Air Force Seeking Geeks For 'Cyber Command'

An anonymous reader writes "Wired reports that the two-star general in charge of the US Air Force's new Cyber Command is looking for hacker-types to beef up its cadre of cyber warriors — no heavy lifting required. 'We have to change the way we think about warriors of the future,' General William Lord says. 'So if they can't run three miles with a pack on their backs but they can shut down SCADA system, we need to have a culture where they fit in.' The Cyber Command is the Air Force's first new Major Command since the early 1990s. Its purpose is to be able to win an electronic war with China and other potential adversaries."

Yeah, right.

[Black Parrot (19622)]

we need to have a culture where they fit in.

Somehow I don't think the Air Force is going to be keen on people smoking pot in the command center.

Re:Yeah, right.

[the grace of R'hllor (530051)]

I know I'd not be keen on people smoking pot in my work place either.

Deadbeat != security expert. Get a job and cut your hair, dude.

Re: Yeah, right.

[Black Parrot (19622)]

Deadbeat != security expert. Get a job and cut your hair, dude.

Pothead |= deadbeat. Judge results, not style, shitsuck.

Your rebuttal is somewhat weakened by your unfortunate choice of the logical symbol for "entails" to indicate the inequality!

Re: Yeah, right.

[Oktober Sunset (838224)]

Man's finger lands 5mm too far to the left: must be a retard. More at 11.

Re: Yeah, right.

[-koosh- (86122)]

What the hell screwed up keyboard are you using? My | key is about 8 inches to the RIGHT of the ! key.

These are possibilities:
Italian [wikipedia.org] or Portuguese [wikipedia.org]

Re: Yeah, right.

[by Anonymous Coward]

And so the power of groups on slashdot is proved: deadbeat == French-Canadian

Re: Yeah, right.

[mattsucks (541950)]

I've always blamed Canada.

Re:Yeah, right.

[Cecil (37810)]

Pothead who is so in love with the stuff he or she cannot get through a workday without a joint is a deadbeat. Other poster is right when they say grow up and join the real world. If you want people to pay you money for services, start by acting like you deserve it.

maybe

[legallyillegal (889865)]

they could be called GeekSquad

Cyber, huh? Neat!

[SpiffyMarc (590301)]

Just seeing that the name of this new command is the "cyber command" makes me want to run right out and hack a Gibson.

Man, the surf is ripped out on that information wave today. I mean gridlocked, on that information superhighway...?

HACK THE PLANET!

Re:Cyber, huh? Neat!

[value_added (719364)]

Just seeing that the name of this new command is the "cyber command" makes me want to run right out and hack a Gibson.

I think the Gibson is scheduled to be replaced. At least if the scene in Breach [wikipedia.org], where the Chris Cooper character storms into the CIA server room and demands that all the equipment be replaced with "mumble mumble Red Hat Linux Enterprise 5! mumble mumble Gigabit! mumble mumble" is any indication.

I expect hackers in the future will be clicking icons on a Gnome desktop. Only the old-timers will remember the days when we used spooky coloured one-character-at-a-time terminals, and performed incredible feats of hackery while being simultaneously threatened by a supervillain and distracted with a blowjob from a supermodel.

Re:Youngster..

[Technician (215283)]

Only the old-timers will remember the days when we used spooky coloured one-character-at-a-time terminals,

No, old timers remember ECL logic card computers driving a Mod 28.
http://railroad-signaling.com/tty/tty.html [railroad-signaling.com]

Were were really impressed when our first dot matrix KSR showed up, the DEC KSR Keyboard Send Recieve unit arrived.
http://www.recycledgoods.com/item/15910.aspx [recycledgoods.com]

A few years later, we got our first screen display.

Re:Youngster..

[c6gunner (950153)]

He said "old-timers", not "petrified fossils".

Re:Youngster..

[IndustrialComplex (975015)]

I worked for a gentleman that was a Captain in the Navy. This guy was older than dirt, but surprised the hell out of me with how computer literate he was. He was fit, active, intelligent and an adept computer user. You might say so what, there are lots of older people who are in shape, intelligent and know their way around the keyboard.

He was 94 years old when he passed on and taught me plenty about computers. He was already 33 years old when ENIAC was unveiled. He was working until his last days because he enjoyed it so much. Perhaps the amusing part was at the funeral we had remind ourselves that we were shocked at his death at 94 due to his clear mind, and active lifestyle. If you met him, you wouldn't have thought he was a day older than 70. I'd say if someone is shocked at your passing at age 94, then you probably were doing it right.

Certainly a fossil, but far from petrified.

Re:Youngster..

[Dogtanian (588974)]

My dad is in the mid 70's

You mean he wears flared trousers and likes early disco music?

In the words of another military leader:

[UnknowingFool (672806)]

Admiral Ackbar: It's a TRAP!

Re:In the words of another military leader:

[freemacedonia (1100555)]

Hasn't the military been getting people to sign up by blatantly lying to them about what they'd wind up doing once they got in for...ever? Once they get you to sign on the dotted line, it doesn't matter if they told you that you WOULD be smoking pot and playing video games all day. They can put you wherever they need you once you sign. No complaints, no law suits, nothing. Door to door in Iraq or afghanistan. Who knows, you could wind up hacking all day.

Re:In the words of another military leader:

[jvkjvk (102057)]

Hasn't the military been getting people to sign up by blatantly lying to them about what they'd wind up doing once they got in for...ever? Once they get you to sign on the dotted line, it doesn't matter if they told you that you WOULD be smoking pot and playing video games all day. They can put you wherever they need you once you sign. No complaints, no law suits, nothing. Door to door in Iraq or afghanistan. Who knows, you could wind up hacking all day.

Actually, if they really want you, your contract (yes, you *do* sign a contract to join the military) can stipulate the job you are signing up for. It can also stipulate that the contract is null and void if they are unable (for whatever reason) to give you that job.

I happen to know, because that was the only way I joined. Of course, you have to have the balls to say - "Fine, I quit!" if they don't keep their end of the bargain. But, they don't have a legal leg to stand on if it's in your contract.

So the moral of the story is: If they tell you you can smoke pot and play video games all day get it in writing as part of your contract. Because you will have recruiters tell people all kinds of things but only what's in writing sticks. Kind of like any other employment contract, no?

Re:Electronics techs can be sent into harms way ..

[budgenator (254554)]

Actually you can quit up to 180 days without any legal repercussions, you don't get an "Honorable", but a Entry level separation (ELS) [wikipedia.org], that isn't a big deal anymore either. On the 181st day a lot of veteran's benefits kick in and it's difficult to get out without a General Discharge [wikipedia.org], but it's possible to get a hardship discharge that avoids the bad papers of a General Discharge. After your military obligation is fulfilled you can then just resign, but that's a serious action.

Generally the contract will be fulfilled if they give you the training you want, assign you to the duty station you want and your in a unit that uses your Military Occupation Specialty. If the 1SG in the unit decides your a better asset doing something your pretty much SOL.

Yeah, right

[Rix (54095)]

If they want us, they can bring us in as civilian contractors. Why would anyone want to take a low paying job they can't quit?

Re:Yeah, right

[Jah-Wren Ryel (80510)]

If they want us, they can bring us in as civilian contractors. Why would anyone want to take a low paying job they can't quit.

It doesn't necessarily need to be low-paying. The air-force and navy have been suffering a mass pilot exodus to the commercial industry, so they started implementing retainer bonuses to keep their pilots. There is no reason the military can't do the same for computer guys. In addition, the computers guys don't have to worry about the biggest downside - dying.

There are perks to being in the military - access to USAA banking and insurance, being able to jump a transport flight to anywhere in the world for free, stay in military housing world wide for a pittance (some of said housing is near resort quality), pension, medical care, etc.

For the right combination of benefits, it might be a good deal. Of course it would have to be head and shoulders above what they give to the rank and file, but that's the nature of a competitive labor market.

PS - for you 420 types, there is no drug testing required for a secret clearance, nor most types of top-secret clearances, but they will ask about drug usage as part of the standard questionnaire (along with stuff like defaulted loans, arrest record, etc).

Re:Yeah, right

[Thoth Ptolemy (110353)]

As a member of the USAF, here's my take on military benefits:
Guaranteed housing. Either you're on base for free, or you get housing allowance (Single E4 in DC area = $1300/month).
Guaranteed food. Either you eat in the chow hall for free, or you get an allowance (~$270/month)
Guaranteed health care, 100%. Go to sick call/hospital pretty much whenever you need to. Includes dental and optician.
Guaranteed work. Whether you want it or not.
Commissary and BX are tax free.
30 Days of Leave a year plus holidays and weekends. Only 9-to-5 workers get actual weekends and holidays off though, the rest of us (operational AF, operators) 2 and 3 and sometimes 4 day breaks thrown in. Regardless, you still get paid 12 months a year, but can take one of those months off. Or save those days (up to 60).
Being Deployed has extra benefits. And I'm not sure CyCom would even deploy into a live fire warzone.
And just being military can have benefits too ($55 lift tickets at Breck, and 15% off food).
As well as other stuff the above mentioned; Space-A flights for free, USAA, retirement after 20 years (50% of your last base pay).
And then there's the cool factor of being stationed in Germany or Italy or Japan for 2+ years (assuming CyCom will have shops in said countries).

AND...if a career field is undermanned, they'll actually give bonuses for re-enlistment equal to Multiplier * Monthly Base Pay * Years of re-enlistment. Multiplier based on how much they need people in the career field. I imagine CyCom fields would be pretty high once it starts rolling, x4 or x5.

The pay is not too shabby IMO. Base pay is not as high as civilian, but other stuff does go a ways to make up for it (see above).

Obviously, you can't quit whenever you want to. Contract obligations and all that.
You also have to maintain a fitness standard. That means a reasonable waist and weight (or BMI) and a decent 1.5 mile run time. Pushups and situps also count, but only for very little.

It ain't a dream job, but it's been pretty freaking awesome for me. First tour was in Germany, now I'm in DC, next stop; who knows?

For you "420" types...stay the fuck out of my military. There is a 100% Urinalysis policy. You will be piss tested, you will be caught.

\obviously i'm biased in favor ;)

Re:Yeah, right

[dissy (172727)]

For you "420" types...stay the fuck out of my military. There is a 100% Urinalysis policy. You will be piss tested, you will be caught.

And i for one feel a lot safer knowing that we are protected by people that never smoked up in their life, cuz you know, stoners never did anything useful for anyone or something. /sarcastic

While I can understand them (or any employer for that matter) requesting you dont come in drunk/high on the job (thus their time), but short of people on call 24 hrs, I cant see any difference between smoking up for a weekend and getting drunk (thus YOUR time), as neither effects your job!

If my employer asked me to stop drinking milk at home, or to stop buying scotch tape, I would think just as little of them as when im asked to not smoke up at home too.

And no, I dont smoke (only cigerettes), but hell that could be next if we dont keep them in check now!

Re:Yeah, right

[IndustrialComplex (975015)]

And that is why people in the military don't drink.

He who lives by the sword....

[syousef (465911)]

Commander: They did what?
Lieutenant: They fell down and started rolling around, keyboards in hand.
Commander: And this was suppose to say what exactly?
Lieutenant: They were gibbering something about he who lives by the keyboard dies by the keyboard. I think they thought it was funny or clever. You have no idea what the men have been dealing with. These geeks have no social skills whatsoever.
Commander: So I've heard....and they absolutely refused to perform that first strike.
Lieutenant: Yes, sir. But it gets worse. They started muttering some inane dialog and sniggering at each other. "Burn the building" and such. We thought they were making threats at first, but then one of them laughed at me for not watching some cult film they all worship. Office Farce or Office Day or something.
Commander: I told them this would never work. Damn geeks.

Barn Door: Already Open

[jo42 (227475)]

...to win an electronic war with China...

To win an electronic, heck any kind of war, all China has to do is to stop shipping electronic and any other goods to the US. After all, that is were all of the stuff comes from these days. Not to mention that most of the corporates have either sold or licensed almost all intellectual property to China in one form or another. Talk about giving a potential enemy all of the sticks they need to beat you over the head with.

Re:Barn Door: Already Open

[rale, the (659351)]

> How about trying to win PEACE with China instead?

I don't think that's the military's job...

Re:Barn Door: Already Open

[by Anonymous Coward]

I don't think that's the military's job.

Of course it is -- their mission is to protect us. If peace is the better way (say, compared to the shit going on for the past seven years in Iraq), they should just salute and look for the assignments board.

Why do you think the troops spend a lot of time in Iraq building schools, water purification plants, etc.? When he's president, Obama should just tell them, "Get your asses back stateside and build schools and water purification plants for our own people.

So far, to take revenge for some 3K deaths in NY, we've sacrificed nearly 4K of our own troops. Never to mention a good 60K to 100K Iraquis. There's a hell of a start -- do you think there's a single family in Iraq which hasn't had multiple members killed by Bushfuck? That bastard has set us up for a thousand generations of hatred and revenge.

If you think the terrorists haven't won, consider that we're about a trillion into the war, with at least another trillion in future payments for medical and psychological care for our surviving troops and their families. And that's not to count the value our nation will never get back by having these people in productive jobs.

There never has been and will never again be a project with a better ROI for the perpetrates than 9/11.

The terrorists will not have long to hate our freedom -- our own government will take it all away on behalf of the terrorists. They won't have to lift another finger, except for the medial digit.

Okay, but...

[AndGodSed (968378)]

how would they control the inner geek urge to hack EVERYTHING?

commanding officer: "Dammit, someone emptied my bank account - AGAIN!"
second in command: "It's those cyber warfare officers, sir, they keep hacking anything connected to the network"
CO: "WELL COMMAND THEM TO STOP DOING IT!"
SCO: "I can't sir, the rerouted all communications through a local brothel..."

In the air force...

[bky1701 (979071)]

Your pointy-haired boss has a gun.

China ?

[SomethingOrOther (521702)]

China and other potential adversaries.

I can't be the only dude from the EU who has noticed a slow rise in anti-China stuff on slashdot?

Do other news sources in the US have this slant? Because looking at it from the outside, it's like the US^H^H^H^H Fox News is seeking a new bogeyman now the cold war is over. Unfortunately some of this is rubbing off on a more intellegent news source like /.

Watch out kids!

[martin-boundary (547041)]

"Join the USAF, you can hack computers all night and sleep all day"

"Woohoo! Where do I sign?"

"Great! Now pack your bags, you're going to Iraq"

"Butbutbut, that's not what I signed up for!"

"Too bad, we need people on the ground in Iraq NOW. That's where you're going."

What will boot camp be like?

[OldManAndTheC++ (723450)]

Turning raw meat into the cyberwarriors of tomorrow -- the drill sergeant at Fort Ran:

ALL RIGHT YOU MAGGOTS LISTEN UP! EVERY LAST ONE OF YOU IS A PERFECT SPECIMEN OF WELL-MUSCLED MANHOOD, BRIGHT-EYED,
NEATLY DRESSED, AND HIGHLY DISCIPLINED. WELL STARTING TODAY I AM GOING TO TURN YOU ALL INTO SLOVENLY, SARCASTIC,
ANTI-SOCIAL LOSERS! DO YOU HEAR ME SOLDIER??

Sir, Yes sir!

NEVER CALL ME SIR! YOU ARE TO SHOW NO RESPECT FOR AUTHORITY! DO YOU UNDERSTAND ME MAGGOT?!

Sure, whatever dude.

WHAT'S THAT AROUND YOUR NECK SOLDIER??

It's a tie s..., er dude

WELL TAKE IT OFF! YOU WILL WEAR T-SHIRTS AND LOOSE SHORTS AT ALL TIMES! IS THAT CLEAR?

I really don't like people shouting at me.

DAMN RIGHT YOU DON'T. AND WHAT DO YOU DO WHEN SOMEONE LIKE ME PISSES YOU OFF?

Uh, replace your desktop with a screenshot and then watch you trying to click on it while I snicker from my cubicle?

I THINK WE GOT A REAL GEEK HERE! IS THAT WHAT YOU ARE MAGGOT? A REAL GEEK???

I guess so.

OH YOU GUESS SO? WELL WHEN I'M DONE WITH YOU THERE WON'T BE ANY DOUBT! EVERY LAST ONE OF YOU WILL BE ABLE
TO LIVE FOR DAYS ON NOTHING BUT JOLT COLA AND DORITOS! YOU WILL LEARN TO LOVE THE WARM GLOW OF YOUR MONITOR
MORE THAN THE LIGHT OF THE SUN! YOU WILL BE ABLE TO WRITE NETWORK PENETRATION CODE IN THE DARK, IN MACHINE CODE,
USING A MAGNETIZED NEEDLE AND A STEADY HAND! YOU...WILL..BE...WARRIORS!! HOO! HOO! HOOOO!

Let's hope they're not like these guys...

[Spy der Mann (805235)]

http://en.tiraecol.net/modules/comic/comic.php?content_id=223 [tiraecol.net]

Guy: It just arrived in the mail: I've been accepted in the U.S.A.'s Hackers Elite corp...
Other guy: No way!
Guy: Geeze, I'm going to learn so much: Data interception, a darn bunch of encryption... can you imagine the level of the guys attending these lectures?
Other guy: You'd better review your strong encryption knowledge...

(A week later...)

Teacher: And in the window labelled "create nuclear crisis", simply select the country from the drop-down menu...
Student: What's a drop down menu?
Guy: :'(

My Keyboard

[d3m0nCr4t (869332)]

My Keyboard (The Creed of a United States Cyber Command)


This is my keyboard.

There are many like it, but this one is MINE.

My keyboard is my best friend. It is my life.

I must master it as I must master my life.

My keyboard without me is useless. Without my keyboard, I am useless.

I must type my keyboard true.

I must type faster than my enemy who is trying to hack me.

I must hack him before he hacks me. I will...

My keyboard and myself know that what counts in war is not the keys we type,

the noise of our modems, nor the trojans we make.

We know it is the hacks that count. We will hack...

My keyboard is human, even as I, because it is my life.

Thus, I will learn it as a brother.

I will learn its weaknesses, its strengths, its parts, its accessories,
its sights, and its barrel.

I will ever guard it against the ravages of weather and damage.

I will keep my keyboard clean and ready, even as I am clean and ready.

We will become part of each other. We will...

Before God I swear this creed.

My keyboard and myself are the defenders of my country.

We are the masters of our enemy.

We are the saviors of my life.

So be it, until there is no enemy, but PEACE.

Re:Those who join will become killers.

[rossz (67331)]

I take it you graduated from Berkeley. Our soldiers, not counting the rare psycho who slips in, do not target civilians. You must be thinking of Hamas and Al Quada who consider babies a perfectly legitimate target.

Every single soldier I know would be appalled at the very idea of attacking civilians. Every single one of them would refuse an order to do so.

Re:Those who join will become killers.

[jd_esguerra (582336)]

The only answer is to stop the killing by all those involved using communication and other methods.

Like appeasement? Or bribery? Or lying to avoid conflict? Or global adoption of your philosophy? How do you plan on convincing people to not want "your stuff" or to not want you dead or worse? Are you going to inform them that it is hurtful?

I'll suggest that communication alone may never bring peace, because communication does not address disagreement at the philosophical level. It just defines the boundaries of the disagreement.

You really do eat the propaganda from the military don't you.

Way to communicate. I'm sure your patience, empathy and understanding will bring love and peace to /. in no time.

Oh wait, maybe I misinterpreted that statement as being condescending. Either way, maybe you should consider improving your communication with people you do not agree with.

God I love irony.

Re:Those who join will become killers.

[QuantumG (50515)]

Human society is based on violence. What you're suggesting is that we all just stop being human. Good luck with that.

Re:Those who join will become killers.

[CannonballHead (842625)]

I'm not exactly sure if you're referring to just the current or recent wars of the US, or if you're talking about any war whatsoever...

But what utopia do you live in, may I ask? I'm sorry, but war is sometimes necessary. I'm not defending any particular war of any particular nation, but only saying that war is sometimes necessary. If someone is out to blow *your* country to bits, it doesn't do much good to talk to them or give them a philosophical (and well thought out, too) argument about why killing you would really just incite more killing, etc. There are even people that simply enjoy the carnage.

As long as life exists, there is going to be anger, hate, and malice; and as long as anger, hate, and malice exist, there's going to be bloodshed.

I'm all for peace and not war, but it is an unfortunate necessity at some points, in order to save life from those who WANT to destroy it for whatever reasons. It is from those "wanting to be guilty of murder and death" that more moral nations and armies are to protect the innocent.

Re: Those who join will become killers.

[Bloke down the pub (861787)]

So if the Mongols come around burning your people's villages and raping their donkeys, you shouldn't take up arms against it?

Well that would make you just as bad as them, wouldn't it - after all, two wrongs don't make a right.

I'm sure they'd listen to reason and realise what jolly bad chaps they are, if you presented your argument in the right way. It's not like they're barbarians or anything, their culture is just as valuable as yours and who are you to judge?

they do

[Quadraginta (902985)]

Actually, they do. The military has no problem hiring the very best if they want to. Half the best physicists and electrical engineers I knew at MIT -- and the better half, typically -- went either directly into the military (via ROTC) or worked for defense contractors. Why not? It's where the really interesting physics and engineering was being done, the pay and benefits were great, and you weren't hassled by dumbass marketing suits wanting you to make your product cute or cheap.

The military wants their tech to work and be way cooler and better than anyone else's stuff, cost to them is no object, and they don't give a fuck what it looks like or whether it "appeals" to the critical 18-25 Facebook demographic. It's going to be painted olive drab anyway, and soldiers will be told to use it, not begged. Fairly ideal working conditions for a really smart technical person, I'd say. The only drawback is the various amounts of bureaucratic bullshit you have to cope with, which tops the level in a good private firm.

Anyway, I've never heard of a good technical job in the military or one of its prime contractors, or one of the defense-associated national labs, not drawing a huge raft of top-notch applicants. It's agencies like the EPA which pay terribly, have hideous civil-service and union rules weighing them down, and which, frankly, involve boring and outdated technology, which end up desperate to hire even third-rate people.

Re:not a bad deal really

[ettlz (639203)]

It is weapons training day at military camp. The instructor is running through some of the kit trainees will be using. "OK, moving on. The next weapon I am showing you here can be used to devastating effect --- in the correct hands and under the right circumstances. We call it vmsplice_to_user()..."

Re:this is good but

[Charcharodon (611187)]

Military culture is kinda sorta the complete and total opposite of geekdom.

You've obviously never been in a maintenance shop before then. LAN parties were the norm most weekends back in the day. Now that almost everyone has broadband most everyone is playing WOW or other online game together. Whole sections go raiding and then talk about it the whole next day. It drives me nuts and cracks me up at the same time since these same guys pick on the "socially inept" for being nerds.

The level of geekdom varies, but the whole spectrum can be found, most are just gamers, many build their own computers, some are digital/3D artists, and a minority are your uber "look what hardware/software creation/hack I came up with this weekend" nerds.

I wouldn't buy the whole "they may not be able to run three miles and carry a pack" the Air Force is kicking people out left and right for being too fat and lazy. They like to call it "Fit to Fight", even though most of our jobs requirements are "Fit to Sit", they're just trying to cut down on the medical bills they have to pay.

Re:this is good but

[aproposofwhat (1019098)]

"mens sana in corpus sana"

And if you don't understand that, it's probably because you haven't done enough exercise....

No, it's probably because you've mangled the Latin - it's Mens sana in corpore sano [wikipedia.org]

Just being a Latin Nazi :)

Re:At least I know

[Technician (215283)]

But don't they realize that people smart enough to do their hacking are also smart enough to see through their sorry attempts to recruit them?

Count me in that group. Before you laugh, It wasn't the Air Force, but Navy. I went through the Advanced Electronics program. In six years, I got training (ISCET Certified) experiance, and no student loan. It gave me a head start in the recession in the 1980's when nobody was hired without experiance. I passed plenty of college grads into the field due to the education and experiance. I basicaly had a Geek job while in the service. I never carried a pack, seldom used dress blues, etc. Most times it was work attire and keep your haircut and shoes in shape. In the late 1970's I was working with a PDP11. Not too many schools in the 1970's had one you could learn. I qualified on a sidearm, but never was assigned one.

Don't knock geek training without a student loan.

Re:At least I know

[smilindog2000 (907665)]

I forget where I read the article about military trained CEOs... apparently, they kick butt on Wall Street vs we college geeks. Lots of theories were stated... but when a guy can work for a seriously screwed up organization, be given screwed up goals and sorry resources, and still succeed in motivating his men and accomplishing the important goals... well that seems to translate real well into succeeding as a CEO in Dilbert land.

I've got a real soft spot for the Air Force (my Dad flew F102s, and is the guy in the official F102 post-card). Too bad there's no low impact way of helping out, kinda like the Army Reserve, but for geeks.

Re:At least I know

[Technician (215283)]

All other things being equal, do you think a Bachelor's degree would be worth it when I already have military experience and a CCNA certification?

Many employers look at military as at least a Bachelor's degree and are able to start you at a late apprentice level. I went right to Journeyman when I got my ISCET Journeyman certification. Many places have HR departments that understand Military is compressed specialty training. This is valuable in the technical fields as you didn't spend half your time in liberal arts classes. I still have no college sheepskin, but I am working as an engineering technician in R&D. If I went for the sheepskin, I could easly gone on to a full engineer. So yes, depending on your goals, the degree is worth it. Challange as many classes as possible so you don't waste your time.

At the time I got out of the service, my goals were to be stable in unstable times. (1981) Engineers were often hired to fix a problem or complete a project and spent the rest of the time looking for work. (remember the 1980's where engineering degrees would get you a job flipping burgers? I never worked in fast food ever.) I liked the hands on tech stuff, so instead of persuing money, I picked a field where I could play and get paid for it. I never had the 9-5 blues. For steady work, I worked repair in high end audio/video. It was cutting edge, new and ever changing. Later I worked a contract to do 2 way Motorolla trunked system repair/programming and service. On the side we had a contract to keep a local radio station on-air. I got to fix the transmitter after it took a lighting hit. It was a little spooky working with the 5KV 10KW power supply. It was interesting and varied work for someone without a degree. There is a lot of work for someone with proper military training. Any extra certifications you get is a bonus. For me it is low voltage and broadcast. I finaly got an offer to move into R&D and I have been here since.

It always pays to keep on learning. You can easly pick up side stuff. I am building a home recording studio (On Linux). On another front, I'm using much of my tech training to move into theatratical lighting. I have a current project on the side designing the lighting system for a new church. I have convinced them to ditch the set of light switches by the door and go with a proper dimmer pack that talks both wall stations (so the janitor can come in any door and turn on the lights) and talk DMX-512 so the lighting director can run all the specialty luminares along with the house lights from the lighting desk/soundboard workstation. Part of the job it to establish the load requirements. The pastor had no idea why I wanted at least 2 20 amp circuits minimum to each truss. Part of the job is customer education. People skills are a must. Instead of $20 wall dimmers, the advantages of a $3,000 dimmer pack and $250 wall stations needs to be explained. It comes as a shock when they learn 2 20 circuits isn't going to run a dozen Par 64 fixtures and the 12 house light fixtures take 8 100 watt bulbs each. (500 to 1,000 watts each fixture) It's fun work. If you get the right training, you can get paid for playing, but you gotta have a skill someone will pay you for. The more you know, the more you are worth.

I can name 5 different 12 channel 2400 watt/channel wall mount dimmer packs by 5 manufactures that will do wall stations and mix with DMX-512 and the advantages of each and which need an option board to enable it at additional cost. I know on single phase power they require a 120 amp 240 volt circuit for each pack. Know your stuff and you will be valuable. Keep learning. DMX-512 didn't exist when I started. Now it is part of what I do.

Re:At least I know

[Daengbo (523424)]

I bet a lot of guys who are not anarchists would jump at the chance to work with NSA-style tech. Think about someone who's into cryptography and then think about what htey'd be doing for this group. I know the AF isn't the NSA, but plenty of my SINGINT buddies in the AF, Army, and Navy were tasked out to NSA. That's where all the cool intel happens.

I got stuck humping radios for a living.

Re:At least I know

[daspriest (904701)]

I still don't know how they are going to make this work. The military is very SOP (Standard Operating Procedure) driven. Can't imagine someone trying to hack by SOP, and if they deviate from the procedure, getting smacked down for it, even if the deviation from procedure is a better method.

Then the approvals, and officers sticking their 2 cents in every second.

Don't see it working well unless they truly allow for a different methodology in this "command"

How the military secures computers

[billstewart (78916)]

I used to share a lab with an ex-Navy guy. His basic description of how the different military branches "secure" a computer was like

• The Army sends a bunch of guards armed with automatic weapons to make sure nobody steals the computer.
• The Navy ties the machine down with netting so it won't bounce around during shipping, tightens the screws in the rack, coils the cables neatly and attaches them with cable ties.
• The Air Force cuts a purchase order to buy another one.

Our lab was _much_ neater once Dave got there - plus he did a good job on router ACLs, installing OS patches, etc. :-)

You'd think the NSA would be more involved in this kind of thing, but usually when I hear about people getting funding for cyber warfare boondoggles as opposed to computer security, it's the Air Force.