iPhone Interest Still Going Strong 339
Only $220 to Make an iPhone. Bomarc writes to tell us BuinessWeek is reporting that according to a recent analysis the new iPhone only costs Apple in the neighborhood of $200 ($220 for the 8-gigabyte model) to manufacture.
iPhone User Review. Alexandros Roussos writes "It has been an unforgettable week-end for the first iPhone buyers and MacScoop will now put the focus on one of them who provided to a complete review of Apple's very anticipated gizmo."
Mistakes in the iPhone Interface. Rakesh writes "I love the iPhone. It 's here to stay as my primary cell phone. But I've come across a bunch of things that make me think Apple rushed at the end to get this thing out there. Here's my list of the top 10 mistakes Apple made with the iPhone interface."
iPhone Security Roundup. An anonymous reader writes "Although some security researchers noted problems getting their iPhone activated, others wasted no time tearing the new device apart. Seth Fogie, from Airscanner, reported passwords can be found for the device from running strings obtained from the backup images through a password cracker. Robert Graham, from Errata Security, writes about Safari and Bluetooth bugs on their blog."
iPhone Hardware Details. abdulzis writes "Engadget has the scoop on the iPhone's hardware specs through a leaked firmware. 'Sascha at Gear Log seems to think given the recently discovered Samsung chip in the iPhone, perhaps the processor in question is a Samsung S3C6400, a recently-produced 667MHz ARM1176JZF-based CPU that seems to fit the bill.'"
No, really? (Score:4, Insightful)
$220 to buy the parts, not "to make" (Score:5, Insightful)
I bet the software development cost a pretty penny (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:I bet the software development cost a pretty pe (Score:4, Insightful)
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Of course the cost of the parts does not take into account assembly, or the research and development that went into the iphone, which if you ask me, those R&D folks should be canned for making so many obvious
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Actually, I wonder if many other product designers fall into a trap of non-omission, that is, a need to include everything. After a few days with an iPhone I can say, sure, there are things that aren't there, but the things that are included are very good. For instance, there is no MMS, but the SMS is great. I figure that every product design team has limited resources, and maybe it was better to
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There is an unlimited data provision for email in all the iPhone plans. You can send email instead of SMS or email with a photo attachment instead of MMS all day long and pay no additional fees. Using SMS or MMS just removes money from your pocket and sticks it into AT&T's.
Happily, the iPhone is software upgradeable, so you can look forward to the addition of an IM client to give you even more free ways to sling
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let's assume a 10% profit margin (Score:2)
Re:let's assume a 10% profit margin (Score:4, Insightful)
Says about $90/device for Windows XP Embedded.
For Qtopia, it is somewhat less but I can't find any info on TT's site about the actual pricing. It is about $200 for the SDK. I *think* I saw that it was about $20-$30 per device some time ago. Much cheaper than Windows.
Of course, you could just hack X+Gnome and be 100% "free" (not really for free, costs money to hack the thing for a phone). But I guess some other WM would be better than having Gnome there.
As for Apple Stock, it actually fell 0.6% today to $121. Their P/E ratio is about 38 which means even if they have a 30% jump in profit, that means their P/E ratio will drop to about 29. That is still relatively high. Companies like Microsoft and IBM have their P/E ratios at about 21 and 16 respectfully. Currently there seems to be a 15% anticipated increase in profits for next year over current year. If that does not materialize, Apple stock will drop.
Apple may be a better company to invest in today than MSFT though. I'm not sure if the price is warranted though (they'll need to double their earnings to be at the same price as MSFT is right now)
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The Smartphone / CE / PocketPC OS can't realistically be any more than $5 a unit.
Anyway don't fool yourself that the iPhone is OSX. It's running on an ARM device, iPhone is as much OsX as windows smartphone is windows XP.
Re:let's assume a 10% profit margin (Score:4, Informative)
This is important to note, if nothing else, for those who go around saying things like, "If it's OS X, I should be able to load Mac applications on it." Yeah, we'll get back to you on that after you load World of Warcraft on your Treo, Einstein.
Good profit margin (Score:2)
This shows how Apple is really good at playing the game, where it's often about cheaper is better. They show style and quality is worth it. Most people will buy Fords, but some with the money will pay a premium to own a Mercedes. Apple is just the Mercedes of computing.
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Funny, I was thinking more along the lines of new cloths for the Emperor.
To each their own, I guess.
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*ok really most people (in the US) still buy GMs, but Toyota is second, Ford is third, but my way is funnier
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(I don't even have a car, so I'm lower than rabble I guess.)
Apple's Profit Margin: Alwyays 20-30% (Score:2)
No, it shows that the people who figured it cost 220 bucks have no clue. Apple's profit margins have always been around 20-30%. I would be extremely surprised if they suddenly sold a 220 bucks device for 600 bucks.
People always guesstimate iPod margins way too high, and invariably, they turn out to be wrong during the next Apple analyst call.
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I'm completely against DRM on my computer, and I run Linux at home. I have no interest in most closed-source software for use at home or at work (most of my work is also on Linux machines).
But I looked at the iPhone this weekend and was quite impressed. It did everything a so-called "smart phone" should do, only it does it right. It was easy to use Google maps to find directions, to take notes, to play music, to watch Youtube videos, to surf the web, and lots more.
You see, an open-source L
220 - Yeah right... (Score:5, Insightful)
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It wouldn't surprise me if it was selling at near-cost at retail once you factored in the costs of activation on the network, the store supply chain, tax and so on. If Apple have a good deal with the telco then they may be getting a cut of the network fees. The exclusivity suggests this might be the case; even if it's not most phones on contract are effectively subsedised by the telco and they recoup this semi-loan over the term of the contract. And then there's iTunes, ring tones, accessories and what not.
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Still going strong?!? (Score:5, Insightful)
Has society's attention span gotten so short that we are surprised when news reports on a high-profile new product spans past the Friday it was introduced through the weekend following its introduction?
Or are we just surprised that the iPhone has managed to steal a few seconds of airtime from the whole Paris Hilton thing?
- RG>
Re:Still going strong?!? (Score:5, Funny)
Long answer: yes. (I'd post more but my attention span is too short)
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What does attention span have to do with paid-for advertisements? The Apple marketing campaign for the iPhone has been stellar, it's a thing that they truly excel at.
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Im sorry but I really think the hype over the iPhone has gone way past apples marketing. People keep acting like apple is driving this hype machine but they really aren't. They barely talk about the iPhone compared to how much everyone else seems to talk about it.
Apple doesnt drive that hype machine because they don't have to. Not since the iPod came out.
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I know it seemed Insightful at first, but that was so half-an-hour ago.
I'm going out for a latte.
WTH is wrong with the media? (Score:2)
And they call themselves journalists.
Re:Still going strong?!? (Score:4, Funny)
YES
Next!
What I WANT to know is... (Score:5, Funny)
1. First iPhone user looking at porn
2. First iPhone user sitting on toilet and surfing web
3. First iPhone user to get laid because of it (those with significant others don't count).
4. First person to have an orgasm just by touching it (it being the iPhone you sicko)
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I'll let you handle that.
Mission accomplished.
Done.
I'll let you handle that one, too.
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Those who purchase an iPhone and have a significant other will probably NOT get laid because of purchasing it.
What I find funny is... (Score:2, Insightful)
Who cares. It's another product. It'll make some people happy, some not. Don't get so wrapped up in the drama.
(And no, I won't provide links or references. This is my opinion. I don't have to prove it.)
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Re:What I find funny is... (Score:5, Insightful)
They are a vocal minority. The phrase I heard recently to describe everyone else was "circle-jerk". That's never something I'd ever even considered and I promised myself that I'd use the phrase again.
It's not that people like me want to see it go down in flames. Quite the contrary, I've been waiting for a device like the iPhone for many years. My problem is that I got that device two and a half years ago and I'm still happy with it. I welcome the competition in the market and I value Apple's UI design highly so hopefully they will drag the entire industry forward with them. I've been a mobile early adopter since GSM first came out, so to hear that another large, respected manufacturer has entered the industry is fantastic.
What annoys some of us is that it's being presented as revolutionary. It's not. It might be, if it takes off and in the future changes most peoples outlook on phones. It took the iPod to bring mp3 players to the masses but it wasn't really an evolution change in technology. It was more marketing and design, such as the white headphones serving as a constant "join us, it's great!" advertisement.
The iPhone seems to be advertised to be a leap forward. Now, it may not be Apple doing this, there is a lot of grassroots support for it as is clear based on the volume of news around it, and they may be generating this meme that it's all powerful. The problem is it's not. It would be a downgrade for me. From what I hear it has the same UI problems as the first smartphones. Having to write down numbers for example as there is no cut and paste or hyper-linking of phone numbers in text. Lot's of little quirks have been ironed out over the years; I've been running homebrew ROMs on my mine, so I've seen it at it's worst and at it's best. From reading about people using it, some of the UI is an improvement but it needs work in many places.
This is what annoys us. Sure, for most people the iPhone is a leap forward and it's sure silenced most of the "a phone is just a phone" crowd that I have discussed this with on many previous occasions on Slashdot whenever there is a story about new phone technology. So, for the majority of people, great! Enjoy it. Having the internet in your pocket is awesome, as is the lack of needing to carry around a separate media player. The integration of SMS and email is also very handy. Google maps is great, though personally I prefer things like TomTom that keep the data locally. And so on, there are so many things you can do with a device with this.
Just stop making it sound like you are the first to be doing it! :-)
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I haven't delved into mobile computing yet and am curious where to begin. I'm afraid of the iPhone mostly because it's useless to me if I can't open an ssh connection from it.
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I've got an HTC Blue Angel, which is also known as a Orange SPV2000 or T-Mobile MDA2s. I think! The problem is that the company that makes them (HTC) has only recently began selling phones under it's own brand. The rebranding from telcos makes it complicated and has definitely killed brand recognition in their products. Don't bother with this one, it's not far off being three years old now and there are better ones availabl
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Actually the iPod starting its dramatic take-off before the slick advertising began, but you can remember it your
I am happy the iPhone is doing well (Score:4, Insightful)
It seems that other manufacturers "test the waters" by making a half-ass web feature enabled phone
Come on, a high res screen for web browsing and touchscreen.. we've been wanting that for a while
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You bastard! What are the rest of us going to do now? And why did Apple only make one of them?
All joking aside, the way you phrased that says something interesting about how a lot of consumers view the iPhone. Not as a commodity (I bought a monitor) but as a singularity (I bought the iPhone). Maybe I'm reading into a bit too deeply, but it seems to me that it reflects a valuation of the iPhone as something more than a thing.
Re:I am happy the iPhone is doing well (Score:4, Insightful)
Actually only the cell-phones in the US are half-ass web featured ones. Two years ago, the coolest cell in the US was the brain-dead, RAZR, granted it was sexy, but it was also brain-dead. On the other side of the planet, there were touch-screen phones that ran Linux and had Opera 7.5 as a pretty decent browser. They still rule because they can run Doom and Quake, and can render most pages without a problem. Come to think about-it, most of what the iPhone brings, you can get from a Nokia N800 with a basic GSM phone that also has Bluetooth in parallel. Actually the N800 is a lot better than the iPhone. I have an excelent IMAP client on it (Claws), I have Pidgin for IM, I have a very decent Opera 9 with flash and a lot of other goodies. The great thing about-it is that it only takes an incredibly small amount of time to port ANY gtk application to the Maemo platform that the N800 uses. The multitude of applications that have been ported to the N800 only proves that it's a better platform than most of the others.
I will give the iPhone the following:
1) Multi-touch. It sounds like it's more than a simple touch-screen. The Nokia N800 has a nice feature that detects if you touch with the stick or a finger and adjusts the input method and the menus accordingly, but I doubt that it's as cool as the one on the iPhone. I am sure that the Nokia N800+1 could easily implement something like this.
2) Screen rotation sensor.
3) Phone
Flame follows: (3) is actually one that can be put in both good and bad. The iPhone is an Edge phone on a 3G world. Granted that the network coverage for 3G in the US is a joke compared to Europe or Asia. Actually, the network coverage in the US is more like a joke. In Romania, the country that only a few years ago was under communist ruling, we have basically 100% coverage for the cell phone networks, and a lot of 3G, and nation-wide GPRS on Vodaphone (they are introducing 7.something Mbps HSUPA later this year) and EDGE on Orange (same as Vodafone). Vodafone currently has 2.8 Mbps HSDPA, and Orange has 3.6 Mbps HSDPA. In Germany it's even more impressing, you have almost full 3G coverage for the whole country.
Zapp, our only CDMA operator, has EVDO 2.4 Mbps since 2004, and they are going for an upgrade later this year. Now, allow me to be disappointed by the lame EDGE options available to the US market. I am also disappointed by the fact that Apple didn't allow the buying of unlocked phones and gave AT&T exclusivity.
BTW: The rates for Cell phone is the US are also huge. In 2005, a prepaid card from Cingular gave me "free calls" in the US, but having to pay an airtime rate of $.25/min for both outgoing and incoming calls. In Romania in 2005 the prepaid rates were somewhere around $.20 for outgoing calls, and free for incoming. I also found the fact that you get charged from the second that you make the call, even if the other party doesn't answer, to be a little disturbing, especially since a call to Romania costed around $.90 + airtime tax, and would usually take around 45s to connect to the Bucharest based operators. I've called Cingular and asked for my money back for the situations in which it didn't connect at all. Based on their pricing details I expected to be charged $0.25 in that minute until the person answers and until the call connects, and after that $0.25 + $0.90 for the call, but I was charged almost an extra dollar for each call. I find this wierd because in Europe, if the person doesn't answer, you don't pay anything, and if you receive a call (except for roaming), you don't pay anything. In the US, if someone hates you they simply have to send you a lot of Text messages, because they also cost if you receive them.
Anyway, to make a long story short, in the US the mobile phones are a lot more expensive and dumb (literally), the rates are a lot worst and the network coverage is a joke. This is coming from a guy that lives in Romania, not in the UK or France or Germany. I talk my ass off on my cell phone (and we all have a cell phone), and I never exceed than $45, except when I'm out of the country.
Coverage information is available at Coverage Maps [coveragemaps.com].
News Flash! (Score:2)
Bawwwwing (Score:2)
Perhaps "the amount of media hype and saturation" would be a better description... Going by Slashdot's reaction, you'd think they'd invented an orgasmatron or something.
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I'm worried about reading the comments when this thing [wikipedia.org] comes out.
Dealing with Apple geeks is one thing, dealing with Linux geeks with their own OSS phone will be quite another.
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Huh (Score:2, Insightful)
Someone's forgetting software development, R&D, support, distributing, warranties, shipping, licenses, patents, and around a 50-60 other things like that, which go into a product you buy from the local shop.
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Firmware (Score:2)
And they've cracked the root password for the iPhone OS
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AT&T Network (EDGE) +iPhone (Score:2)
Also, would like to know if anyone has been able to make the thing work as a bluetooth modem for internet on a laptop.
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Ugh (Score:2)
Even though the iPhone has already been released into the wild, the amount of excitement surrounding this device doesn't seem to be subsiding by any measurable degree.
And when did the product come out? Oh that's right - yesterday! I know it's just an introduction and it's just tech "reporting" (read: hummers) but stupidity like that should be painful. Should the general population become bored with a product as soon as it has launched? No, and we would all prefer it if the tech media wasn't either. I, f
Configured my bosses - impressive (Score:4, Informative)
The EDGE network blows. But, browsing off of it from our wireless network is a breeze. The screen is solid and I was amazed at the clarity of the screen with fonts, images when zooming really close. After setting it up on the network, it does need a few things.
1. ActiveSync or something to sync to our mailserver so the user can get contacts, calendar and mail.
2. IPSec VPN ability - maybe Cisco will get a client in this?
3. Open Office documents (Excel, Word)
4. Open PDF docs.
I am sure this will get better as it goes. But, far far better than I would have expected as a first gen device. It does make my Treo 700p look poor.
Re:Configured my bosses - impressive (Score:4, Informative)
2. IPSec VPN ability - maybe Cisco will get a client in this?
3. Open Office documents (Excel, Word)
4. Open PDF docs.
2. I have no idea.
3. Already opens Word/Excel files.
4. Already opens PDF.
I heard there was a bug related to PDF, but not sure about that as I haven't tried it yet. I would expect a bug fix software update for several issues soon.
Boneheaded Built-in Battery (Score:2)
Who needs it? (Score:2)
Otherwise, who really needs to replace the battery that easily? I fully expect to get many years of use out of this one. I don't see making the case less sealed than it might be a good tradeoff for something I will almost never want to do.
I thought the same thing, back when I purchased my Palm V - I had no need for a removable battery then, nor do I now. I prefer the longer battery life that
Interface blog entry worth the read. (Score:2)
I don't know if it's my layout or what but the font he uses has literally no whitespace between a 'v' and the next letter. So clicking becomes . . .
iPhone Interest Still Going Strong (Score:4, Funny)
all the same (Score:2)
http://www.marketwatch.com/tools/quotes/intchart.
"But don't take my word for it, go and see for yourself" (RD Laing).
Still Don't have Answers (Score:2)
I'd be willing to consider one if they had bluetooth laptop tethering but that doesn't really sound like the sort of thing that AT&T would go for.
iPhone users are willing beta testers (Score:2, Interesting)
Lets contrast that with Apple, and their beta product, the iPhone. It is still lacking some features. Other features aren't polished. Very few people clown the iPhone adopt
Re:iPhone users are willing beta testers (Score:5, Insightful)
Apple is making their first mobile phone ever, and while only the foolish expect it to be perfect, there are already tons of people talking about how much better the interface is than any other phone they've ever had. Many of them are also sharing what they see as the flaws in the device. And while I have no doubt that many of those people waiting in line were hardcore Apple fanboys, they're probably closing in on one million phones sold already, and I doubt there are that many Apple fanatics in the US.
To sum it up, MS needed around five years to put out a mediocre new version of their flagship product, after tons of feature cutting and multiple embarassing delays. I don't know how long Apple had been working on the iPhone, but it came out the day they said it would come out, and people seem to be genuinely impressed by it.
Apple has made it to where they are primarily by developing products that its customers think are great. MS has made it to where they are by developing products that are just good enough (and some wise business decisions). The two companies are judged differently, sure, but only because each has earned its reputation.
Time to get a new icon... (Score:3, Insightful)
Not to trash the iPhone. It just isn't something I'm ever going to want. I want a simple phone, with easy-to-use PDA functionality. (I'd prefer to have separate phone and PDA, but that train has left the station.) If I want to watch video, I'll get out my LE 1600 [motioncomputing.com].
Software Updates? (Score:3, Insightful)
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I'm sorry, did you say something?
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The iPhone craze has truly reduced epic proportions... so much so that my GRANDMA emails me and says she wants to buy me one. I mean, I don't want to be ungrateful, I'm probably the only person I know who actively DOES NOT WANT an iPhone, I should take advantage of my most-favored
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Thanks Apple for paying for my college education and a house.
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Re:Who cares really? (Score:4, Interesting)
Because we are Slashdotters, we have watched Star Trek and already own a device that does everything the iPhone does. :-)
Granted it doesn't have a cool logo and look as pretty, but as geeks we aren't supposed to care about such things!
Geeks Should Care! (Score:2)
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Because we are Slashdotters, we have watched Star Trek and already own a device that does everything the iPhone does.
Examples?
Using the iPhone is like using something *from* Star Trek. The iPhone is the single most amazing device I've ever used, although I'm more than willing to be amazed by something else and eagerly await some suggestions.
I mean, if there are existing devices that do everything the iPhone does, and I'm so utterly amazed by the iPhone, I can hardly wait!
However, I suspect a list of the usual suspects that, in comparison to the iPhone, are like using Lynx compared to Firefox (and I don't mean lack of gra
Re:Who cares really? (Score:4, Insightful)
With current phones, from a capability point of view, they all do things that seem like they are from Star Trek, I fully agree with you on that. Where they all fall short is in the interface. That's what I mean by it actually *feels* like using something from Star Trek, and not just "has the capabilities" of something from Star Trek.
Essentially, doing something on a standard smart phone (or cell phone in general) takes quite a bit of effort. That's why most people don't do much beyond calling, taking photos, and SMS/MMSing. As geeks and technology enthusiasts, most of us here on Slashdot enjoy doing those things enough to overcome effort required--sometimes we enjoy it so much that we even completely ignore the effort, or count it as "part of the fun". With the iPhone (and all things Apple, in general), the effort is so minimized that the interface becomes almost invisible.
Take the task of multi-party calling. Pretty much every phone can do it, and I've done it on every phone I've ever had, but I've *only* done it when I really, *really* wanted to, because the interface was so limited. The process usually involved multiple, "are you there?"s because you're never quite sure who exactly is on hold, who is connected, and who you might have accidentally hung up on. With the iPhone, even though it's the exact same feature, it's so effortless that I am sure I'll use this feature more during the next year than I have on all my past phones combined. The same goes for web browsing, email, etc. With the iPhone, the actual *experience* of using it--every one one of its features--is fun and easy. With all other phones, it's quite impressive to *have* all those features, but using them can be called *many* things other than "fun", and beyond the first time, "hey, this is cool", a large portion of those features will go unused--not because they are not worthwhile features that one might want to use, but because they aren't worth the trouble.
The iPhone is the first phone (or device in general) that I've used that has me feeling confident about leaving my notebook behind, and *that* says a lot.
It's all about the experience. I suggest playing with one at an Apple Store (an AT&T store will do in a pinch). 5 minutes trying out Safari, the iPod, YouTube and the phone features will convey far more than my post possibly could. Even if, after that, you don't think the iPhone is worth $600, or that the features don't match your needs, or that you're going to wait for 3G, or any other number of things, I'm pretty sure you'll know exactly what I meant by my Star Trek comment.
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After playing with mine for the weekend, I'll be designing my own cover with "Don't Panic" written on it... in large, friendly letters.
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That being said...Apple is up about 30% since February, and that screams SELL to my mind. On the other hand, they're not seriously overcapitalized, they've got cash reserves, and their P/E is normal for a tech company (Lower mid 30s), and last time their stock hit 60 bucks a share they split it (and it's twice that value now).
I'll probably ride it out for a while. If they can really pull off th
Re:Who cares really? (Score:5, Informative)
The prediction is they will move 10+ million by the end of the year.
That's who cares. It's tech. This is a tech news site. It's the biggest thing techy to happen in the past week.
He's modded flamebait because he was baiting flame.
Re:Who cares really? (Score:4, Insightful)
In a mall, stop and ask 20 people which they're more excited about GPL3 or the iPhone.
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Fortunately, slashdot is not a mall. That's why most of us are here.
Though it is beginning to seem more and more like a mall, as evidenced by your other reply in this thread.
Re:Who cares really? (Score:4, Insightful)
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I think you underestimate the sheer bling this piece of gadgetry represents, not just for the "style-obsessed apple-fanboys", but for the idealistic geek in all of us that sees the iPhone and thinks... I must have a Star Trek PaDD.
I'm in that camp. Plus, I lost my iPod several months ago, and have been month-to-month with my curren
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If only...
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Also, if you don't want to read TFA, you don't have to. You could, you know, STFU & GBTW, as your comment's subject would suggest.
Also, I'd just like to note that, for the record, I watch little TV, and I have barely notic
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I'm in the same boat that you are. I don't watch TV in my own home and only see it when I happen to be at someone else's house who has it on. I saw a grand total of one iTunes advertisement two times. I didn't see any billboards for it, or bus advertisements. I don't listen to the radio either, so I can't comment on whether or not there was any advertising done in
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At any rate, I'd much rather have all the hype on one easily-avoidable story for people who are sick of it, instead of constantly.
Keep in mind though, that some people do want to see the iPhone stuff, and it's completely up to you whether or not you want to waste your time on them.
Possibly not an issue with the iPhone (Score:2)
---> Kendall
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While it's interesting, it's no big deal. Voicemail is notoriously insecure. Most people don't even realise that it can usually be accessed from any line and therefore do not change the default password for this.
Several UK reporters were arrested a year or so ago for doing this to the Royal Families phones to hear their messages. Initially the story seemed to be about some hi-tech uber-hack but in the end i
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God please no. I hate those critters. :)
Re:It's a phone (Score:5, Insightful)