The Making of a Motherboard at ECS 269
sheiky writes "Hardcoreware.net has posted a look at the manufacturing process of a motherboard at a new ECS factory in Shen Zhen. Unlike most factories, they build boards from the ground up at one location, starting with the PCB all the way to a finished product. They also talk a little bit about the working conditions they witnessed in China."
Scary... (Score:5, Interesting)
All of these motherboard factory tours (there have been a few) are pretty scary. We see the really cool equipment, and get to hear the tests each piece of hardware goes through, and then we hear about how their employees do really repetitive tasks, for low wages, with tough ("military-style"), if not abusive, bosses, in an insulting environment (the "grape system"?! What are they, kindergarteners?!?!). Sure, they're efficient, and the product is relatively cheap, but do we want to support the ways these companies treat their workers, even if it's "okay" with the workers?
Re:Was this article written by the Chinese? (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Was this article written by the Chinese? (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Unions (Score:2, Interesting)
Wrong. China is a fascist oligarchy which is no closer to communism than America is. In fact, less so. Many workers in China's buliding industry are not paid at all until their (possibly years long) project is over, and the rural regions have been decimated by the withdrawl of all education and health services. Violent uprisings in China, by China's own figures, reached 87000 last year and have increased steadily by more than 10% per year for some time.
China is on the edge of exploding into civil war and what I think would seem strange to Americans is that when it comes the people doing the rebelling will probably be fighting to establish communism, which they've been raised to believe in because it was a good way to control them but have never experienced.
Re:Was this article written by the Chinese? (Score:3, Interesting)
I know I'd rather be doing academic work in a field I'm interested in than punching a clock to clean tobacco spit out of trashcans or to clean up after someone's explosive diarrhea, especially if you get paid enough as a professor to live relatively comfortably.
Worker's Paradise (Score:5, Interesting)
(FWIW, I'm not comparing China to the US or elsewhere, where there is also too much torture and executions, for whatever reason. There is no relativism that justifies torturing people, certainly not over economics.)
The first page has the claim that "Pretty soon every computer you buy is going to have an ECS motherboard in it!" Although that's probably just wrong, it shows how naive is the reviewer about the real world outside motherboard specs. If it were true, I'd be worried about a single company, a single factory (which can halt or be destroyed) representing a single point of failure for every computer in the world, or even (especially) in the US.
That article is about as analytical as a videogame review. That is, not at all, after being bought off by a free trip to the factory where their toys get made.
Re:Slanted? (Score:5, Interesting)
How about the union (Teamsters)? I visited a facility once dressed in a suit and tie (I was in IT). My job was to show employees how to work a bar code scanner for a new tracking system. As I was talking to the employee two large guys (also in suits) arrived and stood on either side of me. I picked up a Next Day Air letter to show how to scan (I thought they were managers checking my training procedure). Nope, soon as I touched the letter one guy shouts out, "What the fuck you doing? You're not supposed to touch packages." He tells me that he can shut down the entire facility in a second and that I shouldn't be touching packages. He's shouting two inches from my face. At this point the facility manager comes by and starts talking with the union guys to smooth things over.
Management and unions (at least the ones at UPS) are just a bunch of pricks looking for money. They're both evil. The problem is that you let one group get the upper hand and it may be even worse (look at the current political parties in the US for a similar thing).
Been there, seen that (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Unions (Score:3, Interesting)
A good place to start is Antony Thomas' film "Tank Man" [pbs.org] about the famous film of the guy who blocked the tanks' advance into Tienanmen Square.
The American propaganda machine is confused by huge amounts of money to be made out of China's slave labour. That's good for capitalism, just as it was under the Nazi's when Hitler's Germany was the only European country where US investment increased (and at the incredible rate of 48% over just a few years) so a solution has to be found which allows China to be "most favoured trading nation" but official disapproval of communism still expressed.
The solution settled on seems to be to pretend that the Chinese government "has seen the light" and is introducing capitalism. This can be painted as a victory for western values while the reality that the vast majority of China is still available for work at what might as well be zero pay can be used to make massive profits for multi-nationals who are "in" with the Oligarchs who rule it.
The new middle classes in China are shiney and bright but they are a tiny minority in a vast sea of repressed people on the edge of starvation with a life expectancy which is actually decreasing. They look good in documentaries about the upcomming Chinese Olympics and suchlike but their real purpose is to make a west-friendly face for investment and political photo-ops.
Re:Was this article written by the Chinese? (Score:3, Interesting)
As you're handing out the criticism, dont forget to mention the other side of the coin. How about 'intellectual property legislation so out of control that domestic workers can no longer compete'.
Unions arent alone in driving spiralling costs. Rent-seeking is rife in the whole economy.
Better tour arround Shen Zhen and DVD factory (Score:1, Interesting)
Re:Chinese work conditions (Score:1, Interesting)
Re:Scary... (Score:2, Interesting)
Just because it's different from what you're used to and you can't understand it doesn't make it something horrible. People need to realize that the majority of the population in modern China don't live in shitholes or scrabble for a living by putting up with a shitty job and abuse. Assembly line jobs in China are perfectly respectable - in fact, it's the same in Canada, where I live; assembly line labourers make quite a tidy sum compared to other manual labourers. No abuse going on here, move right along.
Re:Unions (Score:4, Interesting)
Although I am too lazy to dig up links to the online citations - from what I have read - one of the largest causes of the economic problems in the former USSR was Wall Street & the US government's poorly conceived and even more poorly executed attempts to "jumpstart" a captalist system over there after the fall of socialism.
In extremely simplistic terms, they simply threw money at the situation without much in the way of accountability. The end result, as is always the case when accountability is not a strong requirement, was endemic corruption.
From the tone of the reports I've seen, Russia would probably be a whole lot more democratic with decently competitive free markets if the US had just left it alone to sort things out on its own after the revolution. Instead, they got the equivalent of the dot-com-bomb - tons of companies spending willy-nilly in order to "get in on the ground floor" who eventually abandonded the country to the aftermath of all that poorly spent money and political 'advising.'
A number of separate issues are being fudged... (Score:5, Interesting)
Q1: Are working conditions in countries such as China perfect by our standards?
A: Obviously not, too strict.
Q2&3: Are working conditions good enough by their standards? Are working conditions better than, for example, working on a peasant farm?
A: Yes, otherwise why would they work there? There's plenty of peasant farms in China -- people are leaving them in droves.
Q3: Will working in such standards help raise the wealth of China so that in years hence they can afford to have our standard of living -- along with real unions, health care, etc.
A: Yes - globalisation in East Asia has brought about the greatest mass liberation from poverty in the history of the planet. For interesting data, check out:
http://hdr.undp.org/statistics/data/ [undp.org]
Click on Human development trends 2005 NEW !
Q4: How would China be without globalisation?
A: Check out Burma or North Korea, both of which are following their own roads to paradise.
Q5: Is the rise of such factories a challenge to labour in developed countries?
A: Yes of course - globalisation is not a zero sum game -- it does make all coutnries better off -- but jobs will go where they can be done cheapest. And that does include a lot of skilled tech jobs.
Q6: Is the rise of China accompanied by extra pollution?
A: You bet.
However, I believe it's worth it overall -- a country as big as China is never going to be raised from poverty through our charity. It needs industry. This will be accompanied, as it was in the West, by pollution, and also by job losses. But everyone reading this has reaped the benefits of industrialisation (computers don't grow on trees), now it's their turn.
Re:Chinese work conditions (Score:4, Interesting)
Sometimes it is even worse. I am a city employee (firefighter) salaried at a 40 hr week but have to work a 46.7 hr week. Granted I am supposed to have 6.7 hours of sleep at work but that never happens because we are one of the busiest stations.
Re:A number of separate issues are being fudged... (Score:5, Interesting)
You may believe that. I'm sure you do. But all I know is that I'm earning a lot more than I was when I entered the work force twenty-six years ago, yet have less buying power than I've ever had, and frankly don't perceive a future that's anywhere near as bright as you seem to make it. Sure, globalization may not be a zero-sum game
I've heard too many people carry on about the supposed benefits of what is variously termed "globalization" or the "global economy". I have yet to see any of these mythical benefits, in fact, so far as I'm concerned all that is happening is just an example of involuntary foreign aid from the United States to China. So be it. But don't try to sugar-coat what is really going on. China is not interested in economic competition with the United States. It wants to eliminate the U.S. from the world scene as a viable competitor.
Re:Chinese work conditions (Score:3, Interesting)
I'd say that the fairest method is by companies competing for the workforce. Locking Employer and Employee in and endless struggle against each other is neither fair nor a good solution to the problem (what if I don't want to be in a union? Not so fair them is it?) Healthy competition has served us quite well in recent history.
Unions are more necessary than ever if we want all Americans to share in the prosperity that their hard work has created through productivity growth. Just because we're not fighting against a 72-hour workweek anymore doesn't mean the basic reason for the existence of unions, to create equal bargaining power for workers, is any less desirable.
No. A more balanced import and export sheet with the rest of the world and a great (high) education system will ensure American prosperity in the future. Modernization would be a boon as well. Relatively few Americans' hard work has created the productivity growth we've seen (I attribute most of that growth to the baby boomers). Some American's also don't deserve to share in those benefits. Prosperity is not a guarantee in life, nor should it be.
Having also worked in a union myself (not for the big G however), it's laughable to say that the basic reason for the existence of unions is to create equal bargaining power for workers. That might have been true a century ago when there were no such thing as child labor laws, the 40 hour work week, minimum wage, etc, but it is, quite frankly, a stupid reason to argue for their existence now. The laws are in place, they're not going anywhere, the workers have won...and there was much rejoicing.
Let me give some examples of how unions have failed America:
1. Cough. The automobile industry. 'nuff said.
2. Longshore union. They pretty much get first dibs on stuff coming in from over seas, and anything that goes, uh, "missing" is just shrinkage that gets added to the cost of business (read: we pay for it). Despite their jobs being completely useless in an age of robots, they've somehow terrorized shipping companies and lawmakers into giving them the 5 finger discount, 6 figure salaries, and pensions. How hard do they work? Most of them sit on their ass and watch machines do the work they used to do (it's okay to use a machine as long as you still pay the man who's job is being taken over). Useful!
3. If you lived in Southern California you should remember the strike that took place a few years ago in many grocery stores (Vons/Safeway). Not only do these people get paid damn good money for work that requires nothing more than a high school education, they had full healthcare benefits. Why'd they strike? Cause "The Man" wanted them to pay a co-pay like the rest of us. Solution: a strike that will eventually allow other nonunionized grocery chains to overtake them. Nothing says short term profit like long term unemployment!
4. Unionized government labor. Yes, I realize the parent here is one of those people. Thanks to this bullshit (read: pension plans) the City of San Diego is for all practical purposes bankrupt. Mmm. Fiscal 2007 budget: $2.6 billion. Pension fund deficit: $1.43 billion. Solution: cut funding to everything that doesn't have "political suicide" written on it and raise taxes. Sure am glad we have unions! (source: http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/metro/pension/2 0060619-9999-1n19bankrupt.html [signonsandiego.com]
5. I would say that the downfall of American construction/manufacturing is directly tied to unions who tried to keep jobs no matter what. The resulting inability to compete in the global marketplace doomed the corporations that employed them. I wonder how many familys w
Re:A number of separate issues are being fudged... (Score:5, Interesting)
A: Yes, otherwise why would they work there? There's plenty of peasant farms in China -- people are leaving them in droves.
It's worth noting that this isn't an automatically safe assumption. Much of Africa, right now, has a huge influx of people from the farms to the cities, but there is little or no economic growth (often there's profoundly negative growth instead), and it doesn't seem increased job opportunities or quality of life are driving it at all. It also doesn't seem to be driven by agri-business taking over land formerly held by families, or any of the other causes usually cited in other cases. The same goes for parts of South America.
One guess is that African urbanization is being driven almost totally by non-economic factors, such as fear of mercenary bandit forces invading rural villages. This is a very real risk in some places, but also an incredibly overhyped risk in others where it is geographically unfeasable and not historically seen, yet waves of rumors seem to spring up from nowhere, and people respond to them in states of near panic by moving to the citys even with no prospect of employment or socal services.
China, and most of Asia, seems to be roughly following the model of the west, where flight to the urban centers is at least sometimes driven by desire to better oneself. However, they also have concurrent pressures the 'first world' didn't. In the US and Europe, we had songs and jokes (How are you gonna keep 'em down on the farm, after they've seen Paris?) ever since the 1910's, while big Agribusiness presures lagged that by 50 years or so. In China, the two are nearly running in sync.
Re:Slanted? (Score:3, Interesting)
"We're your local union reps. You sign these papers and we automatically deduct your union fees from your wages. Does anyone not want to join the union? [pause] Good."
Now there was nothing DIRECTLY threatening, but as an 18 year old I wasn't about to raise my hand and point out that I'd not like to join the union...
I fully believe his story.
Re:Was this article written by the Chinese? (Score:1, Interesting)
But an interesting study was done by Vicente Navarro, a professor at Johns Hopkins who works on public health issues. He decided to reanalyze the statistics, separating out the factors of race and class. For example, he looked at white workers and black workers versus white executives and black executives. He discovered that much of the difference between blacks and whites was actually a class difference. If you look at poor white workers and white executives, the gap between them is enormous.
The study was obviously relevant to epidemiology and public health, so he submitted it to the major American medical journals. They all rejected it. He then sent it to the world's leading medical journal, Lancet, in Britain. They accepted it right away.
The reason is very clear. In the United States you're not allowed to talk about class differences. In fact, only two groups are allowed to be class-conscious in the United States. One of them is the business community, which is rabidly class-conscious. When you read their literature, it's all full of the danger of the masses and their rising power and how we have to defeat them. It's kind of vulgar, inverted Marxism.
The other group is the high planning sectors of the government. They talk the same way -- how we have to worry about the rising aspirations of the common man and the impoverished masses who are seeking to improve standards and harming the business climate.
So they can be class-conscious. They have a job to do. But it's extremely important to make other people, the rest of the population, believe that there is no such thing as class. We're all just equal, we're all Americans, we live in harmony, we all work together, everything is great.
Take, for example, the book Mandate for Change, put out by the Progressive Policy Institute, the Clinton think tank. It was a book you could buy at airport newsstands, part of the campaign literature describing the Clinton administration's program. It has a section on "entrepreneurial economics," which is economics that's going to avoid the pitfalls of the right and the left.
It gives up these old-fashioned liberal ideas about entitlement and welfare mothers having a right to feed their children -- that's all passé. We're not going to have any more of that stuff. We now have "enterprise economics," in which we improve investment and growth. The only people we want to help are workers and the firms in which they work.
According to this picture, we're all workers. There are firms in which we work. We would like to improve the firms in which we work, like we'd like to improve our kitchens, get a new refrigerator.
There's somebody missing from this story -- there are no managers, no bosses, no investors. They don't exist. It's just workers and the firms in which we work. All the administration's interested in is helping us folks out there.
The word entrepreneurs shows up once, I think. They're the people who assist the workers and the firms in which they work. The word profits also appears once, if I recall. I don't know how that sneaked in -- that's another dirty word, like class.
Or take the word jobs. It's now used to mean profits. So when, say, George Bush took off to Japan with Lee Iacocca and the rest of the auto executives, his slogan was "Jobs, jobs, jobs." That's what he was going for.
We know exactly how much George Bush cares about jobs. All you have to do is look at what happened during his presidency, when the number of unemployed and underemployed officially reached about seventeen million or so -- a rise of eight million during his term of office.
He was trying to create conditions for exporting jobs overseas. He continued to help out with the undermining of unions and the lowering of real wag
This isnt new by a long shot. (Score:2, Interesting)
What you see in China will meet the same fate with even more dire consequences for a population that cannot even question the problem. If there are any benefits at the end for pulling these kind of stunts, I might as well sign up and be frozen for the next 500 years and maybe have a chance at seeing any perceived benefits.