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Comment Re:Trump wins either way. (Score 1) 557

Out of curiosity, where can I find the evidence that led the House to impeach him earlier this week?

I mean, it's a serious charge, there must be witness statements, a report from the investigation, various exhibits presented to lawmakers to help them understand the need for a trail.

I just can't seem to find them.

Ah you again. You'll need to watch his video from his rally and find an archive of his deleted tweets. The most incriminating tweet, in my opinion, is the 2:26pm tweet where Trump all but told his supporters, who were already inside the capitol, that it was Pence's fault that they were in danger of losing the country.

Comment Re:Practical effect? (Score 1) 557

I hate the guy and his policies but I don't think we should revoke his secret service protection, if for no other reason than it's a bad look if he were to be assassinated. On that note though, what does secret service protection look like when the principal is in prison?

Are you worried that he is going to have an Epstein moment in his prison cell?

Comment Re: Platforming hate speech (Score 1, Informative) 307

Parlor didnt publish those things. They just had them on their platform and likely removed them just like FB and everybody else. Amazon just wanted to shut them down

Ok clearly you did not read Amazon's filing because Amazon specifically asked them to remove certain posts and they refused to remove it - they actually said it was impossible for them to delete the posts.

Comment Re:Trump wins either way. (Score 1) 557

1. To air all the evidence that shows that Trump lied to and manipulated the people of this country for his own benefits

I'm looking forward to this one. Not least the subpoenas and disclosure the defence will surely demand.

I say have at it. What evidence or disclosures are the defense going to be able to demand when they were unable to demand any such evidence in the 62 trials Trump has already had with regard to this exact same topic? Do you think just because it's happening on Capitol Hill all of the sudden evidence that did not exist before will magically materialize? He had the power to compel / subpoena evidence in some (not any appeals) of those 62 hearings already and there was literally nothing to show for it.

Comment Re:Politicians (Score 1) 557

> If you or I committed perjury we'd likely end up in jail, even if it it were just a 6 month stint.

I recall legal analysts at the time practically snorting in contempt at the idea you or I would even be charged.

Then they were being disingenuous. This literally happens all the time. Watch some True Crime TV or something like that and you'll see that prosecutors often resort to such things when they are trying to get someone to plead to another crime (stack on charges and potential jail time) or when they fail to convict (or lack sufficient evidence to try) someone for a more serious crime. I've hung around with a lot of lawyers and have worked for a prosecutor's office before. This is way more common than you think.

Comment Re:House Votes Without Evidence To Impeach Trump (Score 1) 557

No witnesses.

Isn't it ironic that during the first impeachment it was Republicans who were against allowing witnesses?

That was at the trial. They have not held a trial for this impeachment just yet. McConnell has indicated that he will not schedule it until after the 20th, when dems will take over and they will have the power to schedule and the votes to convict. At that time I believe you will see evidence and there will be plenty of witnesses, I am sure. There is no requirement for evidence at the house impeachment hearing and even if there were, as someone stated above, the entire event was televised live. The tweets are all there. The speeches from Trump have all been watched by the world. What evidence do you want them to present? For them to sit there and personally testify about what they saw and heard? You want them to replay Trump's own speeches as evidence? Don't worry you'll get to see that all when it goes to trial.

Comment Re:Trump wins either way. (Score 1) 557

So, at best, Trump loses his pride and a pension that he doesn't need. At worst, we lose the Republic. I liken Nancy Pelosi as waving a red flag in front of a bull. I don't believe she appreciates the degree to which the insurrectionists hated her and the Democrats more than they liked Trump.

Show some perspective about this. This is much bigger than Trump, the GOP, or the democrats. IF you want to threaten your republic then you do nothing. The impeachment trial gives us two opportunities:
1. To air all the evidence that shows that Trump lied to and manipulated the people of this country for his own benefits
2. Demonstrate to future presidents that they can't try to overthrow the government if they lose and walkaway unscathed.

You might think that Trump will walk away enjoying his fortune and retirement but there is a state penitentiary awaiting his arrival in GA for conspiracy to commit election fraud - assuming that the feds don't beat GA to the punch.

Comment Re:Practical effect? (Score 1) 557

If convicted, he wouldn't be eligible to run for public office again. The idea isn't to screw Trump. It's to screw the people who might want to vote for him if he runs again.

Democrats only trust democracy when they're assured a win.

This mindset of yours is mindboggling. But I am also confused as to how anyone can claim to be a patriot standing up for their country, democracy, and the constitution AND still support Trump after last week. I've honestly been afraid to ask any family members if their views on Trump have changed because I am afraid I will be disappointed in what they say./P.

Comment Re:Practical effect? (Score 4, Insightful) 557

If the impeachment leads to a conviction, they can also vote to revoke his pension, travel allowance, secret service protection, and have him barred for life from holding federal office. But really, it's mostly symbolic.

I disagree that this is all symbolic. If we just ignore what Trump has done then it tells all future presidents that they can go ahead and lie, cheat, and attempt an overthrow of the government if they lose and the worst that will happen is that they walk away with a pension, a travel budget, and a secret service detail for life. He needs to be held accountable so that others know that such activities can cost you everything.

Comment Re:Politicians (Score 1) 557

Sure, and what did he lie about, getting a blowjob from an intern, which has NEVER been used to impeach a President before.

When do Republicans get impeached for? Attempting to use the CIA to subvert an election (Nixon) or Attempting to use the GRU to subvert an election (TRump) or attempting to incite an angry mob to murder the Vice President and hold Congress hostage (trump)...

Where are your fucking priorities to think that Clinton's impeachment was anywhere close to the evil that gopers have been caught at?

I don't think that the two president's crimes are comparable (Clinton and Trump). If you or I committed perjury we'd likely end up in jail, even if it it were just a 6 month stint. I think politicians and other public officials should be held to a higher standard. But if the senate does not convict Trump for his behavior then I think there are a lot of senators who need to find new jobs. Honestly, I'd like to see about 80% of all these politicians get expelled anyway but... I'd be happy to settle for Hawley, Cruz, and others who helped Trump lie and manipulate the people of the US in order to obtain their own personal ambitions.

Comment Re:We have lost our way. (Score 1) 478

asking him to change the result was illegal

Good job he only asked for the election to be investigated to assure that it was fair then.

Sorry, I did listen to the call. He asked for legal actions to be taken to verify and validate the vote. That's all he asked for.

Let me reiterate this for you - the correct and legal course of action is to file suit and go to court. Also, you may which to see an otolaryngologist because you clearly did not listen to or are willfully ignoring the part of the call where he specifically asked the Sec State to 'find 11,780 votes' that don't exist and declare Trump the winner. The Secretary of State does NOT have the power or authority to 1) make votes appear out of thin air 2) change the outcome of the election. The role of the Sec State in an election is to ensure that the law is being followed during the election process and to review the process and ensure that it was done correctly. The Sec State performed those duties and they hand counted the votes at Trump's request. These are all legal requests and they were all carried out in accordance with the law. Everything Trump asked for after his lawsuits were dismissed (by judges he himself appointed, at least for the GA suits) were all illegal. You can handwave and try to claim things that are not true but you could also take the time and the effort to look up the appropriate codes and educate yourself. I really don't care which you do.

This sends a message that it is okay to lie, cheat, and steal an election.

Given a US congressman today stood in the Capitol and said that 80 million Americans have their doubts about the election, it's reasonable to assume that they'll hear the message "Shit, he almost caught us."

This is not going to help bridge political divides.

I am not sure I understand what you are trying to say but I think it's clear that what needs to happen is that we need to stop allowing politicians to say whatever it is that they'd like while in a public and official capacity. They should not have a first amendment right to lie about the honesty and integrity of an election. Such behavior ought to, at the very least, result in their expulsion from office by their peers. If you want to fix this divide then we need to start cleaning up both parties and sending these clowns to jail instead of parroting their nonsense and acting like something happened that did not.

The behavior of both parties over my lifetime has continued to devolve into a cesspool of lies, manipulation, and complete nonsense and we will only continue to grow further apart as a country if we, the constituents, don't hold these people responsible. We need to stop blindly supporting a person because they put a D or an R next to their name.

Comment Re:Platforming hate speech (Score 5, Informative) 307

Please. I see that speech ALL. THE. TIME. on Facebook. These internet activists take whatever the hot button topic of the week is, change their profile picture to virtue signal, then proceed to spew the worst things imaginable at the other side about it for days. Then they move on to the next thing they've been told to be outraged about. Lather, rinse repeat. Yet nobody does anything about it at all.

Selectively using hate speech as an excuse is hypocrisy, plain and simple.

Did you read Amazon's filing in response to the restraining order requested by Parler? They were not shutdown for hate speech. They were shutdown for listing specific threats to rape, murder, or otherwise harm both elected officials and private citizens. And I guarantee you that would get you booted off Facebook, Twitter, and any other social media platform regardless of political party.

Comment Re:We have lost our way. (Score 1) 478

What sort of crime does he need to commit before you stop supporting him? Clearly sedition and election fraud are not enough.

Well, clearly they're waiting for you to provide some actual evidence of sedition and election fraud.

Asking a Secretary of State to use their legally appointed powers is not election fraud. He did not ask Raffensperger to do anything illegal.

I don't even support Trump, I'm just disappointed that people keep misrepresenting him while at the same time egregiously ignoring the same or worse behaviour from their own favourite politicians.

It's that hatred of unfairness, you see. Sorry. Here, I just ordered pizza, come and have a slice, maybe you can stop being angry at the man that won't be your President in a week's time.

This is the funniest thing I've read all week. Thank you. But yes - asking someone to change the legal outcome of election for you and then threatening them with criminal charges if you do not is, in fact, the literal definition of 'conspiracy to commit election fraud.' Do you want me to cite both the US and Georgia codes that he violated or do you think you can google it yourself? Because just asking him to change the result was illegal at both the state and federal level and threatening him on top of that was also illegal.

And let's be clear - just letting him end his term unmolested is not the right thing to do at all. This sends a message that it is okay to lie, cheat, and steal an election. Worst case is you fail and they just let you leave office in peace. It also does nothing to unify the country as there will still be a bunch of idiots running around talking about election fraud. No, we need a trial and we need the evidence to be aired publicly so that people have a chance to see the truth.

Comment Re:We have lost our way. (Score 1) 478

You should listen to the 1 hour audio call he had with Secretary of State (Georgia) Raffensperger where he clearly is guilty of a conspiracy to commit election fraud in violation of both US and Georgia state laws.

The hour long call in which he articulated a dozen ways in which he felt the election was unsafe, and suggested legal means by which his concerns could be addressed, and was rebuffed at all stages?

That call?

Did you listen to the call? First of all, he was about 1 month too late with that call to begin with. The results were already certified and the GA electors already cast their votes. Secondly, that call was unethical to begin with - there is a procedure for handling such complaints during an election. You know, where you file a motion seeking relief and you layout the basis for the motion and the evidence that it is needed. Trump filed a motion but didn't mention any voter fraud and sure as hell didn't submit any evidence of fraud in his filings. He lost in court. Calling the Secretary of State and demanding that he find votes is illegal. You can try and sugar coat it with "well he raised concerns that I think are valid BEFORE he engaged in a conspiracy to commit election fraud" all you want but that is irrelevant. I don't care if he had a smoking gun - he should have brought that smoking gun to his hearing in both state and federal courts. Since he failed to do so he is either an idiot or the evidence doesn't exist. Pick one, I don't care. Just accept reality.

I have asked my own family members this and nobody wants to respond - maybe you will. What sort of crime does he need to commit before you stop supporting him? Clearly sedition and election fraud are not enough. So what does he need to do, murder someone? When are you going to concede that Trump was a poor choice? Is this a matter of pride - do you not want to admit you've been conned? Do you want to feel smarter and superior to everyone else because you know about supposed election fraud that no one else, even Trump himself, can prove? What exactly is your angle here?

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