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EU Considering Regulating Video Bloggers 351

Aglassis writes to tell us that recent proposed EU legislation could require anyone running a website featuring video content to acquire a broadcast license. From the article: "Personal websites would have to be licensed as a "television-like service". Once again the reasoning behind such legislation is said to be in order to set minimum standards on areas such as hate speech and the protection of children. In reality this directive would do nothing to protect children or prevent hate speech - unless you judge protecting children to be denying them access to anything that is not government regulated or you assume hate speech to be the criticism of government actions and policy."
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EU Considering Regulating Video Bloggers

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  • by viniosity ( 592905 ) on Tuesday October 17, 2006 @09:33PM (#16479471) Homepage Journal
    Another question is: should this work? I am not a historian, but wasn't the whole point of broadcast licenses to prevent frequency interference? Is that really relevant with the way things work on the Internet today?
  • On the up-side (Score:4, Interesting)

    by atomicstrawberry ( 955148 ) on Tuesday October 17, 2006 @09:33PM (#16479475)
    TFA is actually about the UK government trying to prevent this directive from being passed, so the whole world hasn't quite gone insane yet.

    On another note, it seems very interesting, timing-wise, that this would come up so soon after Google acquires Youtube.
  • How? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by TVmisGuided ( 151197 ) <alan...jump@@@gmail...com> on Tuesday October 17, 2006 @09:50PM (#16479647) Homepage

    Enforcement is going to be the pain here...are they going to go after hosting services that aren't located in any EU country? Or just after the originator of the material? Or the person holding the domain registration?

    Unenforceable laws do nothing but weaken the entire legal system, and it doesn't matter what nation or group of nations sets the law up. My advice, unasked: don't bother. 'Nuff said.

  • Re:Taxman! (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Zarniwoop_Editor ( 791568 ) on Tuesday October 17, 2006 @09:51PM (#16479653) Homepage
    I think George Orwell may just have been before his time...
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thoughtcrime [wikipedia.org]
    Next thing you know I'll need a licence before I can hum a tune in my head.
    They can have my videoblog when they pry it from my cold dead server. ;-)


  • by MoralHazard ( 447833 ) on Tuesday October 17, 2006 @09:55PM (#16479693)
    Today, it will also be used to justify modding down this post. Tomorrow, it will be used against you to place you in prison.

    I don't think that's necessarily true, historically. Look at the history of free speech in the United States: in the last century, we've seen net progress in the scope of what people can say and write without fear of government interference. The obvious example that comes to mind is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Sanger [wikipedia.org]

    Which is not to say that we shouldn't be vigilant about our rights--support the ACLU, and don't vote for Joe Lieberman.
  • Flash (Score:3, Interesting)

    by eurleif ( 613257 ) on Tuesday October 17, 2006 @10:24PM (#16479947)
    Would Flash animations (and animated GIFs, for that matter) be regulated too? I don't see any reason why they wouldn't be (cartoon boobies -- won't someone please think of the children!), but it seems like that type of regulation would be even more upsetting to the general population than one on live action video. 'What, you mean I can't watch H*R when I'm supposed to be working anymore?!'
  • by ScentCone ( 795499 ) on Tuesday October 17, 2006 @10:30PM (#16480007)
    If this directive passes, it will severely restrict freedom of speech and expression among deaf sign language users. In the past year or so, sign language videos and video blogs have exploded in popularity and are well on their way to become the primary means of sharing information across the Internet among the deaf.

    I have no numbers to go on here, but... SURELY the written word continues to be the primary way that deaf people communicate online? IMs, e-mail, and web content? I have a hard time imagining that people would rather fire up the webcame and sign at each other to send an asynchronous message to someone ... in the same way that increasingly FEWER non-deaf people that I know are more likely to drop a TXT message or an e-mail than they are to pick up the phone.
  • by Gryle ( 933382 ) on Tuesday October 17, 2006 @10:37PM (#16480089)
    I'm on a first name basis with one of the librarians at the local public library. In light of Banned Books Week [ala.org], we were discussing censorship. He noted that the USA has some of the best anti-censorship laws in the world*, both in strength and legal firmament.


    *public schools notwithstanding
  • by Krischi ( 61667 ) on Tuesday October 17, 2006 @10:42PM (#16480125) Homepage

    Yes, a lot of people prefer firing up their webcam or their videophone over textual communication, often for similar reasons why hearing people prefer the phone, but not limited to these.

    Also, there are a lot of deaf people who feel far more comfortable with signed languages than with written text. Sadly, literacy is still a big, and contentious, issue in deaf education.

    Several examples to back up my point:

    • In the USA, Internet-based videophones and video relay services have almost completely displaced text telephones, and are preferred over IM for interactive communication.
    • In Sweden and Denmark, the G3 mobile standard is offered at a very low cost to the deaf population. Deaf people use their cell phones to communicate with each other all the time, despite the fact that framerates still suck, albeit less so than in the USA.
    • There has been high demand for allowing video content in deaf-oriented discussion forums.
    • Vblogs are getting hammered like crazy with the turmoil going on at Gallaudet University
  • by O'Laochdha ( 962474 ) on Tuesday October 17, 2006 @10:46PM (#16480153) Journal
    A few nitpicks.

    1: We don't lose the right to habeas corpus. You do. An enemy combatant - which can be anyone - can be put in prison indefinitely, and subjected to any act that does not meet a very narrow definition of torture. Habeas copus is an option if and only if the person is a US Citizen. The theory is that anyone else is essentially an enemy soldier, and doesn't deserve it.

    2: Habeas corpus is actually in the original Constitution, not the Bill of Rights (the first ten amendments). As for the Bill of Rights, freedom of religion and petition are still intact. The right to bear arms was already long gone. The one you got is fine. The freedom from search and seizure is gone as such, but you can still have gay sex! No double jeopardy or self-incrimination, although due process is out. No public trial. Excessive bail is still illegal...but you can be tortured. The last two are procedural and basically forgotten...man, this is depressing.

    3: Ben Franklin was never President. He just wrote a lot of books.

    4: I lost all faith in the EU when they started imposing fines for advertising in Imperial measures. For the man on the street, that's worse than what the US is doing. This is even worse.
  • Re:Not a Bad Idea (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Slithe ( 894946 ) on Wednesday October 18, 2006 @12:41AM (#16480915) Homepage Journal
    the whole EU thing is starting to get a bit silly - the EU is not a country (and if it ever looks to become a federation in the way the US is blood will be spilled first(not because the US is bad but because I like my country just fine as it is)) and we don't all use the the Euro either. There are some aspects of law that are handled by the EU but on a whole it is still national law that is important, except for transnational issues within the EU area (and i have no objection to international law either)
    You might want to take a look at the Wikipedia article on the Articles of Confederation [wikipedia.org] to see how the U.S.A. progressed from a confederation to a republic. If you are a citizen in an EU member state and are opposed to unification, you might see some interesting (and scary) parallels.
  • by TubeSteak ( 669689 ) on Wednesday October 18, 2006 @01:43AM (#16481259) Journal
    The stuff having to do with foul language and whatnot was a nice side benefit- after all you can't let people curse on the airwaves if they are public, can you?
    The United States is still carrying a lot of repressed (sexual) baggage from its upbringing in a Protestant/Puritan dominated society.

    The U.S. is in good company, if you compare the FCC's treatment of sexuality & language on television with that of various second & third world theocracies.

    Religious Fundamentalists are essentially the same everywhere.
  • by Paua Fritter ( 448250 ) on Wednesday October 18, 2006 @06:56AM (#16482645)
    ``On the basis of secret "evidence" (oxymoronic - secrets are by definition not "evident"), Guantanamo inmates were held in pretty ugly conditions, for years. Shackled, abused, some of them literally beaten to death. Some of them despaired and committed suicide. They are denied the basic human right to justice which the US constitution supposedly guaranteed.'' ...to Americans. I don't think the US constitution says anything about the right of non-citizens. I could be wrong, of course.

    You could indeed, and I am pretty sure you are. See there's Amendment 6 which says:

    In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, [...] to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the assistance of counsel for his defense.

    See it just says "the accused", not "the accused, so long as they're American". There's also this other article "Amendment 5", which says:

    No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person [...] be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law

    Again, "no person" is pretty clear. That's not "no American citizen" - it's "no person". This is no accident, you know - the founders of the US were firm believers in human rights; their ideology was firmly based on the absolute equality of individuals. This constitution, as it makes clear in Amendment 9 and 10, does not purport to "grant" rights to citizens - on the contrary, people's rights are held to be innate, or at least gifts of God, not the Federal Government; indeed, rather than granting those rights, the constitution purports instead to circumscribe the ability of the State to put limits on those human rights.

    The American Declaration of Independence is a beauty in this regard too. I don't know if it has any legal status in the US, but as a historical document it contains some real pearls, such as this bit:

    We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

    ... but especially in its detailed denunciations of the crimes of King George, such as:

    He has affected to render the Military independent of and superior to the Civil power.

    Can you say "designated enemy combatant"?

    George's other crimes included:

    ...giving his Assent to their Acts of pretended Legislation: [...]

    For depriving us, in many cases, of the benefits of Trial by Jury:

    For transporting us beyond Seas to be tried for pretended offences:

    For abolishing the free System of English Laws in a neighbouring Province, establishing therein an Arbitrary government, and enlarging its Boundaries so as to render it at once an example and fit instrument for introducing the same absolute rule into these Colonies

    Would that be Guantanamo?

  • by some guy I know ( 229718 ) on Wednesday October 18, 2006 @08:12AM (#16483003) Homepage
    To add to the parent post, there are a very few places in the US Constitution where citizenship (or something equivalent thereto) is explicitly mentioned (e.g., who can run for US President, etc.), which is an even stronger argument that those places in the US Constitution that do not explicitly mention citizenship are therefore meant to apply equally to all people, citizens and non-citizens alike.
  • Re:Taxman! (Score:3, Interesting)

    by coastwalker ( 307620 ) <acoastwalker@[ ]mail.com ['hot' in gap]> on Wednesday October 18, 2006 @08:22AM (#16483085) Homepage
    Agreed, the issue in the UK at the moment is the sudden realization that we are being taxed to death by stealth taxes.

    37% of our income is taken in taxes on average, which may be acceptable to pay for free health care and a decent society. What is not acceptable is that new ways of collecting revenue are being dreamed up every day. If you want to regulate hate speech then put the perpetrators in jail, don't impose yet another tax collection scheme and jail those who don't get the paperwork right.

    I'm heartily sick of state sponsored scrounging that this represents which is entirely different to tax breaks for families on minimum wage with children to bring up. The state is growing fat and lazy.
  • by Tim C ( 15259 ) on Wednesday October 18, 2006 @09:05AM (#16483555)
    It is bigoted, xenophobic, possibly nationalistic

    And, speaking as a UKian who has always thought of the UK as being part of Europe, really rather funny. There's also more than a grain of truth in it; England and France, for example, were at war with one another on and off for centuries. Pretty much every European country has invaded at least one of its neighbours at some point.
  • Time to wake up... (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday October 18, 2006 @09:38AM (#16483947)
    It is long past time to get off the RegulatedNet(c) and become active in anoNet [anonet.org]. Hell for that matter there is i2p [i2p.net] (I just happen to be more active on anoNet since it is a full ipv4/ipv6 network).

    The fact of the matter is, EVERY day they add one more reason to hide and conceal everything you do.

  • by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday October 18, 2006 @10:11AM (#16484393)
    The president can legally just pick up the phone and "designate" you, and you can be "disappeared". What's to prevent abuse?

    Please don't take this comment as an insult - it is intended to help provide some perspective. It's important to recognize when you're starting to go past the fringes in paranoia thinking. One of the greater challenges for intelligent people is dealing with unreliable information. Whom do we trust? How do we know what they say is true? More fundamentally, how do we define truth? How can we even ever know it?

    All tough issues that ultimately resolve to "faith" - yes, an ugly word for some, but if it bothers you, take it in its non-religious definition. You're left to make assumptions in incomplete and often highly inaccurate and imprecise information.

    What helps balance this out is expanding your data set through historical comparison, and using other tools like empathy and alternate solution finding. Considering the above example of "Bush secret torture hitler" delusion:

    - Empathy and alternate solution seeking: What would you do as an alternative? The options are pretty limited. Put them into the criminal justice system where intelligence data cannot be provided and they end up walking the streets in the US? No alternate suggestion has shown any viability when the goals are obtaining intelligence information to protect innocents and then hold the bad guys until their own nations will take them back (which all are refusing to do because they know their "court system" model will end up releasing the terrorists back on their own streets).

    - National Comparison: Has the EU or any other Western nation ever treated terrorists in the criminal justice matter? Of course not - not the threatening ones. France has former colonys to help "disappear" the real bad guys. So does the UK. Turkey, the western-most Islamic nation? They openly torture you and help you expire. Dead bodies don't pose any further threat. And what about the rest of the world? China's known for their execution bus fleet, Indonesia and Malaysia execute you for minor drug possession, so forget about mercy for terrorists. You're a fool if you believe Guantanamo is such a bad place - it's in the top percent of Western nations for handling this kind of prisoner, and you cannot even imagine what the rest of the nations do.

    - Historical Comparison: FDR disappeared tens of thousands of Americans - Germans, Japanese, etc. My kids school just had a German internment camp visiting exhibit come by as they were predominant around our part of the country. They were slaves for the war - forced to work in the camps and had their liberties removed. Many were snatched up without notice, and all received no due process. Once the war was done, they were released back into society. Evil? The greatest Democratic president did this. Clinton used Syria and Egypt to interrogate terrorists and this practice existed since the cold war began. France, Germany, Italy and the UK are insincere when they feign moral disgust - look at their own behavior in their colonies for the answer.

    So yes, reality's a bitch, but don't go down the paranoia path. There have always been evil SOBs, and there always will be. The hard part is you have to decide on incompete information.
  • Jose Padilla (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Kadin2048 ( 468275 ) <.ten.yxox. .ta. .nidak.todhsals.> on Wednesday October 18, 2006 @12:53PM (#16487723) Homepage Journal
    Jose Padilla was the Administration's experiment in applying their legal reasoning to U.S. citizens.

    It failed. The courts correctly shot them down, and right before the USSC was going to rule against them, the Executive branch basically gave up and remanded him to Federal prison for conventional (civilian) charges.

    I don't think that case supports your argument very well; it seems to me that it is an example of the court system functioning correctly. The Executive branch overstepped, the Judicial branch stepped in and said (or was about to say) 'no way,' and as a result he got sent to Federal prison. Since then, the Bush administration has basically given up on that strategy and has been dealing with U.S. citizens through the conventional court system -- for example, there's Adam Yahiye Gadahn (who was recently indicted for treason in civilian court, by a Grand Jury). One branch of government attempted something that would have been illegal, they were stopped by another branch, and now they're doing it (more) legally.

    Seems like the system worked the way it's supposed to: the courts have allowed the Executive branch to assert some authority over foreign detainees (implicit allowance; by declining to hear certain cases -- although they did reverse the Administration in certain respects), but stopped them when they began to do the same over citizens. You may disagree with this interpretation, but then your beef is really with the Federal and Supreme Court judiciary, not really with the Executive branch alone.

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