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Comments: 144 + -   An iPhone App Store That Apple Doesn't Control on Friday July 30, @02:38PM

Posted by Soulskill on Friday July 30, @02:38PM
from the mr-jobs-tear-down-that-wall dept.
iphone
software
apple
waderoush writes "Princeton's Ed Felten has criticized the iPhone and iPad as Disneyland-like 'walled gardens' and says there's no way the iTunes App Store can 'offer the scope and variety of apps that a less controlled environment can provide.' Now there's a central marketplace where developers can sell iPhone-optimized apps without going through Apple's gatekeepers. Launched today, it's called OpenAppMkt and it's a showcase for mobile Web apps — not just the type seen back in 2007-2008, before the advent of the App Store, but also for new games and other apps developed using HTML5/CSS/JavaScript (in some cases, the same apps compiled and sold as native iPhone apps). Xconomy has a behind-the-scenes interview with OpenAppMkt's creators, who say they're not out to compete with the native App Store, but that developers deserve new ways to reach users."
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Submission: An iPhone App Store that Apple Doesn't Control by waderoush (1271548)
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  • Hi, I'm at black hat (Score:5, Insightful)

    by yttrstein (891553) on Friday July 30, @02:44PM (#33086790) Homepage
    And I would like to tell you this:

    The iPhone App Store never, ever looked so good.

  • Take a look at their so-called apps. (Score:4, Informative)

    by Animats (122034) on Friday July 30, @02:45PM (#33086810) Homepage

    Sudoku. A flip clock. A picture of a watch. I'm so not impressed.

  • Disneyland (Score:5, Insightful)

    by whisper_jeff (680366) on Friday July 30, @02:46PM (#33086828)

    Ed Felten has criticized the iPhone and iPad as Disneyland-like 'walled gardens'...

    I like Disneyland. It's a ton of fun. I especially enjoy Bats in the Park. Good fun.

    Oh. Wait. You were trying to use Disneyland as a way to imply there was something wrong with it? Oh. My bad. Sorry.

    On a serious note, however, I think it's very cool that there's now an app store for the web apps that can run on the iPhone. After all, that is one of the features of the device.

    • I wouldn't want to live there

    • Slashdot: Disneyland shouldn't exist for anyone... (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Brannon (221550) on Friday July 30, @03:07PM (#33087132)

      because some people don't want to go there.

    • He was using Disneyland of an example of a completely controlled environment. And it is. Disn'y is the prototypical example of a walled garden.

      Something that should be avoided with computer devices.

      • Re:Disneyland (Score:5, Funny)

        by Red Flayer (890720) on Friday July 30, @03:05PM (#33087096) Journal

        Try going to Disneyland and doing whatever you want to do, rather than what the people in control of the park actually condone.

        I tried that, and failed -- but it wasn't Disney that stopped me.

        For the sake of brevity, let's just say that the Minnie Mouse character is NOT anatomically correct.

        • Don't start spreading rumors like that. Parents only want women inside the full Disney body suits, as opposed to having men in there. They'd rather have only women potentially touching their kids inappropriately.

        • For the sake of brevity, let's just say that the Minnie Mouse character is NOT anatomically correct.

          From that I'm going to assume you were charged as a sex offender shortly thereafter...

      • Re:Disneyland (Score:5, Funny)

        by MBGMorden (803437) on Friday July 30, @03:09PM (#33087178)

        Tell me about it. I think I managed to avoid the Cinderella stand-in filing a restraining order, but just barely. I'll be damned if she's getting that shoe back though.

        • We went last summer and in one of the Animal Kingdom locations they had a Pocahontas character come out for picture time...Pocahontas was rather endowed and kept coming close to having a wardrobe malfunction, but she caught it every time...for once i didn't mind waiting in the long line for the photos...

      • We can't I open a Liquor store in Epcot? (Score:5, Insightful)

        by Brannon (221550) on Friday July 30, @03:17PM (#33087298)

        Disney should be forced to allow 3rd parties to do anything they want inside Disneyland. If their customers don't want to go into the porn shops, gun shops, brothels, casinos, and check-cashing stores then they can simply avoid those places while walking down Main St.

        It's really just a question of freedom.

  • Apple also has a web app gallery... (Score:5, Informative)

    by SuperKendall (25149) on Friday July 30, @02:47PM (#33086832)

    Apple has a web app gallery [apple.com] too.

    The difference between now and then is, that web apps have access to most of the sensor data on the phone... so there are a lot more ideas that a practical to do as web apps now than there were before.

    But still native apps will always give a developer the performance edge and full access to every nook and cranny of the device.

  • have the first "app store" in its vcast offerings? It wasnt really too good, and there was not a lot of content, but i believe that they were actually the first to offer such an idea that apple generally is credited with creating, rather than making viable as it should be. Than again I could be wrong.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Nadaka (224565)

      I've been downloading apps|software from an app_store|package_manager for a very long time on linux as well.

      • well im specifically speaking of the mobile market. Yes there have been app stores for PCs for years
      • But have you been paying for apps on Linux? Are there any popular Linux package managers that support authorization and payment to the repository owner for access to particular packages? Not all paid apps have a Free or even free alternative; I've given examples in another comment [slashdot.org].

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by Nadaka (224565)

          No I have not, but it wouldn't be hard to do if you really wanted to.

          In fact, Steam is on its way to native linux support sometime in the next year.

  • Won't install on iPad (Score:4, Informative)

    by dazedNconfuzed (154242) on Friday July 30, @03:04PM (#33087090)

    Go to openappmkt.com and click on "Install OpenAppMkt" using an iPad.
    Popup sez "To install our app, use the iPhone browser" and offers to text the link to a phone number, same as if attempted on a PC.

    • Of course, this app store has been launched by Apple itself, and they will make it almost fail. I say almost, since they will try to keep only a critical mass of users, so no-one will attempt to make yet another app store.

      How's that for a conspiracy theory? :P

  • Cydia? (Score:3)

    by pak9rabid (1011935) on Friday July 30, @03:13PM (#33087234)
    Isn't this what Cydia accomplishes?

  • It's already been done (Score:5, Informative)

    by MattskEE (925706) on Friday July 30, @03:14PM (#33087254)

    The Cydia App Store [saurik.com] has also been around for a while, serving the jailbroken iPhone market. Of course there is not a huge number of apps on it, but there are also lots of free apps in the Cydia repository.

    • Re:It's already been done (Score:5, Informative)

      by stokessd (89903) on Friday July 30, @03:25PM (#33087414) Homepage

      However, with Cydia there's a huge range of apps that make your phone significantly better. And most importantly they are the sorts of aps that you can't get on the official app-store. Things like frameworks to change the look and feel of your phone (winterboard, and springboard replacements, new keyboards etc). There's better ways to control your phone like SBSettings where all your critical settings are a simple swipe away.

      So no, there aren't a lot of apps that could be sold in the app store (because you'd most likely want to sell them in the official app store), but cydia is like having a couple more isles in the store full of the stuff that will make your life better even though it's officially not allowed.

      Now, where's my damn jailbreak for the new iPhone?!?

      Sheldon

    • The Cydia App Store [saurik.com] has also been around for a while, serving the jailbroken iPhone market. Of course there is not a huge number of apps on it, but there are also lots of free apps in the Cydia repository.

      Yeah, but Cydia is only for users that can handle the truth. Not everyone can bear that burden.

  • Walled garden discussions (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Dracos (107777) on Friday July 30, @03:22PM (#33087362)

    All walled garden discussions begin and end with this: Internet vs AOL.

    The outlands will always become more diverse and desirable than the garden. The garden's residents will therefore always abandon it. It is only a matter of time.

    • Re:Walled garden discussions (Score:4, Interesting)

      by Karlt1 (231423) on Friday July 30, @04:00PM (#33088100)

      The outlands will always become more diverse and desirable than the garden. The garden's residents will therefore always abandon it. It is only a matter of time.

      And after almost a decade, /. users are still predicting that iTunes + iPod will fall to a more opened platform.......

      • But it has. I don't know anyone with an MP3 player. It seems crazy to carry one around when our phones play MP3s just as well. I do see people still organizing their collections with itunes, but I don't see many ipods. Phones have leap over mp3 players and unless you really need a feature that only specializing hardware carries then you don't need an mp3 player if you have a smartphone.

        Granted, a popular smartphone is the iphone, but the phone market is much more competitive than the mp3 player market. I

        • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

          by Karlt1 (231423)

          But it has. I don't know anyone with an MP3 player.

          But yet and still Apple sells almost 50 million iPods a year (70%+ market share) and iTunes is the number one music retailer in the world.....

          Phones have leap over mp3 players

          Where can I buy a phone with 160GB of storage (iPod Classic) or even 64GB of storage of the Touch?

          I'd say that the first generation devices have huge advantages because consumers are naive at first. That doesn't usually last and they'll flee the walled garden in time.

          So why have most m

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Snowmit (704081)

      I've got another one for you: PC gaming vs Console gaming

      PCs have been around longer, have more options re: hardware & software, not to mention complete freedom for developers to charge and distribute however they wish, along with extreme modability. Meanwhile consoles are hampered by incredibly restrictive walled gardens, developer-hostile revenue splits and licensing and they only release new hardware every few years.

      Given the obvious openness and freedom of PC gaming compared to console gaming it may

  • Nothing Apple itself hasn't said (Score:3, Insightful)

    by NameIsDavid (945872) on Friday July 30, @03:25PM (#33087402)
    The story attempts to suggest that this is a way to get around Apple's walled garden. On the contrary, this is a fully supported system that Apple has promoted many times. They always say there are two ways to develop apps: an open HTML5-based web app method and the curated App store. What's the news here other than showing people the showcase itself?

    • They always say there are two ways to develop apps: an open HTML5-based web app method

      Can an HTML5-based web application make real-time 3D graphics? (I tried making my own 3D engine in JavaScript with the 2D canvas, but it was fairly slow even on a PC, and there were always cracks between the polygons.) Can an HTML5-based web application ask the user's permission to turn on the camera and microphone? Can an HTML5-based web application run with zero bars and save the user's work?

  • Ah, history - where are you? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by vague disclaimer (861154) on Friday July 30, @03:51PM (#33087914)
    Er,Web Apps were Apple's original vision for iPhone Apps, but everyone whined about them and hence the SKD. Web Apps are fully supported, not a swerve-around.

    But still, let's not let facts get in the way of a good conspiracy adventure.

    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Crashspeeder (1468723)
      Could it be because the webapps are crippled by design? What good is a texting app that can't access your phonebook? That doesn't work terribly well as a webapp does it, now? If you want something useful, it'll have to be written in Obj-C.

  • There are no apps...all this "store" does is place shortcuts on your iPhone home screen to existing web-based apps like Google Voice and other apps which are mobile-friendly.

  • I'll catch a carp for this (Score:3, Interesting)

    by bryan1945 (301828) on Friday July 30, @05:57PM (#33090082) Journal

    But I'd rather have a more controlled environment where, for the most part, the apps have been vetted so they're not trying to steal any info from me. Part of the reason I'm not an Android fan (and no, I don't have an iPhone. Actually, I don't even have a smartphone).

    Being open and fancy-free is fine for some things, but for others I'd prefer some measure of security.

      • Re:Oh good (Score:4, Insightful)

        by dloose (900754) on Friday July 30, @03:04PM (#33087086)

        This means that if your iPhone app is a pile of Perl scripts, you can push it. What iPhone SDK EULA? We don't know what C/C++/Objective-C limitation you're talking about, we'll list your app in our store! If you feel like writing an app for iPhone in C#, you can push it as a .NET exe in PE-COFF format, instead of having to compile it to native code. If you wanted to port Firefox Mobile and have it use it's own JavaScript engine, you can. You could even push a port of Chrome using V8.

        I'm pretty sure that none of this is true...

      • As a developer, this is completely useful to you. Not stated is the words "including, but not limited to", words that anyone with so much as a sliver of common sense would know are implied

        No, anyone with common sense would know that there is no "including, but not limited to" implied in this. The iPhone doesn't let you download and run programs from arbitrary websites. This is a well known limitation of the device.

        This "app store" sells (bundled?) web applications. As such, there is no executable code.

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