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The Almighty Buck

How To Get Hired As An Open Source Developer 369

Posted by timothy from the an-ask-slashdot-faq dept.
An anonymous reader writes "Todd Cranston-Cuebas, tech recruiter for Ticketmaster, offers insider tips and tricks for landing an open-source job -- or for recruiting new talent to your IT staff." Make yourself googleable.
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How To Get Hired As An Open Source Developer More

How To Get Hired As An Open Source Developer

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  • Its rather simple. (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 02, 2002 @05:28PM (#4796493)
    Just put it "willing to work for free" in your resume!

    • Re:Its rather simple. (Score:5, Funny)

      by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 02, 2002 @05:49PM (#4796663)
      I'll work for free.. I just won't do what you want me to do. But that's okay, if you offer me some cash then we can talk.
    • Free as beer or free as freedom? They just look for people who will work "free as beer", so be nice.
    • My nephew really did put 'expected salary: $0' in his resume. He was serious, in view of the high unemployment rate here and he doesn't want to stay home for nothing.

      The interviewer really asked him: "Would you consider getting more for this job?" - you dream to hear that in the interview do you? XD

  • does this happen? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by mschoolbus ( 627182 ) <{travisriley} {at} {gmail.com}> on Monday December 02, 2002 @05:33PM (#4796551)
    I thought the point of a company hiring you is so that they may make money off of you (i.e. What can you do for the company?).

    I understand there are some companies that can somehow make money off of you creating open source software for them, but does it really make sense to look for a job in which you create open-source software? I mean, isn't working about bringing in money at the end...?
    • Remember the whole point of computers and software is a means to an end. The only reason there are companies that produce and sell software is other companies then use this software to generate wealth. The software itself is not wealth. (This may vary depending on your definition of wealth, which - despite the efforts of many - does not have a single definition.)

      The company that uses the software doesn't really care about who owns it cause it's not there business. Their business is generating wealth (or assisting others in generating wealth) so that they can skim their share.

      So then existence value comes into play. There are companies who, for a variety of reasons, will pay others not to do certain things to their land (ie not knocking down trees by a certain stretch of river). The paying company doesn't now own the land... nor do they want to. There is no value to them owning the land. All they own is the decision not to knock down those trees because those trees have an "existence value" to them. Well this can be extended to software as well. Since the company is not in the business of own or selling software they can get a way better deal in buying the decision that somebody develops it instead of buying the software.
      • "Remember the whole point of computers and software is a means to an end. The only reason there are companies that produce and sell software is other companies then use this software to generate wealth."

        Yeah but by far most corporate software produced is not for sell. It is for use. So for most cases the only reason companies produce software is because they percieve a need for that software to do something for them. Thus, in the majority of cases, GPLed software is a free jumpstart. Since distribution in a non-issue, there is no problem with the GPL.

        • Re:does this happen? (Score:3, Insightful)

          by sql*kitten ( 1359 )
          Yeah but by far most corporate software produced is not for sell. It is for use. So for most cases the only reason companies produce software is because they percieve a need for that software to do something for them. Thus, in the majority of cases, GPLed software is a free jumpstart.

          Why would any company want to give a "free jumpstart" to its competitors?

          There might be a philosophical argument for Open Source, but I have yet (in almost 6 years of reading /.) to see a convincing economic argument.

    • Well... (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Snork Asaurus ( 595692 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @07:25PM (#4797366) Journal
      It's easy to forget that there are several different categories of software development, each with different things driving them. Here's a gross simplification of how I see it:

      There are 3 distinct major groups of developers:

      1 - people who earn money developing software for sale as a product: to them, open source generally != good

      2 - people who earn money developing software (embedded, hardware device drivers, etc.) to support another product that is sold: to them open source: sometimes == good and sometimes != good (gives away, architectures, secrets)

      3 - people who earn money developing software for IT purposes and/or in-house use: to them, open source generally == good

      Of course, there are many other groups of developers (academic, recreational, etc.) and there is intermingling, so the above is not a hard and fast rule.

      I also think that this is also one of the reasons that you often see acrimonious debate here at /. - each group has a different set of objectives and priorities.

  • Hiring with or without a degree... my thoughts. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by dagg ( 153577 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @05:34PM (#4796554) Journal
    "Companies looking for open source skill sets are very focused on the proven abilities of the engineer in the work environment. In other words, if you can do it, you are the right candidate. With proprietary systems, like Microsoft technologies, there's a tendency to look at things like certifications as a prerequisite for hires. In the open source world, there are very few certifications that matter."

    My experience is this:

    • People without degrees will willingly hire people without degrees.
    • People with degrees usually hire only people with degrees.

    • Re:Hiring with or without a degree... my thoughts. (Score:5, Insightful)

      by MattW ( 97290 ) <matt@ender.com> on Monday December 02, 2002 @05:43PM (#4796624) Homepage
      That hasn't been my experience. My experience is that good managers who are knowledgable about the workforce will hire people without degrees. People who are poor managers and in over their heads are too afraid to hire non-degreed personnel because they feel it will reflect poorly on them. It's the HR equivalent of "no one ever got fired for buying Microsoft".
    • In part this is because (in the US anyways) people are raised believing that you're sent to school to get the degree so you can get a good job so you can get the pretty and vapid girl so...

      And it's just a farce. People that have succeeded, or seen someone else succeed without the degree will realise (generally) before people that've gone through the schooling and the job, and have the pretty and vapid girl, and are oblivious.
    • People without degrees will willingly hire people without degrees.

      This has not been my experience. I've worked in a tech field for 4 employers in two states since 1994. I have no advanced degree (I was 12 units away from a BS in Geosciences when I recruited away from school to California, FWIW) yet I've worked continuously for the last 8 1/2 years. I was only hired once based solely on my resume. All other times, I had some working relationship and/or professional reputation with those who hired me (ie, they knew -- or knew someone who could vouch for -- what I could do). The one time I was hired based on my resume was by a person without a technical degree.

      It comes down to knowing people or being in the right place at the right time, in my experience. You have to know people and they have to know what you can do. Your working life should be thought of as one long probationary period from which future employers can draw by taking a peer's word that you are a good employee. You should also be able to find out a lot about an employer through similar methods. Either that, or you have to look really good on paper and somehow stand out from the crowd.

      The best employment experiences I've had were ones where I knew them and they knew me (at least second-hand).

      -B

    • People without degrees will willingly hire people without degrees.


      I've found just the opposite to be true. Oracle, headed by Larry Ellison, who never graduated, is obsessive about only hiring master's degrees from schools like MIT and Stanford. I beleive that Microsoft, headed by Mr. Bill who also never graduated, prefers degreed people as well. Of course, some of the brightest developers I've ever met never graduated.

      • Uhh (Score:2)

        by mindstrm ( 20013 )
        public company, etcetera.... Larry Ellison does not do all the hiring.

        Not having a degree WILL keep you frmo many corporate executive positions... there will be a point where you can go no further.. not because of what you know, but because of public perception... if they hire a VP with no degree, and he screws up, it's the fault of those who hired someone without even obvious credentials.

        • Re:Uhh (Score:2)

          by El ( 94934 )
          Larry used to interview every potential new hire personally, until the company became too large for this to be practical. The point was that Larry and Bill do to a large extent determine the corporate culture of their respective companies.

    • It's not that simple (Score:4, Insightful)

      by dcavanaugh ( 248349 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @06:39PM (#4797028) Homepage
      As a manager with no degree, I am in a position to comment.

      I give careful consideration to all applicants, but I take a sceptical view of those people whose only claim to fame is a degree or certification. I want experience, or concrete evidence that the candidate is prepared to do the job with minimal babysitting. Another thing I want is some longevity. If I'm hiring for a full-time position, I view it as a purchase as opposed to a rental. You would be amazed to see how many people have years of experience, but never more than 12 months at any one place. What assurances do I have that such people are not simply hopping from one contract to the next, leaving behind a trail of destruction?

      My hires have ranged from a high school dropout [long story omitted], to an MSCS. I'm quite proud of my people; all except one have worked out well. I don't actively seek to avoid hiring people with degrees, I'm just not convinced that the credential means much. This means I'm tough on recent grads, but who isn't? For the record, I hired a recent grad after he spent some time in my department as a temp -- another success story.

      I believe that managers will repeat any behavior that works, and abandon that which does not work. After you get burned on a few bad hires, you will seek to avoid whatever led you down that path.

      • dcavanaugh wrote:

        Another thing I want is some longevity. If I'm hiring for a full-time position, I view it as a purchase as opposed to a rental.

        Hmmm. I assume longevity, then, is something you as a manager can offer your employees, too? Can they feel confident that there won't be layoffs, that the company won't collapse, that there won't be huge accounting scandals that ruin their retirement?

        What assurances do I have that such people are not simply hopping from one contract to the next, leaving behind a trail of destruction?

        I dunno. Why not ask the applicant? Maybe former employers too. Maybe you can find out whether they did well in those jobs.

        Maybe he's hopping from contract to contract, leaving a trail of happy employers- maybe he's worked for a lot of high-risk companies that went under or had to lay him off, and he's looking for something now that's a bit more stable (if you purport to offer it).

        I don't think your metric has much value, but I'll be honest- with a big stack of resumes, some winnowing technique must be used. It's hard to argue with one that's worked, and isn't outright unethical.

      • You would be amazed to see how many people have years of experience, but never more than 12 months at any one place. What assurances do I have that such people are not simply hopping from one contract to the next, leaving behind a trail of destruction?

        No, I wouldn't be amazed at all. It's a bit naive to think that sort of work history has been anything but typical in some sectors--for years, now. If you want assurances, interview them hard, and check their references. Meanwhile, how about giving us some assurances that you're committed to long-term loyalty to your employees, and won't lay us off next Christmas to appease your new CEO, who's making arbitrary budget cuts to line his own pockets.

      • In this economy (Score:3, Insightful)

        by Twister002 ( 537605 )
        You should probably check to see whether or not the places they've "hopped" to in the past 12 months are still in business. I've had 3 jobs in the past 3 years and I have YET to voluntarily LEAVE a job. :)

        • There are different kinds of layoffs:
          • If you have 1000 non-union IT people, and a 5% layoff, then 50 of the "weakest links" are going to be gone.
          • If you have the same 1000 people and a 50% reduction, then there will be plenty of talented people among the 500 casualties, but the worst will go first.
          • With a 100% reduction, the talent pool starts to look pretty good, since the best & brightest are now available.

          Reference checks are difficult when the applicants past employers are out of business. Even when the ex-employer is still in business, most will never say anything negative ex-employees, and many have "zero disclosure" policies that circumvent the entire purpose of a reference check. I have had some success asking the magic question "Would you rehire?" Asking for an opinion instead of a statement of fact works wonders.

          It's difficult to tell the difference between a compulsive job-hopper, a deadbeat who gets consistently canned, and a talented person who is stuck with the LIFO scenario. It's also difficult to read a resume (or check references) to determine which of the 3 layoff scenarios has taken place. A letter of reference (with an e-mail that works) from a past supervisor may be the only thing that helps.
      • > I take a sceptical view of those people whose only claim to fame is a degree or certification.

        So I guess the rest of us who graduated from college and can't get experience because nobody will hire us are fucked then.

        If I wasn't supposed to go to college, what do you suggest I SHOULD have done after high school? College certainly hasn't paid off.
        • If I wasn't supposed to go to college, what do you suggest I SHOULD have done after high school? College certainly hasn't paid off.

          You were supposed to go to college, but in a field that isn't so drastically oversaturated as tech is now a days. That way, you wouldn't be competing for entry level positions against people who already have 10+ years of experience.

          Sad, but true.

        • Re:It's not that simple (Score:5, Interesting)

          by dcavanaugh ( 248349 ) on Tuesday December 03, 2002 @12:25AM (#4799018) Homepage
          I was in college back in the early 80s. At the time, new grads were having a hell of a time landing jobs. I was really worried about graduating and finding nothing to do. By the mid 80's, things warmed up just a little. I was looking for a part-time job that would provide meaningful experience, because it looked like experience was the only way to get a "real" job later.

          I applied for what I thought was a temporary, part-time, third shift operations job in a data center that ran a bunch of DEC VAX machines. The job they offered me was first shift, and 91% of full-time (state employee benefits included). I was a junior in college, who accidently landed a job that was no worse than what a new grad would get. I decided to take a break from school and go back when the job ended. Well, the job that wasn't third-shift or part-time wasn't temporary either. The original employee on leave never came back, so I became an accidental full-time permanent employee. I never went back to school, because I stayed 13 years, with five promotions, ending as the Director of Technical Services.

          If I had stayed in school, I would have finished in 86 or 87, and the job market was really hopping by then (but who knew back in 85?) I was so happy to have found a job, I thought it would be stupid to finish school if that meant graduating into a down market. Having seen how many employers "required" degrees but "hired" experience, I determined that experience would win out over degrees most of the time, or at least often enough to keep me working. My cynical view of employment has served me well. After 17 years of uninterrupted employment, I'm having a hard time seeing the downside of quitting college early.

          So, why do I post this mini-autobiography? To illustrate just how cyclical the IT has always been. When it's hot, anyone who can type can get a job. When it's cold, having a Ph.D. won't help. So, I think the strategy is to build credentials and manufacture your own experience in the "cold" years, as you wait for the "hot" years. If you live in a high-cost area, consider moving someplace cheap. There is no reason to tolerate a high cost of living unless you have a big paycheck to cover it. Go back for an MSCS or MBA degree if you can; work outside IT if you must. Either way, start your own little empire of computers, using open source (Linux) or free downloads from Oracle (free for non-commercial use, including home hacking). If you can pick up contract work of any type, then you'll be in a position to do something when the market heats up again. Timing is everything.

          The fact that we have a down market combined with a glut of H1Bs makes me wonder if we are going to see a massive correction when the market heats up. I predict a shortage of IT people, because it makes no sense to invest 4 years of tuition just to compete with H1Bs. Then again, my prediction plus $1.10 gets you a medium coffee at Dunkin Donuts.

  • Same as getting any job (Score:5, Insightful)

    by BigGar' ( 411008 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @05:34PM (#4796555) Homepage
    Have skills applicable to the job and a few others that might come in handy.

    Be flexabile on salary, understand that pay has come down in a lot of markets.

    Interview well when it gets to that point.

    Get lucky.

    How is any of this different than getting any job?

  • Lucky me :-) (Score:4, Informative)

    by Wizard of OS ( 111213 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @05:34PM (#4796560)
    I know, I know, I have been extremely lucky :). Exactly one year ago, I was asked to join the internet team of a public broadcaster in the Netherlands. Their sites are based on the Open Source CMS mmbase [mmbase.org]. Of course, my work doesn't consist of 100% open-source programming, a lot of projects are more based around implementing the CMS for sites then on extending it. Nevertheless, I have been able to write significant bugfixes / applications that have been or will be released under an Open Source license.

    Please don't hurt me now :)

  • No way (Score:5, Interesting)

    by IamTheRealMike ( 537420 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @05:35PM (#4796567)
    Wow, slashdot is really proving itself interesting tonight. I should get a subscription but student, no cash, blah de blah.

    This is almost psychic though. I was just talking to my flatmate (we both work for former ministry of defence research) whether it'd be possible to get a project code for my open source project and try and get a grant from the LinuxFund, the idea being that I could "bill" the Fund for my time working on the project. Often the fund gives out money and the projects don't really know what to do with it, I think the best use I can think of is to let me work on it fulltime.

    Of course, as Dan rightly pointed out, there are all sorts of ugly issues with that plan, noteably the overhead my company would charge, and the fact that they have a tendancy to eat IP for breakfast. Even though the project doesn't do anything that hasn't been done before, they might try to "own" the code, which wouldn't do any good at all.

    Still, I think I might talk to my boss about it tomorrow. I get paid jack all basically so I'd be able to make $1000 go a long way.....

  • ResumeRank(tm)? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by szquirrel ( 140575 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @05:36PM (#4796573) Homepage
    From the article:

    We create an index of all incoming resumes and search on keywords. That's why it's important for job-seekers to repeat the major skills multiple times in their resume.

    WTF is this? It's bad enough having to compete for a job with people who flat-out lie. Now am I going to lose out just because some dickhead spammed more buzzwords around his resume?
    • Agreed... I just finished what I thought was a kick-ass resume, where I explictly removed multiple occurances of the same word.

      Why? Because it looks bad to the human eye "Apache this" and "Apache that" and "Apache thisotherthat" "Java this" "Java that" "Java something else", when you could say "This that thisotherthat Apache" and "Java this and that".

      Now I need to go back and put those keywords back in multiple times... arg!
    • could be worse, you could be competing with Bernard Shifman [petemoss.com]

      - He once sent our company mascot an email with his resume. Apparently he thought a mouse was in charge of human resources. Guess he thought we were disney.

    • Though this also might be a benefit (especially in better markets). If the company doesn't hire on decent people they're not going to succeed. They're not going to get good people keyword searching. And you don't *really* want to get hired on just so you can go job hunting again in a few months do you?
    • WTF is this? It's bad enough having to compete for a job with people who flat-out lie. Now am I going to lose out just because some dickhead spammed more buzzwords around his resume?

      Dude, seriously... Don't sweat it. Why would you ever want to work at a company where recruitment and hiring is performed by a computer?

      In other words, if some stupid company hires Joe Blow because his resume contains six more occurrences of "PHP" than yours, do you really want to work there? Imagine what your new boss would be like...

  • Open source, closed sorce.. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by kaoshin ( 110328 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @05:37PM (#4796585)
    What does it matter. If you can get employed at all right now you are in nice shape.

    • short-term vs. long-term (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Idou ( 572394 )
      I landed my current job just as my company was going through a major layoff. Many tech guys were let go. But you see, I am not considered a tech guy (I'm in accounting, I'm an analyst).

      Your post reminded me of posts that I have been seeing for years, "Software isn't a religion, I pick the best tool for the job." Let me let you in on a little secret: in preparing for the CPA exam, I became a religious believer of the accounting standards and rules established by the FASB, GASB, and IRS, even though many standards might not be the best approach. I would never, ever follow another standard unless I could do so without breaking any major rules of the profession (there are very rare cases when its okay). You see, I am a professional, and this is how professionals go about their business.

      Accounting standards are open for everyone to see and judge, but in the end, only one entity that is 100% loyal to the PROFESSION has the power to alter them. There is always a shortage of CPAs because the AICPA insures that their is never a surplus. MS has always insured that their is a surplus of MSCE's and is under even more pressure to do so now to compete with Open Source TCO. Thus, your industry is polluted by incompetents who constantly repeat their 3 r's (reboot, reinstall, reformat). I have severed all my major needs from the IS department with an unsupported laptop ("we don't support Lynoocks") running LAMP for some of the more complex analysis calculations that I must do (that some IT professional would otherwise be getting paid to code for). The MSCE's have forced me to become more tech savvy than I ever expected, and now I no longer need them. Meanwhile, the FASB and AICPA do everything to insure I keep on making good $, and I protect and respect these organizations as if my job depended on it, because it does.So here is a short trend analysis: value of accountants over time -> up, value IT workers over time -> down.

      Don't get me wrong, I do sympathize with your situation. However, nothing will ever change unless IT becomes a profession instead of a type of manual labor and as long as one company is making all the calls, it ain't ever going to happen. Open Source is the last chance for IT workers to make themselves a profession and pull themselves out of minimum wage before everything gets pallademonized. Professionals make more and have more opportunities. Now, create yourself a profession, the code is already there.

      Good luck.

      No job? Become a paid MandrakeExpert in just a month.
      Requirement: Know Linux . . . I mean really know Linux INSIDE and OUT. These guys are Linux GODS!!!
      www.mandrakeexpert.com

  • Ticketbastard (Score:5, Insightful)

    by timothy_m_smith ( 222047 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @05:37PM (#4796586)
    I find it almost funny to hear Ticketmaster being associated with free software since they provide a service that adds almost no value and charges a boatload. Good thing they are saving so much money on software systems.
    • Right on. The best part is that they charge you a 'convenience fee' for ordering online... while saving money on operators!


      What a deal, eh?

    • Re:Ticketbastard (Score:3, Insightful)

      by RazzleFrog ( 537054 )
      Please mod this up. Can people be so blind as to not see the value of his post? This is not about a company supporting the open source revolution. It is about a money grubbing, evil empire (that has made buying event tickets an absolute expensive nightmare) using freely available open source applications to save money and then hiring a full time open source employee so that they don't have to pay support fees to any of the companies/organizations creating the applications.
      • Which is why I don't go to concerts and therefore don't buy tickets.

        If people voted with their wallets instead of spewing filth upon the head of the filthy rich on geeky forums and then spending their hard-earned cash on tickets and convenience fees, they'd change their tune.

        Anyway: It's like saying the soup is salty and asking for seconds: mixed messages get you nowhere.

      • Re:Ticketbastard (Score:5, Insightful)

        by Soko ( 17987 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @06:57PM (#4797168) Homepage
        Creators of apps like Microsoft?

        Welcome to capitalism, and (for good or ill) one of the roles of OSS. How many times have you heard "RedHat is cheaper than Windows, so businesses should use it!!!", or worse, said that yourself? Don't like it when the other edge of the OSS sword swings around and hits you, eh?

        Since when does the GPL say "No money grubbing, evil monopolists allowed to install and use this software to further thier cause."? Oh, that's right, it doesn't - only rules about re-distribution. Hopefully 2.0 of the GPL will stomp out all monopolies, hunh?

        Grow up.

        Like it or not, we get the good with the bad. As "evil" as TicketMonster is, they _are_ forwarding our cause in a way that businesses understand - namley that OSS makes good business sense. I'll take that over a tin-foil hat any day, bud.

        Hell, maybe our way "of goodness and light" will rub off on them by association, making for a kinder and gentler monopolist. You just never know...

        Soko

        • Right, so this story is currently in the midst of being played out by YOURS TRULY.

          Thanks to everyone's FAVOURITE media monopoly [clearchannelsucks.org], ClearChannel, which is the OWNER of TM, I and a friend were EACH screwed out of $40 because of our dietary restrictions due to our religious/ethical beliefs. Just for the record, I keep Kosher & my friend is a vegan, just like the HEADLINER of the Area2 concert, Moby [moby.com]. We wanted to see the Area2, obviously.

          We bought tickets over the web to the Area2 concert when it rolled into Philly. Before purchase there was NO indication of what restrictions would be placed on our tickets. Of course, AFTER we had paid, and our tickets printed on our printer, did we see all the fine print on the ticket that said, "subject to venue rules" or somesuch.

          Ok. Fine. We check the website for the venue, the Tweeter Center in Camden, NJ (btw, ALSO owned [or is that 0WN3D?] by ClearChannel), and it seems like we'd be allowed a backpack & a small amount of our own food. Of course, when we GET THERE, they inform us that we cannot bring our own food in. We are REFUSED ENTRY due to our religious beliefs. I and my friend cannot eat the food they have there, and it its a 6 hour+ show. Oh, I also forgot to mention the fact that they were only allowing ONE bottle of water per person. This was on quite possibly the HOTTEST day of the year in a venue that has NO shade.

          So, to sum up, I (and my friend) were REFUSED ADMITTANCE based upon our religious beliefs, not to mention the fact that apparently, ClearChannel wants to KILL all of their customers through dehydration. They refuse to refund the ticket price, claiming "all sales are final." However, they did NOT divulge the terms of purchase until AFTER the purchase had been made, and then even CHANGED terms on us!

          If that's not a tangible example of someone being harmed by CC's evil monopolistic behavior, I don't know what is.

    • Even worse is that they can't even keep their services working well. I've lost 8th row tickets because of their "you must check out in 5 minutes" rule when their website wouldn't work well enough to let me purchase the tickets in that allotted 5 minutes. Or even worse, getting on for a presale right when it starts, and being told "there are no more tickets available" while talking to other people who were purchasing tickets throughout the time it wouldn't find any for me.

      In other words, why take the advice of this person? What reason is there to believe they're not trying to find another way to make money off of doing nothing, and doing it badly?

  • Google? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by xchino ( 591175 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @05:39PM (#4796598)
    What's the difference between sorting out 3,000 resumes and 3,000 irrelevant google links? Secondly, if someone is not actively seeking employment, then they are probably employed. Why not give the job to one of the thousands of highly qualified unemployed Open Source professionals? Seriously, it's like a geek can't get a break in this business ;)
  • Gee, thanks! I just submitted my resume for a job at one of the ticketmaster subsidiaries...

    My resume is now lost in a huge, even bigger then usual pile of resumes.

    404 - Career Not Found!

  • pssst... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by jki ( 624756 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @05:41PM (#4796615) Homepage
    offers insider tips and tricks for landing an open-source job -- or for recruiting new talent to your IT staff

    Here's a free insider tip [sourceforge.net], here's another [openchallenge.org].. do something to get noticed. A CV with something concrete in it looks much better than one without.

  • Ticketmaster, huh? (Score:5, Funny)

    by X_Caffeine ( 451624 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @05:43PM (#4796626)
    Does he have any tips on running the sort of monopoly that a company like Microsoft could actually take notes from?

  • Sigh - #include (Score:5, Funny)

    by 4of12 ( 97621 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @05:48PM (#4796660) Homepage Journal

    I guess it's probably just a reflex action against spam-like resume submission (he cites 3000 applicants for a PC support tech), but I have to cringe that resumes get pre-processed by machine.

    Soon applicants will achieve homogeneity in resumes, devoid of any real persona...

    • PHP, 5 years experience
    • MySQL 6 years experience, senior project lead, architect
    • Apache 3.0pre9, principal developer, 9 years experience
    • .NET original architectural team, 15 years experience
    • Java2EE, 23 years experience
    • Linux kernel developer, 497 years experience
    • MCSE since 1954
    • SANS certified since 213 B.C.
    • CCNE since Cheops finished the pyramid
  • Imagine the deluge of resumes this recruiter is going to see .. solicited or not.

    My take on working full time in an open source role is ..

    Keep your skills current and relevent for the job market and interview as best you are able ..

    The fact that there might be a chance for open source evangelism or code contributions is secondary unless you are either independently wealthy or found some group that is.

    In this case, it's like my career. I was a Unix admin before the boom .. during and after. The tools change and improve but the basic requirements don't change.

    That is why you find people brought up on Dos or Linux having no particular problem getting around Windows .. no more so than going from Solaris to Red Hat Linux to Debian Linux .. the particulars are different but the skills required to understand what needs to be done do not vary very much.

    Which looks better on a resume

    Unix Administrator - 5 Years - Linux (several) Solaris, HPUX, AIX and others

    or

    Red Hat Linux Administrator - 5 years

  • Get a headhunter (Score:2, Insightful)

    by stratjakt ( 596332 )
    They'll do all the work for you, and (usually) get paid by the hiring company for finding you.

    This article is good advise if you want to work as a support tech at ticketmaster, but in my experience, a good headhunter is the only way to go.

  • My new resume (Score:5, Funny)

    by Waffle Iron ( 339739 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @06:00PM (#4796748)
    This article has excellent advice for writing a resume in this age of Internet search engines. I've already rewritten mine. Here it is:

    Resume Resume Resume Resume Resume

    Java C Windows Windows Motivated C++ C SQL Teamwork C++ Perl C GDI C++ Perl Teamwork Windows Perl SQL SQL Motivated Windows GDI C++ Windows Self-Starter Perl C++ C C++ C++ GDI Motivated Self-Starter Python C++ Java Java C++ Python C++

    Motivated Teamwork Python Motivated C++ Perl Motivated Perl C Java Self-Starter Windows GDI Self-Starter Java GDI Motivated C++ Windows Windows Windows Teamwork Self-Starter GDI Self-Starter C C Windows SQL Windows Python Python GDI Motivated GDI Perl Teamwork SQL Perl Self-Starter Java Python GDI Teamwork Teamwork Motivated Java SQL Windows Perl Teamwork SQL C++

    Self-Starter C++ GDI Java Python Windows Perl C++ GDI Windows Teamwork C GDI Python Perl C++ Perl C C++ Self-Starter Teamwork Motivated Python Java Teamwork Java Motivated Motivated Teamwork Motivated Python Self-Starter Java Python C++ SQL Python Teamwork Python Self-Starter Java Teamwork Teamwork C++ C++ Self-Starter Motivated GDI Motivated Windows Motivated GDI C++ GDI Windows Python Perl C Python Teamwork Python Self-Starter Windows Motivated SQL C++ GDI GDI SQL SQL C Self-Starter C++ Java GDI SQL GDI Self-Starter C Teamwork Motivated Motivated SQL SQL Self-Starter

    Self-Starter Motivated C Teamwork Motivated Teamwork SQL Windows Java Windows C Windows SQL C++ Teamwork Python GDI Java C++ Python GDI

    • Resume Resume Resume Resume Resume

      Java C Windows Windows Motivated C++ C SQL Teamwork C++ Perl C GDI C++ Perl Teamwork Windows Perl SQL SQL Motivated Windows GDI C++ Windows Self-Starter Perl C++ C C++ C++ GDI Motivated Self-Starter Python C++ Java Java C++ Python C++ ...

      You SWINE!! You copied my resume! You may expect to hear from my liars!

  • Insider tips and tricks, condensed version (Score:3, Funny)

    by kwertii ( 305902 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @06:04PM (#4796782) Homepage
    • List buzzwords often in your resume.
    • Put your resume online.
    • Already know someone who is hiring.
    • If this is not possible, already know someone who can refer you to someone who is hiring.

  • Move towards becoming self-employed and contract (Score:4, Interesting)

    by NZheretic ( 23872 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @06:09PM (#4796814) Homepage Journal
    If your planning on spending most of your time actually developing or deploying rather than administrating open source systems, then do yourself and open source in general a favor and consider becoming a self-employed contractor.

    As a contractor, it is easier to avoid getting locked into internal (and infernal) NDAs development agreements, the bane of my current position.

    The concept of open source and development is finally gaining ground and it's a lot easier these days to sell your development services, based on open sourced and free licensed software, to other interested parties.

    Individual jobs come and go, but GPL and LGPL licensed source is forever.

  • Open Source a Fantastic "Interview" (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Adam Fisk ( 536262 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @06:11PM (#4796829)
    We see this issue from a slightly different angle -- open source coders for LimeWire offer us an extended "interview" period where we can truly judge the value of their code. This lets us make hiring decisions easily. There's no interview that can substitute for months of open source code. Interestingly, we've seen that one of the primary attributes of people who write good code is also one of the primary attributes that involves them in open source to begin with -- passion for the project. The best coders often don't have the most impressive degrees. Rather, the best coders are the ones who care enough about the project to write good code for it. Experience and training help, but it's passion for the project that makes average code good, or good code great.

    • I hope you have checked with your State to see what qualifies as an employee, or you may find yourself on the loosing end of a lawsuit.

      Actual, check with the IRS. They list 20 thing that indicate someone is an employee, regardless of anything the sign. That applie to courts as well.

      Rul of thumb, if the person doing the work could answer yes to 7 out of the 20 question, there an employee.

      Again, the courts and the IRS don't care about what the person has signed when determining status. this will get you into a lot of trouble if you using 1099.
      • That's an interesting point regarding liability in general, and about the IRS. In terms of suite regarding any copyright issues in particular, however, it's unlikely that employees of companies would be held personally liable in any way. The assets of company officers could potentially be fair game in a suit, but even that is unlikely and not really what the plaintiffs would be after (except perhaps as a scare tactic). Given that open source coders could never be considered officers, there's really no legal threat in terms of personal assets.

        As far as the IRS goes, any open source programmers that get paid are required to file their earnings, just as any freelance employee would be. If they're not getting paid, it's off course not an issue.

    • There can be some difficulty in determining, in a multi-person open source project, who the author/designer really is. And who did the coding (good and bad).

      This isn't unique to open-source code, of course. For every big succesful commercial project there are plenty of people willing to take credit for the whole thing, too.

      • In any project that is centrally controlled, where a set of individuals keeps close track of any new code (and where limited numbers of people are able to add code directly without submitting patches), it's quite easy to know precisely who did what. This is the case with LimeWire just as it's the case with Linux (our job is orders of magnitude smaller and easier, of course).

        That issue aside, however, even if you only know that a specific person wrote a specific piece of code that you liked (whether or not you know exactly who wrote every line in the program), that person has a much better chance of getting hired if and when a position opens up.

  • How I got my last job (Score:3, Funny)

    by Binarybrain ( 253017 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @06:14PM (#4796840)
    Sometime during the last few days at my last job I happened to ask my employer why he hired me. The reason was rather caught me by suprise.

    Because I hated Microsoft. Im not kidding. He figured that if I was smart enough to dislike Microsoft that I probably knew what I was talking about.

  • Crappy hiring techniques (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward
    Another reason is that some recruiters use applicant tracking programs that do automatic skills assessment based on keywords found in the resume, and will rank resumes based on that assessment.

    Having seen my fair share of resumes padded with every acronym under the sun, I have to say this is a pretty crappy way to do recruiting.

    There's a reason why people get hired based on "who they know"... it can be an effective filter.

    Looking for a job? Get to know people!

  • Now hiring OS Developers! (Score:4, Funny)

    by NineNine ( 235196 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @06:29PM (#4796947)
    Payment:

    I'll buy beer for you and won't tell your parents.

    You get to look at my personal collection of nudie magazines.

    You can code at my office, and tell your parents that you're at a sleepover. I'm an adult. They'll believe me.

    I can pick you up from school, posing as your parents.

    I have a PS2 and Grand Theft Auto: Vice City!

    You can have all of the soda and candy you want.

    Please send resume and/or high score list.

  • How I did it (Score:4, Interesting)

    by mikosullivan ( 320993 ) <miko@idocCOUGARs.com minus cat> on Monday December 02, 2002 @06:44PM (#4797065)
    Without planning it or expecting it to happen, I got a new job developing open source software last month.

    My wife Starflower and I have been volunteering for the Rescue Mission of Roanoke, a Christian organization that provides meals, shelter, and other needed services to the homeless in the Roanoke area. It's a great place and Starflower and I are very proud to help out there.

    One evening I was having dinner with Joy, the director of the mission, and she mentioned that her computer had crashed a dozen times that day. Out of habit I said that that sort of thing doesn't happen in Linux. She got very interested and said that I was the fourth person to say that, so tell her more about this Linux thing. Well, I gave her the standard pitch, talking about the value and quality of open source in general and Linux in particular. I told her about LTSP and how the mission could make life a lot easier with a set of thin clients and one good server. I talked about how great and helpful the open source community is. I even mentioned that Larry Wall (I'm doing the database project in Perl) is an evangelical Christian. Joy was very interested in all of this.

    The following week, I presented a requirements document for a new database system using Apache, PostGres and Perl. I call the system Joyis [idocs.com], and you're welcome to read through the document yourself.

    My intention was to develop the system on a volunteer basius. The management team had a better idea: they offered me a full time job on the spot. I accepted on the spot. I'll be developing Joyis for the next couple months, then migrating the entire mission to a completely open source infrastructure: Linux, LTSP, OpenOffice.org, Evolutions, and of course, Joyis.

    The pay ain't much, but we can get by on it. On the plus side, I get to spend all my time in my favorite development environments, working my own hours, and creating a system that will actually help people and make the world a better place. When I'm done, Joyis will be released open source so that other homeless organization can use it. Keep an eye on SourceForge for the first release in a month or so.

  • a bit late (Score:5, Funny)

    by Tablizer ( 95088 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @07:09PM (#4797252) Journal

    1999: "How To Get Hired As An Open Source Developer"

    2001: "How To Get Hired As A Developer"

    2002: "How To Get Hired"

  • work cheap? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by phorm ( 591458 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @07:12PM (#4797276) Journal
    Even with a College/Uni degree, or diploma, nobody should really expect to get out and immediately get a $75000/yr+superduperbenefits job. Really, what you should look for is a job that you would like, make you enough income to survive the first year, and looks really good on a resume.
    Barring that, you can also spot the companies you'd wish to work for that do pay the big bucks, and try getting in on one of the lesser positions.
    It's 100% easier to climb a ladder when you're already working in a company. It's also (ironically) very often easier to get a job when you've already got a job. You don't have to mention on your resume that you're "undervalued and underpaid", just list what you're capable of, and the fact that you are currently doing it helps prove so.

    There are a lot of small/starter companies who need computer support that frankly can't afford to pay big bucks in the beginning. They do look good on a resume though, and the work generally isn't too hard. Oftimes if you are lucky, said companies can end up growing, and as they grow - so often does your paycheque.

    It's hard to think of with the cost of living nowadays, but sometimes the value of a position is not in the paycheque, but in the respect, references, and experience it gains.

    Oh, and a big problem with small companies is that it gets really hard to leave when you're ready to move on... they tend to grow on you.

    • Re:work cheap? (Score:3, Insightful)

      by geekoid ( 135745 )
      "It's 100% easier to climb a ladder when you're already working in a company. "

      I find that to be false.

      If you want to climb the ladder, the best way is to find another company that is hiring for that position. In general you get a higher pay increase, no need to deal with the projects that you have gotten associated with, and a better opertunity to start focusing your next step right away.

      I wish it wasn't that way, but it is.

  • Why to hire OSS developers (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Adam Wiggins ( 349 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @07:25PM (#4797369) Homepage
    I spend a lot of time dealing with hiring for the IT staff at my company. These days, I pretty much instantly trash any resume doesn't include some sort of background with creating or maintaining an Open Source projust of reasonable size. It may be an unfair bias, but experience has shown me that OSS developers are almost always an order of magnitude more skilled and more responsible than applicants from other backgrounds.

    The self-motivation, self-discipline, organizational skills, and willingness to write code that the author isnt ashamed to display to the whole world are exactly the sort of traits that employers look for (or should be, anyway).
    • I spend a lot of time dealing with hiring for the IT staff at my company. These days, I pretty much instantly trash any resume doesn't include some sort of background with creating or maintaining an Open Source projust of reasonable size. It may be an unfair bias, but experience has shown me that OSS developers are almost always an order of magnitude more skilled and more responsible than applicants from other backgrounds.

      The self-motivation, self-discipline, organizational skills, and willingness to write code that the author isnt ashamed to display to the whole world are exactly the sort of traits that employers look for (or should be, anyway).

      And, of course, the willingness to work for next to nothing doesn't hurt when it comes to your balance sheet.

  • In short, shy comptuer geeks, which is many of the good ones, have little chance. I'm a good programer, but I like to sit in my little corner and program. One day I found myself out of work, and boom, I looked around, and so where most of the people who knew I was a good programer. (My small group)

    Mind you, the above story is nothing new. Every shy person faces it everytime we need a new job. I can deal with people, I just prefer not to, and when I have a good job I like to get the job I'm hired to do done.

  • One way to get your resume taken seriously... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by esconsult1 ( 203878 ) on Monday December 02, 2002 @11:15PM (#4798715) Homepage Journal
    I've never been turned down for a job I interviewed for, and I dont have a degree, and I've never been fired. My skill sets are sparse: PHP, Postgresql Perl, MySQL, Apache, Linux etc... Here's what I did:

    1. Went into detail what I did in the last 3 jobs, I mean serious detail. It means that the people that I'll work well with, will appreciate my resume instead of some PHB looking for acronyms.

    2. Include links to articles I wrote, and postings I made in forums for all the above technologies. The last job I got was because they received help from some silly posting I made and forgot about years ago.

    3. Include links to interactive sites that you helped build. Forget the pretty stuff, the fancy HTML, that's not what you will be hired for, instead, link to the interactive portions of the site that actually do something.

    4. Always have some code samples handy with lots of comments. Include some OOP examples along with traditional procedural code.Even if they dont use OOP, at least they know that you can.

    5. Make sure that you will have lots of hits in google, which will turn up all your online activity.

    6. Dont bring your resume to the interview. Instead, when they ask for it, give them the URL where they can view it.

    7. Refuse a job where they require your resume in Microsoft Word format. It means that they are not really an open source shop, and the PHB's probably use Outlook, Exchange, Office and IE. Tell them that you are refusing the job because of that reason. They will respect you for having the balls to do it, and in the same vein, always submit your resume in text format in the email to the recruiter (not as an attachment).

    8. Be assertive in your resume, tell them exactly what you want to do. Dont be vague about what you want to do. Tell them how you can help them, and that you will make a great fit in their org. If possible, tailor your resume for each job you are applying for.

    9. Don't mention that you can use a word processor, browser, or spreadsheet. That's passe, everybody's expected to do that. Don't mention that you can admin an NT/2000 box (even if you can), instead, tell them in the interview.

    I guess there are more tips out there, but for last 2 jobs and 4 interviews in 6 years, those have worked well for me.

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