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Journal bigdreamer's Journal: The Adventures of Girl Geek, Episode II: Gay Is Bad? 17

Journal by bigdreamer

For all their claims of being individuals, my guy geek friends seem to share one conformist fear: Being gay.

My say? Gay is good. Gay is happy. (I'm straight, but I'm accepting.) Maybe the fear comes from living in the Bible Belt. My boyfriend tells me that if a guy is perceived as gay, he is looked down upon. He loses status in the pack. He is weak, effeminate, and deserves to be harassed.

Case in point: A person in the pack admitted the other day he was exhausted and would like to take a nice, hot bath.
Gay alert! BATHS? REAL MEN SHOWER! Instant shun. No namecalling. Just snickering, subtle jokes. Isolation. Nothing terrible, but there, nonetheless.

Problem is, my good friend is gay and he is stronger, more handsome, more popular, more charismatic, and can get more women than any of my straight friends. And frankly, he can physically kick all of their asses with ease.

So I find this immature, ignorant, and stupid. I usually understand men (better than I do other women) but this stumps me. Is this some young twenty-something phase? Do most men have this fear? You men got some 'splainin' to do.

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The Adventures of Girl Geek, Episode II: Gay Is Bad? More

The Adventures of Girl Geek, Episode II: Gay Is Bad?

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  • goat (Score:1, Offtopic)

    by Metrollica ( 552191 )
    goat [ebay.com]
  • As a happily gay geek, I have to say I think it's probably just your Bible-Belt placement :-) Both gay men and geeks find the Internet a great way to find like-minded people, so it's hardly surprising that the overlap between the two is quite large. Gay geeks are both the best kind of geeks and the best kind gay guys, in my opinion (but hey, I'm biased :->! Not to mention unbelievably egotistical )
    • I've decided to make you my friend! :D

      In my experience, my gay friends tend to be much more fun, open-minded, and better looking their their straight counterparts. (I'm generalizing, here, but you get the picture.)

      I'm glad to know that that there is life outside of the Bible-Belt. We really need to loosen up around here.

  • Here's thoughts out of my personal experiences. They might shed some light on the fear of appearing to have qualities that are often associated with being gay by society.

    First some details about me, so you understand context:

    I've been a geek since I was born. I spent a lot of saturdays in my room reading. I've never found sports to be terribly interesting. I found, in general, males my own age to be not terribly bright and not interesting.

    At age 8, I overheard my father discussing with my mother weather I was gay. Because I wasn't interested in sports or fixing cars, only reading books and playing with computers. My father was a homophobe, a drunk, and eventually an attempted murder, but at age 8, you want your father's respect, even when you should know better.

    In my particular case, I decided at an early age, conciously that I didn't care, wasn't going to be made to conform to what society expected me to be. To heck with them.

    But I can understand, how other males in similar circumstances with slightly less obviously disfunctional fathers might well take care to make sure they didn't have the traits that society associates with being homosexual.

    As for me, I kinda like who I am, and have long since decided that I was right at 8 when I decided the rest of the world could go to heck, although I might use stronger language now :)

    This peek into the windows of my life has been brought to you by the letter T and the ascii code 254.
    • If I had mod points, I'd mod you +1 Insightful. But I never have mod points, for some reason-only meta-moderating priveleges. Oh, well.

      In my particular case, I decided at an early age, conciously that I didn't care, wasn't going to be made to conform to what society expected me to be. To heck with them.

      Wish I learned that that early in life. I didn't accept that consciously till I was 17, and I still have that problem subconsciously. I find myself worrying about what people think about me being constantly late to everything. On medication for anxiety, even. It's very difficult.

      I'm still not quite sure why men fear being gay. I guess it's sort of like my fear about what will happen when people find out I have no desire to have children.

      "It's not natural!" "Every woman should be a mother!" And this is from the women...men are more accepting of this. Hmm. Journal topic idea for the future.

      Thanks for the thoughts.
      • I'm still not quite sure why men fear being gay. I guess it's sort of like my fear about what will happen when people find out I have no desire to have children.

        I'm not sure I could have phrased it better myself. I think it's percisely analogous. A man's 'duty' is to be a strong partner for a woman and to father kids (preferably sons, to carry on the family name. How dumb is that?) If we don't do this, we are seen, often by our own fathers as being a failure.

        And since males are just as socialized to play follow the leader as women are (just different leaders. A man is 'strong' (so his wife will do what he tells her to), a man has 'honor' (so he'll run into enemy fire when war comes). The leaders are just as real, for being ideals, instead of the man who put a ring on your finger.) we believe it. If I don't carry on my father's name, I'm a failure. *laughs* the strange thing is, I probably will, in spite of it all. My fiance likes my last name, go figure. Not that I particularly like it. I was all ready to adopt her last name (and my father would turn over in his grave...) but she wants to take mine. I wonder if we can just swap? :)

        Maybe I can luck out and have daughters. It's a cruel world to be male in.

        Don't worry about the mod points. I long since stopped caring about them, and capped out my karma too. Far more interesting is hearing your replies to my thoughts. As for your mod points, it may just be too early. I believe /.'s userbase has to grow 10% from when you joined before you're eligable for modership.

        Minupla
        • Sometimes I feel weird because I'm not feminine. I've just recently noticed that people treat me different because I'm female (or that I'm white, for that matter...) silly judgmental things. Yes, since I have the XX chromosome and my skin is in a certain range of shades, people expect that I will have kids and be fairly well-off, and somehow my brain isn't capable of "male" subjects like technology/business. I find that amusing because I major in CIS and Management. So much for that.

          My family indoctrinated me to go to college, be a teacher, then quit work and pop out a couple kids. When I realized what was going on, I moved out. Well, I'm oversimplifying things, but basically they wanted me to live the lives they had, and I wanted to make a new path. One of us had to go, and Mom and Dad weren't going anywhere.

          Leaving home gave me time to explore what I was really like. I also learned to appreciate the fact I'm female. Being a woman sucks in a lot of ways. Most of the ways are bad. As if the physical burdens of fertility aren't enough, there's the whole physical strength difference. Some people assume that justifies beating/raping/abusing women. I say someone who gets a kick out of dominating people smaller than themselves are the epitomy (sp?) of cowardice.

          There's this whole subconscious attitude among people that women only act or think like X. Women can and do think like X. I think and act like X. But I also think in Y, Z, A, D, etc. etc. Yeah, I'll act silly and post my picture and ask, "You like?" Sometimes I'm like that. Other times, I want to discuss applied algorithms in Perl. I'm a human being, you know. I don't stick to one subject or attitude all the time. I don't expect other people to. Why do some of them expect that from me? Well, aside from this rant, I am doing something about this. I've noticed that hanging around people with such attitudes influences them without me really saying anything. Leading by example will probably affect more people than posting this rant.
          • I have a close friend I've known since I was a teenager. Being 15 yrs older then me, she was married with 2 kids when I met her. Her daughters are mid-teen now.

            A few months back, I got a call from her. Her youngest daughter was sexually asaulted, while on a run behind her house. She lucked out, since then the ... there's no word for it, I can't come up with a strong enough expletive... has killed a woman, and put another into a coma.

            I've known the daughter since she was 3 or 4. It almost killed me to hear about it. If there was anything I could do more to change the world, I would do it in an instant for that young lady, for my mom too, for that matter.

            Honestly, I don't know how other males can't see it, or if they do see it, how they can stand by and do nothing. I've seen it happen a lot of times, and where I've had power, I try and do what I can to redress the situation (and have paid a price for it, but that's fine, friends like that I do not need).

            I guess, in a roundabout way we come back to the original subject of your journal. Given the costs, in social terms, associated with being different (be that in terms of intellectual powress, sex, sexual orientation, color, economic status, etc), if you're not different, I guess we have to expect that you would do whatever you could to avoid appearing different.

            As for myself, I'm never going to pull off being 'normal' :). (I'm normal, everyone else is a fscking loon! :))

            If you have any bright ideas on how we can change the world, I'd be happy to hear them, because frankly, I'm plum out at the moment.

            And I am a sysadmin/managment type, happy to see another one! The world needs more technical managers with some actual technical skills.

            Minupla
            • Experts say people rape for a sense of power. Rape is the most cowardly, weak thing someone could ever do, harming a relative weakling in that way.

              There was a rape near my campus a week ago. I stay at home at night now. I'm tiny enough as it is, better not push my luck.

              I guess, in a roundabout way we come back to the original subject of your journal. Given the costs, in social terms, associated with being different (be that in terms of intellectual powress, sex, sexual orientation, color, economic status, etc), if you're not different, I guess we have to expect that you would do whatever you could to avoid appearing different.

              I try that. It never works. Plus, the idea of "Being twice as good to show you're half as competent as the norm" depresses me.

              I occasionally wonder if life would be easier with a sex change. Then I realize the benefits aren't worth the effort. Plus, I'd have to be male socially, and that, pardon the pun, would suck.

              I view people as individuals who just happen to be male/female/black/white/ethnic/religious/social class/whatever.That's my solution. I never realized what I did till after Sept. 11th. Then the reality of discrimination became real, because I found myself doing it against Middle Easterners, because I was afraid. Stupid. So now I've gone back to seeing people as people, but now I'm much more aware of the prejudice in this world.

              Sorry, I'm depressed today.
        • Maybe I can luck out and have daughters. It's a cruel world to be male in.

          Thanks for your enlightening perspective on things. I think it's just a cruel world. But I'm a bit depressed right now, for no discernible reason. So pardon my negativity.

          It's upsetting, in a way, that people discriminate or put standards on you because they think you fit some sort of category. I am slowly beginning to realize that those people are messed up. I am gradually developing my own standards and my own definitions of success and happiness. I am used to being a slave to everyone else's standards, but I am gradually developing my own. I guess it's all part of being a geek. [circus.com] I quote:

          "The unwritten geek credo states that originality and strangeness are good, and that blind conformity and stupidity are unforgivable. "
          -From Geek: A Definition by Omni.

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