Corel Wordperfect Office 2000 for Linux Beta Test 164
KiWiB0RG writes "Corel has opened Wordperfect Office 2000 for beta testing. The only requirements is that you run Linux, using kernel 2.0.30 or greater, and have experience in one of these software packages -> Wordperfect, Quattro Pro, Corel Presentations, CorelCentral and/or Paradox. "
Bah (Score:1)
... (Score:2)
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Anyone heard anything from Corel on this? (Score:1)
It would have been nice to get an automatic notice saying that it is being processed.
Re:Bah (Score:1)
Compatibility issues... (Score:2)
It would really be good to have all my files accessible on one place...
Another question I have is does it co-operate with window managers... separate windows instead of the fake windows that StarOffice generates?
What about swap space? Again, compared to star office, is it still going to sink my 64 MB ram, 64 MB swap computer into oblivion?
Re:Bah (Score:1)
That explains it. (Score:2)
I've been wondering why Corel's stock has been on a tear this week. It almost doubled since August, with most of the gains coming in the last month.
One thing I didn't like about WP 8, and I hope that they fixed this in WP 2000, is that the Linux version of WP 8 was pretty much a port of the DOS/Win product that did not take advantage of the Linux platform. I really thought it was quite silly to have application-specific printer drivers and fonts, in this day and age. That's so... 80s.
I gave up on WP 8 when I realized that I was spending more time fiddling with the printer driver, then playing with the program. I also so that it was rather strange that a word processor does not have a "Print Preview" function. I managed to hack one up by setting up a postscript printer driver that fed ghostview. That was fun, but I don't think that Joe Sixpack should be expected to live with something like that.
Although I don't have the time to beta WP2000, I'll definitely give WP 2000 a spin once its available. Although I didn't end up liking WP 8 very much, it was definitely a solid product which I'll keep my eye on.
Wish list for WP (is it too late, for one?)
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Hrm.... blank page response? (Score:1)
hrm.
Re:Compatibility issues... Yes. (Score:2)
Ack (Score:2)
Re: OT Ofc97/2k bitching. (Score:1)
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Windows Version? (Score:2)
Re:That explains it. (Score:2)
I also so that it was rather strange that a word processor does not have a "Print Preview" function.
I suspect the idea is that you're using a WYSIWYG word processor, so Print Preview is redundant. You want to see what's going to print, you zoom out to Full Page. I've found it works well for me.
Anyhow, I am looking forward to this. I have liked WP ever since I first used it (WP5.1), and I still like how it's a word processor which does what I tell it to, rather than deciding for me what I want done. (Unlike certain unnamed products).
WP 2000 for Win.. (Score:1)
Re:Windows Version? (Score:1)
Seems to me that Corel had this same stuck-in-the-(legalese)-mud when they released their distro beta. I'm sure you all remember.
Perhaps their marketing department isn't ready to believe that some people get along just fine without Microsoft's help. Naah... that'd never happen...
Having only briefly looked at the page, I think it'd be neat if the "Windows version" would accept an entry of "no." Or perhaps they're referring to a windows manager...? Either that, or they're weeding out the wanna-bes by watching for those who just blindly type "Windows 98" in there.
I mean, really, are windows users the kind of people you'd want testing your software??
Re: OT Ofc97/2k bitching. (Score:1)
Re: OT Ofc97/2k bitching. (Score:1)
Rob, fix it.
Wah.
--Corey
Link does not work.. (Score:1)
Re:That explains it... silighty off/on topic (Score:2)
Re:Ack (Score:2)
It's a holdover from the Windows age, when they bundled crash insurance with the software licenses.
As Katz would say, welcome to the POST-Microsoft age.
*** BEEP! ***
[Offtopic (sorry)] Props to you (Score:1)
Sorry, I was just struck by the little things that indicate a true hacker. You're cool!
--GnrcMan--
Re:Windows Version? (Score:1)
I put XFree86 3.3.5 -- that's what I'm using...
- Ken
have you seen this?!? (Score:2)
First, they want name, address, etc. The standard stuff. CPU type, computer 'make and model number' whatever that means. CD-ROM type, printer make and model, printer ram, plotter or etc. How about your video card? Its ram? Your monitor make and model? How about mouse? And your sound card? Got a scanner? OS and version? (mind you, this is on a page that only lets you download a LINUX version of the software...what the fuck do they THINK my OS is?!?) Windows version? Isn't that covered in OS and version?!? Network? Scan software? HD and compression? Other TSRs? Font manager? They don't need half this stuff for legitimate development reasons.
I don't know how much this info's worth but I'll bet for the cost of pressing a CD (and they probably don't even do that. I'll bet you've got to download the software anyway) they get over $50 worth of information.
Sorry about the rant. Usually, I like Corel, and wordperfect in particular (though the windows versions have all sucked big-time. 5.1 for dos (IMNSHO) was the best one they made. Still use it, in fact) but this is such a blatant effort to invade my privacy, it's sickening.
Re:That explains it. (Score:1)
corel for java? (Score:1)
Re:Bah (Score:2)
The application form is too long (Score:2)
While I'm in rant mode, corel should make sure the download is not just a cgi script, but also has a straight url. Big downloads do get cut off, and with a cgi script I can't use nice programs like getright. (yes, I'd boot to windows just to use getright)
Re:That explains it. (Score:2)
Remove all that nonsense with the printer drivers. Spit out Postscript, and let the printer driver handle it.
Uh, that's why there's a printer driver provided called... wait for it... "Generic Post Script Passthru". You just tell it which queue to which it should pass the output.
------------
Michael Hall
mphall@cstone.nospam.net
GetRight (Score:1)
Re:GetRight (Score:1)
Why don't you try to remember?
Quite possibly the stupidest form I've ever seen. (Score:2)
We've got 5 Printers around here, over a dozen computers, running everything from NT to redhat 6.1, to debian, to windows 98..
What the hell do they expect but for me to put "varies" on everything?
bleah
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Re:Windows Version? (Score:1)
Re:The application form is too long (Score:1)
Because these days, a slashdot account is sadly no guarantee of any kind of cluefulness whatsoever.
yes, I'd boot to windows just to use getright)
My brother raves about getright, too, but I don't see the attraction. I'd rather stay in Linux and use wget or snarf.
Bad Choice of Words? (Score:2)
The reason I'm asking this is that if I didn't know any better, I'd think that this is just WordPerfect and a few little addons, not an entire package (word processor, spreadsheet, presentations, etc.).
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Old form, Stupid questions (Score:1)
Re:That explains it. (Score:2)
Don't get me wrong, I'll take Linux over Windows any day, but I'd have to say that one of Linux's weaknesses is no real support for system-wide printer drivers. Most Linux and Unix apps assume that you've got a PostScript printer. If you don't you have to use something like ghostscript to act as a filter for your printer.
There are numerous problems with this setup. For one thing, ghostscript is complicated, rather badly written in places, and crashes far more often than I'd like. To get an idea of how hokey the ghostscript code is, try compiling it with '-pedantic -Wall'. You'll see tonnes of "variable x may have not been initialized" warnings...
Using PostScript as the API for communicating printers is just a bad idea. PostScript is Turing complete. That means there's all sorts of analysis you simply can't do to the stream sent to the printer. It isn't even guaranteed that the printer will ever finish (the halting problem). It would be a lot simpler if there was a drawing API, sort of like a subset of X, but for paper. Or heck, an XML-based page description language. Just make sure it isn't Turing complete.
If Linux actually had decent printing system, then WordPerfect wouldn't need its own. As it is, printing is one of Linux's biggest weaknesses, IMHO.
Sign up form (Score:1)
No download available (Score:1)
I loved WordPerfect, from (IIRC) 2.0 on a Victor 9000 under DOS 1.0 up to 5.1, whereupon it started to suck. I've tried WP8-Linux, actually bought a shrink-wrapped copy from a store, and found it too slow to use with moderately complex layout. A two column, single page document should not take 90 seconds (!) to scroll down one line. This on a PPro-233 with 196MB of RAM. I don't need WYSIWYG; I'd love the old character based interface, but that's not available anymore without per-user licenses.
There's a really great word processor and decent layout program in there still, struggling to get out. If Corel had any sense they'd release the source to public scrutiny, put up with the derisive comments about it's quality or lack thereof, and accept the assistance of all of us fans. I'd understand if they didn't want to do this with the latest and greatest; so give us the code to 5.1 and let your users save the product.
"compatibility" is more than just kernel version (Score:1)
Also, if it's dynamically linked (and it should be, static linking on an app that size would be pure evil), then there's library version issues..
You'd just expect Corel to be at least slightly clueful when it comes to these issues, rather than just quoting a kernel version. OTOH, they're probably just testing it with Corel Linux and couldn't care less about other distros....
what the? (Score:2)
Error Occurred While Processing Request
Error Diagnostic Information
ODBC Error Code = 37000 (Syntax error or access violation)
[Microsoft][ODBC SQL Server Driver][SQL
Server]User 3 not allowed in database 'b etarep' - only the owner of this database can access it.
SQL = "exec GetElements 1"
Data Source = "betarep"
Date/Time: 11/13/99 00:11:03
Browser: Mozilla/4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.13 i686)
HTTP Referer: http://slashdot.org/
Template: e:\dox\cfscripts\betarep\applicationform.cfm
Query String: bp_entity_id=2
I would have thought they used their own product!!!!
Main page (Score:1)
http://www.corel.com/betaprogram/index.h tm [corel.com]
in case you're interested in perhaps reading some stuff about it, rather than just the direct link to the application form. There's not that much there, though.
Re: TSRs ? (Score:1)
Committed to Linux??? (Score:1)
Error Occurred While Processing Request
Error Diagnostic Information
ODBC Error Code = 37000 (Syntax error or access violation)
[Microsoft][ODBC SQL Server Driver][SQL Server]User 3 not allowed in database 'betarep' - only the owner of this database
can access it.
SQL = "exec GetElements 1"
Data Source = "betarep"
Date/Time: 11/13/99 00:11:44
Browser: Mozilla/4.61 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i686)
Remote Address: 207.75.178.101
HTTP Referer: http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=99/11/12/19352
Template: e:\dox\cfscripts\betarep\applicationform.cfm
Query String: bp_entity_id=2
...kind of disappointing from a company supposedly committed to Linux.
Re:Committed to Linux??? (Score:1)
Re:That explains it. (Score:3)
Re:Bah (Score:1)
shades of OJ.. (Score:1)
Or something stupid like that.
Pope
Re:Bad Choice of Words? (Score:1)
How many people out there seem to call Word or any other MS application "Microsoft?" "Yeah, I got Microsoft 6?"
Also, Corel Office would imply that it has something to do with Corel's other products, Corel Draw and Corel Paint.
So, to sum up this incomprehensible comment, WordPerfect Office is OK by me.
And just because my sister works for Corel doesn't mean I'm biased
Pope
Re:Old form, Stupid questions (Score:1)
Good news is, it's being released at comdex, a buddy of mine is going, should have my copy as soon as he gets back... too bad I can't go.. friggen college.
Hope this is better than the windows version (Score:1)
OpenSource-not (Score:1)
Re:Link does not work.. (Score:1)
Of course, it could just be an NT server running normally.
Deosyne
Ass Raped Monkey (Score:2)
Some people might like their bloated word processors, but I'll stick with raw LaTeX, thanks. Doesn't suck down all my memory and I invariably get better output than that of any GUI word processor I've ever seen.
Re:No download available (Score:1)
Version 8 for Linux is ok,but as others have pointed out, they really do not understand the *nix way of doing things. And this product is likely to be only marginally successful until they do.
note to all companies (Score:2)
Note to Corel and all other companies:
Don't make these mandatory forms that people have to fill out before using your product. You will gain NOTHING from them. NOTHING! except a bunch of useless fake data.
There is no way for you to verify any of that information. Even if some people do fill in the correct information, the false data will simply screw up any analyses you plan to do on it.
GIGO. Garbage In. Garbage Out.
Re:note to all companies (Score:2)
"Gimp? VIM?"
hehehe
"We hope you find fun and laughter in the new millenium" - Top half of fastfood gamepiece
Re:what the? (Score:1)
I'm waiting for M$ to start blaming Linux for their SQL 7 problems in their debug dumps, too.
Apparently Corel don't read their own press, or they'd be running Linux Netwinder Server. Oh yea, they sold that....
btw, after I spent 3 hrs answering the questions, my form went in with minimal fuss. But then again, my _REFERER_ didn't say
Re:That explains it. (Score:2)
"We hope you find fun and laughter in the new millenium" - Top half of fastfood gamepiece
Yeah, I noticed that... (Score:1)
The problem with Postscript - right on (Score:3)
Postscript isn't going away any time soon, and the glitches you mentioned will be eradicated over time in classic open-source style. The turing-complete problem isn't a horrible problem because the postscript-generating program can limit itself to generating postscript commands that are known to produce predictable results.
You can use the turing-complete features of postscript judiciously without taking the risk of your printer never halting. E.g, for doing things like headers and footers - you don't download the whole text every page, you just make up a function and call it. Not that it really matters that much with a fast printer connection.
But basically, I agree with you, why does a printer language have to be turing-complete? If it does, then why don't we make every darn interface in the whole computer turing complete? IOW, what's so special about printers?
Postscript is so firmly entrenched, though, that an alternate solution would have to be really compelling to make any headway. The easier to implement, the more compelling. So, what's easy to implement? I'd say, start with Gecko
Then we'd need a kickass way to talk to Gecko. XML would fill the bill, as you said.
Intense questions (Score:1)
How do they decide if you're "qualified"? Does someone actually read it or do they run it through a bot?
Re:GetRight (Score:1)
Re:Old form, Stupid questions (Score:1)
Anyway, I guess scanning refers to scanners, i.e. reading pictures.
Re: OT Ofc97/2k bitching. (Score:1)
mcrandello@my-deja.com
rschaar{at}pegasus.cc.ucf.edu if it's important.
Re:corel for java? (Score:1)
TTF (Score:1)
Re:Intense questions (Score:1)
LaTeX (Score:2)
Somewhat offtopic: I recently started using LyX [lyx.org], basically a WYSIWYG front-end to LaTeX that's actually pretty cool. I find it nice when creating documents containing lots of greek to actually see what the formulas are going to look like. It even supports macros (though only in math mode). Plus, it's open source! I used it to write a conference paper submission and found it way smoother than hacking the raw LaTeX. Not everything is as intuitive as one might hope -- I had a few points of confusion early on, mainly because I didn't RTFM, but the developers were quite helpful and set me straight.
Granted, LyX still has some stability problems (i.e. it randomly dumps core) but since it makes emacs-stlye emergency backups, in addition to creating recovery files just before giving up the ghost, I've never lost a single keystroke of data, unlike some other word processors [microsoft.com] I've used.
Re:Bah (Score:2)
Re:Bah (Score:2)
damn should 've used the preview
Re:The application form is too long (Score:1)
I thought newer versions of getright detect and intercept downloads in browsers, and this works even when a cgi and not a direct url is used.
Re:That explains it. (Score:2)
"I have liked WP ever since I first used it (WP5.1)"
hmm. I have had long sessions with wp5.1 where I tried to fix the layout after changing the printerdriver. I had this star lc 20 printer in those days, the driver for that printer sucked.
I never really liked the 6.0 dos version (my computer was too slow for it). Later when I got a computer with win 3.1, I tried some of the windows versions. They were rather poor at that time.
Eventually I installed word 6.0. Which was still a bit flaky. After that came word 95 which is the best word version I encountered. Word 97 is too bloated. Last year I installed framemaker. If you want consistent layout and a friendly GUI, framemaker is a good compromise.
My main problem with framemaker is that the user interface is a bit primitive compared to word and wordperfect. Basically it's apple interface ported too windows. As a result it is a bit flaky in the look and feel. But, hey, it works and it doesn't mess my generally complex documents up.
Re:That explains it. (Score:1)
Just for the record, WP8 is essentially the only piece of Windows software that's still used by my sister... I know she'll be happy when WP2k/Linux comes out. I'll be happy to get rid of that I-have-window-manager-delussions piece of software on some boxes...
(I don't use GNOME, I don't use KDE) AFAIK, with GNOME this might be possible in a distrubution neutral way, with KDE I don't have any idea, but with AfterSTEP and the like, you are getting dangeously close to distribution-specific stuff that I would not like to see in WP2k or any other product for that matter... and I'm a Debian user, I hope Corel has got some pretty decent working experience with Debian, they know for sure they have to stick one file in one directory to get the thing installed on every window manager's menu, but it's still distribution specific (darth! why won't the other distros see the light and admit that menu is a great idea...)
Re:note to all companies (Score:1)
Re:The problem with Postscript - right on (Score:1)
Re:have you seen this?!? (Score:2)
Re:I just hope that... (Score:1)
corel draw 4 linux? (Score:1)
Re:The application form is too long (Score:1)
I think they're hoping that only the most rabid techies will sign up for this, and aren't interested in 'casual' beta testers.
I think I can offer a reason for this too - I worked as part of my co-op work experience at Corel, doing QA...
The bugs they receive from beta sites that we have to duplicate and pass onto the developers are often atrocious - and naturally this time they decided that they, if we're gonna do a public beta, we're gonna accept only those who are willing, from the start, to give us the whole story.
Re:Bah (Score:1)
Force them to find an interpreter; there's even ghostscript for Win32.
That's what I do with my physics labs; of course, it's physics with other geeks who know what Postscript actually is, but...
Re:Link does not work.. (Score:1)
Re:Bah (Score:2)
Postscript is not a format that's very suitable for editing. TeX is particularly lousy for exchanging documents. Basically all the exports to other wordprocessor fileformats are
A one way, no way to read back an rtf file and maintain the layout
B pretty lousy (HTML, rtf, wordperfect)
"That's what I do with my physics labs; of course, it's physics with other geeks who know what Postscript actually is, but..."
I know what postscript is and I know its only good for forwarding it to the printer (if your lucky enough to have a postscript printer). I found that ghostscript reads most but not all posscript so in most cases it is possible to get a printed version of the document.
Re: OT Ofc97/2k bitching. (Score:1)
98lite [98lite.net] basically just replaces elements of the Windows 98 installation (mainly the shell) with those from Windows 95. I guess you get to keep the kernel, but lose the Internet Explorer based shell.
Re:Bah (Score:2)
Re:Bah (Score:2)
How did they get this far so fast? (Score:1)
Re:Hrm.... blank page response? (Score:1)
XFree86 3.3.3.1! (Score:1)
:-P
Re:I just hope that... (Score:1)
...
One request.. (Score:1)
Lets hope all the beta testers will strongly request this.
...
Re:Committed to Linux??? (Score:1)
Their MS SQL (????) table is full:
Error Occurred While Processing Request
Error Diagnostic Information
ODBC Error Code = 37000 (Syntax error or access violation)
[Microsoft][ODBC SQL Server Driver][SQL Server]Can't allocate space for object 'LongAnswers' in database 'betarep' because the 'default' segment is full. If you ran out of space in Syslogs, dump the transaction log. Otherwise, use ALTER DATABASE or sp_extendsegment to increase the size of the segment.
SQL = "exec SaveApplicationForm 2, -- CUT a lot of personal data-- "
Data Source = "betarep"
Date/Time: 11/13/99 11:05:43
Browser: Mozilla/4.6 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.14pre4 i586)
Remote Address: -- CUT --
HTTP Referer: http://nas.corel.com/cfscripts/betarep/applicatio
Template: e:\dox\cfscripts\betarep\submission.cfm
MS SQL???? They should be ashamed!
Best regards,
Steen Suder
PhotoPAINT (Score:1)
Anyone who knows of a simple, geometric shape drawing tool for the Gimp will cause me to love the Gimp forever.
--------
"I already have all the latest software."
Re:How did they get this far so fast? (Score:2)
---
"'Is not a quine' is not a quine" is a quine.
Re:One request.. (Score:1)
Bottom line: Motif widgets suck.
--------
"I already have all the latest software."
I guess you've never run a Beta Test before (Score:3)
First of all, they are going to have to cull a list of a few testers out of the hundreds, if not thousdands, of applicants. To do that, they are going to want to pick canidates who are knowledgeable about computes, have experience with all the software involved, and have a wide variety of software, hardware, and configurations in use.
Once you get to the actual test, the exact combination of hardware, kernel, drivers, daemons, libraries, desktop environment, and everything else up to and including their background image, can make a difference. If you don't think so, you've never had to operate a Beta Test before.
I found their survey perfectly reasonable, although their were a few (excusable) DOS- and Window-ish questions on it ("TSRs" are "daemons" on Linux, etc.).
A couple of specifics --
OS and version is legit - you can run Linux programs on BSD as well, plus there are different distributions of Linux that can be considered different "OSes" depending on your definition of the term.
Windows version is legit - they could want to know if you have Windows install in a dual-boot configuration. (It could be simple stupidity, but neither you nor I know for sure.)
Re:COREL == INCOMPETENT (Score:2)
First off.. PEOPLE LIE. They say they've managed project X which consisted of buzzword buzzword buzzword. For instance, "I wrote the classes which interfaces an Oracle database into the java application. I used inheritance and operator overloading.. blah blah"
5 minutes later, I'll ask him.. "What is a byte?" Couldn't answer the damn question!
Now, I don't go asking API questions, but I make sure they know types, arrays, pointers, etc.. But I would ask generic questions ABOUT an API. (What does the Xt lib do in X windows?)
The point is that there are too many potted plants masquarading as PROGRAMERS. They read Dr. Dobbs, and PC Week, and can spit buzzwords at you all day. But when you get down to specifics, the thin vail crumbles.
I asked a DBA position candidate (first question, honest) how to insert a row. He actually added a "where" clause. BWAHAHAHA!
So, there is a minumum technical interview required. Some places would require a very deep interview for their projects. (Think "router design and programing" at Cisco!)
I don't think it's necessarily about doing a "better job" - but I do think it clues the interviewer into if the candidate will be able to operate with a core competancy to DO the job.
The other half of the equation is motivation. People that are _not_ motivated, but have the skills are also potted plants.
Pan - from the hellfire known as "Saturday Work"
What product? (Score:2)
Why should their Linux Desktop Apps Group waste their time reinventing the wheel and learning PHP when Corel already has a generic beta-tester signup form handy? It's not as though this is, say, Sun, still running a web store written with Dynamo when they own not one but two competing app servers.
Lord knows I've never seen a MySQL or Postgres database throw errors when a tablespace fills up and there's no room for more extents. Not.
Babies.
Re:That explains it. (Score:2)
So, CUPS is another important piece in the puzzle for us. Now - why is CUPS 2.0-oriented and not 2.2? Is it time to pay more attention to the printer problem? Or should be wait until there are more newbies on board so that people are more in the mood to pay us for working on this gungy stuff?
Re:Bah (Score:2)
In case you are wondering, this is called 'sarcasm'. But only slightly.
Re:Quite possibly the stupidest form I've ever see (Score:2)
Funny to be replying to myself, but..
I got accepted into the beta.. sweeeeet!
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