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Socializing For The Win? 128

Posted by Cliff from the i'll-drink-to-that dept.
The Living Fractal notes: "Yahoo! Business has an article about workplace socializing. Apparently, those who drink alcohol and socialize make more money on average." According to the article: "Regular drinkers make 10% to 14% more money than those who do not drink, according to the study, conducted by the Journal of Labor Research, published quarterly by the Department of Economics at George Mason University, and the Reason Foundation, a Los Angeles-based think tank." Fractal wonders: "This article spawns a few questions. Do those 'regular drinkers' end up spending that extra 10-14% on booze? Who here is a social drinker? Finally, have you noticed this in your workplace?"
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Socializing For The Win? More

Socializing For The Win?

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  • Sure, it may be easier to go and have a drink to catch up, but would someone who chose non-alcoholic drink when they socialised make less money? Would someone who drank alone at home make more money than someone who drank tea alone at home?

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by krotkruton ( 967718 )
      Ever notice how the kids who drank in high school tended to be the popular kids? Or was it that the popular kids tended to drink in high school...
      • You see, people who make more money and have more disposable income spend more money on going out to the bar than those that make less money.

        Clearly, alcohol and socializing cause you to make more money.

    • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

      by From A Far Away Land ( 930780 )
      I'd guess they find the same results studying workplace smokers. If they have a group to smoke with, and the boss or someone in power smokes, I'd guess they earn more. If they smoke alone, I'd say they probably earn less on average too.
      • None of them pay 10-14%!

        If you run with this set, you know how to take this on expenses. "Team building exercise". "Morale event". "Goal setting".

        "Don't worry... I'll have Geoff sign."

    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by robbkidd ( 154298 )
      This could be a misconstrued causation. While the article talked much about the benefit of socializing, it could be that since some folks are making 10%-14% more, they have more potentially-disposable income with which to buy alcohol.
  • Who in the company has the most opportunity to socialize and drink on the job? If you work in a normal office, most likely the managers and sales departments. It's part of their job to work with customers and engage them not only professionally but also socially. "Greasing the wheels" of business, so to speak.

    So you, in your little basement office with the desk pushed all the way to the wall, get to churn out KLOCs until your fingers cramp up with CTS for a fixed salary. They, in their windowed corner offices with lovely assistants and fresh flowers, meet with customers and hammer out deals over a fifth of Wild Turkey and get paid a commission of their generated revenue. When you get to selling million dollar contracts, those margins add up really fast.

    Yeah, no one told you life was going to be this way. Your job's a joke, you're broke, your love life's DOA. Shoulda studied management, eh?

    • So you, in your little basement office with the desk pushed all the way to the wall, get to churn out KLOCs until your fingers cramp up with CTS for a fixed salary. They, in their windowed corner offices with lovely assistants and fresh flowers, meet with customers and hammer out deals over a fifth of Wild Turkey and get paid a commission of their generated revenue. When you get to selling million dollar contracts, those margins add up really fast.

      Bitter much? Remember, sales people lose their job when the

      • On the contrary, I have the highest regard for salespeople. I don't have much regard for people who look down on them as if they don't contribute anything to the company or are simply overhead that helps sell engineering that would is so good it essentially sells itself.

        However, I would like to point out that in the typical small office, when a salesperson fails the whole company suffers and engineers can get laid off right along with an underperforming salesperson.

        • Re: (Score:1, Insightful)

          by deepb ( 981634 )

          However, I would like to point out that in the typical small office, when a salesperson fails the whole company suffers and engineers can get laid off right along with an underperforming salesperson.

          We could have this argument all day.. an underperforming sales person doesn't have a good product to sell because of the engineer, etc. Also, the reason why sales people have quarterly quotas is to avoid situations like the one you described. If the company only has one sales person, and can't suffer a bad quo

    • Re:It follows logically that drinkers would get mo (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Builder ( 103701 ) on Friday October 06, 2006 @04:56AM (#16333903)
      That's probably one of the most outdated bitter views I've ever read.

      Most 'execs' these days don't have assistants anymore. That role was killed to save money and now the role falls between them and their line managers. In the rare case where a PA does still exist, she's normally shared among 4+ execs.

      Just one last question - where would your job be without those deals and those sales? Ever think that maybe some people hate the whole sales process, but they do it anyway because it's their job? How much fun do you think it is for a woman being pawed by a customer and not being able to say anything because it would cost her the sale? How much fun do you think it is for a family man to have potential clients oggling women and behaving badly, and not be able to say anything about it because it would cost the sale?

      On the flip side, I've noticed that since not just going to work and going home, but staying around once or twice a month to socialise, my salary has increased by 30%. Just making contacts and networking is far more than learning some new technology.

      • Re:It follows logically that drinkers would get mo (Score:4, Insightful)

        by seasunset ( 469481 ) on Friday October 06, 2006 @06:24AM (#16334229) Homepage
        just one last question - where would your job be without those deals and those sales?
        Where would their job be if they had nothing to sell?
        Although I see your point, I think the main issue is to strike a balance between how rewards are distributed.
        And - my highly subjective view - generally sales makes more than their fare share of it.
        If, say, a coder makes something that has a high impact on company productivity he might go - probably - unnoticed. If a sales guy/gal makes a big sale, (s)he normally is a hero. That is, at least, what I tend to see.
        Disclaimer: I'm in the academics "business".

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by Bob9113 ( 14996 )
          If, say, a coder makes something that has a high impact on company productivity he might go - probably - unnoticed. If a sales guy/gal makes a big sale, (s)he normally is a hero. That is, at least, what I tend to see.

          There is one significant place where this is the opposite of the truth. The darling of the business world. Google. But it's all lip service. We talk about emulating Google at my corporation, but it always comes out as, "Lots of good ideas there - but we need more management control, and we can'

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by CAIMLAS ( 41445 )
          I agree with you, but... that's not the way the world works. (Understandable, as you're in academics, so I'll let it slide.)

          As a coder, it wouldn't matter if you spent your whole day finger-painitng on your basement cube wall - provided the sales team manages to sell their product image (NOT the product). In a slightly exagerated sense, it only matters that you're on payroll and they can say "we've got X number of programmers working on this project, it should be done by June!" or something like that.

          Yeah,

          • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

            by bob65 ( 590395 )

            that's not the way the world works. (Understandable, as you're in academics, so I'll let it slide.)

            I don't really understand why academics is somehow not "part of the real world". The people in academics are real people, making real money, so I don't see how being a professor is somehow a less-real career than being a sales manager. Professors have to fight for grants and funding, and work for pay just like any other employee. In fact, many times the funding for academic projects comes from industry. Poli

      • The problem is that 1) sales are directly measureable, 2) if the product is good, the job is easy but if the product is bad, the job is hard, and 3) they are the final stage that SEES the money. So they are in a good position to demand a per unit profit that is significant. If they work for a crappy company, then they deserve their huge paychecks. But if they work for a company with a product that literally sells itself, they get WAY overcompensated.

        The producers on the other hand are far down the pipe,

    • Thats it I'm getting an MBA on top of my IT bachelors.
    • Even though you are bitter, you do have a point. The claim is that drinkers make more money. Perhaps its the other way around, people who make more money can afford to drink and socialize more. Of course this socialization can ultimately make them part of the "good old boy" network and get them more money. But I think it all starts with being of the upper class in the first place.
    • "Yeah, no one told you life was going to be this way. Your job's a joke, you're broke, your love life's DOA."
      You just quoted the Friends' theme song....and people replied to you like there wasn't something horribly wrong with your post. What is going on here???
    • Yeah, no one told you life was going to be this way. Your job's a joke, you're broke, your love life's DOA. Shoulda studied management, eh?

      I think I liked the original version of that song better. This one doesn't even rhyme right...

  • A non drinker (Score:5, Interesting)

    by andy753421 ( 850820 ) on Friday October 06, 2006 @01:48AM (#16333045) Homepage
    Perhaps theres just as much of a correlation between non drinking and making less money. As a college student who doesn't drink I also don't feel that much of a need to get the highest paying job available. Once I get all these loans payed off it doesn't matter to me whether my car is brand new or 10 years old. Perhaps it has to do with a desire for worldly things, whether it's good times while drunk, or lots of money to buy stuff.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Kris_J ( 10111 ) *
      That's a good point. I also do not drink, and neither do I have any strong desire to agrue for a pay rise. There are times when I feel that I'm paid too much and times when I feel that I'm paid too little, but on the whole I don't really know what to do with most of the money I'm paid anyway.

      But I have noticed that my distaste for social events with a heavy emphasis on alcohol can put me behind the eight-ball when it comes to some office politics.

      • but on the whole I don't really know what to do with most of the money I'm paid anyway.

        I've got it. You could use it on fellow Slashdotters that, through no fault of their own, do not yet know the intimate wonders and secret joys of an HDTV. I could point you in the direction of a few.

        In all seriousness, though, if one has some extra money, there are some pretty financially safe things to do with it. Maybe a few CD accounts at a bank? Invest in some utilities? Treasury bonds? Even money in a van

        • Re: (Score:1, Offtopic)

          by cptgrudge ( 177113 )

          Bad form to reply to myself, but on second thought, utilities may not be a sure thing to invest money into in the wake of Enron. :-/

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by Kris_J ( 10111 ) *
          With rising medical costs, the coming collapse of (US) Social Security,
          I'm in Australia, so health insurance isn't really an issue. My bank account gives moderate interest, I have some shares. Really, I'm quite comfortable.
      • but on the whole I don't really know what to do with most of the money I'm paid anyway.


        Many people spend their money on things like bills, mortgage payments, and savings for when they lose their job. But maybe those things don't apply to you.

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by Kris_J ( 10111 ) *
          Yes, no, yes by default.

          Maybe it looks like I have more because I don't piss any of it away.

      • on the whole I don't really know what to do with most of the money I'm paid anyway.
        Well, I'm not proud, I'll accept any handouts you care to make. You can make it a standing order if you like.
      • Maybe then what you need to do is spend the next few hours getting totally trashed and then call your boss at about 1AM and argue for that pay raise.

    • Re: (Score:2, Flamebait)

      by QuantumG ( 50515 )
      non-drinker and single obviously.
    • As a college student, you probably don't even have an idea yet how much money things really cost. Once you are out of college, many things get more expensive FAST.

      - you don't want to live in a student hall forever
      - you realize that you need some savings for retirement
      - you don't want to call daddy if you need a new computer
      - health insurance is much more expensive (students get special rates where I live)
      - girl friend and family planning cost money
      - jobs suck, so you might consider having your own company.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by mgblst ( 80109 )
      I don't see what this has to do with whether or not you drink. You maybe looking down on your high horse, and thinking that us drinkers are running around looking for more money to through down our throats.

      And you are a college students, we all felt like that back in the day. Then the real world hits, and when your low paying job sucks just as much as the high paying one, what are you going to do?

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by elrous0 ( 869638 ) *
      As a college student who doesn't drink

      No offense man, but what a waste. Wish I had a nickel for everyone who kicked themselves later in life for the fun they didn't have when they had the chance.

      -Eric

      • Maybe he doesn't drink because he doesn't enjoy it? I didn't do much partying in college either, because I'm very introverted and I simply don't enjoy large social gatherings (big frat parties, bars, etc..). Now if I never tried to go out and party while I was in college, I might be kicking myself now but I made an effort to go out and have fun like everyone else and it just wasn't my thing.

        • As a college student who doesn't drink

          ...what a waste. Wish I had a nickel for everyone who kicked themselves later in life for the fun they didn't have...

          Maybe he doesn't drink because he doesn't enjoy it?

          Lot's of college kids now are pretty much abstainers. It's not like when I was in college. Now for fun, they bike and kayak and start million dollar web businesses. Crazy kids.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Y2 ( 733949 )

        As a college student who doesn't drink

        No offense man, but what a waste. Wish I had a nickel for everyone who kicked themselves later in life for the fun they didn't have when they had the chance.

        Actually, if I had it to do over again I would opt for about 25% less fun and a bit more focus on the work. Not that things turned out badly; I graduated with honors and a double major. It just seems so inefficient in retrospect. Much better qualities of fun are available once one has the long green rolling in.

    • What the heck? What makes you think there's a connection between minimalism and whether somebody drinks?

      I know a drinker who lives in a small, mostly-empty, apartment and drives a 10-year-old (but reliable) car even though we both have the same job and he could easily afford a house, or a bigger apartment, and car payments.

      I also know more than a couple non-drinkers who seem to buy new pickup trucks every couple months and live in a huge house with a plasma TV.

      I'd like to see some evidence of a link betwee

  • How did you think the world worked? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by QuantumG ( 50515 ) <qg@biodome.org> on Friday October 06, 2006 @01:55AM (#16333099) Homepage Journal
    Of course the boss' drinking buddy gets the corner office. You didn't actually think that people get promoted because of their good performance did you? If anything, it's the other way around, the bad performers get promoted so they can do less harm.

    • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

      by BadAnalogyGuy ( 945258 )
      That assumes that those doing the promoting are sufficiently capable to spot where someone is performing badly and promote them to protect the company.

      If you're not willing to assume that those who are getting promoted are promoted for their ability, you can't assume that management has the ability to sense the harm that an underperforming individual does. They are those underperforming individuals in your scenario!

      Or you can assume that that's just a funny saying that's written about every day in Dilbert c
    • If anything, it's the other way around, the bad performers get promoted so they can do less harm.


      Of course, if Dilbert says so it must be true. It's not just something that the bottom-rung workers say to themselves to make them feel better about their own lack of progress...
      • It's not exactly promotion, but my brother is experimenting the same thing in the administration he works for.
        He is a IT worker currently in an administrative role, working with a lazy beanworker and recently, an real IT job opened in the next service so they both asked to move to that position.
        Guess which one their boss proposed to go to that other service (hint: guess which one he wanted to keep in his team): the guy who knows computers and is doing decently on his job although it is not the one he learne

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Aladrin ( 926209 )
        There are 2 ways to get rid of someone: Fire them or promote them. This is not a Dilbert-ism, but reality. Sometimes it's just easier to promote someone out of your area and into an area that they aren't competant enough to handle, and they can be fired from there.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by orasio ( 188021 )
        Dilbert is a friend of the BSA. For all that I care, he is dead to me.

  • I drink alone (Score:4, Funny)

    by slorge ( 722786 ) <slorge@gmaWELTYil.com minus author> on Friday October 06, 2006 @01:59AM (#16333113) Homepage
    Well, the other night I got invited to a party, But I stayed home instead. Just me and my pal Johnny Walker, And his brothers Black and Red. And we drank alone, yeah, with nobody else. We drank alone, yeah, with nobody else. Yeah, you know when I drink alone, I prefer to be by myself.

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by maxume ( 22995 )
      I too prefer to drink alone, but it never works out. When it isn't disembodied voices, it's dead relatives, talking cats or that damn monkey.

  • I myself am a wine drinker, but I have never sat and had a glass of wine with a coworker. I do socialize a fair amount with my coworkers while at work, and some of us go out to lunch as a group, but no alcohol is served (mainly because it is against policy).

    Then again, I work in advertising (I'm a graphic artist/web developer). I hang out with sales people a fair amount, and we all know sales people tend to be a bit off the statistical rocker.. :P

  • Bullshit (Score:5, Funny)

    by mqduck ( 232646 ) <(ten.kcudqm) (ta) (kcudqm)> on Friday October 06, 2006 @02:03AM (#16333141)
    I spend all day drinking and never make a cent.

    • Re: (Score:1, Funny)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Sounds like my boss.

      *rimshot*
  • get trashed and tell their boss what they really think... about the boss' daughter. She's hot, it should be a complement, but no, mr. 40oz and my tuckus get dumped on the curb to pour some out for the newly deceased homie; my job.

    Sure, good things come out of a relaxed social environment, but so do horrible things... pros and cons to be weighed carefully.
    • Seriously, I actually did that once. It was a minimum wage job and I was a few months away from a better job, so I didn't really care that I lost it. She introduced me to her daughter afterwards though, which was both wierd AND rewarding.
  • I think 90% of decisions get taken in the smoking rooms, and the networking chances are also high as everyone from the lowliest pleb to the top management drop by for a ciggie.

    The other 10% of the decisions get made over drinks and more ciggies, I suspect...

    • Re:Where I work, it's the smokers! (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Procyon101 ( 61366 ) on Friday October 06, 2006 @03:45AM (#16333569) Journal
      Yes. As a former smoker, I will hang out with the smokers anyday,

      I have seen company's fold in the parking lot over cigarettes and seen people get rich on IPO's during the same. The big decisions are often made in the smoking room rather than the board room. It's a weird little club.
    • Absolutely true.

      When I was with the Ohio National Guard, I was trained as a Photographer/Videographer (25V, for anyone who wants to know). One of the Infantry units in the state was going to spend 2 weeks in England, training with the QLR (Queen's Lancashire Regiment, their version of the Nat. Guard). I was, naturally, doing a job that had nothing to do with my training.

      While taking a smoke break, I overheard a General and a Major discussing how they would love to have someone to go and document the t

  • Drink! (Score:3, Interesting)

    by delirium of disorder ( 701392 ) on Friday October 06, 2006 @02:31AM (#16333283) Homepage Journal
    Here's to wealth! [google.com] So maybe alcohol is key to success in mainstream business, but it looks like acid [wikipedia.org] is the drug for you if you want to make it in the tech industry.
  • Perhaps those that make money then begin drinking socially, rather than the other way around.
  • Managers always drink on the job and have more then to talk then normal workers. ;)

  • chicken, meet egg (Score:4, Insightful)

    by JanneM ( 7445 ) on Friday October 06, 2006 @03:26AM (#16333501) Homepage
    Correlation is not causality. There's three factors here: drinking or not, being social or not, and making more or not.

    Are you making more because you're being social? It would not be surprising - if you're social you have a greater contact network, and you make a better early impression, so you'll tend to end up in better (higher paying) positions over time.

    Are you social because you make more money? Perhaps to a small degree (don't discount it entirely), but on the face of it it should not be nearly as strong an effect as the opposite - and you can argue that with money comes power and there's no need to be nice anymore so you'd be just as likely to become less social instead.

    Do you drink because you're social? Quite probably. Being social means getting along with people, and that includes spending time with people and doing what they do. And not infrequently social gatherings include drinking.

    On the hand, does drink promote sociality? Yes, it does. For most people, moderate amounts does loosen inhibitions and relax the mind, making alcohol the renowned social grease it is.

    So you can argue that if you're more social you make more. And you become more social by drinking, and if you're more social you're more likely to drink as well.

    I don't think anybody would seriously try to argue that alcohol directly is connected to earning power. I'd like to hear a coherent argument in favour though.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by gold23 ( 44621 )
      I don't think anybody would seriously try to argue that alcohol directly is connected to earning power. I'd like to hear a coherent argument in favour though.

      Sorry, I'm too drunk to argue coherently. If you ever need incoherent rambling, however, I'm your man.

    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by ozmanjusri ( 601766 )
      I'd like to hear a coherent argument in favour though.

      I drink with my boss, and get out my camera when the boss is incoherent. The next day we have a brief discussion about company expectations, goats and instant custard.

      I get a pay rise.

      Regards,
      BOFH.

    • If you're right (and I think you probably are), then I guess that how much you earn is less correlated with how much you drink, it's more correlated with how much you engage in social activity - and the forms of social activity will vary from culture to culture. It would be interesting, for example, to see whether these results hold in places where alcohol consumption is supposedly frowned upon (like Utah or Saudi Arabia).

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Aladrin ( 926209 )
      I think another aspect of the social bit is that if you are social, you are much more easily noticed and remembered. People pay attention to what you do, on and off the clock, and you are remembered when a new position comes open. If you aren't seen and simply quietly do your work, it's very easy to forget you.

      I know, because I'm the second example in most jobs. Luckily, the company that I'm in now is small enough that it's impossible to hide.

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by kfg ( 145172 ) *
      I don't think anybody would seriously try to argue that alcohol directly is connected to earning power. I'd like to hear a coherent argument in favour though.

      Rob Walker, scion of the Johnnie Walker family and Formual 1 empresario, used to list his profession on official documents (including his passport) as "Gentleman." He used the term in a technical sense; one who has sufficient money that he doesn't need to sully his hands with money, other people both providing and spending it for him on his behalf.

      Of
    • "Being social means getting along with people, and that includes . . . doing what they do."

      You were correct with your statement up until that last point. Being a social person does not mean you have to do what other people do. Believing that you must do what other people do because it makes you a social person is a form of self-inflicted peer pressure.

      In short, there is a not-so-subtle difference between being anti-social, a social conformist and a social independent.
    • The mechanism that might be driving what people think might be happening is as follows:

      Nerds, by definition, are social outcasts and often display the body langauge of a nervous creature. Often the persons who are making the decisions about who gets hired and how much they get paid are people who see this nervousness as a sign of weakness and therefore assume the dominant role in this Employer/Prospective Employee relationship.

      If the prospective employee is a nerd then it is likely that they have

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by CAIMLAS ( 41445 )
      It's kinda interesting, and somewhat related, so I'll mention it.

      Part of the reason I still smoke is because of hte network it provides. Where and when else can I freely converse with everyone from middle or upper managers, all the way down to the cleaning crew? (Having a company which has 'set smoke breaks' is nice, in this respect.)

      Granted, I might die 10 years earlier as a result, but I don't really give a fuck about that.
  • If I only spend 10-14% on alcohol, I'd feel rich. Does this count as my first step?

  • Who defines "social drinking" ? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by drsmithy ( 35869 ) <drsmithy&gmail,com> on Friday October 06, 2006 @05:50AM (#16334119)

    I mean, by Australian standards a "social drinker" is probably an alcoholic in America and a teetotaller in Ireland ;).

    On a more serious note, it's not hard to see why there would be a correleation between socialising and improved job performance. Even ignoring the obvious schmoozing and brown-nosing possibilities, if you socialise more with people from work, you're far more likely to know more about how the business works, its current problems (and successes) and modify your work habits appropriately to address the problems and/or act on the strengths, thus making you a greater asset to the business and more likely to be prompted/paid more.

    With that said, any attempts to attach a causative relationship between drinking and income is working on *very* shaky ground IMHO.

  • Backwards? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by AmiMoJo ( 196126 ) on Friday October 06, 2006 @06:22AM (#16334223) Homepage Journal
    I have seen this happen where I work, but isn't it a bit backwards?

    I hardly ever drink, so I turn up to work on time and am alert, ready to do my (complicated) job. One of the other guys turns up with a hangover, feeling really bad and spends most of the day sat in his chair reading email and Wikipedia. Yet, because he spends more time socialising with the boss, he gets more perks and money.

    Surely someone who is a reliable worker should be rewarded. I suppose it's a bit like how tall people tend to do better.
    • It's all about face time with the decision makers. You get face time, you get promoted. You don't get face time, you don't exist. Managers don't promote people they don't know about. If the company is doing well becuase there are a bunch of good workers in cubes working 7 to 5, there will always be a couple of personable, social [smokers/drinkers] that end up hanging with a few folks in management after hours (you know, while you're tending the family). Among the idle chit-chat, they're going to talk about

  • True Here... (Score:2, Interesting)

    by dintech ( 998802 )
    As a junior java developer for an investment bank in London I see there is certainly a drinking culture here. Its sort of team building to go out for a few pints with guys from work. Aside from that it can never hurt to mix with you managers and colleagues in any kind of social situation outside the office. Its just that drinking is the easiest one to do as there is a bar somewhere near every office here. If senior management know your face and have had a few laughs with you, they're more likely to respec

  • Strange conclusion... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by brucmack ( 572780 ) on Friday October 06, 2006 @06:48AM (#16334325)
    Apparently, those who drink alcohol and socialize make more money on average.

    Funny, I would have worded it differently:

    Those who make more money on average drink alcohol and socialize more.

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by TubeSteak ( 669689 )

      Those who make more money on average drink alcohol and socialize more.

      Have you seen the type of swill that poor people (with lots of free time on their hands) drink?

      I could easily make the argument that those who make less money will drink alcohol and socialize more. If you live near a relatively large city, go wander around and hang out with the alcoholic homeless people for a bit. They'll drink & socialize with you all day.

      Alcohol and cigarettes aren't exactly tangible goods. When prices go up, it is

      • I think what he was stating was that people who make more money tend to work longer hours and have more work related stress and therefore tend to self-medicate with alcohol more frequently in an attempt to alleviate that stress.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Sangui5 ( 12317 )

        It is the other way around. Let me tell a story...

        If you die, and somebody is responsible (say, negligence, or recklessness), then your next of kin are entitled to compensation for your death. There's the whole "pain & suffering" bit, which is quite abstract, but there are also economic losses. That is, you, being dead, are no longer being paid, and that is money out of their pockets. Figuring this out is dreary economics and statistics, but it is quite measurable, and well presented economic dama

      • Alcohol and cigarettes aren't exactly tangible goods

        tangible: capable of being perceived by the senses or the mind; especially capable of being handled or touched or felt

        So these homeless guys drink virtual alchohol and smoke virtual cigarettes?

  • Is drinking causes making more money
    or
    Is making money causes more drinking ?

    The study does not say what is causing what. Only that there is a correlation. I think that having more money makes it easier to have a drink, not the other way around.

  • Seems obvious. (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Lave ( 958216 ) * on Friday October 06, 2006 @07:28AM (#16334559)
    To get paid more you need to be promoted, and it's a fact of working life that to be promoted you need to be liked or at least known to those that do the promoting. It's a harsh fact, but a fact non-the-less, that if you only ever see someone behind there desk your not going to relate to them as much as the person you socialise after work with. And then when you get a choice to promote one or the other it isn't unfair to promote the one you *actually* know.
  • Socializing FTW!1!!

    It looks like the comments are making their way to the front page now...

    All the way from digg. (buries head)

  • "Yahoo! Business has an article about drinking. Apparently, those who make more money, drink alcohol and socialize more on average."

    It's shocking to think that people may actually not drink because they don't have the money for it, but you can't argue with Yahoo! They! are! very! serious! about! this!

  • Just because there's a correlation doesn't imply there's necessarily a direct cause/effect relationship. There are significant cultural differences between income brackets, and (assuming they did the study in North America) one of them is that the lower middle class income brackets do less moderate social drinking, possibly because they are closer to and more aware of the lower-class bracket, wherein drinking is mostly the province of boorish drunkards, whose habits and behavior are distasteful. Alcohol
  • On board ship, a lot of networking is done on the fantail/in the smokepit. Talking over rumors, ship's plans, who's doing what, letting your superiors bum cigarettes... It's the one place onboard that you really can interact socially with your chain of command. On shore, a lot of the same thing goes on during at after work gatherings at bars, though not as much as when I got into the Navy 20 years ago. Drinking isn't encouraged as it once was... We've come a long way from when I was chastised for not t
  • Perhaps people who make 10-14% more can afford to go out drinking with their cow orkers.


    Or people who bust their ass to make that 10-14% more have no social life outside work, therefore are more likely to socialize with coworkers.

  • Damn straight it does (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Lord_Dweomer ( 648696 ) on Friday October 06, 2006 @09:13AM (#16335299) Homepage
    It doesn't take a genious to figure out that the people who go out drinking, socializing and schmoozing get ahead. While it would be nice things were more merit based, the truth is that the majority of management spent their college days hitting the bars and making their friends over a pint. Some of that changed in the real world, but thats still where a lot of the connections are made, not at the office where people are more focused on getting work done.

    Getting your boss drunk tends to make them be more intimate with you (not in the sexual sense) and they feel they can trust you more. They trust you more, so they feel safe promoting you or giving you a raise.

    People hate the guy who doesn't do squat at the office yet is very charismatic and sociable and rises to the top. But what they don't realize is that being that sociable can actually be a lot of work. Especially across your entire network. You have to go out to lunch all the time to catch up with people...go to bars at night...throw get togethers...etc.

    For an introvert like me, that's a lot of friggin work. But you know what? I recognize that that is how the game is played, and I play it, and play it well. And it has rewarded me. So I guess there's that.

  • For example, did they control for gender or other sources of salary bias? Did they control for socializing but drinking seltzer?
  • > Apparently, those who drink alcohol and socialize make more money on average.

    Uh, I think you meant:

    "Apparently, those who make more money on average tend to drink alcohol and socialize."

    Using the original false logic, we could also say:

    Apparently, those who host huge parties at their mansions make more money on average. So y'all better go buy your dang mansions and throw a party if you want to make more money!
  • Their function is essentially alcohol-powered, and they generally make a LOT of money.
  • Let's see...
    * The asshat in the office who never does anything and sucks is less likely to come out with the co-workers.
    * The ones who go out probably enjoy the company & respect their coworkers.
    * The completion of a long hard won project, or extra hours slogging away at the office is usually celebrated by a few rounds at the local pub.

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