SpaceX didn't go hiring a bunch of ULA engineers to build the Falcon series of rockets; there's a quote floating around that it was like 5% came from existing rocket related enterprises. It turns out that rocket science and engineering is just science and engineering; anyone can do it.

And yeah, if you're an engineer and working for a company that employs 4 guys who keep a chair warm, 2 guys who create make work for everyone else, 1 guy who is a drooling moron, and you, and you're consequently spending 10 engineers worth of time to do 1 engineers worth of work, and you don't notice or care that its the case, you're fscking mediocre.
Good engineers pay attention, collect data, do metrics; if you don't do that, you're mediocre.
You work for ULA/ESA-Ariane/SLS, and you don't see the writing on the wall? You're mediocre.
In fact, you're the definition of mediocre.

Christ, its not even close; the majors have been in this business for almost 70 YEARS. I mean, how in the fsck do you have to charge 10X what your competitor charges when they just started doing, heavy industry, like this century, ferchissakes? I mean, ULA/ESA should be able to FART faster better cheaper rockets than SpaceX. The fact that they can't, and aren't even trying, tells you all you need to know not just about the companies/alliances themselves, but ALSO the people who work there.

And I didn't say anything about CalTech/JPL; we are talking about SpaceX competitors here. JPL might do theory, design, and testing, but I don't think they've built an EELV class launch vehicle lately. In any case there is no evidence they are mediocre since nobody else has built a planetary rover, deployed it, and done equivalent science with it for better than 1/10th the cost.

andy

Do you work in the defense aerospace industry? Because the part I worked for boasted that it was white collar welfare. In the specific instance, what do you call an industry that is getting paid 10X what it should cost (as defined by what cost someone else to do it) to deliver something? I mean, if you paid fast food cashiers 72.50$/hr (10X minimum wage) simply becuase they work in a niche industry using revolving door lobbyists to gather no competition govt contracts, what would you call that? What if you paid market rate to 10X as many engineers as you should (using the definition of should, above) for the same reason? What if your "competition" and "you" were allowed to "merge" into an "alliance" (ULA) and then you jacked up the price on a mature, delivered product, what would you call that?

At least he didn't call it racketeering, or extortion, or bribery...which one could also argue....

He called it welfare.

As to the mediocre part, who in the fsck would ever work in a place like that? That's right, engineers who couldn't/can't get another job. As in, mediocre ones.

andy

So, do you work for Orbital, Boring, or Lockmart? ESA? Major sub? Trying to do SLS? Even work(ed) in Aerospace?

This is a mature Delta II launch:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WsVzpE7ltb8

A Titan 34D (carying a 1B$ KH-x spy satellite, no less):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXBl03wVHOY

Early failures:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13qeX98tAS8

All of these were funded ENTIRELY by the US Federal Government on a Cost Plus Fixed Fee basis, meaning even when they failed we paid costs AND profit to the contractors. SpaceX hasn't failed like this buddy, not by the order of magnitude less that they cost.

You're either deliberately obtuse or a moron. I'm not a fanboi, I'm just glad to see a prime not fleece the Feds out of my tax dollars; I'm a huge fan of that.

I tried to find "Wagon Train to the Stars" for the obligatorily accurate portrayal of NASA also, but my google-fu was not so good.

Anyone, who thinks the status quo pre-SpaceX was better than the current situation is the one with their head in the sand.

andy

Poor track record? How so? They haven't popped one on the pad, as all the majors did getting to this point. They built an EELV class launcher for less than ULA charges to keep the manufacturing base available for DeltaIV/Atlas V.

These posts are so three years ago. SpaceX is bi-coastal and in business. All legacy launch companies are done. SLS? Done. It will go to the real commercial world for 3B$ instead of 30+. Lockmart and Boring cannot compete in any non rigged contest (CPFF what?). No more white collar welfare in the launch business.

Oh, and birds don't have to be 1/4B$ if launch costs drop by an order of magnitude. You don't have to be that careful. You can afford to lose a few. And, you can afford to use technologies developed this century as a bonus. "Flight Proven" == 1960's tech.

And we might get humans living off this rock this century, as a bonus. Or we can keep paying the tards to keep tarding.

andy

I agree. I am far more likely to be harmed by my own government at this point than any other. I fear my own government more than any other. We need to address the factions in our government and make it for the people again.

andy

My take on the solution, feel free to critique it. Its my current plan.
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=4056347&cid=44485435

Hubble size was limited because the Prime Contractor (Lockheed) already had some engineering and hardware to support the 2.4m size. They had developed it for another project looking down, not up.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KH-11_Kennan#Design

andy

Fsck come on now, the Federal Budget is going ever higher. Arguing over Federal Employees vs government contractors wholly responsible to Federal Employees is pedantic. They are spending more money they are in control of more people. End of story.

andy

Horrible car analogy. 1000 HP and 50 MPG are engineering extremes (current tech, gas, etc.).

What he's asking for is for his Federal politicians in the US to actually uphold the 2nd Amendment and the 10th Amendment. Or any of the other ones. Or have a party whose platform doesn't consist of the opposite of the other party's platform.

Parent, all we can do is vote third party (pick one, doesn't matter). Until any third party has a viable chance no reasonable candidates will run, no politicians will heed the will of the people.

andy

AFAIK, in California firing you immediately after you give two weeks notice means you are entitled to two weeks pay plus qualifies you for unemployment until you get another job or it runs out (just like being laid off would). This is important for those times where you dont have another job lined up or are starting your own business.

I wish my previous employer had done this, would have been worth almost six figures to me, at the time....

andy

What do you pay for international? US plans are for the whole country; that's like UK to Eastern Europe, Scandanavia to the Med.... I can fly 2500 miles across the continent, drive a 2000 mile loop once I'm there, and everything just works. Over 300 million people. Unlimited voice text and data (500 GB at 4G/HSPA+). All for $50 USD/month. Is there a plan that matches that?

andy

Are you kidding me? Why in hell would you even say something like this....

Linus wouldn't fill out the 17 forms required to get a check from the feds, much less submit the monthly progress reports or sign the forms, in triplicate, each month to receive the paper check to be deposited. Goddamn 7 digits, no understanding of the system at all...

Much less participate in a system he would find grossly inefficient and horribly flawed. The man respects greatness, not whatever this is.

You are an idiot. If this was a joke its not funny, even once.

andy

Americans like me just have to:

1. Vote "None of the Above" if possible in all elections until candidates that agree with your political position run.

2. Vote any third party candidate possible. If enough of the vote is third party, a third party that represents us will appear.

3. Do not vote for any candidate other than these.

Eight years later we will start getting better candidates and the parties will start to crumble. The two parties are our problem, they have staked out nonsensical platforms by playing the opposite game. We spend trillions of dollars a year for this useless crap. Spying, prisoning, drug war, fill in the fscking blank.

If you identify as a Republican or a Democrat you are the reason this stuff keeps happening.

andy

priceless!

andy

I always thought the opposite. I hate being passed by rigs at 80mph, only to have to pass them once the road climbs, traffic slows, there's a funny looking bird on the tree, or whatever else slows traffic momentarily. Ad nauseum. Slower trucks means they dont feel the need to pass anyone, since seeing that would be an instant speed ticket, so they stay over in the right lane(s) where they belong. The right lane(s) in CA becomes the lane for merging, old people, and trucks. Trucks moving with traffic means they are all over the place and clog traffic continuously. Also, nothing like a truck tailgating you because he can move with traffic and drive like the rest of the death wishers. Keeping them slow takes most of the bad truck driver behavior away; I am always suprised by bad truck driver behavior in other states....

andy