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An Interview with a Cheater 371

Posted by Zonk
from the live-and-learn dept.
Dan writes to mention a post at the Aeropause site. Author Richard was recently given the rare opportunity to interview a cheater, shining a light into the dark recesses of a conflicted mind. The article explores why the cheater cheats, and the great excuses they use to be able to look themselves in the mirror. From the article: "Aeropause: What made you decide to mod your Xbox to gain an unfair advantage in games like Halo 2? Schmuck5000: Modding is not an unfair advantage. There is just as much chance that there will be a modder on the other team. I am there to even things out. Halo 2 is beginning to get old, us modders are just making it more funner."
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An Interview with a Cheater

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  • by Kirin Fenrir (1001780) on Monday September 18, 2006 @12:20PM (#16130828)
    Cheaters never win. Okay, well, they always win, but that's what makes them losers.
    • by dourk (60585)
      Cheaters never lose, and losers never win.
    • by Anonymous Coward on Monday September 18, 2006 @02:07PM (#16131847)
      It is not a mystery. It is very simple. Our brains are the products of evolution in a competitive environment. In the good old days, the losers got eaten (or starved to death or what have you). So, those who used all their resources to give themselves every advantage they could tended to be the winners.

      We, therefore, are instinctually driven to use all resources available to us to give ourselves every advantage we can. Hence, the "temptation" to cheat is an ever-present behavioral drive.

      Good sportsmanship is an arbitrary social construct. There is nothing natural about it. It takes an act of self-denial to be a good sport, and to not cheat. Now, this may be ethically and socially superior...it may be the more enlightened path...but it is not natural and as such most people don't walk it.
      • by moro_666 (414422)
        From a Freudish point of view. The whole thing looks like a hoax, more like the interviewer has been just owned in a game times enough so his own bitterness his hitting out. Seriously, those imaginary questions which i doubt anyone answered at all (besides someones subconscious) are just so aggressive that any weak ass cheater would have hanged up the line.
        There isn't really a point in the whole thing, just someone is bitching on an imaginary cheater. It would however be interesting to see an inter
        • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

          by phulegart (997083)
          In games like Freelancer, what you suggest was done over and over again. Servers were set up so that those who wanted to mod their clients before connecting to gain an unfair advantage (disallowed weapons, faster ships, impervious hulls, etc) could do so and play al they wanted, with other modders /cheaters.

          It doesn't work.

          Apparently part of the modder/cheater mentality is not only to have an advantage over the other players, but to exploit that advantage in the FACE of those who are trying to play an hone
      • by misleb (129952) on Monday September 18, 2006 @05:19PM (#16133735)
        It is not a mystery. It is very simple. Our brains are the products of evolution in a competitive environment. In the good old days, the losers got eaten (or starved to death or what have you). So, those who used all their resources to give themselves every advantage they could tended to be the winners.


        Depends on what you mean by the "old days." Humans are social animals and always have been (as far as we know). Generally speaking, individuals cooporate in a social situation. It pays to play by the rules within the group (which may include *lawful* competition). In a group, you're more likely to be killed for "cheating" (theft, for example) than get a survival advantage. It is therefore the norm for humans to obey the rules of the social group. "Cheating" is a deviation... an aberation that ultimately hurts the stability of the social group.

        Cheating may, however, still be natural in the sense that it is an evolutionary carryover from a time when the animal that humans eventually evolved from was not social/cooporative. But as far as being human goes, it is not "natural."

        Good sportsmanship is an arbitrary social construct.

        Social contructs are no more or less arbitary than any other survival adaptation such as tool making. We make physical tools. We make social constructs. Same basic purpose: survival.

        -matthew

  • by Winckle (870180) <mark.winckle@co@uk> on Monday September 18, 2006 @12:20PM (#16130829) Homepage
    Halo 2 is beginning to get old, us modders are just making it more funner."

    This is the 12 year old kid who followed some instructions on the internet so he can stop losing at Halo.
    • That's the only part of the interview that truely surprised me (when he said he was 24). Either he's much younger or the educational system is clearly failing.
    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      While, he does claim to be 24, in general I agree with you, he definitely appears to think like a 12 year old. For example:

      Aeropause: How many times have you been banned or suspended from gaming servers?
      Schmuck5000: .... The people at Bungie are the worst. How can they complain about people like me. They should have built a anti-cheating engine in the game to prevent it. Its not my fault that modders cheat.

      Aeropause: .... What advice would you give game designers to help discourage cheaters?
      Schmuck5000

      • I thought the exact same thing when I read it...

        It also got me thinking about what an anti-cheating engine would look like...
        Honestly why don't companies like bungie simply run a CRC on any downloaded content, or record the downloaded date server side and compare it with the modified date client side. I honestly don't know much about cheating online but as someone who has modded Xbox consoles I would imagine the cheating comes from modifying the extra content that was downloaded from Xbox live and sits
        • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

          by lbrandy (923907)
          Honestly why don't companies like bungie simply run a CRC on any downloaded content, or record the downloaded date server side and compare it with the modified date client side.

          Because it's not that simple. Think of the code that gets run.

          Calculate CRC
          check CRC to answer
          if not equal jump to OMG_HACKER
          if equal jmp to PLAY_GAME_PLEASE

          All a hacker has to do is find any location in 'Calculate CRC' and put a single instruction 'JMP PLAY_GAME_PLEASE', and he's bypassed your CRC check. So now you have to pu
          • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

            by abandonment (739466)
            this is pretty much what most online games do, lookig for unmodified content, but again you're relying on the client to tell you that it hasn't been modified, which is pretty much impossible to trust.

            punkbuster et al rely on a seperate executable checking the state of another executable, which is a slightly better situation, but it ends up in a situation like bf2 where the 'validating client data' stage of loading a game takes as long as loading the content & connecting to a server, if not longer.

            modder
        • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

          by scribblej (195445)
          Since you can't modify the disc content (if you did you'd need to run a modchip and if you're running a modchip when you log into Xbox Live MS can detect that and ban your sorry ass).

          You don't know what you're talking about.

          I don't cheat because I don't play online games because I can't stand f-ing cheaters, okay?

          That said, you're just wrong. I've modded about a dozen Xboxes. None of them using a modchip, all done in software. When I am finished modding an Xbox:

          1) You can connect and play on Xbox live.
      • Everyone always cheat, and we will always find a way to do it.

        And yet, not everyone cheats.

        Strange.

        On another note, did you guys read the forum posts following the article? I particularly enjoyed the furor subsequent to the "Cheaters_Mother" posts.

        -stormin
  • by svunt (916464) on Monday September 18, 2006 @12:20PM (#16130834) Homepage Journal
    Schmuck5000: Modding is not an unfair advantage. There is just as much chance that there will be a modder on the other team. I am there to even things out.


    Exactly. This is why I carry $1000 in Monopoly money in my underpants at all times.

    • Re: (Score:2, Funny)

      by Anonymous Coward
      You wear underpants? I've been hiding it in bodily cavities until people wanted to stop playing because of the smell. Then I declare myself winner by default.
    • by neoform (551705)
      $1000? What's that worth? 2 hotels?

      You'd be better off carrying $10,000 and a pile of get out of jail free cards.
      • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

        by svunt (916464)
        $1000? What's that worth? 2 hotels?

        Naw, dog. I'm from the ghetto, that stretch of slum land from Go to Jail. A grand will buy you crack, a lap dance, a few forty ounce bottles of malt liquor, and your own chain of Flag Inns.
  • by Siberwulf (921893) on Monday September 18, 2006 @12:20PM (#16130836)
    "Speak Easy 2: Haxxing"



    You to can make ur games much more funner then before! Plug in yer haxx and away yous go! Cal Now!

  • Here come the Slashdot Spelling and Grammar Police..

    "I am there to even things out. Halo 2 is beginning to get old, us modders are just making it more funner."

  • by Bloke down the pub (861787) on Monday September 18, 2006 @12:21PM (#16130839)
    I thought a person who acts unsportingly was a cheat. Whereas a cheater's sort of like a leopard.
    • by MightyYar (622222)
      I think that they are both acceptable, and both are in common usage. Most people say "cheater" when it is a stand-alone noun and use "cheat" when it has a noun modifier. For example, "He was arrested for being a tax cheat," versus, "You're a dirty cheater!" Of course, I have no real idea what I'm talking about.
    • by PeeAitchPee (712652) on Monday September 18, 2006 @02:57PM (#16132348)

      Whereas a cheater's sort of like a leopard.

      Correct. It's very similar to the other Southern Appalachian big cat, the lyin'.

  • by EVil Lawyer (947367) on Monday September 18, 2006 @12:21PM (#16130842)
    FTFA: "Aeropause: Do you have a girlfriend?"

    Boh the interviewer and interviewee appear to be relatively idiotic. This interview might have been marginally interesting if they had interviewed someone more on the cutting edge of cheating -- someone who actually creates the mods, or develops new cheating modalities.

    • by xtracto (837672) on Monday September 18, 2006 @12:36PM (#16130987) Journal
      I would like to say thank you to Schmuck5000 for letting us in on how utterly dumb and senseless the mind of a cheater can be. I am sure all our faithful

      I agree with parent, the interview is stupid, it is just one person whining because the 'cheater' beat him. I agree that what would be interesting is to interview the developers of the cheats.

      However, the reason why the people develop cheats is just because there is demand for cheats. So in a sense this cheater has a point, there is people who wants to cheat, it has been like that since the GameGear times of the NES (or before).

      My first cheat was with the Price of Persia game on the PC, I remember looking the PRINCE.SAV file on Xtree Gold and editing it in Hex mode (without knowing what it was, just hacking my way trough it) to have more lives and time. Oh, and to bypass the manual letter verifiaciton =o)
      • by 1010110010 (1002553) on Monday September 18, 2006 @01:14PM (#16131314)
        You're missing the point of the interview.

        Yes, it would be very interesting to ask technical as well as moral questions to the people who enable cheaters to cheat, but this interview gave us insight into why a person would cheat in the first place.

        I would also like to add that there is a strong difference between cheating at a single player game, and having fun figuring out the save system, and cheating at multiplayer. When you're cheating by yourself, whether it be because you enjoy reverse-engineering the save file or because you simply want to advance faster, it has no impact on anybody else.

        Cheating at multiplayer is an annoyance for everybody. The interviewee clearly demonstrates that there is no technical challenge to what he is doing. He's not doing it because he wants to understand how the game works. He's doing it because he's not very good at the games he likes to play and he wants to win, to the frustration of everybody else.
        • by Jonner (189691)
          Yes, that's an important distinction. A "cheat" for a single player game doesn't disadvantage anyone and isn't in any way dishonest. But all the people in a multiplayer game must be playing by the same rules for it to be fair. I've used single player "cheats" many times to explore a game, because I was frustrated with a particular section, or just to try something different. However, I have no interest in cheating in a multiplayer game, since I want to know I beat other people due to my skill.
      • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

        by ergo98 (9391)

        I agree with parent, the interview is stupid, it is just one person whining because the 'cheater' beat him. I agree that what would be interesting is to interview the developers of the cheats.

        It's impossible for a cheater to win. People who face cheaters get irritated because they completely ruin the game, not because they're such potent adversaries.

        Even when you aren't getting shot by magic bullets from adversaries who can track you and shoot you through walls, once cheaters have permeated a domain you can

    • by plague3106 (71849)
      I'm willing to bet most people that cheat in games won't have a girlfriend. Otherwise why would they be so obsessed with 'winning' an online game? People with a SO have better things to do that worry about if they won or lost..

      I found the rationalization interesting personally. He honestly thinks the game is more fun playing by different rules... I've never heard of anyone that liked rules which worked against them. He also assumes that the other players DON'T want to play by the same set of rules, whic
      • by Score Whore (32328) on Monday September 18, 2006 @01:11PM (#16131292)
        People who are cheating are playing a different game. They may be having fun, but they are not playing the same game as the rest of the players.

        They want to be bully's and the only way the can bully people is to use a "tool" to get over whatever is preventing them from bullying without the "tool".
      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by JavaLord (680960)
        I'm willing to bet most people that cheat in games won't have a girlfriend. Otherwise why would they be so obsessed with 'winning' an online game? People with a SO have better things to do that worry about if they won or lost..

        You are wrong, I created and released an aimbot for a certain FPS game and I had a girlfriend at the time. It's amazing people still don't understand what a griefer is. It never mattered to me if I won or lost, just as long as I pissed someone off, and got a laugh out of it.

        Al
        • by Vellmont (569020) on Monday September 18, 2006 @02:37PM (#16132137)
          For some reason the word "sociopath" keeps coming to mind when I read your post. Anyone who enjoys pissing off anonymous people in a computer game, and actively seeks that out has a screw or two loose. Perhaps you should up your meds?
        • by Jekler (626699) on Monday September 18, 2006 @03:10PM (#16132504)

          Other posters said it sounds like sociopathic tendencies. It's not a tendency, you are a sociopath.

          "It's amazing people still don't understand what a griefer is."

          That's practically the definition of a sociopath. A person who does not think or feel the same genuine emotions the rest of society does, but you firmly believe everyone else's brain is wired up the way yours is.

          People with normal minds do not play games for the disenjoyment of others, don't understand why someone would want to, and wouldn't enjoy it if we tried. Your thoughts and behavior are equivilant to someone going to medical school so they can cut people with a scalpel. (i.e. Someone who wants to end up with half a dozen bodies hanging in their basement.) You've chosen a course of action for exactly the opposite reason most people do, but you think it's strange the rest of us don't seem to understand or empathize.

          • Sociopath (Score:3, Insightful)

            by Phat_Tony (661117)
            Exactly. Instead of

            "They bitch and morn about how I cheated but they could have modded their box just like mine."

            How about "They bitch and moan about how I broke into their houses and stole their stuff, but they could have lots of stuff too if they just broke into other people's houses and stole theirs." [insert random grammatical mistakes for added authenticity]

            This is about the basic trust and respect for other people that makes society a decent place to live. Saying "it's OK that I'm an asshole b
  • by 192939495969798999 (58312) <info@devinm o o r e .com> on Monday September 18, 2006 @12:25PM (#16130875) Homepage Journal
    Athletes often use the same excuse, that since there will be "other" players on drugs, they need to use the same drugs to stay competitive. However, this should only be the case if the drugs are allowed, because any given cheater could be exposed and stripped of their titles, video game or otherwise. That's the ultimate slap-down, because anyone after that will assume you're cheating even if you're not.
    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by Red Flayer (890720)

      Athletes often use the same excuse, that since there will be "other" players on drugs, they need to use the same drugs to stay competitive.

      I think there's a difference between recreational gaming and professional sports, however. Professional sports are ALL about winning (unfortunately, IMO -- it sets a bad example). Look at the famous quote by Vince Lombardi -- "Winning isn't everything, it's the only thing."

      Recreational gaming is about competition, win or lose -- and the fact that some people are willi

    • Re: (Score:2, Funny)

      by edxwelch (600979)
      Are you suggesting that taking anabolic steroids can increase your performance in a Halo2 death match?
      interesting
  • by eldavojohn (898314) * <eldavojohn.gmail@com> on Monday September 18, 2006 @12:25PM (#16130880) Journal
    I haven't read this article. But from that last sentence of grammar stumbling, I'm not interested in this interview at all. I don't know what Xbox modding is but I'd imagine that Schmuck5000 didn't invent this 'modding' procedure. A lot of times, they just follow some process online and then run around killing people saying "1337 h4Xx00rs pwn you n00bz0rs." I consider these people much less than 'cheaters' although I don't think the names I have for them are for public display.

    What about the people who write the code or make the hardware for the mods? You know, the people that actually do all the work? I want to talk to these people who probably don't even use it all that much but just consider it a challenge and then get bored after the challenge is overcome. Game Genie & Game Shark are popularized commercial versions of this but it's not online play. I wish I could talk to the people that reverse engineer the packets sent out using something like Burp or a networking tool that gives them speed hacks. These people work for it while I don't even think their end goal is really to cheat. I kind of have the feeling that they enjoy the cat and mouse game that appearantly Blizzard has won (after rounds of losing) but Xbox Live has lost.

    I investigated writing a program that read the memory from video and tried to interpret it using heuristics on what to do in casewise instances. While it might work for some games (like Tetris), 3D emersion worlds like WoW or online play are much much more difficult. If people are out there and writing these 'bots' that are pretty highly sophisticated, I'd love to hear from them and ask them real questions (not "Do you have a girlfriend?").

    By the way, the article has a picture of Steve Martin as "The Jerk" and it's pretty obvious they were interviewing an idiot and doing a radio talk show host job of making him look like a poser.
    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by Cadallin (863437)
      Here's a hint: AI's in Video games don't look at the video data.
    • I consider these people much less than 'cheaters' although I don't think the names I have for them are for public display.

      You're new here aren't you?

    • by rabbot (740825)
      I wrote a very simple program for a certain FPS a while back that would read the video memory and determine if my crosshair was on an enemy model and immediately fire...pretty simple but very effective (60-90% accuracy).

      I'm not a cheater though, I just wrote it to see how easy it really is to defeat punkbuster. Aside from the testing I did with some friends on live servers, I don't put it to use...takes all the fun out of the game.

      Obviously this isn't sophisticated at all, but I thought I would share it wi
    • I wrote a bunch of things for games like Star Wars: Galaxies (scripts that would play pretty much all the professions for me so that I could grind out and sell a bunch of Jedi, way back when) and stuff for City of Heroes (more or less to street sweep etc. to powerlevel). Also stuff for World of Warcraft that'll automate play.

      For Galaxies, I did it purely for the profit - sorry, but people paying $1000 and up for Jedi characters was too good to pass up at the time. I spent maybe 100 hours on the automation p
  • by antifoidulus (807088) on Monday September 18, 2006 @12:27PM (#16130898) Homepage Journal
    he cannot "mod" the English language as easily as he can his XBox.


  • I think he has a great future in front of him. As we are continually told, life
    is a competition. The point is to win and not to winge about how it wasn't fair
    when you loose.

    Besides which, it is only a game that we are talking about. If you are worried about people cheating, I would suggest chess or scrabble. Much harder to cheat at these.

    Phil

    • If you are worried about people cheating, I would suggest chess or scrabble. Much harder to cheat at these.

      You, sir, have never played Scrabble against my friend's grandmother then.

      Possible ways to cheat:

      • Use made-up words. (When I was really young I didn't know better...we ended up having to buy her a Scrabble dictionary so she couldn't cheat.)
      • Use a regular letter upside down as a blank (only works until the third blank comes up).
      • Swap letters when people aren't looking.
      • Use fuzzy math [wikipedia.org]
    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Oligonicella (659917)
      "I think he has a great future in front of him. As we are continually told, life is a competition. The point is to win and not to winge about how it wasn't fair when you loose."

      The you're an idiot and don't understand the meaning of competition. Competition implies that there are rules being followed.

      Want to play without rules? Great. Come and play a game of poker in my neck of the woods and cheat. Please don't winge (whatever that is) about the lack of working knees when you get caught (ie: lose).

      L
  • by arun_s (877518)
    I always wanted to get inside the mind of a cool haxx0r.

    Give Up! There is no way to stop us. Everyone wants to cheat and we will always find a way to do it. Anyone reading this is simply jealous of the fact that I have enough nuts to cheat and play the game the way I want to.

    Man that guy's got balls! None can stop our XBox-modding overlords.
    Thanks /. for bringing this to our attention.
  • The Worst Part... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by HappyCycling (565803) on Monday September 18, 2006 @12:33PM (#16130951)
    The worst part of cheating is that it forever creates doubt, mistrust and skepticism about the skills of others online, meaning that if you play well, you are labeled a cheater. Respect goes out the window.
    • The problem that the parent poster described is very real.

      There are some people in the world that are in the upper 0.01% for gaming. They're not cheating - they really are just that good. Sometimes it can be difficult to tell the difference.

      I used to run all of the gaming servers for a (now defunct) gaming clan and I was often called upon to jump into a game and check out someone in person to see if they were cheating. Automated tools like PunkBuster et al. can be tricked and fooled; The best way to catch a
    • by PitaBred (632671)
      Yup. I remember playing UT when it first came out. I wasn't the best, but I played with some of them, and could even somewhat compete. Then the bots started coming. You could tell when they were there, because the feel of the whole game completely changed, and it got to be where it just wasn't fun running around a corner and getting headshot immediately no matter what you did.
  • Rare Opportunity? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by KermodeBear (738243) on Monday September 18, 2006 @12:34PM (#16130960) Homepage
    The summary calls this a "rare opportunity to interview a cheater". Cheaters are hardly rare and it isn't difficult to talk to them. Granted, you're likely to get "OMGSTFUONTEHBBQ!!!11!1!one!eleven" than a real conversation, but...

    Regardless, the amount of cheating that exists online now is the reason I only play online with people I know, on locked servers. The rest of the time it is single player stuff. When I play a game I play to have fun, and cheaters make games very UN-fun.

    Catching them can be a problem. I'm happy the some companies are taking steps towards anti-cheating measures, but ultimately the cheaters are going to win. They control the software running on their hardware and they can modify it as they see fit.

    PunkBuster was a good example of this. A server with PunkBuster running required all client connecting to be running a PunkBuster client, which reported to the server various bits of information such as video drivers, what processes are running, if something might be modifying the game's memory, etc. But, after a while, it was useless because the client software was hacked to make the cheater player seem legitimate.

    Anti-cheat software is like a lock on a door: It only keeps the honest people out.
    • by Buzz_Litebeer (539463) on Monday September 18, 2006 @01:05PM (#16131241) Journal
      I used to help write anti cheat software, and the thing is the cheats have their own forums as well.

      if you want to "interview a cheater" it is very easy to find them.

      To successfully find out what cheats were out there I had to get on those boards and become a member and all that stuff. Trust me, "skill" can easily be downloaded for almost any game out there.

      The cheaters get all angry and stop playing if they cant cheat, cause the game "aint fun" because they losing or they expect someone else is cheating against them when they lose.

      We are teaching our kids that the only way to have fun is to win, and if you are second place it just means your the first loser and all of that.

      Kids arent learning that the POINT of the game is to show how good you are at it versus someone else, when you are cheating you arent really playing the same game and your rules are better in your favor. Its completely pointless.
  • Dammmit, I really wish natural selection still worked.

    The people at Bungie are the worst. How can they complain about people like me. They should have built a anti-cheating engine in the game to prevent it. Its not my fault that modders cheat.

    later...

    What advice would you give game designers to help discourage cheaters?
    Schmuck5000: Give Up! There is no way to stop us. Everyone wants to cheat and we will always find a way to do it.

  • So you can get an interesting look into my mindset if you want. I expect heavy critisism but I'll continue anyway: Halo 2 is a fun game. I'm not gamer, and Halo 2 is one of the only games I actually play, besides the ones on my old Megadrive! I played online for quite some time until I experienced a cheater on a matchmade game. I became interested. I'd been using linux for 6 months and the idea of putting it on my xbox - to cheat - appealed to me. It took me a lot of getting to grips with the text talk use
    • by Dorsai65 (804760)

      It took me a lot of getting to grips with the text talk used by all the "modders" as they prefer to be known on Halo 2

      What they want to be known as, and what they're likely called, are probably two different things.

      If one (or more) people are cheating, then whatever they're doing, it isn't playing a game any longer; it's more like theft of time, effort, energy, and so on from the one(s) NOT cheating. Reading about all the mods, cheats, hacks, bots, and everything else available for online games is the ma

  • by SanityInAnarchy (655584) <ninja@slaphack.com> on Monday September 18, 2006 @12:36PM (#16130989) Journal

    I hope I spelled that right...

    But man, it's amazing this guy can't put two of his responses together:

    The people at Bungie are the worst. How can they complain about people like me. They should have built a anti-cheating engine in the game to prevent it.

    Ok, ignoring for the moment that they did do that (they put it on a freakin' console, for one), even ignoring that banning cheaters is an "anti-cheating engine" of sorts, when asked how game designers should stop cheaters (since he suggested that they do), he says:

    Give Up! There is no way to stop us.

    So, damned if they do, and damned if they don't.

    Still, this has got to be my favorite quote:

    The other players are just jealous p***ys who wish they had the ability to cheat.

    Funny, I think this guy cheats (not hard!) because he's a jealous pussy who wishes he had the ability to play fairly.

    I can play each and every game I cheat at very well.

    I call BS. The people I know who can play a game "very well" -- some of them could be tournament-level if they practiced just a bit more -- would all much rather play fair. Oh, they have fun with new cheats and exploits, for about 10 seconds, and we're talking about things like Warthog jumping. The rest of the time, they are the ones who will be winning anyway, by knifing the aimbotter in the back.

    But I suppose it's like trying to teach a Ferengi about honor, or a Klingon about restraint, or a Trekkie about the Real World. He'll always cheat, and he'll always suck, and nothing I say will change that.

    • by joe 155 (937621)
      I have to agree. I will cheat on some offline games, because I'm not that good at them and sometimes just can't be bothered to put in the effort to get good, but cheating online is just a sure fire way to piss off the honest people and make everyone not want to play. I've played online against people who both are loads better than me and camp and thats enough to piss me off (almost to the point of leaving but I feel I should at least be curtious) but if someone can just click to kill from anywhere or othe
  • Schmuck5000: Modding is not an unfair advantage. There is just as much chance that there will be a modder on the other team. I am there to even things out. Halo 2 is beginning to get old, us modders are just making it more funner.

    Bad grammar, immaturity, poor spelling...Quick Taco! You've found a new Slashdot editor!

  • I tried reading this, but the grammar center of my brain imploded. This would have been a far more intellegible interview had they actually interviewed The Cheat. [homestarrunner.com]
    • Thank you. Thank you very much. I just had this wonderful (soda spraying) audio visual moment of the cheat reciting this guy's answers in his usual cheat manner, complete with kerpows, clickaclickas, all while playing Halo XIXVII: Strongbadia Invasion on his fruit.

      Complete with Strongbad as the interviewer.

      You just made my day.
  • Twink (Score:4, Insightful)

    by MeanderingMind (884641) on Monday September 18, 2006 @12:51PM (#16131128) Homepage Journal
    The principles the cheater presents are remarkably similar to arguments for twinking in WoW. Players claim they do it for a variety of reasons, but a very common one is to "even things out" since the other side probably has twinks.

    Also interesting is the similarity in attitude. Anyone posting anti-twink messages generally gets called a "loser" and more offensive terms and is labeled as jealous because they can't get the funds to twink. The cheater says the equivalent, calling people who complain about cheaters some nasty things while saying they are envious because they can't cheat or aren't "smart" enough to.

    There's also the classic "If they (being the game creators) didn't want me to cheat (or twink) they would have built an anti-cheat engine (equipment based team selector)" argument. As well as the "I have 1337 skills and even without cheats I'll pwn you" argument.

    While there are certainly mature people who do things like twinking because they are bored or because they enjoy fighting other twinks, I think it's obvious (especially if you've ever fought them) that the vast majority are without skill and make up for it with whatever advantage can be afforded to an unskilled moron. If everyone actually cheated, they'd stop playing because they wouldn't be able to win.

    The fact that the cheater is 24, lacks a girlfriend (quite defensive about it too), and quotes a hideous translation from a dub of a mainstream cartoon show doesn't lend us to have faith in his intelligence.
    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by dwiget (947248)
      Twinking characters is not even remotely close to cheating. Sorry.
    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Sqweegee (968985)
      Twinking in an MMO is part of the game mechanics, nothing like cheating. If someone goes through the effort of gathering the rare items that allow them to equip better gear then they deserve the advantage they have.

      You don't get mad at the person who ran around an FPS map gathing weapons, ammo, and armor before opening up on you, or do you expect them to only fight with the default handgun?

      Hacker/mod cheaters should be banned and are really only showing their lack of skill at playing the game.
    • by kalirion (728907)
      The fact that the cheater is 24, lacks a girlfriend (quite defensive about it too), and quotes a hideous translation from a dub of a mainstream cartoon show doesn't lend us to have faith in his intelligence.

      You actually believe him that he's 24? I'm guessing he's about 15, though other people think he's a lot younger than that.
      Also, I wonder what the chances are that he was intentionally saying things to get a reaction out of people.
    • Wait? (Score:3, Funny)

      by ad0gg (594412)
      You're comparing cheating to twinking? Cheating involves breaking the rules, twinking involves playing within the rules to gain the best advantage. What next? Ferrari F1 team is cheating because they have a better car than the Williams-Coswort team?
  • Even Kirk was a cheater!
    • by Pope (17780)
      Yeah, and look at how much tail HE got!

      Schmuck5000: your day will come.
      • by Scooter (8281)
        Hey he's not cheating - he's just chnaging the rules of the game so it's possible to rescu^H^H^H^H^H hit everything he aims at!

        He probably used protomatter in his code too!

  • by autophile (640621) on Monday September 18, 2006 @01:12PM (#16131298)
    In related news, AeroFLOT interviewed The Cheat:

    Aeroflot: In Soviet Russia, interviewEE interviews interviewER!
    The Cheat: Mrr, rrr, m! Mm mrr mrah mreah!

    --Rob

  • Anyone else think this "interview" seems entirely too stereotypical to be true? Maybe I'm not playing online enough or something.
  • "us modders are just making it more funner."

    It's obvious he cheats on his English tests, too. Most foreigners I know speak English better than he does.
  • Guy claims he cheats because there will be modders on the other team
    Guy claims he wont stop cheating if no one else does and he is evening out the playing field
    Guy claims he can own the battlefield without cheating
    Guy claims that people who whine about him cheating should mod their own xbox
    Guy claims that everyone wants to cheat and he just had the nuts to do it

    Guy is a whiny little bitch who cant play for shit. He makes up excuses to why he should cheat, claiming the otheres are , and therefore they are ag
  • by musicon (724240) on Monday September 18, 2006 @01:31PM (#16131494) Homepage

    ... as if millions of grammar nazies cried out in terror, and were silenced.

    "more funner" indeed.

  • Bah! (Score:4, Insightful)

    by SirJorgelOfBorgel (897488) * on Monday September 18, 2006 @01:58PM (#16131770)
    I must say, I hardly play FPS's online anymore as I can't spare the time and today's FPS's just aren't what they used to be. I have been #1 on ngWorldStats for UT/CTF a few times. I have written (non-cheater)mods for a game or two, and an ANTIcheating tool for another (all very well received by their communities). Cheating pisses me off. Yes I used to be real good at some FPS's, and I spent a LOT of time becoming it, playing several hours a day (so call me sad, whatever). What the hell is fun in cheating? If I go into a server and own everybody in there, do I feel good? No. It sucks! I leave and find a server with people who are up to par with my skills. Sometimes they're way above you, then you find a server that is only a little bit above your own skills. And if you get really good in a game, you get to know the other good players. You know who cheats and who doesn't. You don't play with cheaters in general, though sometimes it is fun to kick their scrawny girlfriendless hinies. If you cheat, where's the challenge? What is fun in winning all the time? Ok, I may have actually written a few cheats, but that is because I love coding - it's not like I ever used them 'in the wild'.

    Online cheaters are below contempt. I don't care what their motivation is. You don't go and purposely ruin others people's fun. It's just "not done". I don't care if your retarded, doing it for kicks, have some half decent self invented excuse or whatever, you just don't. Hell, I've ended real life friendships when I learned they were cheating (in various ways) and couldn't convince them it's just not done.

    The arguments presented in the article are just beyond sanity. "I tend to ignore those people, they bitch and morn about how I cheated but they could have modded their box just like mine.", "How can they complain about people like me. They should have built a anti-cheating engine in the game to prevent it.", "Anyone reading this is simply jealous of the fact that I have enough nuts to cheat and play the game the way I want to.", "why should I stop if no one else does"

    It's all about the morals and values. Hell, I could've been fairly rich if I didn't hang on to it. Many players of various games have used tools (mods, extensions, cheater-finding, etc) I've made daily. I could've taken most of their accounts if I wanted, selling them on ebay, and in some cases just exchanging it for real world cash (in case of real-cash-economy games). And believe me, there's lots and lots of cash in that. Morals and values...

    Saddest thing is, we are most likely to see this guy grow up to be president of some company that earns millions by ripping other people of or otherwise cheating them (spammers anyone?). Fuck that.
  • why people cheat (Score:4, Insightful)

    by the dark hero (971268) <adriatic_hero@NoSpaM.hotmail.com> on Monday September 18, 2006 @02:03PM (#16131814) Homepage
    no one wants to work for things anymore. they want the quickest way to the top. instant gratification. it's the bane of american society.
  • The software used (Score:5, Informative)

    by w33t (978574) * on Monday September 18, 2006 @02:10PM (#16131875) Homepage
    This is a timely article for me since Saturday evening on Battlefield 2 I ran upon an entire squad/clan of cheaters.

    It was around 4am with no admins on the server, so they were being quite blatant about their cheating. I believe they were using the wallhacks and aimbots offered from MSXSecurity [msxsecurity.com]

    Check out the videos:
    http://media.putfile.com/MSX-Aimbot [putfile.com]
    http://media.putfile.com/MSX-Video2222 [putfile.com]
    http://media.putfile.com/pwnage5580 [putfile.com]
    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-364914118 8840786715 [google.com]

    Unfortunately, I must be honest, these hacks actually DO make cheating look kind of fun. Like you are a mutant with super-human powers.

    I would like to see a team of cheaters going up against another team of cheaters though - that would be strange and pointless gameplay I would think.
  • I set up a network connection for my friend's 360 and we hopped on Halo 2 to test it. I am admittedly inexperienced with Halo 2 but had a respectable body count with Halo 1. After joining 5 different games I got so annoyed with posers lagging the game and fragging you during lag I wanted to toss the box out the window. At first I thought it may have been my own connection but my ping times proved otherwise. I was pulling full 3Mb and everyone in the game was getting the same lag. Then there were the gu
  • Cause I'm crap at them - and I still paid the same money... and after all how else can I come second last.

    Anyone playing World of Warcraft ever looked up thottbot.com .... then you are a cheat.
    Anyone playing World of Warcraft ever had a 60 show their 40 through a tough area ... then you are a cheat.
    Anyone playing World of Warcraft install mods to allow them to heal better in raids ... then you are a cheat.
    Anyone playing World of Warcraft go into battle grounds against noob 60s in full epic regalia and prete

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