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Software PVRs Becoming Tivo Killers
Posted by
Zonk
on Tue Oct 11, 2005 01:29 PM
from the sad-state-of-affairs dept.
from the sad-state-of-affairs dept.
mikemuch writes "ExtremeTech's Jason Cross examines PVR software that runs on Windows -- applications from SnapStream, Cyberlink, and SageTV. With TiVo's mounting price hikes, service contracts, and 'features' like self-deleting shows, the DIY option is getting more appealing all the time." From the article: "All the major TV features you're used to with TiVo or Windows Media Center Edition are there--quick 30 second skip, padding show recordings (start early and stop late), a nice integrated guide with easy-to-read program info. The interface design isn't quite as good as either of those two other options, but it's one of the best we've seen in a Windows-based PVR application outside of MCE. If we had to pick an annoyance, it's that you can't seem to bring up the program guide or navigate the menu without stopping the live TV or recording that you're watching. TiVo plays the current TV program in the background, and MCE plays it in a small window in the lower left. We didn't miss it until it was gone."
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Software PVRs Becoming Tivo Killers
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MCE for me, unfortunately (Score:5, Interesting)
(http://www.unanimocracy.com/about.html | Last Journal: Tuesday April 04 2006, @12:04PM)
I tried EVERY other Win & Lin PVR and none were as stable or easy to install/use. The new Rollup2 for MCE adds copy/view restrictions but they're relying on the video driver and encoder to pass the flag. I found a driver that doesn't pass the flag, and I'm happy.
I'd love to switch to Meedio or MythTV but recent trials a few weeks ago vetoed the idea. Stability and ease of use weren't there yet. MCE is a performance hog but it works. No kludges, never crashes and really integrates well in my house with the Xbox Extender.
My reason... (Score:5, Interesting)
(http://skippus.blogspot.com/ | Last Journal: Sunday June 19 2005, @07:25AM)
I can't speak for the parent, but one reason I'm attracted to MythTV is because of external modules, stuff like MythGame, MythWeather, MythPhone, etc.
As for TiVo, they still (for now) have one big advantage for me: I'm a DirecTV subscriber, and TiVo is the only device that will record the digital signal instead of the analog conversion. When DirecTV starts offering their own DVRs, I'll probably start using it instead. I love my TiVo and MythTV, but the most important thing to me is seeing what I watch in its glorious original quality.
Re:My reason... (Score:5, Informative)
TiVo Too (Score:4, Informative)
(http://slashdot.org/)
Re:MCE for me, unfortunately (Score:5, Insightful)
(http://www.unanimocracy.com/about.html | Last Journal: Tuesday April 04 2006, @12:04PM)
Every MythTV I've built has involved future phone calls. I've followed guides and tried various installs. When my home MythTV burped, it was hours of hitting forums to resolve.
I've been building PCs (Win & Lin) for 19 years. I love Linux, but MythTV is ill supported.
Funny thing... I had to call MS once for an MCE issue, and tech support figured it out in 10 minutes.
When a F/OSS PVR passes the WAF, I'll keep it.
Re:MCE for me, unfortunately (Score:5, Funny)
(http://www.unanimocracy.com/about.html | Last Journal: Tuesday April 04 2006, @12:04PM)
10. Less chance of catching VD.
9. Laundry always clean
8. Personal Memory Backup
7. Cheaper insurance rates
6. Morning Sex
5. Ego boost (she's hott)
4. Someone to procreate with without threat of lawsuit or ridiculous child support hassles
3. Inside jokes get better
2. Introduction to non-AnCap views
1. Morning Sex
Re:MCE for me, unfortunately (Score:5, Insightful)
(http://www.unanimocracy.com/about.html | Last Journal: Tuesday April 04 2006, @12:04PM)
I was "lucky" to run a very successful BBS starting at age 12. By 14 I was earning enough to move it to a commercial space, basically moving out from home.
I don't know how old you are, but I can give you some advice...
First, if you have even the slightest desire to marry some day, NEVER live with a girlfriend . Ever. Even a fiance. Live together after the wedding.
Why? Cohabitating can create very bad codependencies. You need to test your girlfriend's ability to make it on her own. Don't seriously date girls who live at home. Casual dating is fine with them.
Don't date girls in massive debt. Don't date girls with all guy friends and 1 girlfriend, or girls who say "I hate girls." Don't date girls that your friends don't like or that don't like your friends. Don't date girls who can only have a good time drinking or smoking up.
With that out of the way, it shouldn't be hard to find a girl who can handle your PC "addiction," or in my case, gadget addiction. The "no" girls I listed above will have a propensity towards jealousy -- over friends, family and even toys.
My lady met me when I had 7 PCs at home. Now I only have 1 media PC and 1 PDA, but not because of her. I'm bored with technology. I know she'd love a new notebook at home
If you can use your PC skills to strike out on your own (consult), she'll see value. Even better, build a tech bench with a power strip on a timer -- have it force you off between 5pm and 8pm for spouse time!
Re:MCE for me, unfortunately (Score:4, Funny)
Re:MCE for me, unfortunately (Score:5, Informative)
(http://slashdot.org/)
Re:MCE for me, unfortunately -- TRY GB-PVR (Score:4, Informative)
(Last Journal: Friday July 18 2003, @10:31AM)
Both of these fine products are easier to setup than MythTV or Freevo (I tried those too).
Just another alternative to MCE.
Re:Easy to use Windows PVR software: GB-PVR (Score:5, Informative)
(http://kerrdivine.googlepages.com/ | Last Journal: Wednesday March 17 2004, @05:58PM)
Re:Windows based? Who cares? (Score:4, Interesting)
Why mess around with a Windows-based PVR, when there's Linux and OS X?
I've seen enough Windows-based solutions to be 100% positive that I made the right decision going with a Mac and the EyeTV 500. If I cared about streaming video all over the house, I probably would have looked at getting my fingernails dirty with MythTV on Linux, but I don't so the Mac does a fine job of what I want.
So why even look at whatever "me too" offering the Windows world is currently coming up with? Go for one of the obvious choices and spend your time agonizing over which projector to buy.
Not for Joe Public (Score:5, Insightful)
Price Point (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Price Point (Score:4, Insightful)
Also, why wont it be up 24/7? My desktop (and I figure most user's on slashdot) has been up for the past 9 months with 2 days of downtime.
Software PVR killed my Tivo. (Score:3, Funny)
Need a clue here- (Score:5, Insightful)
(http://www.angelfire.com/va2/AlfaFiles | Last Journal: Wednesday August 24 2005, @01:32PM)
But what confuses me is this: All the "new" features they keep adding, seem like a step backward to me, are these features forced upon you regardless of device you have, or are "1st Gen" model TiVOs and whatnot, valuable property for ignoring all the new stuff?
Re:Need a clue here- (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Great timing on the topic (Score:5, Insightful)
But then again I'm a Mac person, and I value things that just work.
What about MediaPortal? (Score:5, Informative)
Re:What about MediaPortal? (Score:4, Informative)
BeyondTV for portability (Score:5, Interesting)
(http://www.informationr.us/ | Last Journal: Monday November 05, @09:38AM)
80 GB and then some... (Score:3, Insightful)
(http://www.dragonswest.com/ | Last Journal: Monday November 05, @07:35PM)
With the ability, for years, to record straight to my HD I couldn't think of a decent reason to get a TiVo. Heck, I even get TV schedules and can pick and choose what to record, when and it came with my ATI video card. No funny business, telling me what I can and can't record, how long it lasts, what I can do with it, etc. It's all a bunch of MPEG files and plays as good as when I recorded it.
This all subject to change when everything goes HD.
I have my OWN TiVO Killer... (Score:5, Funny)
(http://www.joshdm.com/ | Last Journal: Friday February 16 2007, @11:14AM)
Tivo Advertising a Household Name (Score:3, Interesting)
(http://sumdog.com/ | Last Journal: Tuesday October 18 2005, @10:54PM)
Although some of these references may have just been for the hell of it, like on talk shows, when the name comes up in sitcoms and dramas, it's pretty safe to assume the plug was paid for.
Living in the southern US, everyone down here likes to refer to generic products by their brand name. Every soda in the word becomes a "Coke" even if its a Pepsi, every portable mp3 player becomes an "iPod" even if it's an "iPlay" and now ever PVR device is being referred to as a "TiVo" when it's really a Comcast PVR (which is probably made by Motorola or some other company).
TiVo might go away, but the name will stick in every household.
You Can't beat the Cable Companies Offerings... (Score:3, Insightful)
The standard offerings by cable companies are pretty good. Cost $5 a month for standard definition PVRs or $10 a month for the HD PVRs.
That $10 a month for the HD PVR is practically untouchable. There just isn't any HD PVR solutions that are comparable. I am talking about more than just the over the air HD content that MythTV, et. all. can record. HBO-HD, InHD, TnTHD, Discovery HD, etc.
You can get cable boxes that output HD over firewire for recording purposes, but those firewire devices must respect the "Broadcast Flag" like signal the cable companies have implented. IE, you don't control the content coming from that port.
I am coming from an HD centric view point. SD centric viewers obviously have more choices and options available to them.
Slashdot idiocy (Score:5, Informative)
What series of price hikes are you referring to? The prices for the Tivos themselves have been consistently dropping, albeit with rebates (and the before rebate prices haven't been going up). The monthly subscription fee has increased just once in the past several years - certainly not at all in the 2+ years I've been a subscriber - and the multi-unit fee has actually DROPPED.
I'm guessing you've never had a Tivo - you just get all your "facts" from Slashdot discussions?
Re:Slashdot idiocy (Score:5, Informative)
(http://www.devaudio.org/)
Re:Slashdot idiocy (Score:4, Insightful)
(http://slashdot.org/)
Good free one (Score:4, Insightful)
(http://brownman.org/modernphysics)
1) Meedio/MeedioTV - buggy as hell. And slow. It's also very new, as in a few months (MeedioTV is, at least). Looks nice, though.
2) SageTV - the built-in video browser/viewer isn't that good. I found setting up plugins sort of a pain, and I could never easily get ComSkip to work well. Maybe it was just me. It's also kind of pricey.
3) BeyondTV - no videomedia component at all; you have to separately purchase BeyondMedia. Other than that, I like this one the best. Never really tried messing with any plugins.
4) GBPVR - pretty good as is, much better with the MyVideos plugin and some other plugins that are very painless to install. Downside is none of the skins, even the MCE port, are attractive at all. Also, sometimes there's a lag between hitting a key and getting a response. Few crashes, less than Meedio but more than Sage/BeyondTV (I have roughly one crash every 3 weeks, running 24/7). Have to renew your Zap2It profile every three months to get an EPG, which is kind of annoying. Installing ComSkip a breeze, and it will auto-ship commercials (BTV and Sage require you to press some button during commercials to skip them, presumably for legal reasons; I'm not sure with Meedio).
There you go. There are plenty of other ones, like Media Portal or Myth. I've never tried MCE, though, and most people I talk to like that best if for no other reason than the WAF (wife acceptance factor). Likely, my gf prefers software she's used to, and since I already showed her how GBPVR works, she's happy with it. As long as Desperate Housewives and The Daily Show are recorded, the GBP-vo stays.
What's wrong with Tivo? (Score:5, Interesting)
(http://impact-technologies.com/ | Last Journal: Wednesday September 07 2005, @06:34AM)
TiVo's true source of concern (Score:5, Insightful)
(http://www.unity08.com/)
Someone could probably come up with a software solution to defeat 5C, but with the DMCA [wikipedia.org] in place and without the DMCRA [wikipedia.org] to defend our rights, doing so would be illegal. Essentially, it takes open-source PVRs, which are legal and worthwhile in the analog domain, and puts them in the category of tools for piracy when used in the digital domain. And what's more, the DTLA [wikipedia.org] (which administers licensing of DTCP) will, just like the DVD-CCA, never ever ever grant a license for someone wanting to build an open-source PVR.
TiVo has nothing to worry about from software PVRs - they'll die off slowly as the shift to digital HD continues. Then the entertainment industry can finish TiVo off at its leisure.
small error in article re: program guide (Score:4, Informative)
Not Really... (Score:3, Insightful)
(http://slashdot.org/)
From the article:
Not really, unless you're a geek with too much time on your hands. The DIY option will become appealing when it's as easy to install and set up as any other off the shelf appliance. Until then, a DIY PVR a hobby.
TiVo, for all of it's faults, is still trivial to set up and use. In fact, it's so easy to use that my six year old child (who can barely read) figured it out. My wife and I were so happy with ours that we just purchased a second TiVo (the current rebate didn't hurt).