Wanna Buy a Reusable Rocket for 19k USD?

Anonymous Coward writes with story from the Mainchi Daily News: "'Earlier this month, Hokkaido University started putting its Camui rockets on the open market. Camui rockets are true rockets, being 1.6 meters long, flying at 300 meters per second and parachuting slowly to the ground after reaching heights of up to 1 kilometer.' The Camui use a mixture of fixed fuel acrylic and liquid oxygen."

Re:why is this here?

[Spy Handler]

Agreed.... this thing runs on LIQUID OXYGEN for chrissakes, it should be going 60,000 feet or more. Some of the high-powered homemade rockets those guys shoot in the Nevada desert easily go 60,000 feet or more, and cost way less than 10 grand. Maybe the original article misprinted the altitude, maybe it was 10km rather than 1km.

pictures ...

[weighn]

there's some pics here [hokudai.ac.jp]. and a cnn story here [cnn.com].

Ainu

[kahei]

The real significance of this project is that it's probably about the last time anyone names anything in Ainu, the old language of Japan... ...although SNK fans will recall that Nakoruru's moves are named in Ainu, and her 'Kamui Mutsube' is Ainu for 'God Blade'. The real Ainu pronunciation would be more like 'Mutpe' though. Okay, I'm rambling.

What makes this a "True Rocket?"

[DevilsEngine]

I have hybrid engine models (acrylic / NO2) that are larger and go higher. Heck, I had refillable solid engine models that were considerably more powerful -- though with new regulations, getting the refills has become too much of a hassle. I don't see anything to this that wasn't available in dozens, if not hundreds, of High Power Rocketry models available ten years ago. Standing next to me at the moment (in two pieces, because it's too tall to be assembled indoors) is a 11' tall model on 5.5" tubing (at base, step down to 4" at top). Hybrid engine in the "L" range. It's made half a dozen flights on hybrid power, and a couple before that with solids. Easily clears a mile. Next to it is a LOC Magnum, a standard kit available for nearly a decade, with what has to be a good twenty flights to better than a kilometer on a "J" class hybrid. What makes these any less "true rockets?"

Wanna buy a re-usable rocket for 19k

[El Batemano]

No and ill tell you why, Hobby stores sell a reusable rocket with a paracute and using solid based cheap fuels that can reach a thousad meters for twenty quid. Although the one i bought turn itself into a missile shortly after take off. Skimming the heads of passers by and embedding itself into a tree. So im sure the one for 19k is a bit safer!!

Re:Within Three Seconds?

[Natchswing]

Let's see. One kilometer in one second. This would require an average velocity of flight of, oh... 1 km/s. If we had linear acceleration (rough estimate) and we started from zero (sounds like a safe assumption) then we'll have 2 km/s by the time we hit 1km altitude.

If the fuel is cut there:

vf^2=vo^2-2*a*s or 1000^2/(2*9.8)=50km

That sounds a bit better. Loki Darts [designation-systems.net] could do that.

Re:regulations

[DrXym]

Firework rockets usually consist of gunpowder propellant (to get them into the air), an explosive charge (i.e. more gunpowder tightly wrapped) and pellets containing various metallic compounds for the colourful 'starburst'. If you removed the pellets and packed it with your pathogen of choice it would have the desired effect. I imagine some thick cardboard would insulate the contents sufficiently for most of it to survive.

Re:regulations

[jguthrie]

Can anybody buy a rocket and launch it from his backyard? Well, it depends on where you live. If you live in the United States, then the answer is a qualified "yes". It's "qualified" because you're not supposed to launch any rockets near airports.

The air traffic is not really an issue, even near a airports. It's hard to hit an airplane with a rocket. That's why military missles are guided and typically use some sort of proximity fuse and explosive warhead. Those guidance systems and warheads with proximity fuses are not generally available to the general public.

Anyway, the regulations recognize three different categories of rockets. If you have a rocket that masses no more than 453 grams and has no more than 113g of grams of propellant, with no more than 62.5 grams in any given engine, then you have what is known as a "model rocket" and you can launch from anywhere that isn't near an airport it without telling anybody you're going to do it.

If you have a rocket that masses no more than 1500 grams and has no more than 125 grams of propellant, with no more than 62.5 grams of propellant in each engine, and a total impulse of no more than 160 NS and an average thrust of no more than 80 Newtons, then you have what's known as a "large model rocket", and you need to notify the FAA before you launch it.

If you have a rocket that masses more than 1500 grams, or has more than 125 grams of propellant or has more than 62.5 grams of propellant in any one engine, has a total impulse of more than 160 NS or an average impulse of more than 80 Newtons, then you have a "high power rocket" which requires that you get the FAA's permission to launch it.

There are two organizations supporting model and amateur rocketry in the USA. The National Association of Rocketry [nar.org] and the Tripoli Rocketry Association [tripoli.org]. Those web sites have links to local chapters all over the country.

Whether or not you can legally buy the propellant (premanufactured "single use" engines are recognized by everyone as legal to buy, sell, and use) is a matter of opinion, and there are lawsuits pending on that subject right now. If you have an interest in these matters, please donate the NAR legal fund or the TRA legal fund.

The guys I know who do high-power (I'm starting to do LMR's now) made a great deal of fun of these Camui rockets because the high-power guys build rockets that go a great deal higher for a lot less money. A $300 investment can get you a completely reusable rocket that goes up a couple of kilometers as well as the propellant for one flight.

Talk about overpriced

[pilot-programmer]

I am level 2 certified through the National Association of Rocketry [nar.org] and Tripoli Rocketry Association [tripoli.org]. I have rockets, built from kits purchased for under $200 and propelled by solid fuel motors [aerotech-rocketry.com] for around $200 or hybrid motors [hypertekhybrids.com] for about $100 that can carry a 0.5 pound payload far higher than one kilometer. Anybody on this list who is willing to take a few evenings to build a rocket kit, spend the money to join NAR or TRA, and join the nearest high power rocketry club will be able to launch a small TV transmitter with telemetry over one km and save $18,000 over the Japanese liquid rocket. And if you are really into liquid fuels, you can even find amateurs working with those.

Re:regulations

[solodex2151]

All of the existing regulations in place for High Power Rocketry would apply to these rockets. You need a cleared FAA wavier in order to fly anything above 2500 feet. These are not hard to obtain, and 95% of the population in the US is within 3-4 hours of a high power capable launch site. On the other hand, rockets are NOT capable of shooting down planes. Some government agencies tried proving this before, but were unsuccessful and looked like idiots doing it. Also, the rockets are not impressive at all. You can construct a much larger rocket out of composites with a homebuilt hybrid engine using HTTB and LOx as fuel compenents for under 500 dollars.