Maybe. But like I said, American cities are generally cleaner than cities in less affluent parts of the world. Maybe we should be sending them hefty bags or something.

Yes, that's pretty much what I was saying. Thank you for contributing.

Maybe you should look again. Iceland is #1. How do they live with themselves? The shame, the shame.

Anywhile, that's energy use which should probably be adjusted for GDP. The US would come out looking pretty good in that case. Kenya, probably not so good. Still, it's nice to know that we don't consume as much energy as the average Canadian.

And what does that prove, except my point that this is not a problem you can blame on North America. Not that you would really blame North America, cause Canadians never litter and Mexico isn't even in the First World.

Maybe you need to get out more. Like travel. Actually go to places. First go to any of the top 10 cities in the USA. Then go to any comparably sized city in Asia. Take some pictures. Maybe, if you're really serious, take some air samples. Or just sample it your self.

I guess if a country/region has the numbers, then it is okay to be nasty polluters. By your logic, Mexico City doesn't have an air pollution problem.

But I'd settle for nothing less then the Nobel Peace Prize.

First, I don't have to provide a model, because I'm not making the claim that there is going to be catastrophic global warming. All I have to do is point to the models that the team keeps putting out and then reference reality and show that they are not happening. We can start with Michael Mann's hockey stick. Where is it? His model predicted consecutive warming year over year. Hasn't happened. That's one down, how many more to go?

The latest models have all lowered sensitivity and yet they are still running hot. Are they gonna give that peace prize back if it turns out they were wrong?

Anywhile, there is already a 'model' called orbital dynamics that plays a key role. There are also models for solar dynamics which, despite what you may have read, have not been disproven. We will get a big test of some of solar dynamics soon, as we are about to enter a protracted period of low solar activity.

And yet the people who have been to the Pacific gyre say it is mostly Asian trash. I've been to Asia and it doesn't surprise me at all. American cities are much cleaner than most Asian cities, Singapore being a notable exception.

The average American is becoming more and more of just an average person. How much more does an average American consume than a middle-class person in Europe, Japan, China or other emerging economies? In Kenyans, of course, since that appears to be the common measurement.

The caveat is you have to believe in Michael Mann's Hockey Stick. Which is going to start happening when exactly?

The Earth is heating. Has been before peeps started burning things. Now more peeps then ever are burning things and yet no hockey stick. Maybe there is no hockey stick? No hockey stick, no trillions saved. At least you can admit that the hockey stick is about as sketchy as models come. Most are running hotter than reality, some are going to start falling out of the error bars if it doesn't start really warming up.

Gnash your teeth and hope for warming, I guess. Other wise you may have to start rethinking this whole AGW thing.

Ignore the pause, ignore the missing heat, ignore the solar cycles, ignore the lack of sea level rise, ignore an arctic that is not ice free, ignore ENSO effects, ignore weather stations next to tarmacs, ignore urban heating, because they don't match the models.

Ignore the money being made, ignore the cost to society, ignore the lack of true peer review, ignore the missing data, ignore academic misconduct, ignore the denied FOI requests, ignore the emails, because that is just human nature.

When you are blind, everything is 'Nothing to see here, move along'...

Act 1:
In Eastern Europe, a handful of partisans still fight SkyNet and an army of robots. It's a desperate fight and the landscape is filled with the wreckage of a former age. One group is led by Ahnuld. He's crafty and careful having lived through the worst of times. His crew look up to him as a father and would follow him into hell.
Called before the supreme council, it's Eastern Europe remember, one member of his crew is denounced. It's all a ruse to get him and his group to sign up for a high-risk, end the war in Europe mission. He agrees but not before telling everyone of them 'I'll be back'.
Act 2:
Getting there is the hardest part. Sneaking through wrecked cities and desolate wastelands, half empty aquifers and collapsed rail tunnels, fighting and dying heroically to preserve the mission and each other, the rag tag group makes its way to... CERN. The idyllic countryside has been devastated. In its place are ruined behemoths and the rusted hulks of war machines. But SkyNet lives here, at least the part aware of the European theatre and they are there to destroy it.
Act 3:
Is where it really gets good. Also, there's a twist ending. Really, this movie could win awards. That's how good the ending is. Even your Mom is going to like it. I'd tell you, but it would ruin it for you. I'm doing you a favor.

The climate has rarely been in stasis, fool

It worked out ok in the end.

The problem with the Climate Change movement is that people like James Hansen, Al Gore and Michael Mann are the most vocal proponents. None of them has ever expressed any caution and seem to always err on the side of their own arguments.

Hansen predicted huge sea level rises which failed to materialize. Mann spliced together a hockey stick which is also not matching reality. Can we at least acknowledge that both of these guys were wrong in these instances? Who exactly is the zealot here? Al Gore is just a profiteer with an extremely large carbon footprint.

The biggest argument in favor of Global Warming was the loss of sea ice. But even there nothing is unprecedented and it remains to be seen if the loss is permanent or just naturally cyclical. The only thing I am sure of is that the science is not settled.

There is a bold stance 'it is accepted in the scientific community that climate change is occurring'. So glad you could clear that up for all us Neanderthals.

That explains the 97% consensus. The remaining 3% must not get out much.

Nice quote and so apropos to the climate 'debate'. I do think that the scientific process will win out in the end (how can it lose?). I just don't think that the current bunch of 'climate' scientists are backing the right horse, that being C02 as the primary driver of global temperatures.

97% consensus, har har.

You don't need Google, Yahoo, Microsoft, FB if you have the Verizon Backbone that is carrying most of their traffic. It might not even be Verizon, but you get my point.

How do we get around this issue? There is a huge MitM operating here and that is scary.

If we stay on this rare planet, we are certainly doomed. It's the nicest place we know of but if we don't get off this rock, we'll probably get killed off by collision with a smaller rock. Or a super volcano... Or Mannian hot air... Or the next ice age... Or our own greed and stupidity.

My money is on the Bransons and Rutans of this world figuring out how to get us into space and someday stay for good. Once someone figures out how to survive in space, there will be thousands hot on their heels. We don't need another Earth. If we can survive long enough to get there, the only reason we'll stay is for variety, not neccessity.

There are more raw resources between the orbits of Mars and Jupiter than exist on Earth. We just need to get there.