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China - We Don't Censor the Internet 554

Posted by Zonk
from the alternate-reality-china dept.
kaufmanmoore writes "A Chinese government official at a United Nations summit in Athens on internet governance has claimed that no Net censorship exists at all in China. The article includes an exchange by a Chinese government official and a BBC reporter over the blocking of the BBC in China." From the article: "I don't think we should be using different standards to judge China. In China, we don't have software blocking Internet sites. Sometimes we have trouble accessing them. But that's a different problem. I know that some colleagues listen to the BBC in their offices from the Webcast. And I've heard people say that the BBC is not available in China or that it's blocked. I'm sure I don't know why people say this kind of thing. We do not have restrictions at all."
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China - We Don't Censor the Internet

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  • by PoconoPCDoctor (912001) <jpclyons@gmail.com> on Tuesday October 31, 2006 @01:18PM (#16660201) Homepage Journal
    I think just using the CN in a google search must not be returning the same results, but there's no way for me to test this.

    For instance - plug in the term censorship in the same link that the AC used -

    http://www.google.cn/search?hl=zh-CN&q=censorship& btnG=%E6%90%9C%E7%B4%A2%E5%9B%BE%E7%89%87&ie=UTF-8 &oe=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=iw [google.cn]

    I saw links to Wiki with full articles on censorship in the ROC. Would this work if searched while located in Bejing or anywhere else in the ROC? My guess is no. Other hardware filters are in place.
  • by ackthpt (218170) * on Tuesday October 31, 2006 @01:25PM (#16660341) Homepage Journal

    Despite the fact that many outside of China know that it indeed does exist, this piece of news is more likely intended for those within China.

    No kidding. I've met people recently from China and they don't know where we all get off on these things. They claim there are any number of small newspapers and such all over the place. They also think we tend to make a bigger deal of things than we ought and their country is just fine thank you very much.

    Of course, if you grew up never knowing otherwise or thinking outside the box someone has constructed around you, you may be so indoctrinated. Same way Brits appear indoctrinated that they must read in the Sun or News of the World what trollop David Beckham is frollicking around Spain with or Americans feel the overwhelming urge to tell others how they ought to live and behave.

    Those friends and colleagues listening to the BBC webcast, since we don't know otherwise, may be checking for new words or topics they need to add to their filters.

    However you shake it up, China is in for a bit of adjustment when the 2008 Olympics bring people from all over the world into China where they will be expecting access to news and media as they had at home. Perhaps China has already thought of this and is constructing exclusion zones...

  • Four Words (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Yvanhoe (564877) on Tuesday October 31, 2006 @01:39PM (#16660593) Journal
    Tien Anmen Google Images
  • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday October 31, 2006 @01:50PM (#16660789)
    #dig news.bbc.co.uk ;ANSWER SECTION:
    news.bbc.co.uk. 900 IN CNAME newswww.bbc.net.uk.
    newswww.bbc.net.uk. 300 IN A 212.58.240.41 ;AUTHORITY SECTION:
    bbc.net.uk. 172799 IN NS ns0.thny.bbc.co.uk.
    bbc.net.uk. 172799 IN NS ns0.thdo.bbc.co.uk. ;ADDITIONAL SECTION:
    ns0.thdo.bbc.co.uk. 86399 IN A 212.58.224.20
    ns0.thny.bbc.co.uk. 86399 IN A 212.58.240.20

    tcpdump -i rl0 -vv host 212.58.240.41
    tcpdump: listening on rl0, link-type EN10MB (Ethernet), capture size 96 bytes
    01:41:45.567427 IP (tos 0x0, ttl 64, id 54513, offset 0, flags [DF], length: 64) me.64964 > newswww1.thny.bbc.co.uk.http: S [tcp sum ok] 2997578910:2997578910(0) win 65535 <mss 1460,nop,nop,sackOK,nop,wscale 1,nop,nop,timestamp 43747691 0> ...

    01:42:19.758192 IP (tos 0x0, ttl 64, id 54599, offset 0, flags [DF], length: 48) me.64964 > newswww1.thny.bbc.co.uk.http: S [tcp sum ok] 2997578910:2997578910(0) win 65535 <mss 1460,nop,nop,sackOK>

    # mtr 212.58.240.41

      Host
      1. x.x.x.x
      2. ???
      3. to.cl.os.se
      4. 222.72.245.33
      5. 218.1.1.150
      6. 61.152.86.18
      7. ???

    sorry had to trim off stuff to bypass the lame filter
  • by erikdalen (99500) <erik.dalen@mensa.se> on Tuesday October 31, 2006 @02:38PM (#16661731) Homepage
    Here's some proof that it exists:

    First open Baidupedia ( a Chinese wikipedia clone): http://baike.baidu.com/ [baidu.com]

    Then try to search on some censored word like: (falun gong)

    You should now get a "Connection reset by peer" message

    Now you won't be able to access any page on that server for at least 30 minutes.
  • by Ancient_Hacker (751168) on Tuesday October 31, 2006 @02:54PM (#16662059)
    I found a source on Google News:

      I worked in a repair shop with some old timers during the early 80's. One day,
    a customer brought in a set that didn't work on the SW bands. The old-timer in
    the shop found a snipped coil and had the set fixed in a matter of minutes.

    I asked him how he found the problem so fast. He told me he had disabled the SW
    bands in that same set 40 years earlier! He further explained that all the
    repair shops had been under government directive to disable SW reception in any
    set brought in (by a foreign national) for repair. Our government apparently
    thought it could minimize espionage in this manner.

    In the following couple of years, I fixed no less than a dozen sets that had
    been disabled in the same manner. Several of those still had the "serviced by"
    sticker from the same shop on the back. And I have a few in my collection that
    have been fixed for the same ailment.

    Terry

  • by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday October 31, 2006 @03:02PM (#16662195)
    ust as Bush/Cheney "don't torture" ?

    The difference is we know that's a lie, and pointing out that it's a lie won't get you thrown in prison.


    you forgot to add: yet.
  • by ryry (198300) on Tuesday October 31, 2006 @03:06PM (#16662267) Homepage
    Best quote from the Chinese gov't official:

    "Some people say that there are journalists in China that have been arrested. We have hundreds of journalists in China, and some of them have legal problems. It has nothing to do with freedom of expression."

    Yeah, I'd say being imprisoned is a pretty big legal problem ...
  • by deinol (210478) on Tuesday October 31, 2006 @03:10PM (#16662339) Homepage
    In any case, take care not to equate 'invasion' with 'immoral'. An invasion can be moral, depending on who the target is and what the invader's goals and methods are.

    I must tactfully disagree. The only wars I believe have moral justification were nations coming to the defense of another nation being invaded. Example, liberating France during WWII. If only we'd started earlier before they got to France, but that's another matter.

    In every case I can think of, an invading army is just a misuse of power.
  • by pestilence669 (823950) on Tuesday October 31, 2006 @04:09PM (#16663377)
    I happened to work at a company who's primary mission was to liberate the Chinese from their firewall. I believe the motivation was to encourage promote democracy through free speech. It was backed by some pretty influential agencies. Our products worked using a special blend of encryption and peer-to-peer redirection to provide anonymous Internet access.

    Using our software: every site in China works as expected. Without our software: all censored sites are blocked.

    To say the great firewall doesn't exist is an outright lie.
  • Re:Equivilence (Score:3, Interesting)

    by 14CharUsername (972311) on Tuesday October 31, 2006 @05:01PM (#16664227)

    There are two great books on dystopias: 1984 and Brave New World. In 1984 the government controlled all information. People weren't allowed to know what was going on.

    In Brave New World the government was much more subtle. With the use of drugs, orgies, and entertainment the government made it so nobody cared about what was going on.

    To control a population you use fear and apathy. Now the fact that the West uses apathy to control its population more than the Chinese who use fear more, doesn't mean we aren't being controlled. As the middle class grows in China they will become more apathetic and the Ruling class won't need to use as much fear to keep the population in line.

    The US is no better or worse than the Chinese government. The US is so apathetic that there are no student uprisings for the government to suppress. Now Iraq, on the other hand... well compare what you see on You tube to what you see on CNN and Fox News. Yes, they are allowed to report on Tienanmen-level events in Iraq, but they don't. Most people just don't want to see that, so the media doesn't show it.

    Apathy.

  • by Com2Kid (142006) <com2kidSPAMLESS@gmail.com> on Tuesday October 31, 2006 @07:45PM (#16666465) Homepage Journal

    It's too horific to describe some of the things that have happened to women who've had the misfortune to have gotten pregnant after having a child,


    More proof that people are stupid.

    When the repercussions of getting pregnant a second time are made BLATENTLY OBVIOUS, anyone who still goes and purposefully[1] gets pregnant a second time is an idiot.

    If people were not so stupid, many less problems would exist!

    An example of further stupidity:


    Furthermore, it is the U.S. government's view that the right to "found a family" is protected under the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.


    Eating is also a fundamental right, and I'd say it sure as hell trumps the right to have more children!

    Or to put it more bluntly:

    Idiots having kids --> Others starving

    [1]: If a woman is raped, simply kill the accused rapist, let said woman have the baby. Unfortunately humans are such absolute pricks that women would lie and say that they got raped, just to have another baby....

    Pricks ruin it for everyone.

Reference the NULL within NULL, it is the gateway to all wizardry.

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