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Interview With Linux Flash Player's Lead Engineer 222

Posted by ScuttleMonkey
from the because-everyone-loves-flash dept.
An anonymous reader writes, "Ryan Stewart of ZDNet has an interview with Mike Melanson, the lead engineer behind Adobe's upcoming Flash Player 9 for Linux. It covers what the plans are for the player, what kinds of things won't be in the Linux player that are in the other players, and ways to give Adobe input on the Linux player."
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Interview With Linux Flash Player's Lead Engineer

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  • ALSA support? YAY! (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Zarhan (415465) on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @07:40AM (#16006260)
    Good, no need to start my browser with alsa-oss anymore if I want the mixer to work (So that multiple sound sources can play at the same time), or having the flash hogging the sound device.
  • How big is the team working on the Linux version of the Flash Player?

    There is a core team working on porting and testing. There are various volunteers within the organization who have jumped into the effort out of general platform enthusiasm; and if we need any advice with particular areas, we bring in people from the rest of the Flash Player team as needed.

    Of course, we're not making cheese sandwiches here. Throwing more programmers, any programmers, at the problem will not necessarily speed the process al
    • by totallygeek (263191) <sellis@totallygeek.com> on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @08:13AM (#16006366) Homepage
      Throwing more programmers, any programmers, at the problem will not necessarily speed the process along.


      It's like giving nine women the task of gestating a baby in one month.

      • by castlec (546341)
        It's all about the pipeline. You just have to make sure there is never a branch to mess up the continued gestations :o)
      • Bandwidth-wise, if nine women had nine months to each generate a baby, then you can say each woman will have created one baby in one month.
        The Latency simply was nine months.
        The Throughput is the twelve hours of labor it took to push the brat out.

        Consider the ramifications from a Network Admin's point of view.
        If you could completely eliminate the latency, then you could push a baby out twice a day. You could make millions off of welfare alone!
        However, the lowest latency I've ever seen, was that big-bellied
  • 64 bits please... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by tomstdenis (446163) <tomstdenis@@@gmail...com> on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @07:50AM (#16006292) Homepage
    So tired of shit not being developed for x86_64. Get with the times. Didn't RTFA but I assume they'll ignore it like they always have...

    Tom
    • Why was the parent comment marked as Troll? He has a valid point. Its like how jBase (an obscure database no doubt) prides itself on getting to 64-bit in their latest version........ 10 years after all other enterprise databases did.

      Adobe/Macromedia/Coke/Taco Bell: Come on, get with the program.
    • I'm not 100% sure if this will work but why don't you just cut your 64bit processor in half use dual core instead?
    • Flash Player 9 is not just a C program any more. It now has a JIT, and so they have to write a separate JIT backend for every architecture they want to support (although an interpreter might be a good stopgap). They haven't written the x86-64 JIT yet, and it's going to take time for them to do it. Sure, it might have been better if they delayed the release of Flash Player 9 until after they developed x86-64, PPC, ARM, IA-64, MIPS, and Alpha JITs, but it's too late now.
  • by suso (153703) * on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @07:55AM (#16006312) Homepage Journal
    I got into Linux when I wanted to use a free relational database called MySQL for a web project

    Why does this quote remind me so much of Data (from Star Trek, an obscure TV show):

    Data: "It is from an obscure language known as French"
    Picard: "Data, the French language for centuries represented civilization"
    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by suso (153703) *
      Obviously today is asshole moderation day. Since you are probably going to read this and moderate it down too, read this: People take the time out of their day to write comments that contribute in a positive way to Slashdot. Either by being funny, interesting or insightful. They are all important. When you mod those people down, you are making those people become frustrated with this site to go away and then everything goes south. Think next time, every time you mod a comment down that doesn't *need* t
      • by Sqwubbsy (723014) on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @08:23AM (#16006410) Homepage Journal
        I know I'm burning what little karma I have (and I also know it doesn't apply to you) but this comment totally deserves a "you must be new around here", so...

        You must be new around here.
      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by kfg (145172) *
        Perhaps we just need a -1 I Don't Get It mod. Then they at least have the opportunity to be honest about it.

        KFG
      • by byolinux (535260) *
        Sometimes when I moderate, I don't understand references to Star Trek, etc because I don't watch them... however, if they make me laugh, or smile, I mod them up, because they remind me what the Internet is about.
      • by kimvette (919543)
        Agreed; the only things really deserving modding down are obfuscated goatse links and racist pricks, but even then, isn't the mod point better spent modding up a great post elsewhere?
    • by Fearless Freep (94727) on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @08:14AM (#16006371)
      Professor Hubert Farnsworth: This is my Universal Translator. It could have been my greatest invention, but it translates everything into an incomprehensible dead language
      Cubert J. Farnsworth: [into the translator's microphone] Hello.
      Universal Translator: Bonjour!
      Professor Hubert Farnsworth: See? Utter gibberish!
  • Big Corp.(tm) is awakening to Linux. One of these days, one of these "upgrades"
    from one of these companies is going to contain a rootkit tailor-made for Linux.

    I, for one, will not forget why I'm using a free (Open Source) platform. It sure
    as hell aint for viewing snazzier adverts. Let's also not forget alternatives like
    http://www.gnu.org/software/gnash/ [gnu.org]
    This is not an indictment of Mike, I'm sure he's a nice guy.
    I'm not a zealot --I use closed video drivers, but these kinds of needless (IMO) upgrades

    • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

      by bodger_uk (882864)
      If gnash would allow me to go to video.google.com and view the content then fine and great. But it doesn't, so it isn't. Alternatives and moral viewpoints are fine, but when they don't cut the mustard they aren't alternatives.

      As for flash 7 performing flawlessly, try going to the above google site, and see how long it takes you to get annoyed with the out of sync audio.
      • by Sancho (17056) on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @08:24AM (#16006416) Homepage
        You can get in-sync audio by using alsa-oss. I'm sure if you Google around, you'll find the solution to your problem.

        The out-of-sync sound on Linux annoyed me to no end until I installed Ubuntu on a notebook to see what all the fuss was about. I was having problems getting Flash sound to play /at/all/ and hit the forums--sure enough, there was a solution to that /and/ the sync issue. I was ecstatic!
        • by Rik Sweeney (471717) on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @08:57AM (#16006592) Homepage
          You can get in-sync audio by using alsa-oss. I'm sure if you Google around, you'll find the solution to your problem.

          In case anyone is interested, or just too lazy to look themselves, here's the link

          http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=18659 4 [ubuntuforums.org]
    • ... but one of the reasons Flash is so successfull is that it's considered the securest plugin (tm) in existance. Flash allways has been extremely picky about security - that's one of the reasons why it's the easiest cross-plattform VM to deploy in corporate enviroments.
    • by BFaucet (635036) on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @08:25AM (#16006418) Homepage
      Gee I didn't know you represented the needs of everyone. I had no idea Flash was completely useless as I've often enjoyed watching documentaries, news clips, home brew animations and interacting with stimulating websites that utilized Flash as a delivery medium.

      I better uninstall that useless piece of junk right away!
      • Flash 7 for Linux is almost completely useless. Here's hoping that Flash 9 for Linux is sweet and comes out soon, or (better yet) the gnash team gets it going to the point that Linux users don't need to rely on Adobe for flashy goodness.
        • by Nutria (679911)
          Flash 7 for Linux is almost completely useless.

          Oh Great Oracle, pray tell us why Flash 7 for Linux is almost completely useless!

          • Oh Great Oracle, pray tell us why Flash 7 for Linux is almost completely useless!

            If you'd ever used it, you'd know, but I'll explain.

            - The audio and video are out of sync which makes many videos unwatchable.

            - It's rather unstable and can cause frequent browser crashes.

            Some people have found workarounds, or their system works better with flash and doesn't crash as much, or the audio sync bug just doesn't bother them. That's the "almost". For me, it took me hours to stop it from instantly crashing

            • by Nutria (679911)
              If you'd ever used it, you'd know, but I'll explain.

              I've used it since soon after it was released.

              - The audio and video are out of sync which makes many videos unwatchable.

              The a/v have never been out of sync for me.

              - It's rather unstable and can cause frequent browser crashes.

              Flash 7 is incredibly stable. While Flash 6.x crashed Mozilla constantly, Flash 7 and FF are a marvel of stability.

              Maybe Debian "Unstable" is just more stable than the distro you use.
              • I'm glad you've had good luck with Flash. I've had nothing but bad, and if you read what other people have to say about Flash on Linux you'll see the problem isn't just me. I managed to configure a wireless card with ndiswrapper in about a minute the first time I tried, that doesn't mean that everyone has the greatest experience with ndiswrapper and we don't need open drivers.
        • Please understand that closed source has the potential to fork linux.

          Closed source flash on linux is exactly the same as firefox running on windows.
          • Please understand that closed source has the potential to fork linux.
            I'd like to see gnash or another open source flash program get good enough that linux users don't even consider Adobe's. That would be much better than us sitting around waiting for Adobe to release a half-baked linux version, or not.

            Closed source flash on linux is exactly the same as firefox running on windows.
            I don't understand what you mean.
    • It took roughly 6 months for Sony's rootware to surface on a closed system with relatively few kernel-mode experts. I'd venture to guess that if such a payload were targeted at an open platform, it's discovery would be measured in the space of hours or days, not weeks or months. Surely the brand-loyalty of the F/OSS community is worth more than the eternal-alienation of this growing market segment.
    • by TheRaven64 (641858) on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @08:27AM (#16006436) Journal
      If they want input, then I have some:

      Change the license on the Flash spec to allow it to be used players as well as generators. I don't care about their plugin, but I do care about using open formats.

    • I think your being overly paranoid, who in thier right mind would want to 'pull a sony' on Linux.
      discovery of a rootkit would be rapid, fixed and the company that did it would never get its products on Linux ever again.

      To be honest I feel better about a company that is prepared to invest time and money on a linux version of thier product. Of course it's better still when they open source thier product and best of all when they open source thier product and work with the linux community.

      Flash is just one of
  • Yes, but does it run on linux?
  • Open source player. (Score:5, Informative)

    by phoebe (196531) on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @08:23AM (#16006411)
    It does not sound like he has heard of Gnash:

    Gnash is a GNU Flash movie player. Till now it has only been possible to play flash movies with proprietary software. While there are a few other free flash players, none supports anything higher than SWF v4 at best. Gnash is based on GameSWF, and supports many SWF v7 features.

    Features

    1. Runs standalone: Gnash can run standalone to play flash movies.
    2. Firefox plugin: Gnash can also run as a plugin from within Firefox.
    3. SWF v7 compliant: Gnash can play many current flash movies.
    4. XML Message server: Gnash also supports an XML based message system as is documented in the Flash Format specification.
    5. High Quality Output: Gnash uses OpenGL for rendering the graphics.
    6. Free Software: Gnash is 100% free software.
    • by Wylfing (144940) <`brian' `at' `wylfing.net'> on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @09:02AM (#16006629) Homepage Journal

      It does not sound like he has heard of Gnash

      I bet he has heard of Gnash. I also bet that one of the 2 main reasons for Adobe spending effort on a Linux Flash player is the capabilities of Open Source Flash players. It would be quite horrible for them if Gnash surpassed the current Linux offering from Adobe in functionality. Great for users, but bad for Adobe. They would stand to rapidly lose control over the Flash platform in a big way.

      (I think the 2nd reason, from an executive standpoint, that they are developing this is because if they stop short of the "credo" of Flash, that Flash content can be played anywhere, they sell fewer dev kits. Also, the growing market of dedicated gadgets that run Linux, e.g., phones, which has great potential to be a big target platform.)

  • by Rik Sweeney (471717) on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @08:28AM (#16006441) Homepage
    The only problem I have with the current Linux Flash is that the sound is out of sync with the picture. This makes using Google Video or You Tube a bit a hassle. So my question is

    Has the sound synchronization problem been fixed?

    On a side note, if you don't like flash ads with screaming sound, just install Flash Block [mozdev.org].

    But install Firefox first [mozilla.com]
    • by Anthracks (532185)
      From TFA:

      A close runner-up for most requested feature is proper audio/video sync. And Linux users will get that this time around, thanks largely to the purging of the OSS audio API in favor of the Advanced Linux Sound Architecture (ALSA).
    • by jcupitt65 (68879)
      From the article:

      A close runner-up for most requested feature is proper audio/video sync. And Linux users will get that this time around, thanks largely to the purging of the OSS audio API in favor of the Advanced Linux Sound Architecture (ALSA).

  • by rklrkl (554527) on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @08:35AM (#16006473) Homepage
    ...I've got to say that this long-winded dragout of the next Linux version of Flash Player (hey, isn't both 8 final and 9 beta out for Windows already - neither of which we've seen in *any form* for Linux?) is getting rather tiresome. Sadly, the current Linux Flash development "team" (who is involved exactly in writing the Linux-specific code? The article doesn't really spell it out - you do suspect only one person has been assigned to do that and Adobe don't want to publicly admit that) haven't helped by spinning things out with their blog.

    I find it amazing that "obvious" steps haven't been taken by the Linux Flash team, namely:

    * Some sort of release schedule announcement - don't care if it slips by a few weeks here and there.

    * A set of pre-releases (heck, have them time-bomb out if you don't want them being used in the long-term) coming out to showcase its current alpha/beta/RC status. Note here - Windows gets beta releases, why can't Linux?! It's utterly shameful there is no pre-release version for Linux, especially since the latest Linux Flash blog entries brag how stable the player now is at all the major sites it's been tested on!

    * A definitive statement on whether they'll support 64-bit (i.e. "it'll be released at the same time as the 32-bit version" or "it'll be released X months after the 32-bit version" or "it'll never be released"). Sadly, Adobe are somewhat pig-ignorant w.r.t. the 64-bit platform and don't even have a 64-bit version for XP!

    * Explain the exact differences between, say, Windows Flash 9 and Linux Flash 9 - there's some woolly stuff on this in the article really. After all this time in incubation, you'd have thought that the two platforms would have identical version 9 players, but I wouldn't it past Adobe to release a half-baked Linux Flash 9 player, since they have not yet demonstrated to anyone at all that they take Linux seriously (does the word "vapourware" mean anything to Adobe? That's exactly what Flash 8/9 on Linux currently are).

    * Start a merge of the Linux development environment and the Windows one, so that ultimately they work from the same codebase to avoid the ridiculous delays in platform releases we've seen in the past. It's not clear to me if the Linux effort is fragmented - have we been told how much code is common on all platforms and how much is specific to Linux (and how they keep the specific code to a minimum)?

    * Open Source the player! If Adobe have coded the entire player in-house (which I believe they have), then why not Open Source it...it's a free download after all! Even if they've patented some methods used in the source code, they own the patents and the copyright on the source code, so that shouldn't stop them open-sourcing it surely? Just exactly what is Adobe's objection to open sourcing the player? Sheer bloody-mindedness?
    • * A definitive statement on whether they'll support 64-bit (i.e. "it'll be released at the same time as the 32-bit version" or "it'll be released X months after the 32-bit version" or "it'll never be released"). Sadly, Adobe are somewhat pig-ignorant w.r.t. the 64-bit platform and don't even have a 64-bit version for XP!

      They've made [adobe.com] their position [kaourantin.net] on 64-bit support pretty clear.

      Ignoring the 64-bit world seems shortsighted to me. Sure, most users are 32 bit at the moment, but are new 32 bit machines even

    • Even if they've patented some methods used in the source code, they own the patents

      You seem to forget most civilisations don't recognise software patents.

    • There isn't 64-bit Flash Player for *any* platform yet. Linux isn't being picked on. 64-bit is being worked on.

      The Flash Player is mostly core code. They *are* working from the same codebase on all platforms. The whole point of Flash Player is to have a runtime environment which is virtually identical on all platforms.

      Am I the only one who finds it ironic that the comments in Mike's blog often consist of "please release an alpha, even if it's incomplete and buggy", while now we get "I wouldn't it past Adobe
  • Keyboard (Score:3, Informative)

    by protomala (551662) on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @08:36AM (#16006477) Homepage
    The major problem I got with Flash for Linux is that keyboard simply don't work! There are a lot of mini-games out there that use keyboard for controlling the character, but I get nothing trying all the keys. Maybe it's because I'm using a pt-BR (ABNT2) keyboard, but it dosen't seem to be a problem for Flash Player in Windows :-(
  • if they can get youtube's Audio and Video to synch again that's good enough for me!
  • by Wylfing (144940)

    what kinds of things won't be in the Linux player that are in the other players

    The other players can play movies, and the Linux player...can't!

    ways to give Adobe input on the Linux player

    All comments may be directed to /dev/null. We'll respond as quickly as we can!

    Oh, alright, I'm only kidding. Kind of. I actually read (present tense) the Linux Flash developer blogs and at minimum what we'll be getting is a player that is vastly better than anything we've ever had before. I am just a little irked abou

  • Why push for ALSA support? Jack-It is the future.

    All quality sound players (MythTV, Audacity, Gxine, Xine, XMMS), sound servers (alsasound, Gnome, KDE) and sound device (ALSA, ALSA-OSS) support JACK, (recursive for Jack Audio Connection Kit).

    Even the professional musicians touts their superior audio latency, excellent patch panel, hundreds of audio filters (not that any normal user would want them, but its crispy and never choppy).

    I'm getting tired of switching audio server JUST to use Flash/Mozilla/Linux
  • by jonwil (467024) on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @09:13AM (#16006679)
    There are 2 big reasons why it is unlikely that Macromedia will change and allow the spec to be used to build players.

    Firstly, just like with Sun and Java but much more so, flash truely is "develop once, run anywhere". Any web browser on any platform running the relavent version of the flash player plugin for that platform can play any shockwave flash file out there. (which is probobly why web designers love it so much...)

    And, just like Sun and Java, if Macromedia goes open source or open specs, how can they be sure that "GnuFlash" can play ALL the flash files the same as how the Macromedia player can.

    The other reason is the mobile devices space (PDAs, cellphones, smartphones etc). Right now, Macromedia is pushing heavily into the mobile space and trying to convince mobile device manufacturers to ship "flash for mobile devices". I dont know details but I imagine mobile device makers have to pay Macromedia to ship "flash for mobile devices" in their device (especially when a source code licence is required and its not just a binary provided by Macromedia). If the specs or code were open, the mobile device manufacturers wouldnt need to pay macromedia.
  • Is this the same Mike Melanson who contributes to ffmpeg and runs multimedia.cx?
    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by sconest (188729)
      From the article:
      I started doing some homework and began contributing to, and occasionally leading, various multimedia-related open source projects and efforts, such as xine, FFmpeg, and MPlayer.
      So I'll say yes (at least for FFmpeg)
    • by mad.frog (525085)
      Is this the same Mike Melanson who contributes to ffmpeg and runs multimedia.cx?

      Yes.
    • by NereusRen (811533)
      RTFA. In fact, read the first question of TFA. How could that possibly be more work than posting your question and waiting for a reply?
  • by rockhome (97505) on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @09:38AM (#16006835) Journal
    The whole question about wanting the player to "just work" on other distributions really brings up a question that the linux world has been avoiding for at least 10 years, and that is the question of why so many ideosyncratic distributions exist. What makes open source so powerful and effective has also made a mess of interoperability where Linux is concerned.

    Why is that each distribution of Linux has to be so ideosyncratic that a body cannot produce a binary installation that "just works"? Why should that even be a question? Isn't this a stumbling block in terms of mainstream, desktop adoption of Linux? Sure, if you can ./configure --put-this-there --this-is-there --look--for-this-here --my-init-scripts-are-here --use-this-and-not-that;make install everything yourself, you'll not be bothered by a lot of this. But suppose you are the mythical, mainstream Linux dekstop user who doesn't know wnaymore about Linux than it installed from the CD no problem. If you are looking for a piece of off the shelf software are you reall going to see something on the label akin to the following :

    Compatible with RedHat Linux, SuSE, Slackware, Debian, Gentoo, Mandrake, Ubuntu,SlackHat Redbian, Mandrux, Unbonux, Seus, ZuSE, Debware, Mandhat, Slackdrake, Jesux, Paulux, Vitamin-C, and Bean Crock Enterprise

    Even though you can really categorize most into a few base types, what is to gurantee that my Rhinestone Pantux will run something as easily as my Blue Sude Linux even though they are both based on RedHat?
    • by dylan_- (1661)

      really brings up a question that the linux world has been avoiding for at least 10 years, and that is the question of why so many ideosyncratic distributions exist

      And the answer is: because they can. If I decide to put together my own distribution tomorrow, with all the startup scripts in /bin/registry and users' areas in /wherestuffis/username, then I can. And if you object...well, tough! I didn't ask your permission.

      Sorry you had to wait 10 years to find this out. Seriously though, couldn't you work th

  • by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @09:42AM (#16006881)

    The current (but outdated) Flash player 7 for Linux has big problems with audio/video synchronization. They are hoping to solve this by getting rid of OSS support and using ALSA exclusively. This is a good move. But I also see that they do not plan to support the current version of Video For Linux (V4L2), although the older V4L is being phased out of the kernel. And in that engineer's blog, I saw a brief statement about the fact that the Flash player will not use Gstreamer. This is bad.

    Why don't they use Gstreamer? This would solve the synchronization issues (the current gstreamer-0.10 is very good at keeping everything in sync, unlike other multimedia frameworks) and it would also provide good support for both V4L and V4L2. In addition, it would provide a good cross-desktop integration, because Gstreamer will be supported in KDE4 (through Phonon) and in GNOME.

    Currently, Gstreamer allows me to configure multiple sound cards correctly and decide in one place which one is the default one. If the new Linux Flash player ignores Gstreamer and codes for ALSA and V4L directly, then I bet that it will have problems picking the right sound card automatically. And it will probably ignore my gstreamer filters as well, which is a pity. Not to mention that it would force me to keep the obsolete V4L code in my kernel instead of using V4L2 (gstreamer would do the switch transparently), just like Flash Player 7 forces me to keep the OSS API (alsa-oss) while all other programs have moved to a more mature interface (ALSA).

    By the way, I have read some comments in the blog saying that Gstreamer should not be used because its API or ABI is not stable. I say: bullshit. There were some incompatibilities while moving from gstreamer-0.8 to gstreamer-0.10, but this was a long time ago and the interfaces have been stable since then. If I remember correctly, the Gstreamer developers stated that they intend to keep the interfaces stable now. So those who reject Gstreamer for that reason are just spreading FUD.

    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward

      Why are they fleeing gstreamer like plague? I see at least three reasons:

      1. Because gstreamer's performance sucks; there is absolutely no excuse for using ten times more resources than mplayer/xine for decoding a MP3;
      2. Because after 7 years (yes, the project started even before Windows XP and OS X were released!), it still is brittle (look yourself at the serious bugs fixed two weeks ago [freedesktop.org]);
      3. Because no serious video player uses it (there must be a reason...); and even in simple audio apps, see point 1.
  • wish (Score:5, Funny)

    by doti (966971) on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @09:49AM (#16006938) Homepage
    But one suggestion I would make to the community is to use the Adobe Wish Form to make specific feature requests, such as support for 64-bit and PowerPC platforms and alternate OS such as FreeBSD, so the comments are more productive.
    I, for one, wish Flash to die a horrible death.
  • by kimvette (919543) on Wednesday August 30, 2006 @10:36AM (#16007292) Homepage Journal
    Just keep hounding Adobe with requests for Linux versions of all of their products. They will eventually realize it's wise to cater to a growing market. If they continue to ignore Linux, they risk being rendered irrelevant, especially with Xara, Inkscape, krita, and the gimp all quickly maturing. I'm sure that alternatives to Adobe's flash player aren't far off if Adobe continues to drop the ball. I've read that the so-called "lead engineer behind Adobe's upcoming Flash Player 9 for Linux" is the ONLY engineer assigned to the upcoming Flash Player 9 for Linux - I have NO idea if it's true (but the thing is so late I suspect it is) but if it is, that's pretty sad. We'll end up getting the Flash Player 9 for Linux right around the time that Flash 10 for everything else has alreaqdy shipped.
    • Just keep hounding Adobe with requests for Linux versions of all of their products. They will eventually realize it's wise to cater to a growing market.

      Umm, is this the same Adobe that cancelled the Linux, Mac, and Solaris versions of Framemaker a few years after they bought it, abandoning more than half of their install base?

      If they continue to ignore Linux, they risk being rendered irrelevant, especially with Xara, Inkscape, krita, and the gimp all quickly maturing.

      Those are great projects, but Lin

  • by Chacham (981) *
    I got into Linux when I wanted to use a free relational database called MySQL for a web project.

    Except of course, that MySQL isn't a database.

Logic is a systematic method of coming to the wrong conclusion with confidence.

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