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Star Wars Prequels

Chacham's Journal: ST: Nemesis 9

Journal by Chacham

Yes, it's stupid. IMNSHO worse then ST 9.

Too dark, and the plot was hard to follow, assuming there was one. And, adding the scene in bed was disgusting. There was no reason for it (they could have easily had the same scene elsewhere).

Hopefully, the apearance of the Admiral means ST 11 won't be Voyager. Of course, it probably won't be the beloved DS9 either. Rick Berman is an idot. Cancelling good shows for bad ones, and allowing ST movies to be destroyed. Fooey!

I wonder if ST movies will continue. Voyager had only a partial following because they made the other half angry with their stupidity. DS9's drama wasn't embraced by all, and Enterprise, well, I couldn't even tell you if it is still on or what night they show it.

They've ended TOS in many ways, and supposedly that was the end of TNGs movies. What else could there be? Too bad. I'l just have to go elsewhere to watch Brent Spiner.

Frl, rug Engf Fenj btby fv n yybeg.

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ST: Nemesis

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  • I heard that if this movie makes a ton of money, they'll do one more TNG cast movie.

    I think the next step would be to make a movie with the "Enterprise" cast, but they need to mature the TV series more, first. I don't think Voyager OR DS9 would make a good movie.
    • Voyager and DS9 are both done. Stories wrapped up... somewhat. DS9 had half the people leave the station. Given how painful Worf's reappearances in the TNG movies are, I cringe to see how they bring O'Brian, Garrak, etc. back to the station.

      Ditto Voyager. Paris is likely to want to stay earthside at this point, with the new wife. Janeway is an Admiral (read: deskbound. She'll never receive another starship command.) Chakotay and Seven are likely on one ship (IF Chakotay got another commission. Possibly not, and certainly not as XO. Remember, he is/was a traitor to the Federation), and Kim is on another. These last three also depend on not being phobic about space travel at this point.
  • ST (Score:3, Interesting)

    by glh (14273) on Tuesday December 17, 2002 @01:23PM (#4908773) Homepage Journal
    I quit watching Star Trek after STNG. Voyager and DS9 were just too much like Soap Operas to me (especially DS9). It reminds me a lot of what happend to Star Wars. It's hard to keep a Good Thing (tm) going, especially in sci-fi. I figure the limit on any good series is probably about 5-7 years, and then it starts going downhill. When you start making "sequels" or "prequels" chances are they just aren't going to be as good.

    Anyway.. I'm still waiting for the next good sci-fi series. I really liked Dark Angel, bummer that they cancelled it. I watch Smallville quite a bit. Movie wise, I like the Lord of the Rings stuff and the Matrix lately. But when they mentioned another Star Trek movie I just sort of groaned and got on with things. Definitely one to wait to get at the video rental shop.
    • by gmhowell (26755)
      The ironic thing is that what drew me to DS9 was when it developed a continuing story. The Kira/Odo thing interested me not, but the Cassidy/Sisko thing added to the final season. Also, it helped show the growth of Sisko's character. Remember that he got this assignment because he couldn't hack a starship after his wife's death.

      I saw none of the 'soap opera' qualities in Voyager. There were perhaps one or two threads that occasionally were forced into an episode, but they totally missed one of the benefits of being on a network vs. being syndicated.
  • Not sure they can make a movie about Voyager, they made it home: no more story there. Same with DS9, not much left there.

    My opinion, make an epic film (2 1/2 hours) with a true enemy (maybe those wonderful biotech creatures that easily destroyed the Borg in Voyager) that threatens Star Fleet (as usual), but utilize the multitude of characters you have...

    For example, begin the movie with DS9 under attack and finally destroyed. After investigation, dispatch Enterprise and Riker's new ship Triton(?) to further investigate. Work in both ships and crews. Bring the "Traveller" back to give some insight to the bio creatures, leading to the addition of some of the Voyager crew.

    Oh yeah, most important: if you do another ST movie, please, please, please do not bring Data back. He's dead. Leave it alone. Don't remake the absurd "Search for Spock."

    Lastly, if they make another ST movie THEY HAVE TO ADDRESS WORF'S COMMENT: "They fought with honor" IN DESCRIBING THE ROMULANS! Somehow work in Worf finding the little Klingon/Romulan hottie he found in TGN. :)
    • if they made a star trek like that i might start paying attention to star trek outside of the occasional journal entry i read. sounds good. probably won't happen.
    • Actually, DS-9 leaves a lot there.

      First and foremost, Cisco never returned. They could even have an entire series about how he interacts with the Bejorans and the Federation.

      Then there's the Dominion and the changelings themselves. It ended, but there was no epilogue. There's got to be tons of movie material with the Dominion breakup.

      The difference with a DS9 movie, is that it is drama, and thus with the lack of real stories in almost all the ST movies, they could make up for it in drama. Sure, it won't get everyone, but I doubt Nemesis will either.

      As for killing Data, I can't stand it. Star Trek is fantasy in a sense, and like the A-Team noone is really supposed to die. Had they killed Janeway, Tasha Yar (again), or Riker, I would have cheered. Killing Wesley, would be like killing Jar-Jar. Had they killed the Diana Troi, I would not have cared. But killing Data, is like killing Picard, Jordy, or Warf, the really good characters, and I didn't like it at all. Bringing Spock back was silly, but bringing Data back would probably make another movie better, and help him in how he get's into all those future episodes of TNG.
      • First of all, Berman has always been a 'tard. Although, thankfully, not as retarded as Roddenbery. Voyager was a squandered opportunity, and so is Enterprise from what I've read. Why didn't they capitalize on the Star Trek name for the Enterprise series? That alone could explain some of the poor ratings.

        DS9 is over. The Founders tell their foot soldiers to sleep or something to that effect. They will be followed. Who cares what happens in the Delta Quadrant? We don't know enough about it to care about fallout. How would you explain Sisko in a two hour format that wouldn't alienate 50% of America?

        I wasn't overly disappointed that Data was killed. Where else was his character to go? It appeared that he had grown as much as was possible given his limitations. But will someone please tell me why the hell he didn't carry two of those little mini-transporter doo-hickeys? That's just common sense.

        The love scene was gratuitous. Sorry, but Jonathan Frakes has just a few too many pounds to be doing that. Perhaps when the show started. And when did Deanna let him grow the beard back? Perhaps he doesn't have the same hang-ups as Junior and Tony (Soprano's) and Deanna prefers the beard?

        Nobody would have cared if Janeway or Yar were killed. The movie audience views Janeway as a random Admiral. And who is Yar? Except for your bloodlust, why would you have cheered for the death of Riker? I've never felt Worf was a character as much as he was a caricature. He's at the wedding and not once did he mention his last wife? Odd.

        Bringing Spock back allowed them to show the humanity of Kirk, and the friendship of the trio. What does bringing back Data accomplish other than pleasing fan-boys? I thought it a bit gratuitous (Well, we can't blow up the Enterprise AGAIN without court-marshalling Picard, so let's kill off a major character. Especially if it is a high priced (relatively) actor.) How many future episodes of TNG do you expect? From everything I've read, unless this movie does exceptionally well, there ain't gonna be any more.

        Finally, I think this movie was far and away better than number 9. Insurrection was as slow as it gets. The villians weren't particularly frightening. If Picard fell for that chick so much, how come he didn't stay? There's a character with little growth. He's been a curmudgeon for 15 years, with a few bright spots around BOBW, Generations, and First Contact. Conveniently, as quickly as possible, they've again turned him back into a curmudgeon after each of those episodes. Perhaps you are right. Perhaps TNG does need a 'Search for Data' to show that Picard isn't a mere bureaucrat.

        I'm not sure why everyone bemoans the lack of plot in this movie. Guy from Romulus' sister planet takes over. Turns out he is a partial clone of Picard. Wants Picard's DNA to help some botched cloning techniques. In the meantime, he is supported only because he vows safety and comfort from those of the sister planet. Plan to get Picard's DNA fails, so he turns to vengeance. Granted, I wasn't convinced when he gave up on pilfering Picard's DNA, but this plot made at least as much sense as 'save the whales to save the Earth' without all of the environmentalist trappings.

        I was rather hoping that Shinzon could have been rehabilitated. As it stands, Picard has lived his life, with little legacy to pass on. Sure, his Starfleet record, but that will always be marred by his time spent as Locutus (and let me state again that I cannot understand how this man was given command back after being turned into Locutus. Not just any ship, but the flagship of the fleet. It boggles the mind.)

        Wil Wheaton and others have indicated that there exists a massive amount of footage on the cutting room floor. I hope this is the case. There were a number of problems (why only one remote transporter? Why is Wesley back after he went to join a higher species, etc.) that hopefully existed somewhere in the writer's draft.

        Better than 3, 5, 7, and 9. Probably about equal to 4, but in totally different ways. My Trek ratings:

        2, 6, 4, 10, 1, 3, 7, 9, 5.

        Okay, with that out of the way, I think it's time to go back to arguing Bond again:)
        • DS9 is over. The Founders tell their foot soldiers to sleep or something to that effect. They will be followed.

          Come on. Enter any movie plot here. *Something* goes wrong. Now we have a movie to fix it.

          Who cares what happens in the Delta Quadrant? We don't know enough about it to care about fallout.

          Given the wormhole, it is almost the same thing as the Alpha Quadrant.

          How would you explain Sisko in a two hour format that wouldn't alienate 50% of America?

          Don't know. But, why do they need the entire viewing audience? Just market it to half of them. The Star Trek audience is large enough to support a series that alienates half its viewers. Why can't a movie do the same?

          I wasn't overly disappointed that Data was killed. Where else was his character to go? It appeared that he had grown as much as was possible given his limitations.

          Better emoption chip. But that isn't even needed. Data is a very well liked character, so, even if he doesn't grow, his attendance adds to the movie.

          But will someone please tell me why the hell he didn't carry two of those little mini-transporter doo-hickeys? That's just common sense.

          Why didn't I think of that...

          Nobody would have cared if Janeway or Yar were killed. The movie audience views Janeway as a random Admiral.

          Certainly at least half the audience would know, and at least half of those would cheer uncontrollably. :-)

          And who is Yar?

          Just the ultimate red-shirt.

          Except for your bloodlust, why would you have cheered for the death of Riker?

          Because I disliked his character, and the little I've seen of the actor too. He played a pompous fool, who never would have made it far with his attitude. I can't believe he was a first officer, let alone given his own ship.

          I've never felt Worf was a character as much as he was a caricature.

          I've always been impressed by his character. Written mostly well, and acted superbly.

          Bringing Spock back allowed them to show the humanity of Kirk, and the friendship of the trio. What does bringing back Data accomplish other than pleasing fan-boys?

          Nothing. I don't care *how* they get him back. I'm just dissapointed that they killed him.

          How many future episodes of TNG do you expect?

          Just the shows that showed them in the future. Specifically, the last TNG episode, where Data was at a university.

          Finally, I think this movie was far and away better than number 9. Insurrection was as slow as it gets. The villians weren't particularly frightening

          I don't think I care about the actual plot, as much as how it gets involved. In ST9, I knew the entire time what was going on and why. It was stupid, but involving. ST10 was not involving. I had to keep reminding myself why they were doing what. Also, there were a lot of talking scenes. Enough to bother me. The dialogue in most Star Trek episodes/movies is stupid. It's mostly filler. The action is what matters. This movie had little action. Or, at least, that's what it felt like.

          I was rather hoping that Shinzon could have been rehabilitated. As it stands, Picard has lived his life, with little legacy to pass on. Sure, his Starfleet record, but that will always be marred by his time spent as Locutus (and let me state again that I cannot understand how this man was given command back after being turned into Locutus. Not just any ship, but the flagship of the fleet. It boggles the mind.)

          I don't see the problem in that. They added things to his mind and controlled it. When they took it out, he was better. Why wouldn't he be able to control the ship. If anything, he knew better than anyone else how the Borg thinks, and thus he was their greatest weapon against them. I was perplexed when they made something of it. I couldn't understand why.

          Wil Wheaton and others have indicated that there exists a massive amount of footage on the cutting room floor. I hope this is the case. There were a number of problems (why only one remote transporter? Why is Wesley back after he went to join a higher species, etc.) that hopefully existed somewhere in the writer's draft.

          It's nice. If people review it well, I might care to look at it. As it is, I thought it was an uninteresting movie from what was released, so I'd probably be uninterested in seeing what was cut.

Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and annoys the pig. -- Lazarus Long, "Time Enough for Love"

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