usually an one man show, with very few questions from the audience. School is IMHO, wenn the professor cares about the individual progress of the students and asks them questions etc.
The places where you learn are the small exercise groups and in contact with other students.
Today I study computer science next to my job at a distance university and wish I had the same material when I studied physics at a traditional university. That stuff is better and it saves you time, except you are one of those few persons who are actually able to learn at the speed the professor gives his talk (I'm not, I need usually twice the time :-)
I am amazed that you think that professions that don't need lab environments don't need campus based training. Would you want to pursue a history/English/law/religion degree without spending actual classroom time with your teacher and fellow students?
Well I signed up for the hardware lab this year and it is done this way: They send you a complete computer with interfaces, software etc home and you have 8x2 weeks time to get used to it and do homework with it. Later, if you solved the assignments, you have to go to one the locations where they offer examination and write a test. If you pass you are allwed to do a one week full time lab at the university location.
The funny thing that you meet your peer students personally just at the examinations or these labs in person, otherwise e-mail, news or irc is the means for contact, or individual arranged meetings among the students that live not too far away.
Regards, Marc
Re:Distance learning (Score:2)
I understand your point and I have certainly learned a great deal using distance learning methods. My regrets stem from my perception that the best aspects of the university experience are student to student interactions and student to teacher interactions.
The interactions I had with other students were the most valuable part of my university education. Not only will I enjoy those friendships for the rest of my life, but the contacts that I made will be of use to me professionally as well. Just having a degree from such-and-such university is less than half of what makes my education worth the amount of money I paid for it. Yes my degree says that I have some level of CS proficiency, but the people that I know now are even more valuable to me.
For me as much of my learning came in the dorm as in the classroom. I was able to ask people for help and also able to give help nearly any hour of the day. I am not saying that this cannot happen in a distance learning enviroment, but for me it seems much more difficult.
Re:Distance learning (Score:2)
I agree with you. What I wanted to add was that at least in the German university system teacher-student interaction is quite poor (the first time probably when you have to prepare a seminar treatise or perhaps even at the time you prepare a thesis, but not at class time) so that this makes no big difference between presence and distance education.
Student-student interaction is important, that is why the distance university has tutoring centers in the bigger cities that serve a whole region around them, where people can get mentoring. The intenet of course has been very helpful too.
I don't argue for distance learning in general, but because many people have to spend time for jobbing at the same time they study, distance learning methods (as a means to learn at flexible times and locations) combined with traditional student meeting points are very helpful.
Regards, Marc
Back in my day ... (Score:2)
Reading this I am really glad they DIDN'T have distance learning when I was in college 10 years ago. Time spent in class, taking notes, hearing the prof. speek live, asking questions, and so on is so much better than the Memorex version - and yet I can easily imagine being "busy" or distracted enough that I might have chosen the latter.
MIT is doing the right thing to put its course material on line while maintaining the requirement to actually show up. If I were an alum (I'm not) I might kick in some bux for this project. (Not $100M though.)
Nice, but $100 million? (Score:5, Insightful)
My guess is the $100 million figure was dreamed up to shake some cash out of alumni. They're probably hoping that someone will come forward and endow the effort. Perhaps they're targeting Michael Saylor, the MIT graduate who once talked about starting a free university with the cash he was making from MicroStrategy. The dot bomb crash has slowed that dream and perhaps MIT's as well.
Of course, I don't mean to denigrate the entire idea. It just seems like they're taking credit for something they already do. Did I mention that each week, I take out the trash? That's keeping the world cleaner! Call me Mr. Environmentalist!
Re:Nice, but $100 million? (Score:5, Funny)
Well then, you've successfully learned the first computer science lesson now taught by MIT: Garbage In, Garbage Out.
Don't underestimate the cost of web publishing (Score:5, Insightful)
Its not just about setting up a web site - its the cost of migrating the practices of an entire institution around a new model of information dispersal. This will definitely erode the value of journals as graduate work starts filtering in to the system.
MIT may even be attempting somehting more daunting by trying to productize the process to be sold to other institutions, I'm not sure, but that would raise costs even higher.
Re:Don't underestimate the cost of web publishing (Score:3, Insightful)
You miss the biggest cost... storage and availability of data.
We are talking in the 100's of GB, if not TB's. When you use that many spindles, you are going to statistically suffer spindle failure on the rate of 1 every week or two. That rate will increase as your spindle count increases.
You will have to go RAID-5 or mirror. As this will most likely be read intensive, RAID-5 would be an economical way to protect this data while improving read performance.
Availability is going to be another factor here. Think clustering, as it wouldn't do to have MIT's OpenCourseWare offline.
This costs money. Depending on their projected usage you can easily get upwards of $100M in cost. Remember this is a 10yr cost, so think total cost of ownsership (infrastructure, personnel costs, maintenance, etc.).
Re:Don't underestimate the cost of web publishing (Score:2)
Re:Nice, but $100 million? (Score:2)
but if the work is already done for the classes, it dosen't cost extra to make it available to another medium.
That depends on who owns the course material. In a lot of places, that would be the prof.
Great source for supplemental information (Score:2, Insightful)
Oh no! (Score:3, Funny)
I look for a reissue of the DVD "Updated for new technology" anytime now.
I feel sorry for you americans (Score:5, Informative)
Re:I feel sorry for you americans (Score:3, Insightful)
No such thing as a "free education", or free healthcare for that matter. It's all paid for through taxation. Which simply means that those who don't study have no option but to subsidize those who do.
It's all about control. Will the Swedish government (taxpayer) pay for your education at a university that isn't an "approved" part of their system? Of course not... but your 4 years of tuition fees in the US will get you the best education money can buy, anywhere in the world.
When you graduate, you pay the taxes, and you lose control over your future. I mean that quite literally, for example the state-run pension systems throughout Europe are heading for bankruptcy [socialsecurity.org].
European governments are living on borrowed time, just as the dotcom firms were during the bubble, spending money freely without thinking of the future. I will make very sure to move my assets out of Europe and into a "free" (as in speech, not as in beer) economy before the EU governments realise that their vote-winning health, education and pension schemes, or should I say scams, are actually built on sand.
At that time, the American system of "pay for what you actually use" will be proved to be the only sustainable model.
Re:I feel sorry for you americans (Score:2)
Re:I feel sorry for you americans (Score:3, Interesting)
Correct. Many of us do not believe this to be a bad thing, since a reasonable, progressive taxation system results in the rich subsidising the poor. Whilst this isn't the American way, we Europeans kind of dig its naive
Not necessarily. What it should mean (modulo tax cuts for the rich, and the myth of trickle-down economics) is that this generation of students are subsidised by the previous generation of students, since they're now earning more than their "non-graduate" contemporaries. In fact, the UK govt. has just proposed a "graduate tax" for exactly this purpose.
(Oh, and Cato Institute reports attacking government spending are not exactly impartial sources)
Reasonable? (Score:2, Insightful)
"Reasonable"? Reasonable to whom? I assume it's reasonable to the "poor" you mention since they get to plunder the coffers of the "rich." How reasonable is it that the harder you work, the more you are penalized?
Not necessarily. What it should mean (modulo tax cuts for the rich, and the myth of trickle-down economics) is that this generation of students are subsidised by the previous generation of students, since they're now earning more than their "non-graduate" contemporaries.
Many students here take out loans to finance their education, and then pay back the loan when they graduate and get a job. This way, students are responsible for their own education, which is the way it should be.
Oh, and Cato Institute reports attacking government spending are not exactly impartial sources
And Tom Daschle isn't impartial, either. So what? You'd expect a person who is arguing their position to be partial to that position, wouldn't you? Impartiality is not important in this regard. What is important is whether or not the facts stated by the Cato institute are true, and wheter or not the reason they employ is valid. I notice that you chose to assail neither of those things.
Re:Reasonable? (Score:2)
If their credit is good. Like it or not, many people from working class backgrounds have trouble getting sufficient loans to cover both tuition and subsistence, which means they either have to work a job as well as studying, or give up. Either way, they're seriously disadvantaged w.r.t. the independently wealthy. Call me a socialist if you must, but I think I high quality education should be available to everyone with the smarts to use it.
(NB: Most of my experience re: student finance is limited to the UK.)
Which is the way you think it should be.
Re:Reasonable? (Score:2)
My terminology is the standard British usage. Go look it up in the OED.
Bull. Most wealthy students inherited their money.
Taxpayers. This is where we came in. Neither of us are right, you berk. Its an ideological disagreement. I think the rich should subsidise the poor, you think they should fend for themselves. Fair enough. You (possibly) call yourself a libertarian. I call you greedy and self-interested. I say I believe in encouraging social equality, you call me a bleeding heart liberal (or a leftist, a word which, incidentally, is almost unheard of outside America).
You say "The rich should be allowed to keep their money." I disagree. It happens. Now stop pretending you have a hot line to the truth.
Re:Reasonable? (Score:2)
No they don't, you simply don't understand the usage. If differing usage offends you, feel free to replace it with the synonymous "blue collar". And as long as your child is OK, you're absolved of responsibility for any other member of humanity, right? Thats a nice elision you use, implicitly equating freedom of choice with the right to keep all your money. You're also fond that other elision -- playing on the double meaning of the word "earned" (as in "what you got paid" and "what you deserved")
Provide me with GDP, a histogram of earning distribution, costings for health care, and your best estimates of their trends, and I'll put a number on it. How simple do you believe economics to be?
Theres no need. Progressive taxation is a sliding scale.
Says who? Ayn Rand? I am an altruist. Do I then not exist.
That I believe that the role of government is to redistribute wealth so that the richest countries in the world don't have any starving citizens.
I believe in both of them. However, I don't hold the accumulation of property to be particularly meritricious, and I don't believe personal liberty absolves people from a moral responsibility to care for those less fortunate, and that one of the roles of government is to enforce this.
Arguing with "libertarians" is hilarious, because they take the high moral line over ad hominem attacks, and then come out with stuff like that.
If I have good credit because my parents are rich (which isn't true, incidentally), why do you consider that I have earned it. Thats an accident of birth.
Some of them did. Some of them didn't. Lee Iaccoca(sp?) did, Ricky Martin, less so.
Well in the sense of how much they were paid, obviously. Did they work less hard? Some of them. Some rich people are lazy too (George W. Bush, prior to the presidency, had hardly done a hard days work in his life) And some people aren't lazy. I earn more than my sister-in-law, but she works much harder and for longer hours than I do.
Re:Reasonable? (Score:2)
Cute. Leftist == Communist == Pol Pot. Beautiful. Ad hominem, unjustified, unargued. But beautiful. Perhaps I should reach for Capitalist == Fascist == Augusto Pinochet. Thats bollocks too, but you started it.
Your taxes are currently paying to drop bombs on the Taliban. I believe this act of self-defense is also a role of government. Do you? Would a pacifist have the freedom to not pay to support it.
Thats a pretty big claim. I notice you haven't given a reference.
Thats a pretty big claim. I notice you haven't given a reference.
As much as they like. But they should be prepared to pay some of it in taxes in order to care for those who are not wealthy.
Some of them are, some of them aren't. Thats why I singled out those that were (Duh).
Re:Reasonable? (Score:2)
This answer is unclear.
If you do have the right to keep all of of your money, how does the US defend its borders. Bombs don't pay for themselves. Are you saying taxes for guns : good, taxes for welfare : bad. I don't understand.
You have just given a reason for taxation (the US' just war on Afghanistan). Now why do you struggle with the concept so much to ask vapid questions like: "Do I have the right to keep my house? My car? My clothes? Any of my property?". Yes, yes and yes. All I've suggested is a progressive taxation system. Effectively the system you have now, but with tax breaks for the poor, not the rich. Is that so hard to comprehend?
Bullshit, kiddo. When you're 16 or 17 and looking to go to college, your family situation is all important.
Here [muohio.edu] is a nice review paper, discussing the many different views psychologists take to altruism. Here [ryerson.ca] is another. Now give me a reference supporting your contention.
Why do you keep suggesting this? The government taxes you. You agree that this is sometimes acceptable (military expenditure). Why, in this case, is taxation for welfare equivalent to Soviet-style totalitarianism? Its a non-sequitor. Thats why I don't respond.
Yes. Thats why I've couched all my statements as my opinion. You're the one making objective (and unjustified statements like Altruism doesn't exist. Everytime I say moral, I'm being subjective, I know. I'm telling you about my morality.
Thats an awful analogy. There is no similarity between a position on tax rates and government spending and abortion. Having said that, all governments impose the view of the winning side on the losers, thats how it works. Is Bush's tax and spending cuts imposing his morality on America's leftists? Maybe, but thats how government works. Is it equivalent to religious fundamentalism. No.
Whatever the record company feel like paying him. But he should pay tax on that money.
No. Its because lottery wins are so few as to contribute negligibly to the exchequer. I didn't mention lingerie tycoons or stand-up comedians, auto workers or futures traders either, and they're far more important. Would you like an exhaustive list of jobs? All income taxed by the same rules. Not too tricky a concept.
Re:Reasonable? (Score:2)
Very easily. A young person's credit, like the bulk of their money is inherited. Live in a house with parents who are bad risks, and that black mark'll be on your record until you can prove otherwise.
Let me guess, this is in a comfortable, white-collar kind of neighbourhood, right?
Re:I feel sorry for you americans (Score:3, Insightful)
But your garden-variety libertarian logic is flawed: the social security dilemma facing western europe and the US has really nothing to do with subsidized education, and everything to do with an aging work force. Read _Generational Accounting_ by lan J. Auerbach and Laurence J. Kotlikoff if you don't believe me.
And while I'm at it, leaving education to the private sector only makes sense if you believe there are NO external societal benefits to be gained from having an educated populace.
But if society benefits by educating its members, ie people commit less crime and practice healthier lifestyles, then the government has a perfectly logical reason to subsidize education. The market system will fail to provide the pareto optimal level.
Your move.
Your flawed logic (Score:2, Interesting)
But if society benefits by educating its members,
The main flaw in this argument is that the "what's good for society" is *highly* subjective. Many people argue that the War on (Some) Drugs is "good for society," when there is a huge, massive pile of evidence that it does much more harm to individuals than it does good.
Who defines what is "good for society"? I claim that "that which is good for society" and "that which is moral" are almost exactly equivalent. The difference lies in that the former implies groupthink while the latter implies individual thought. And "moral" is also a highly subjective definition.
And your flawed logic (Score:2)
The people - that's who.
That statement in and of itself is an argument that "there's nothing intrinsically bad about people committing crimes or living in poverty" unless "the people" say there is. In which case, you are simply declaring majority rule/conformity the sole rule of an otherwise entirely relativistic morality.
Re:I feel sorry for you americans (Score:2)
Yeah? (Score:2)
Re:I feel sorry for you americans (Score:2)
Hmm... Surely it's just a different kind of accessibility. In the US a good education is available to those who have the money to pay for it. In Europe those who want to study in the best universities need the brains and motivation to get in, not the money.
It is different with schools and colleges, and I think the experience you describe wouldn't be considered unusual in Europe - there's free education available to virtually anyone who is motivated enough to seek it.
Re:I feel sorry for you americans (Score:2)
Actually, US universities are real good at price discrimination, they call it student aid. They know what you have available to pay for tuition, and tailor aid to get as much money as is possible for tuition. A poor, but smart student, can get a free ride while a richer one shells out for it.
Come to think of it, it's rather the same in Europe - the gov't knows what you make, and takes what they feel is appropriate. If you're richer, your education costs more.
To benefit from free MIT education online (Score:2, Funny)
Re:To benefit from free MIT education online (Score:2)
Link to previous slashdot story (Score:4, Informative)
Anyway:
The other story [slashdot.org]
Check out some of the information/comments from that...
-- Josh
Re:Link to previous slashdot story (Score:2)
I just figured I'd point people to this as I found it to be quite entertaining and educational (and somewhat relevant to this topic). I really hope they continue develompent on it (although some of the java applets have copyright 1997 on them).
Positive, but not really new (Score:3, Informative)
But really, they're just formalising and advertising a process that is already well under way. Online course materials are already an important web resource. When I need to teach myself some algorithmic trick, I no longer search for some hard-to-find, hard-to-browse, hard-to-read textbook. I go to Google. If I choose my keywords properly, I'm sure to find somebody's carefully written, example-laden lecture notes, aimed at all the thick-headed freshmen who forgot to come to class.
God, I love the web. For all its flaws, it's an indispensible resource. I know I used to do technical research without it, but I'm damned if I can remember how.
This is about consistency and completeness (Score:3, Interesting)
Another MIT perspective (Score:4, Informative)
This is not to say that the program will be useless; the people who really benefit are professors at other institutions who are looking for innovative approaches to college level education. Because this is the primary benefit to a program like this, it will in no way replace an MIT education with a self-taught system.
(at lael (dot mit edu))
MIT Mechanical Engineering '03
Being there (Score:2)
for people who cannot afford the premium version, or who somehow missed out on college for various reasons, this is a great boon to them without diminishing your experience.
Linkrot!! (Score:3, Informative)
The solution is to put the information on both the "news" page and the archive. That is something all web sites posting news should do. The user should then be responsible for finding the news article in the archive, as an individual page, so that it will last when people go back at a later time.
While degree.net does not have the MIT degree news in their archive [degree.net] right now, I hope they place it there soon. Better still would be an indvidual page dedicated to the MIT degree news, so that it could be directly linked, rather than using the news page or the archive.
Linkrot sucks. Understand what it is, and understand how to prevent it. If you are a webmaster or publisher, make it easy to find information and set up permanent URLs. To do otherwise is poor practice. And users, look for permanent URLs. Use them when you find them. Try to prevent spreading linkrot.
Thanks.
Try this out (Score:4, Insightful)
How long would you last in doing that? When would you lose interest? When would other, more pressing issues, take priority and push your self study aside?
Having all of the courses on line is a nice idea. However, without the pressure of deadlines, grades, and competition, most people would have a hard time following such self study through to completion.
Been there, done that (Score:2)
I went to a Canadian Military College (a loose analogue of West Point) Studied Computer Science (Systems)
The first:
Along the way, I took a course in Military and Strategic Studies, and discovered, belatedly, that that was where my true interests lay. I've since made it a point to read every single book on the MilStud required reading list, plus a large number of the other books written by the authors of those books, plus books written by the professors.
I've also toured some battlefields (seeing the actual ground reveals much the books don't) and have the experience of over 10 years of military service that I can apply to my readings.
I'd lay money that I could pass the 4th year MilStud final exams.
The Second:
After I retired from the Army, I took up building and driving race cars. Shortly thereafter, I took up a self-study of Automotive Engineering, through a mixture of buying textbooks, completing the exercises, and then hands-on applying the concepts to my own race car.
You want obscure formulae? Try reading Miliken!
(http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/156091526
I had a step up here, as there's a lot of crossover at the 101 level courses of physics and math between engineering and computer science, but I'd bet that I could hold my own at Batchlor-level engineering exams.
If there's an interest in the subject, and you're willing to get your hands dirty, you can learn a hell of a lot on your own.
Other online resources (Score:2)
MIT's OpenCourseWare sounds great for me, since I'm looking to learn the information, I don't care about the degree. However, their new system won't be online for several months or longer. Are there any good sites out there that provide good online resources for learning the topics I've mentioned? Pay sites are fine. Please don't say SmartPlanet or About.com
Re:Other online resources (Score:2)
Anyway, Franklin's distance courses are pretty good, and their CS degree is actually CS - not some crappy "cs for managers" curriculum with one programming language and a bunch of business garbage. You get real compiler design, OS design, hardware function, and math classes at Franklin (as well as the requisite well-rounded crap, but not at the expense of CS courses). It was the best online CS program that I could find a couple of years ago when I was looking around.
Re:Other online resources (Score:2)
Re:Other online resources (Score:2)
Re:Other online resources (Score:2)
An Alternative Educational System for Communities (Score:3, Interesting)
MIT's stuff is really cool by virtue of its name. MIT is respected, well known, etc. All the course materials are also a great store of knowledge. But...
I've been working on a community educational system called Oomind [oomind.com]. The great thing about oomind is that people are not just passive recipients of knowledge. You can also contribute your knowledge, and evaluate the quality of others' contributions. And, you can answer quiz questions to develop an academic record which is cumulative rather than percentage based.
You can find more about the philosophy of Oomind [oomind.com], and an introduction to how Oomind works [oomind.com]. The basic idea is that educational material is in the form of courselets. These courselets have scores in ten different attributes including practicality, creativity, and beauty. The scores are based on a weighted average of user's evaluations of the courselet. These scores help in two ways: searching for information, and determining dynamically the academic value of the knowledge. Each courselet can have quiz questions submitted by any user. The questions also have a weight based on users' evaluations. When you answer a question correctly, the weight is used to add a percentage of the courselet's attribute scores to your academic record as a learner.
Anyway, it is very dynamic, but it is still new so there isn't too much content. Please join up and submit courselets!!!
Textbooks (Score:2)
Dang, I was hoping they'd make the textbooks available online. There are a lot of texts I'd love to browse through, but don't really want to spend the $50-$100 each for the privilege. (How did I ever afford it when I was in college, anyway!?)
The FAQ [mit.edu] mentions that things available "could include material such as lecture notes, course outlines, reading lists, and assignments for each course". That's nice and all, but it sounds like you'll still need to get hold of the textbooks if you really want to take advantage of the course materials.
BTW, I suspect that part of that $100M figure may be from lack of revenue selling these materials in the campus bookstore. Just a guess.
some are online! (Score:2)
Some of these are better than print versions-
being more up to date and cheaper.
Stucture and Interpretation of Computer Programs (Score:3, Informative)
http://mitpress.mit.edu/sicp/full-text/book/boo
Mod me down if you already knew this. It came as a very pleasant surprise to me. For those who don't know, this book is considered by many to be part of the core of CS books, along with K&R, TAOCP, and the MIT Algorithms book.
andy
I hate to seem the naysayer. . ` (Score:5, Insightful)
It isn't exactly as if the course materials or curricumlum at MIT, or any *other* college, is some sort of great secret.
Nor is the actual *course material* really going to be online. That will be found in the textbooks.
If you want to learn physics or how to read the Iliad in the original greek all you need do is make the trip to your local public library, and in some states any state funded college library is also considered a public library, and take out a relevant text.
And read it.
Without trying to appear *too* snide, anyone who can't figure this out probably isn't up to college grade work in the first place.
The possibility of having lecture notes available online is an interesting exercise, but I'm not sure of what general relevance or use it might be. The textbook always contains superiour information, that is why they USE textbooks after all, and lecture notes are, in fact, often useless without the text and only needed to make sure you might have some niggling little tidbit that * that professor, in THAT course, is likely to sneak into a TEST.*
All in all I see how this might prove useful to the less actually educationally ambitious student of MIT, and how it might prove *interesting* to some of the public, but I fail to see how it in any way AIDS the public in an educational sense. The material is already available to the public, (including the course curiculum of MIT which is published and stocked by public libraries already), in the superiour form of actual texts.
MIT is correct. They can publish this material freely because 1) The essential information is *already* free and public, and 2) Because you don't pay MIT to reveal to you that F=MA, you pay them to have a professor *explain it to you.* and then be able to say you earned a degree from MIT!
If all you want is access to the learning material so that you may educate yourself at little or no expense you likely have a vastly superior resource right in your own community.
It's called a "reference librarian."
Go introduce yourself.
KFG
Re:I hate to seem the naysayer. . ` (Score:2)
Most subjects taught there will have hundreds or thousands of books on the subject. I know I'd rather find out which books are deemed useful enough to be included in MIT's cirriculum rather than reading every book on the subject or pick one which may not be very good.
naysay away.... (Score:5, Insightful)
So let's just consider going to the local library and finding an available copy of last year's 'Markov Chains and Simulated Neuro-physiology' textbook just right out, shall we?? What we really need is some kind of system that can transmit large quantities of text and pictures to each interested student's workspace, without reducing the supply for anyone else. Gee, I wonder what we could use....
Oh, right, I forgot. Except for those literally thousands of errors I have found in textbooks over the course of my life. So errata must come with each; distributing such and updating such is difficult if it has to come with the physical book -- I suppose you would need the above hypothetical information transport system, tying the errata to the book, in some kind of 'web'.And as I said above, frequently there are no books. Or the books suck, which is an even more common situation. Or school politics fucks up book choice, so the prof is xeroxing and distributing portions of other books, making his own compiliation for the class as it goes along. Or somehow, the prof deigns to think himself talented enough to explain material better, to his focused group, than a general textbook -- perish the thought!
Okay, cockmonger, let me put it for you straight. The material, at least not all of it, is not available to the public. This missing material, the real deal, the reason people pay 5 or 6 digits for 4 years of it, is the community of learning that supports peoples' interest and efforts. This community is the one thing that the ACES project is trying to duplicate that makes it different from the rest of the 'put notes on the web' projects the world over. Go read the article, join the community, add your ideas to the source -- it's GPLed.So in closing, I should thank you for pushing the declining cause of public libraries. They need more support and funding, and always have. But there is so much more to a college course, and to a college environment, that you are missing. Take another look.
Textbooks aren't always superior (Score:4, Interesting)
Except, I've a number of classes where the textbooks were strictly optional. Why? Because the professor thought they only provided good background information. Or, the textbook only supplied a convenient reference... all the "real" learning was based upon the lecture. There are numerous reasons this could happen - here are just a few:
1) There aren't any appropriate textbooks. For example, I took "Linux Kernel Interals". It was all hands on, looking at the code. All the lectures were based upon the professor's and students' personal knowledge. Or how about "Computer Architecture", where our studies were based on architecture principles realized in the PDP-8? (A machine with a decent architecture without being too complex to completely understand.) The only thing available was the lecture notes (which have subsequently been published in textbook form, I believe).
2) It's a topics/research class. You don't find many textbooks for "Current Topics in MiddleWare". Or in "Current trends in Organo-Metallic Chemistry Research", if you want to leave the computer science field. Sure, you can reference some of the appropriate journal articles, but they won't don't give you the comprehensive view and insights that lecture notes give.
3) It's a subjective field. How about all those humanities classes? (I'm sure even MIT students have to take a few of these.) Sure, you can list the "Norton Anthology of American Poetry" as a text book, but that by itself won't give you any insight into the cultural and historical forces that shaped a given poem. And it certainly won't help you when the test asks you to expound upon how the author makes an emotional connection with the reader through his careful selection of language.
I think I've expressed my point. I've usually found lecture notes to be infinitely more valuable than some textbooks. I will admit that there is occasionally a textbook that beats out the lecture notes, but usually that's been because of a lousy lecturer. There's a lot more worth here than you are giving MIT credit for.
Re:Textbooks aren't always superior (Score:2)
Unfortunately the book is somewhat dated, relying on kernel 2.2(.14?). And while most of the exercises are decent, I think learning about VFS and the filesystem code by hacking together a FAT driver was a waste of time.
University Course Ma (Score:3, Insightful)
What I find remarkable here isn't the fact that the info will be free (Mellon et. al. are picking up the early tab) but that it even exists at all. See, one of the scams of education is it's vaporous nature. Having to prepare lecture outlines is one thing, to actually solidify a course's material in almost linear form via a web page has to be remarkable. How many courses, especially the humanities, do you remember as a bullshit waste of time because it was virtually a free for all class discussion or the professor (while well intentioned) was just a very poor professor? This shows, if it comes to fruition, a great deal of courage on MIT's part and proves that they aren't the con artists many Universities are.
How about a complementary peer review slash site? (Score:2)
Of course one of the drawbacks could be the dissemination of misinformation. But I think that on the whole it could be a positive supplemental aid. Any thoughts?
There's not much there there (Score:3, Informative)
There's a section where you're supposed to be able to see questions asked by students along with the answers, but it's empty.
All this seems great if you're a student at MIT, but it's not useful for others.
cool (Score:3, Funny)
Yay! (Score:2)
Oh... Wait...
improve QC of courses? (Score:2)
Good, Better, ...? (Score:2)
I really applaud MIT's move to make their curriculum available for free over the Internet. It shows an interest in the advancement of science that trumps the growing trend to patent and close-off avenues for technology growth by businesses intent on exploiting technology-related law (who can blame them for doing so?).
The reason I think it shows real guts is that MIT traditionally has been very focussed on maintaing good relations with industry, and industry that profits from the current base of technology laws, and an industry that donates money to MIT. They are more closely tied together with industry as an engineering school, where a liberal arts school is pretty much independent of direct industrial largesse.
I was a student at MIT in my past. You may not know this, but MIT is actually run by MIT Corporation. Furthermore, upon entrance to the school, I "had" to sign some kind of paperwork that essentially insured that patents and ideas that I came up with while at MIT were theirs and not mine. Theses, too, are copyrighted by MIT, and generally more difficult to obtain than theses from other universities that are listed by University Microfilms.
Thus, you can see why I'm impressed at the turnaround evidenced by this move.
What would be even better would be if they were to release streaming video of classroom lectures, sessions with teaching assistants, as well as lecture notes, problem sets, exams, solutions.
Don't wait for MIT to post it (Score:3, Interesting)
Bryguy
In the true Hacker Spirit (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Where is the $100M coming from? (Score:5, Informative)
MIT ranks right up there with Harvard and other Ivy League schools when it comes to endowments. Basically, alumni give the school lots of money, which gets reinvested in all sorts of things - including projects of strategic importance like this.
Interestingly, MIT also derives significant revenue from the pseudo-business ventures and inventions created there. Inventions that turn out to be revenue-generators, created on-campus using their facilities, must pay a percentage of those revenues right back to the school.
I remember this causing quite a flap with a guy whose last name was Bose - son of the guy of Bose audio fame - who had an invention and was fighting with MIT over these fees.
At big-name schools like MIT, and Ivy League schools, student tuition is just one tiny piece of the financial machine.
up there with Harvard/other Ivy League schools? (Score:2)
Re:Where is the $100M coming from? (Score:3, Insightful)
Hey, it could be worse, you're paying a premium to attend a quality university *and* to share knowledge with the rest of the world helping inch us closer to Utopia.
I'm at Michigan State where tax money and students tuition are paying a premium to provide a Big Ten athletics program.
I think I'd rather be improving the world.
Re: Athletic programs (Score:2, Insightful)
Places like MIT, Caltech, and Harvard are the few places with incredible academic programs but virtually nonexistant athletic programs (the popular stuff I mean, that makes it to ESPN) that can charge large sums of money because the education itself is so good. How many times do you hear about a company spinning off of an MIT research program. Meanwhile, UNLV had an incredible basketball program which most likely attracted students and professors to the school. However, last I check, the Computer Science program isn't even Accredited there!
I thought I had a point somewhere in there...
Cheers,
jw
Re: Athletic programs (Score:2)
This certainly isn't true. Sports are one of the biggest money makers for division one schools, second only to parking fines (sarcasm, and disgust). Take a look at this article [philanthro...dtable.org]:
Trust me, sports makes money. I go to Va Tech. When we went to the big dance in New Orelands 2 years ago, we got some rediculous amount of money just for making it that far - 11 million, i believe. Then you have to think also: add revenue from tickets/TV/Radio/merchandise (most university bookstores basically launder money)/grants/alumni contributions/athletic boosters/etc.
Sports make money for colleges.
~Z
Re:Where is the $100M coming from? (Score:2)
Your money never went to you anyway (Score:2)
As it stands MIT has a great endowment and they can easily fund this project without dipping into the funds you donated to graduate work.
Re:Where is the $100M coming from? (Score:4, Funny)
Tom.
(Account 190939, having difficulty logging in)
Re:Where is the $100M coming from? (Score:2, Insightful)
Anyone can buy the textbooks for any MIT class. Anyone halfway gifted with Google could get the lecture notes, problem sets, and exam solutions to just about any class since about 1995. Think of those things as the things you get for free as a student.
What you pay for is the opportunity to interact with brilliant minds like yourself (and some undoubtedly more brilliant). Don't believe me? Go to one of Noam Chomsky's lectures on American foreign policy and get in a debate with him. Or head to LCS and have a chat with Ron Rivest. Go to MAS.100 and talk with Michael Hawley (does he still teach that?) after class. That's just a few examples. You can certainly find others interested in whatever you are interested in. And that's just the professors. Don't neglect the opportunity to learn from your fellow students.
Your tuition is only wasted if you waste it. MIT is more than just going to class and reading some books and lecture notes.
Re:Where is the $100M coming from? (Score:2)
Re:Where is the $100M coming from? (Score:2)