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Comment: Re:Tool complexity leads to learning the tool (Score 1) 158

by angel'o'sphere (#47586017) Attached to: Getting Back To Coding

On what part I where wrong?
Sorry ... it is late. If you believe I'm wrong point out where.
Since I'm separated from my previous GF I refuse to attempt to read the mind of one who tries to discuss with me: speak out what you want to say or leave it. I don't try to figure what 'message' you might have behind, besides your words. Particular not over the internet in my second hand language.

Comment: Re:Tool complexity leads to learning the tool (Score 1) 158

by angel'o'sphere (#47585977) Attached to: Getting Back To Coding

The OP, did not say that people 'don't know what the tool' does. He complained they can not accomplish the same thing the tool does, without the tool.

You still don't know what a straw man is? No problem, the accusation that one is using this fallacy is an US phenomenon only anyway ... ah, well it is something to keep my boat floating?

If I would need something keeping me a float, I would rather follow the Inka and use reed than some "straw".

Your challenge, btw is a straw man, I believe, as we where talking about the OP ... and my parent. Actually I answered to my parent and you brought back in the OP ... which is ... shit, don't remember what fallacy that is, also a straw man perhaps .. who knows.

So, both my parent as well as my OP considered abolishing tools.

So perhaps you should focus a bit more and only answer to what actually got written?

Comment: Re:Tool complexity leads to learning the tool (Score 2) 158

by angel'o'sphere (#47585369) Attached to: Getting Back To Coding

Well, if I was not on an iPad I simply would copy paste your rant and exchange every NOT for a yes and every "C can", with a "C can't" etc. p.p.

If you really believe the **** you just wrote there, you don't qualify for discussions about software development etc.

I only agree that Java is bloated, because the need of writing 'public' in front of every class and method and 'private' in from of every attribute is indeed a waste of time, and it is ugly to read.

The rest of your post, especially the claims about how incompetent Java Developers are, how slow Java is, how resource hungry Java is ... simply shows you have no clue yourself about Java.

Hint: did you ever compare a 'real world' Java program in speed and resource consumption with an equivalent real world C/C++ program? Likely not. Why not? Because a Java program where 7 developers work 5 years on costs roughly 4.5million Euros. I doubt there is anyone going to invest another 10(?) million or regardless how much to craft an equivalent C program just to prove you can save a megabyte here and there and gain a few computing cycles here and there.

Guess what, my last 'BIG IRON' Java contract involved a SUN 'mainframe' with 1 terra byte of RAM. It had about 50 Java VMs running with max memory sizes between 2 and 16GB. The self made software running on it was worth roughly 100million Euros, likely more, I joined late in the project, no idea how long it actually ran. And guess what all the VMs where doing all the time? Idling, waiting for DB requests or Network requests to finish. Do you really think C programs ... or Erlang, or just insert your language of choice: would idle less? Would need less RAM? Would be cheaper to develop? (Programming DB access in C ... that is worth than the death penalty ... oh my)

Sorry, you can say about Java what you want. But if we had not Java, many big companies in our times would not even exist.

Comment: Re:Tool complexity leads to learning the tool (Score 1) 158

by angel'o'sphere (#47585281) Attached to: Getting Back To Coding

ROFL.
So, you claim to know the difference between an 'inspection' and a 'walk through' but actually don't know it?

And since when may the reviewers not have access to the VCS of the developers, regardless what kind of review style you chose?

Sorry ... perhaps you should not only read the books your favorite professor suggests but also some others?

There is no such thing as 'the right way doing code reviews' ... there are dozens of approaches, I mentioned two general categories above.

Comment: Re:Tool complexity leads to learning the tool (Score 1) 158

by angel'o'sphere (#47585229) Attached to: Getting Back To Coding

He/she doesn't have to say anything like that. Said person is giving you a counter-argument to your claim that every IDE does such and such. I can also give you another example IDE that is not MS and
He did not give a counter example. He made a claim.
necessarily put things in text files: Oracle's JDeveloper I used JDeveloper ... and all I worked on was in text files ... care to point out, what is not?

Not all tools are IDEs. The OP is referring to tools that generate heaps of stuff (auto-gen code, property files, xml descriptors and what not) and that there are developers who do not know how all of that is supposed to work. You see that a lot in Java and MS land.
Tools are used to tackle a certain technology. The xml files, property files etc. etc. are not there because of the tool. They are there because the technology requires them. So if your co workers or employees can mot master the technology without tools obscuring them, then that is certainly not the tools fault, regardless what tool is involved.

The next tool you want to abolish is a C compiler, because no one using it knows anymore how to code in assembler?

Sorry, the talk WAS about IDEs as any other tool.

And perhaps you should read up what a 'straw,an fallacy' actually is instead of throwing it randomly into discussions.

So, again: what exactly does JDeveloper not store in a text file? What exactly prevents you building a project from the command line by issuing the relevant 'javac' and 'jar' commands?

Comment: Re:Tool complexity leads to learning the tool (Score 2) 158

by angel'o'sphere (#47584801) Attached to: Getting Back To Coding

Sorry, but your claim that you can not build a Java project that originated in Eclipse, without having the same layout is not only nonsense it is bullshit.

First of all I assume you mean directory layout _above_ package level?

Then please explain me why a command line like: javac -sourcepath YOURSOURCE:FOLDERS:HERE -classpath JAR:FILES:AND:CLASSDIRECTORIES:HERE does not work on your system!

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