China's Superior Technologies

paRcat writes "Still think China is a land too far away from everything? This article compares some of China's common uses of technology to what we're accustomed to in the West. With the genius traffic lights and the cell phone coverage... I'm kinda jealous."

Statistics

If you consider the growth of infrastructure in China to the rate of upgrading in the west is it any wonder they are ahead?

They are clearly putting in far more effort than any western government to modernize their country.

A government for the people, what a novel thought.

Re:Statistics

China a "modern country"?
With a "government for the people"?

Hello? Is there anybody home?

In China you get into jail for saying what you think. People are imprisoned and tortured. Human rights violated. How much a nerd does one need to be in order to trade cellphone coverage for freedom?

(Amnesty International's report on China is worth a read: http://web.amnesty.org/report2004/chn-summary-eng)

Re:Statistics

How much a nerd does one need to be in order to trade cellphone coverage for freedom? This is a trick question, right :)

and we have...

abu-gharaib.
We even export our human rights violations.

Re:Statistics

In China you get into jail for saying what you think. People are imprisoned and tortured. Human rights violated.

You can be imprisoned indefinatly with no reason given and with no access to a lawyer - here in the UK, and the Patroit act does pretty much the same I believe.

I'm so glad we're free.

Re:Statistics

Amnesty International's report on the USA is worth a read as well: http://web.amnesty.org/report2004/usa-summary-eng

Re:Statistics

You should also check the one on France and Germany. Infact you should check on it for what every country you live in. IF you can not get to the website then you know you have some real issues. Can the people in China read the report on China?

Re:A government for the people?

The United States executes juveniles and the retarded. We detain Muslims. We invade countries then torture their populace.

Why is that insightful?

Re:A government for the people?

we also elect retards

Re:Statistics

They are clearly putting in far more effort than any western government to modernize their country.

This is one of the tradeoffs between free markets and command economies. Although free markets are great from the point of view of moving quickly to a local optimum in resource utilization, their coverage and consistency are spotty. Command economies tend to pick winners too early and their implementations can be inefficient and hang around too long, but they usually achieve complete coverage and relative consistency.

The best of both worlds is when you "let a thousand flowers bloom" in the early stages, pick a winner for full implementation, and revisit the infrastructure choices on a regular basis to reopen debate. Of course, ideologues of either stripe would usually disavow this solution, as that might force them to widen their narrow models of the world - far too painful to comptemplate!

"Let a thousand flowers bloom," Historical Backgrd

"Let a thousand flowers bloom," is an interesting quote. This comment was made by Chairman Mao in the 1970's to see who really opposed his policies by letting everyine express themselves. There was a period of free speech and outpourings of democratic writings, especially on college Campuses, that was followed by brutal repression and jailings of many university students and professors when Mao felt like it had run it's course.

"Let a thousand flowers bloom," was more or less a political tactic by Mao to exterminate his enemies in the Communist Party. Not sure what this has to do with economic policy and such.

Re:lesson of Japan's stagnation

Actually Japan collapsed for another reason.

Though part of it is what you are talking about.

Their research isn't progressing where it needs to yet. Their country devoted itself singlemindedly to the war, then to industrial and economic growth, now they feel they are better than everyone else so they are essentially wanking.

If you go for a haircut there will be 6 haircutters, people sweep the streets in business suits. Basically their entire economy went from manufacturing to service in a generation.

Service economies are total bullshit, guess what YOU CAN DO IT YOURSELF!

The U.S. went from a manufacturing economy in the 50's to a pure greed mentality in the 80's to a purely consumer driven society in the 90's. It's amazing how changes like this can sweep a whole nation.

Unfortunatly all these trends are negative, it's just the ignorant bouncing around. The people really gettting work done just say, hey there's this thing, might be worth doing, let's do it.

Re:lesson of Japan's stagnation

The one thing I like about Japan's stagnation is that there is no poverty there. It is amazing that in a country as rich as the USA, 12% of the people there live in poverty. Guess what, that is the same as in China.

In USA when the economy suffers, it is mostly the poor on whom it is taken out on. They lose insurance, they lose their jobs and so on. In Japan, they stop growing but guess what, they are not really sweating it. They value different things. Americans value riches and expensive cars. The Japanese actually do get by with Toyotas. Witness how the Lexus brand ws only recently introduced in Japan after being in USA and Europe for the past 20 odd years. And it is owned wholly by a Japanese company. Because the Japanese do not have such big brand mentality, they will be buy a Toyota for the equivalent of $80,000. Americans will have none of that.

USAs GPD per Capita is inflated by the very rich. Japan has one of the smallest, if not the smallest Gini coefficients in the world. There is much more even wealth distribution than in USA. The USA is a country full of individuals, but Japan is more of a community.

In many ways Japan is far ahead of the USA. They still produce higher quality goods than USA and indeed just about every other country.

Re:Government of the people?

Thanks for the false dilemma. Either we accept corporate hegemony and end-times theocracy or we accept godless Communism? How about freedom, which resembles neither?

Come on, superior technology?

A lot of these items were not technology related. Slipcovers for coats and purses @ resturants? Nice, but I'm not counting that as points to superior technology. Gotta admit that stoplight timer technology sounds good.

Re:Come on, superior technology?

technology isn't just computers. it can be coats and the materials they are made of or how they are made. all, uses of things can be technology. technology is a broad term

Re:Come on, superior technology?

In the early 90s I was in a small factory city in South West China. The town was a mass of concrete; an artless, treeless, birdless place dominated by factories. The only luxury goods available were cigarettes and rice wine. Once at the train station one of the locals lectured my friend (a Swiss guy who spoke fluent Mandarin) on how China was leading the world technologically--while the *steam* trains pulled in and out of the station. The local airport even had half a dozen bi-planes sitting on the tarmac and the soldiers had WWI era rifles. In the special economic zones you no doubt have something much closer resembling the standards of the West (and the seeds of the Communist's downfall). One city near the border with Hong Kong protected its appearance, replete with skyscrapers and the reflecting glass that dominated Western architecture in the 80s, with a massive mandatory carwash. Every vehicle coming into the city from the country was forced to go thru the carwash. The carwash also doubled as a inspection point as ordinary citizens needed permission to enter the special economic zone.

Re:Parking, Transit Debit, Lights that Blink--In M

Yeah, but it's not as easy to get Chinese food...

China will be the next big innovator

Just watch.

The USA refuses to adopt alternative fuels and prices are rising as fuel needs go up. Watch for china to lead the way in alternative fuel development and be the sole leader in the world. They need a cheap fuel soure to reach their goals of being a (or the) superpower.

Our dependency because we are lapdogs of Saudi Arabia is going to bite us in the ass. We will be the ones buying the technology from the Chinese.

Re:China will be the next big innovator

China's innovation relies mostly upon remaking things already patented in the West, just doing it cheaper by not paying the patent rights on it. This could be huge problem in the future, as many nations will require that they start honoring these agreements. I once worked with a client who did some of his manufacturing in China (toys, mostly) - he was stunned how quickly their products would turn up as black market ripoffs once they manufactured there - the plant managers typically run a shift a day making your stuff for you, then a shift at night making your stuff for them. They pulled their manufacturing from China after that. Also, I don't see China being much of a leader in alternative fuels - they are cutting deals with the Iranian mullahs now to become their primary oil supplier, and have much looser pollution standards that the U.S. or Europe (in fact, they use the U.S. pollution standards from the 1980's for their cars now). China will probably start making more alt fuel cars when the west demands it - meaning for export, not for domestic use. If you want to talk Asian innovators, Japan is still way, way ahead of China.

Re:China will be the next big innovator

China's innovation relies mostly upon remaking things already patented in the West

I think America ignored European patents in the 18th and 19th century.

Re:Or not

I actually cancelled my subscription to the Globe and Mail for sponsoring her articles about 7 years ago. Mean and vindictive, she had no place in journalism. She's a shrew and a thoroughly despicable person. Although it might be only me, I remember getting the impression that she was a bit of a Chinese communist sympathiser, so her writing an article on the technology 'innovations' of China does not surprise me.

Regarding innovation, you are 100% correct -- that is the US' prime advantage. That plus abundant natural resources which can be exported, or at least support self-sufficiency. Even regarding oil, I believe the US only gets 30% of its supply from OPEC.

Fortunately China is beholden to the US still in many regards. Its needs the US markets to sell products too; it relies upon the US currency to supply economic stability and prevent inflation in China while they go through this boom; and they need North America to provide raw materials and resources. We're a long way from the sunsetting of the American empire, but the US will be facing a new world power as a competitor (if its not already).

use of technology

I must say they have adopted better uses for the technology. Technology is supposed to make your life easier and that is somethign they are doing that western culture isn't.

China has something western society should model after. It kills me how often I hear, "We have always done it that way, why change"

But

We're installing breakfast nooks and berber carpeting all on credit at 28% interest compounded daily! We have Disney trademark paint color choices at Home Repo! We're modern too!

Count down traffic lights are a really bad idea

I've known of one traffic death from a yellow before green in Europe way back. Giving someone a accurate way of determining when they can be moving the microsecond the light turns green is bad given that people have incoporated not just the delayed green but the delayed start after green in their calculations of how late they can run a red light.

Cell Phones vs. Landlines

Almost every developing nation has a higher rate of cell-phone coverage than the US (and many other "western" nations.)

The Bell System and the various state-owned monopolies built reliable, universal landline networks across these countries almost a century ago. Since the majority of the infrastructure has already been made and paid off decades ago, use of these networks today is commonplace (and very affordable.) The technology is often proven, well tested, and reliable (often regulated.) Cell phones, on the other hand, are more expensive and less reliable.

In developing nations, the landline systems are often unreliable and not much cheaper (if at all) than mobile systems. Users in these countries have every reason to invest in mobile phones. I wonder if this will continue to be the case with the deployment of VoIP systems.

Pants Hemming

Although not a technilogical breakthrough, I am super jealous that you can get pants hemmed in-store, in minutes. I am 5' 3" and I have to have all of my pants hemmed. I have a sewing machine, and can do this myslef, but I hate doing it. Either start doing this or I'm moving to China, Dammit!

"Beware ...

...of the Yellow Dragon when it awakens" -Napoleon

I'd think it's time to say: "Good Morning, Yellow Dragon" :-)

Advanced traffic lights?

Are they seeing the same ones that I saw when I was there? [wiw.org] ;).

Re:Advanced traffic lights?

That would explain the driver's manual that says "The green and red light to be going and stopping when lighted."

Simple explanation

Well, I'm sure the reason for this is they have a more advanced system that ourselves - currently lots of people run red lights in the US. But, when is it safe to do so?

Enter the Red-Red/Red-Green light. Now the light just stays red all the time, since you're going to run it anyway - but the green light tells you when it's safe to run, and the second red tells you when it's safe to stop!

Taking away the yellow makes it a simple state transition that reduces incidences of people speeding up for a light. And both directions change instantly, making it far more efficient as you never have an awkward moment when cars are not going through an intersection.

Yes sir, that is is traffic light of the future.

Superior?

I was a bit disappointed with these ten points. I live in Sweden and compared to our standards this list isn't that impressive. Our mobilephones work everywhere and they cost you 10 cents to buy (honestly!). We have computer seating maps in the theaters and movie theaters. And parking signs contain the number of free spaces.
Sure, we don't have everything on the list though. I'd love to have those intelligent stop lights for instance.
I guess the bottom line is that Canada is pretty far behind.

Re:Superior?

Sad.

You live in Sweden and have been too busy playing with gadgets to notice hot blondes everywhere

Absolutely untrue myth about Sweden

You live in Sweden and have been too busy playing with gadgets to notice hot blondes everywhere

I am an American student, fluent enough in Swedish, working on a degree in Sweden. I can tell you as an insider that they are neither hot nor blonde--anymore. Those women went extinct in the Eighties. Right now, they are my professors and bosses--not my peers. A list of grievences:

1. Your typical Swedish girl is now fairly pudgy. Yeah, American girls are usually fatter (Swedes will usually counter with that statement when you start ranting about their women), but if one is comparing ones country's women to ours, then there must be a problem.
2. They use rediculous amounts of make-up. If they do eventually get fatter than American women, I will be studying in a country of Mimi Bobecks. And it's not just the quantity--it's how they use it. Even if they used a 1/20 as much, they would still look like Cirque de Soulei. Make Sweden beautiful: Shoot a make-up counter clerk.
3. Clothes. I am no fashion mongol, but I am morally appauled at how bad these people dress. They look like they have resurrected all the bad things of the 80's and put them on a 70's disco dance floor.
   100% dead-serious: At our student union building, we have an annual Bad Taste Party, where one dresses in bad taste, naturally. I could not tell--I honesty sat through a half-hour of our pre-party without noticing that was the theme.
4. Attitude. Even before you speak, whatever the context, they are impatiently waiting for you to finish. They know that they are a well-known brand-name commodity (all name, no commodity) and act like it, too.
5. Culture. Sweden is a progressive society--it's been that way for a very long time. As such, feminists have had a lot of success here. Economic equality, paternal leave laws, men pushing carriges nearly as often as women, and gaudy machismo is at an alltime low. Now the women are terrified to find that they got what they wished for and that they might have to have sex with men who not only possess an egalitarian outlook but *GASP* possibly make less money than them. While the money thing is a loss, they have fixed the other half of their problems by all learning Italian and going south fishing for boorish senoritos. Leaving the men of Sweden with an awful lot of Southeast Asian and Eastern European wives.

In conclusion, if you are coming to Sweden to have good-looking lovers, only do so if you are a gay man--you'll save yourself a lot of disappointment.

Cool stuff

They have some cool ideas in China. The Styrofoam in the super markets might not work in the US because people might find it unsanitary. I like the traffic light idea and I've always thought about the system of identifying free parking spots every time I'm hunting for one in a large, crowded lot.

However, some of these seem great because they didn't have to replace old technology. They mentioned how landlines were never popular, so they went from no phones straight to cell phones. The US had to piggy back the new system on the old system.

So in 20 years, will they still be cutting edge, or will they be surpassed by other countries that either are just technologically developing or have been developed for a while and are "upgrading".

Great...

Another topic where half the posts will be comments that contain nothing but jingoism and nationalist comments rather than examine China's genuine potential for growth.

Remember people, this is the world's biggest nation (by population), with the real potential to be the world's biggest manufacturer and the world's biggest marketplace. And, remember, that that potential is starting to be realised: China already has a import surplus of billions with most Western countries, including the US, and China is now starting to become a real consumer culture in its own right.

They may have given everyone else a head-start but then so did Japan and Germany post-WWII, and look at how powerful their economies have become.

Re:Great...

until the Chinese start spending money that they don't have, then they will not be able to rival the USA for consumerism.

Re:Great...

until the Chinese start spending money that they don't have, then they will not be able to rival the USA for consumerism.

They built a maglev train to Shanghai airport. Nuff said.

Re:gotta admire that forced prison labor...

Ahem. [straightdope.com] United states has almost six times the proportion of people in prison as China. Now, it is possible that China is simply not reporting many of the imprisoned people, or that the simply use alternative methods which we may find less savory than imprisonment, but...

this isn't superior technology

it is superior use of existing technology and better organization. Sadly we're far behind in many aspects. Hopefully we can catch up.

Still.. Re:this isn't superior technology

we are free to make mistakes and that is more important that having all the technology in the world. I would rather have Freedom of speech than a fancy parking monitor.

Let's not forget

You can't drink the water from the tap

Hocking loogies in public seems to be a national pastime

Air pollution so bad that on some days it looks foggy

Diseases like malaria and dengue fever (more a 3rd world than 1st world problem)

China may have cool tech, but the basic infrastructure sucks.

It's not really that great...

Everyone commenting seems to be all hyped up at the technology. Remember, China's one of the poorest, most overpopulated countries on this Earth in per capita terms. The elite, Party members, and other favored citizens may have access to all this wonderful stuff, but with an average GDP per capita below 5000 USD (as compared to about 38000 USD in the US) the vast majority -- if not most -- of the country has no access to any of the "technology" mentioned.

Re:It's not really that great...

You gotta be kidding right? Who do you think owns a good chunk of the US debt? China is fast becomming the next world military superpower, Little articles like this show they have the inclination. In fact they may well be already. We are just to stupid to see it.

Look at the big picture. Large country, large population, technical savy, individually not wealthy but as a country very wealthy, and most importantly very secretive. Not much news gets in our out that they that the gov. doesn't control. Even internet access is managed.

They could kick a little US ass without blinking an eye. They could lose an entire US population worth of soldiers and still come out smiling.

Look at the N. Korea issue. US didn't have to deal with it, just nicely asked China to speak with them. After some humming and hawing China sends over a low level Gov. official and N. Korea goes quiet. Like the freakin mofia.

Scares the crap outa me when I think about it to hard. I have to stop now.

lalala.....flowers and trees....lalala.....

It had to be said.

I'll take my basic freedoms and liberty any day over technology.

Seriously. Don't you think there's a cost to all this? Do you really think a republic like the US could do something like this?

The fact is -- it would be easier for us to modernize Iraq than it would be to modernize the US. Authoritarian control makes everything a ton easier for the government at the expense of the people.

Pick your poison.

Waitasec, being in China...

I was in China earlier this summer and despite their "genius traffic lights" and cellphone coverage, you can still walk behind the internet bars and savvy shopping marts and find dirt roads, people living on other's garbage and sewage in the streets.

The modernization of Chinese technology is less important than the quality of life of its people. In my opinion, they need to focus less on getting every single person in their country internet and more on getting every single person in their country fed and clean.

No. 11

If you protest the government, they imprison you, or just gun you down on the spot, free! No more paying for Dr. Kevorkian's euthanasia services. Yeah!

How do we even live?

And yet, somehow, life in the old USA goes on.

Convenience vs Profit

I think a major issue that arises in Capitalist countries is that profit is the main (only?) motivator for most technologies. In other words, if it isn't going to sell more copies, or reap more profit it's not worth doing. Many of the items mentioned in the article would have existed long ago in other countries had it been profitable to do so. Unfortunately, modern capitalism seems to trend towards maximizes proft, and minimizing cost (for both the businesses and consumers). This means that most people will suffer incoveniences to benefit from lower prices.

Supermarkets and other retail outlets are perfect examples of this. It's the classic service vs. price.

Even the stop lights in the article are an example of this. Most citizens would rather have dumb traffic lights and lower taxes than smart ones and higher taxes. Unfortunately this leads to a lifestyle that is filled with minor incoveniences.

A sad indicator of this is how surprised we are when someone gives us good service without charging us an extra fee.

Superior? Maybe compared to Canada...

Miss Wong is clearly comparing China to Canada. Her article failed to impress me with China, just made me glad I'm in Silicon Valley, not in Canada. Let's take a look at her list :
1. Cellphones
My cellphone works in elevators, subways, and parking garages too. The no cell phones in hospitals is a safety issue, not an issue of technology. And doctors here break the rule all the time, too. The docotor who delivered my son got a call from his wife (she was going to Taco Bell and wanted to know if he wanted anything) right in the middle of delivery.
2. Informative stop lights
As others have alrady pointed out, this is not the safest thing to do for cars. Most crosswalks where I live do the same thing, except they actually count down the number of seconds (how novel.)
3. Transit debit cards
This is a trivial (though very convenient) "innovation." It's really a product of government. When you have a centralized government that controls everything, you can standardize everything. When you have more freedoms, then different municipalities will do things differently.
4. Adult playgrounds
This is just another product of socialization, and has nothing to do with technologies.
5. Anti-theft slipcovers
A useful innovation when you have problems with crime.
6. Daily banking
My bank is open six days a week. If people demanded it be open seven, it would be open seven so that it could do more business and make more money. This has nothing to do with technology, and is simply an example of free people choosing how businesses operate via a free market vs. a government mandating how businesses operate.
7. Wireless service bells
This has little to do with technology and is much more a cultural issues. This would NOT be desirable at most upscale resteraunts in the west, where good service is expected and rewarded. Now it might be desireable at low-end resteraunts, but in the west, you get what you pay for.
8. Parking data
This is interesting. Do you really need to know how many empty spots there are? Isn't it really just a boolean, i.e. there is at least one empty spot or there are no empty spots? Any paid parking lot is going to keep track of this, and is also going to advertise so that you can find it. So I guess this is talking about free lots. Again it's a function of a free market vs. socialism.
9. Computer seating maps
When I buy tickets to a SF Giants game, I have this exact kind of technology. I don't have this for movies, but movie theaters here are not assigned seating.
10. Free hemming
Again, not technology, but cultural.

Would it be stupid of me....

To list the things that you find in the U.S. v. China, or in Europe v. China, that I find superior in U.S., or Europe, or Japan, or wherever?

But those are First World countries! They should be superior in EVERY WAY!

Nonsense. This First World/Third World delineation is extremely rough, at best.

China is a rapidly developing country. While there are factors which still relegate it status to 'third' world, they have come a long way, and will make it to first world soon.

The thing is, you don't always get optimum deployment of technology in a wealthier society, and this has little to do with the economic system (Capitalism, Communism, Socialism, Anythingism).

In a nutshell: The economic system determines who has the power to allocate wealth/resources.

Then, this decision maker decides how much of societies resources should be spent on what developments.

If 'smart' stoplights are not a high priority, even if 'dumb' ones are an annoyance, you won't get them, period. Even in Utopia.

In China, government decision makers simply implemenent whatever policy they feel is appropriate.

In the U.S., popular demand determines the allocation of wealth and resources. Don't think that I am naive enough to not realize that large companies&governments are capable of influencing this demand. Still, by deciding how much you are willing to pay for a certain service, or expressing your political preference by voting, you contribute to averaged indicators that establish this allocation.

In the U.S., people are willing to spend less of the adjusted per capita wealth on cell phones than are people living in Europe, or Japan.

As such, our cell service is crappier. Sure, there are geeks like you (slashdot reader) & me who want better service. But the Jane Doe's of the U.S. bring the average down.

The same thing probably happens with regards to Jane Doe's preferences. I might not be interested in what she wants, and as such, I bring the average allocation down with regards to her preferences.

You see clear, similar trends with regards to broadband service. Price is simply more important that quality of service/performance, and as such, as a society we allocate less towards our Broadband, and we have crappier service.

Now that you are conceptualizing resource allocation as I have described, the effects of government become clearer.

In much of the rest of the world, governments have 'kickstarted' demand by providing for an initial investments in broadband, cell service, and other 'public' goods.

You get better service, but the costs involved in the government 'kickstarting' necessairly come from somewhere else.

This government influence necessairly introduces economic inefficeny.

Not that that is always bad, mind you. I certainly accept that economic inefficency is necessary such that our resource allocation is not totally mindless/mob oriented.

But we need to consider that it is a spectrum. Somewhere between total government control of everything economic allocation, and total free market laissez faire absurditiy, is the world where I want to live.

Wow. This has been rather long winded. In sum, and in short, all I'm really trying to say is that a certain country not having, or having, various technology improvements does not mean that country is doing worse, or better, than other nations. Specific aspects of resource allocation are not a good way to summarize notions of wealth.

They are more important indicators. Not that the U.S. is doing particularly well in these other indicators. But we aren't doing so badly, and I feel that discussions of these indicators are far more important that discussions of anti-theft slip covers, or smart traffic lights.

Just my 20000000 cents.

The Caveat

How good is cell phone reception inside a political prison?

American's Know VERY Little About Today's China

Very few Americans know much at all about China.

People THINK they do but to someone like me (i.e. a white guy who spends months at a time each year in China, is married to a Chinese woman, is well versed in China's history both recent and ancient and speaks Mandarin), listening to American folks discuss China is almost always very frustrating.

The country is not nearly as oppressive as some of you seem to think. Communism is really just a WORD over there... not an ideology... not anymore. Yes the government has it's problems and for the most part are not too well liked but daily life in China (well, for city dwelling, college educated people anyway) is little different from life here. People own pets, they don't eat them, they have cars, cell phones, high speed internet, live (and thus, not so controlled by the government) news on TV, they go shopping, walk in the park, meet friends for coffee, hit the clubs on Friday and Saturday night or go see a soccer match, whatever.

Many places in China would strike the most ardent neo-conservative as the very height of capitalism. Contrary to what one person posted you CAN talk about/criticise/make fun of the government. I have talked with so very many Chinese about their government and they are usually quite frank. No one is hiding behind their hand whispering, no one is "disappeared". Last time I was there (May-August 2004) there were even some fairly large labor protests in a nortern city. Protests that were not crushed, put down, blocked. We just don't hear about this sort of stuff in the states. Viewed objectively (my wife, a professor of communications, has done much research in the area of media coverage between China and the USA), our government's opinions regarding China, the average citizens beliefs on China and the stories we get about China from our media leave us with a general impression that is, quite simply, wrong and negatively biased.Statistically about equal to the bias you would find in the Chinese press about the USA.

Technologically, China IS rapidly pulling ahead of the U.S.A. in many areas (cell phone technology and IT in particular) and China has it's "Microsofts" waiting in the wings eyeing the world market (the Lenovo Group [hoovers.com] (formerly known as Legend Group) in particular). Bottom line is, most Americans don't know enough about China to make any sort of accurate commentary regarding it. Yes there are many problems in China and with it's government but it is much closer to life here (once again, in the cities, not the countryside) than you probably think.

Re:Existing infrastructure

What about Western Europe? There is much more existing infrastructure in the Western European countries than in the U.S. However, they also seem to embrace technology faster than the U.S. I feel it is due to population density. The U.S. has a low population density. The denser the population the greater your market in a particular area. No surprise that technology hits those types of markets sooner than later.

Re:Existing infrastructure

It's easy when you start from nothing. The Eastern bloc had Soviet-era crap (meaning no progress since 1945)

We had a lot of... imported technology. :D The technology side wasn't really that bad, the economics and lack of freedom is what sucked. Not that those areas are perfect now...

Re:Existing infrastructure

Who moderates this stuff? China and Europe have personal residences and restaraunts older than your counry. Boston's a swaddling baby compared to them.