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Comment: Re:.NET != Silverlight (Score 2) 323

by Empiric (#40145785) Attached to: Mono Abandons Open Source Silverlight
Well, since I was a developer at Coldwell Banker a few years back, whose worldwide real estate search and "tour" sites were running handily on .NET and SQL Server, I happen to know directly that it was a relatively-small percentage that were built on sand and swamp. But you could filter those out by price range. ;)

Comment: .NET != Silverlight (Score 5, Interesting) 323

by Empiric (#40145409) Attached to: Mono Abandons Open Source Silverlight

It isn't terribly surprising that Mono is abandoning Silverlight, since Microsoft seems to be doing much the same in favor of HTML 5.

The .NET Framework and tools in totality are a different story, though.

By the way, for those who haven't looked at it recently, MonoDevelop has come a -long- way. It's feature-comparable to Visual Studio, nowadays.

Comment: *Citation needed (Score 1) 1114

by Empiric (#40143453) Attached to: Debate Over Evolution Will Soon Be History, Says Leakey
"There's no explanation for this change going back 500 million years in any book I've read from the lips of any God."


Jesus said, "When you see your likeness, you are pleased. But when you see your images which came into being before you, and which neither die not become manifest, how much you will have to bear!"

Jesus said, "Blessed is the lion which becomes man when consumed by man; and cursed is the man whom the lion consumes, and the lion becomes man."

--Gospel of Thomas


There you go.

The metaphor-challenged may not "see it", and if not, that's how it should be, and Darwin will take care of you just fine.

Once again, though, the majority of theistic stances have no problem with "evolution occurs", and this False Dichotomy is getting old.

Comment: Re:Yay for science! (Score 1) 235

by Empiric (#39966931) Attached to: Stone-Throwing Chimp Back In the News With Better Plan

I addressed this further in the above response.

No, my characterization is the -required inference- from their stance on religion, which -contradicts- their own stance, as well as evolutionary theory. My restatement is not what their position on evolution -is-, but rather what it -must be- for consistency with their other stances. As I said, it's a Reductio which also, conveniently, points out the self-contradiction as well.

Comment: Re:Yay for science! (Score 1) 235

by Empiric (#39966369) Attached to: Stone-Throwing Chimp Back In the News With Better Plan
Neither Dawkins nor Hitchens has ever said any such thing, nothing even remotely like it, nothing that could be reduced to that.

"God Is Not Great: How Religion Poisons Everything"

Really? How about something -precisely like that- as the very -title- of one of his books?

So, back to the point, when/where was this idyllic "everything" that then became "poisoned" by religion? If he's going to argue the relative preference for his made-up void of the never-existed, he should be more specific.

Your argument is that if a fallacious argument is presented, -demonstrating it's self-contradictory nature- is itself a Straw Man, because that by definition alters it. There is no way to maintain both the premise -and- the conclusion unchanged, even when the argument is entirely erroneous, without rendering it differently. You're essentially claiming that if I claim "I can fly because of my magic ring", and you then systematically refute my conclusion that I can fly as derived from the premise of my ring, that -you- have the problem because you changing "can fly" to "demonstrably can't fly" is straw manning my argument, because you changed "can" to "can't".

No.

I suggest taking a look at the warning at the bottom here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reductio_ad_absurdum

Comment: Re:Yay for science! (Score 1) 235

by Empiric (#39958295) Attached to: Stone-Throwing Chimp Back In the News With Better Plan

I think you're confusing "weakened restatement of an opposing position" with "noting the absurd (also being self-contradictory is just a bonus here) conclusions required by the opposing position".

The first is a Straw Man. The second is a Reductio Ad Absurdum. The first is a fallacy, the second is a refutation.

Comment: Re:Yay for science! (Score -1, Troll) 235

by Empiric (#39955525) Attached to: Stone-Throwing Chimp Back In the News With Better Plan

Wait, wait... you're messing with Slashdot's standard Dawkins-Hitchens understanding that evolution works by the mechanisms of rainbows and lollypops, and all evil started with the creation of religion.

Self-refuting arguments aren't as amusing as self-eliminating arguments, though, I find.

Comment: Re:Usher's fault (Score 1) 198

by Empiric (#39845727) Attached to: Organism Closest To Original "Tree of Life" Discovered
In the 1800's, the scales tipped in favor of Cambridge. After the discovery of the Nag Hammadi library in 1945...

Jesus said, "When you see your likeness, you are pleased. But when you see your images which came into being before you, and which neither die nor become manifest, how much you will have to bear!"

--Gospel of Thomas

...I'm not sure there was actually any decision between the two there to be made.

Overall, though, I'm quite in agreement with your post...

Comment: Re:Oblig. (Score 2) 198

by Empiric (#39844377) Attached to: Organism Closest To Original "Tree of Life" Discovered
Posting an objection on behalf of the guy from 234 AD.

"And with regard to the creation of the light upon the first day . . . and of the [great] lights and stars upon the fourth . . . we have treated to the best of our ability in our notes upon Genesis, as well as in the foregoing pages, when we found fault with those who, taking the words in their apparent signification, said that the time of six days was occupied in the creation of the world..."

--Origen of Alexandria

Comment: Re:Not just analytic... (Score 1) 1258

by Empiric (#39827369) Attached to: Analytic Thinking Can Decrease Religious Belief

I was referencing observations. Healings, converting water into wine, resurrection, that sort of thing. Observables. There would be no distinction between what we would say is miraculous and what they would say is miraculous. For your second reference, for your point to hold -all- instances of it raining would be so noted, they are not. This is clearly given as a special event for something that, believing it or not, we would still agree would be miraculous -if it occurred-, and the latter belief isn't necessary to understand that claiming earlier man considered most everything specially miraculous, that is, had not the distinctions between natural-order and not that "modern man" has, is false.

I have no issue with using "heaven" and "heavens" in multiple senses, much as we do to this day with astronomy, by the way, nor is the notion of "windows" within a book that is already a sea of obvious allegory, to make understandable a currently-causally-indiscernable "emergent" phenomenon either inaccurate or conflicting with what we can causally-perceive from science--as I see it. Quantum effects can cause absolutely anything materially to happen, just improbably so--and no, you do not know what this means causally "behind that".

Comment: Re:Not just analytic... (Score 1) 1258

by Empiric (#39827145) Attached to: Analytic Thinking Can Decrease Religious Belief
But they are related from memory during ordinary waking consciousness. When reconstructing the event as a narrative in order to communicate it, people fall back on the experiences they were taught.

You would have to describe what you are suggesting here more. During EEG flatline, nothing referencing any sort of cognition can be brought into the discussion from a naturalistic perspective. I, naturally, don't agree that because someone's read about a metaphysical place that's sufficient to have a very-compelling-as-actual-experience 3-dimensional, auditory, interpersonal, interactive brain-crash-simulation of it, if that's what you're suggesting.

I have never made any such claim. If you disagree, please provide a quote. Otherwise, you are being dishonest.

Okay, what does "your observation" refer to here? You appear to be using it in a generalized fashion--"observations" per se. You don't know the scope of "observations" humanity has had, but appear instead to be just arbitrarily limiting ourselves to -your- observations. If I misunderstood, please elaborate, as it isn't my intent to be other than straightforward and it wasn't me who, so far, has goalpost-shifted from "not equally plausible as the FSM" to "I'm still have an objection about one of your bases for distinction".

Comment: Re:Not just analytic... (Score 1) 1258

by Empiric (#39825737) Attached to: Analytic Thinking Can Decrease Religious Belief
You can still apply Occam's Razor. If, instead of supposing there is a supernatural being, you can explain this observation without a supernatural being, Occam's Razor implies that that explanation is more practically useful.

No, you can't, except by fiat. We do not agree that the scope of phenomena to be explained is the same, and there is no reason to a priori accept your scope. Different phenomena, different models, for which Occam's Razor becomes irrelevant and appropriately takes a back seat.

So we'd expect that the apperance of the FSM or Jesus in a near death experience would correlate with the prevalence of those memes in our society.

No, we wouldn't "expect that", except by your sheer conjecture. These experiences are often during EEG flatline, for which any previous "suggestion" is directly inapplicable for explanatory power. Aside from that, you are providing no mechanism by which "previous suggestions" should or could be vividly experienced not as memory, but as present facts, due in particular to brain failure. You are not addressing the non-correlation of experiences to previous worldview across religions. You are not addressing knowledge of the environment presented afterward that should have been unattainable while unconscious. You have a weak association here, nothing more.

Since we're now getting more detailed in this argument, though, I'd want to back these claims, with a peer-reviewed medical journal: Here's a link: http://profezie3m.altervista.org/archivio/TheLancet_NDE.htm

Since we can explain your observation without the use of any gods, your observation cannot be used as evidence that there are any gods or that one is more likely to exist than another.

You should probably try applying your analysis to your own psychic claim here, that your observations contain everyone on Earth's observations. Until then, it's epistemologically invalid--your experiences are never synonymous with everyone's experiences.

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