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The Internet

Wikipedia Founder Sees Serious Quality Problems 459

Juha-Matti Laurio writes "The Wikipedia co-founder Jimmy Wales has acknowledged there are real quality problems with the online project. From the article: 'Meanwhile, criticism from outside the Wikipedia camp has been rebuffed with a ferocious blend of irrationality and vigor that's almost unprecedented in our experience: if you thought Apple, Amiga, Mozilla or OS/2 fans were er, ... passionate, you haven't met a wiki-fiddler.'"
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Wikipedia Founder Sees Serious Quality Problems

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  • revenge (Score:2, Informative)

    by jzeejunk ( 878194 ) on Tuesday October 18, 2005 @06:33PM (#13821870) Journal
    slashdot reports on wikipedia's quality hm... first thing i wanted to check was what wikipedia said about slashdot.

    Slashdot is often criticized for posting story summaries that are inaccurate and/or misspelled, and for intentionally posting articles that many find highly biased, and/or defamatory and often incite flamewars, while ignoring news or commentary on issues which outsiders may consider more serious or important (see Slashdot subculture). It is also infamous for the Slashdot effect, when thousands of Slashdot readers read an article and connect to the linked website, flooding it with unexpected traffic, and at times bringing the site down in a manner similar to a Denial of Service attack. The use of "slashdot" as a verb refers to this effect.

    Well I don't see any problems with the quality of that article ;)
    Jokes aside for most things I've used wikipedia for, it has been a good help and is pretty accurate too. Might be just because I normally read at geeky/nerdy type of articles.
  • by julesh ( 229690 ) on Tuesday October 18, 2005 @06:38PM (#13821918)
    Too true. Only today I fixed an article that described "artex" as a type of wallpaper (it isn't, it's a fluid that sticks to walls or ceilings and dries into a solid surface, similar to plaster but much more versatile). The point is, it's an utterly dull subject. So nobody's bothered correcting the blatant error that a minute's research with google would tell you.
  • by FooAtWFU ( 699187 ) on Tuesday October 18, 2005 @06:50PM (#13822038) Homepage
    Jimbo started by trying paid editors; it was called Nupedia [wikipedia.org]. After three years and... well, tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars, I guess, they had a whole 24 articles!
  • Re:Orlowski rant (Score:2, Informative)

    by Wyatt Earp ( 1029 ) on Tuesday October 18, 2005 @07:52PM (#13822605)
    I've read wikipedia, /., the Register and alot of other places for a long long time. I'm a geek. I remember /. when it was Chips and Dips for godsake and the great comment ban of '98 during Operation Desert Fox.

    The Register has gotten more and more snarky in it's reporting. I don't know if it's a change in writers or tightening due to the Recession in Tech since '00. It's gotten so rough IMO that I don't go there anymore.

    Orlowski is terrible, when I've corrected him or commented to him I've gotten crappy responses when I was civil.
  • by Koushiro ( 612241 ) <koushballNO@SPAMgmail.com> on Tuesday October 18, 2005 @07:54PM (#13822621) Homepage
    You mean the controversial articles like, oh, the ones on abortion [wikipedia.org], or evolution [wikipedia.org], or apartheid [wikipedia.org], or the Israli-Palestinian conflict [wikipedia.org], or same-sex marriage [wikipedia.org], or alleged cults [wikipedia.org]...

    You have it exactly the wrong way around. These articles are some the best of Wikipedia, not the worst.
  • by Raul654 ( 453029 ) on Tuesday October 18, 2005 @08:20PM (#13822800) Homepage
    Write a full encyclopedia from scratch in 3 years? Not on your life.
     
    Britannica's various editions are typically the previous year's version, repackaged and slightly updated. Rewriting it all from scratch they typically only do about once in a lifetime. They did it (rewrote it from scratch) in 1911, and they did it again in 1976 --- to my knowledge, 1976 was the last time they completely rewrote it.
  • by SteveAyre ( 209812 ) on Tuesday October 18, 2005 @08:56PM (#13823054)
    Kind of. You can flag articles up as to be deleted because it's incorrect or wrong or something like that. There's then a brief debate on what to do with it, which could end with it being updated, merged with something else, renamed, deleted or a number of things. There's an article somewhere on how to go about it and what sort of things you can flag up. Users then discuss it and a decision's made.
    Wikipedia:Policies_and_guidelines [wikipedia.org]
    Wikipedia:Deletion_policy [wikipedia.org]

    If the problem's a factual error it relies on someone coming along, noticing it and correcting it... that perhaps does not reviewing more as it assumes the reader will spot the error. They probably won't though, as the most likely reason they are reading the page is they don't know about the subject yet.

    People *can* also watch articles so that when anyone edits it if they're an expert in the field they can read it over and see if it's correct or not. There's an option to watch it when you edit it, probably so that previous contributors can help maintain it.

    I think one good feature to add would be to stop Anonymous users editing (it's a simple policy change in the MediaWiki configuration file so is easily possible)... if you have an account they can at least attempt to track how trustworthy you are. (I'm ignoring the problem of people opening fake accounts just to muck articles up).
  • by geohump ( 782273 ) <geohumpNO@SPAMgmail.com> on Tuesday October 18, 2005 @10:50PM (#13823667) Journal
    All Jimmy Wales actually said was that two articles were terribly written. Wales has always had a goal of high quality in Wikipedia. Having two poorly written articles out of over three quarters of a million is hardly an admission of "Quality problems" except for the two particular articles cited. (yes, there are other articles that need work as well.)

    The real issue here is the repeated attacks by this reporter: Remember Andrew Orlowski is the same reporter who wrote about Wikipedia :

    """"It's the Khmer Rouge in diapers," ... which seems as good a description as any to us."""

    Clearly Andrew has found that Wikipedia bashing is an easy meal ticket and that is the actual source of his over-exaggerated headline writing. Orlonski needs to get paid and he needs his editors to view him as a positive asset, drawing lots of eyeballs to the Register website. A quick Google for Orlowski and Wikipedia shows a long, slanted history for our boy Andy.

    There is a verb for this: "Dvoraking" "To Dvorak"
    "The act of trolling by a supposedly 'professional' journalist in order to draw visitors to a webpage generating hits for the paid advertisements."

    In fact, given this background information Andrew Orlowski has less real credibility than, say, your average slashdot poster. :-).

    Orlowski isn't a total waste of time however. After all he has noted that: "Segway's brains head for toy robot", "Microsoft FAT patent rejected - again", and the incredible "Police stake out bar, hoping to catch man drunk"

    Wow, Andrew! Whats next? I wait in breathless anticipation.

    (What, proofread this? not worth the time, Andrew.)
  • by Keith McClary ( 14340 ) on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @02:24AM (#13824463)
    The "Israli-Palestinian conflict" article does not mention the issue of confiscation of Palestinian property, which is the core of the conflict and the heart and soul of "Israel".
  • Featured articles (Score:4, Informative)

    by harmonica ( 29841 ) on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @02:58AM (#13824562)
    Wikipedia works best for geeky subjects.

    I don't think that's true. Wikipedia's featured articles [wikipedia.org] come from all categories. That's certainly not a perfect proof of my point, but an indication.
  • by abbamouse ( 469716 ) on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @04:32AM (#13824794) Homepage
    Wikipedia is unreliable, and I punish students who rely on it for facts. I teach political science, and while some of the entertainment and computing entries are quite good, the history and politics articles are full of misinformation and selective/accidental omissions. I tell my students that they aren't permitted to source a fact to Wikipedia. Of course, if they get an idea from it, they are required to cite it as the source of the idea -- but they must then confirm whatever facts they want to use with a more reliable source. Of course, I generally discourage encyclopedias for all but the most mundane fact-checking, since most concepts and ideas worth discussing in academe are best covered in peer-reviewed articles in academic journals (or in some cases, in books published my respectable academic presses). Still, I wish the Wikipedia project luck, because I think it has the potential to be one of the best resources on the net; they just need to find some type of fact-checking process that works. Until then, a Wikipedia entry in a student's bibliography is a near-certain route to lost points.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @08:07AM (#13825356)
    because those "some nobody" people can be persistant.

    You write some content, they delete it. You put it back. They come back through a different internet connection and delete it. You put it back. They come back a week later and delete it. You put it back. They come back six months later. You don't put it back because you aren't still watching it because you aren't an anal-retentive so and so who obsessively manipulates an online encyclopedia article using tactics gleaned from Goebbels. And when you try to restore it a year later when you finally notice, the person responsable is a popular editor or even an admin and sucessfully maintains their status quo in their favorite articles with a mixture of subtle abuse and social engineering.

    This does happen. Many of us have seen it happen. The Wiki process is not perfect enough to stop this happening when someone with a brain larger than the average Goatse troll is going out of their way to break it.

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