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Operating Systems Software Windows Linux

THG On Migrating To Linux 292

Posted by timothy from the how-would-you-do-it dept.
inphinity writes "The fine folks over at Tom's Hardware have posted an interesting guide titled Migrating from Windows to Linux. In the first of what will hopefully be several parts, they describe what steps to take to back up critical data and move to open-source apps. All in all, a fairly in-depth and comprehensive step-by-step guide. As a nice touch, they've even included a downloadable checklist for confused people."
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THG On Migrating To Linux More

THG On Migrating To Linux

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  • interesting.. (Score:4, Interesting)

    by mandalayx ( 674042 ) * on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @10:49AM (#8713683) Journal
    We recommend Red Hat Fedora, Mandrake Linux or SUSE for the first time switchers.

    I was recommended Debian. (First linux install). Why is Red Hat/Mandrake better?

    Hope I'm not opening up a can of worms here...

    • Re:interesting.. (Score:5, Insightful)

      by DeathPenguin ( 449875 ) * on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @10:50AM (#8713696)
      Because their installers are more newbie friendly.

    • Re:interesting.. (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Debian installer isn't exactly tard^H^H^H^Huser friendly

      Yes I know you only install once (or should), but MDK at least (not tried RH since v6) is alot more friendly to the novice user

    • Re:interesting.. (Score:5, Informative)

      by TheDigitalRaven ( 749023 ) <digital_raven.myrealbox@com> on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @10:55AM (#8713755)
      Debian's good for people who already have some clue about Linux, or indeed experience with *nix-alike OSen. Mandrake and SUSE (I have no experience with RH/Fedora) are both better suited for the first time user migrating from Windows. Less command-prompt stuff to begin with, a default installer which detects their hardware and doesn't ask questions that even a Windows "power-user" considers arcane, and a reasonable set of defaults for someone wanting to learn Linux with the minimum of culture-shock.

      • Re:interesting.. (Score:4, Insightful)

        by smoking2000 ( 611012 ) <linuxminded@gm[ ].com ['ail' in gap]> on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @11:09AM (#8713911)
        My first experience with Linux was with Debian aswell (when Woody was still Testing).

        Because of the lack of GUI tools for every configuration I needed to make, I had to do it myself.
        Through this course I learned a whole lot more about the internal workings of Debian and Linux distros in general.

        So in my opinion, if you're not scared to try and learn something new, Debian is not that bad a choice.

        Another nice side-effect was that I never felt more in controle over my PC then ever before.
        Like Mentor said: "[...] Wait a second, this is cool. It does what I want it to. If it makes a mistake, it's because I screwed it up. Not because it doesn't like me... [...]"

        • Re:interesting.. (Score:5, Insightful)

          by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @11:33AM (#8714183)

          Because of the lack of GUI tools for every configuration I needed to make, I had to do it myself.
          Through this course I learned a whole lot more about the internal workings of Debian and Linux distros in general.

          But that is the whole point. Most folks don't want or need to learn about the internal workings of their OS. They want to send email to the grandkids, print the pictures from their digital camera, browse the web, write letters etc.

          Telling these folks that if they want to use Linux they have to become power users is equivalent to telling them to stay on Windows 98.

          Even I am of two minds. I've been using Linux since 93. I love to play with it. I've done the whole build-a-system-without-a-distro thing, so I'm fairly comfortable with the OS.

          When I sit down in front of it to do my day job however, I want it to just work. So, for my day job I use a specially tricked out (by the company I work for) RedHat 9 distro. Sure, I could have built it better myself, and even now I could spend some time and make it better. But ... I've got work to do.

          I think Linux as a hobby is great. The point made by the article is that Linux as a tool is important, and it different from Linux as a hobby.

        • Re:interesting.. (Score:5, Funny)

          by Richy_T ( 111409 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @11:47AM (#8714365) Homepage
          If it makes a mistake, it's because I screwed it up. Not because it doesn't like me

          Hey, that's a great slogan for open source software

          "Windows doesn't like you!"

          It's good because everytime windows craps up again, it will be a reinforcement of the implanted idea.

          Rich

        • Re:interesting.. (Score:3, Insightful)

          by Welsh Dwarf ( 743630 )
          If it's learning your interested in, and you have A) a reasonably powerful machine and B) Broadband, I recommend Gentoo, you have to do everything by keyboard, but the docs are just outstanding in clarity and logic.

          • Re:interesting.. (Score:5, Insightful)

            by Flashbck ( 739237 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @12:18PM (#8714736)
            I have to agree completely. I've been using Linux on and off for about 6 years now. I started off by purchasing a copy of Red Hat v5.2. At the time Red Hat was perfect for me. I had no idea what "dude just read the man page" meant or even how to untar an archive. I've only started using Gentoo for about 3 months now and I feel as if my knowledge of Linux has grown exponentially. This is mainly attributed to the fact that I've never had to compile a kernel before and I've never had a distro that didn't install a ftp client by default.
            That seemed a little scary at first, but I was over-joyed when I ran top after my first boot and saw how little mem was in use (around 30Mb I think)

            If you really want to get your hands dirty and figure out whats _really_ going on under the hood, I would use Gentoo because you really have to learn everything. There is no choice!

            Disclaimer to all Linux beginners: If you have never used Linux before and aren't willing to spend hours of research time to get a seemingly simple thing to work, I would suggest using Red Hat Fedora or Mandrake. But if you've used those and want to take the next step, I say dive in all the way and give Gentoo a try.
        • Prepared to get flamed by the MS zealots. Mark my words, they'll all yell:

          "Joe Average doesn't WANT to learn, he just wants thing to work!"

        • Re:interesting.. (Score:4, Interesting)

          by Nurseman ( 161297 ) <nursemanNO@SPAMgmail.com> on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @12:29PM (#8714880) Homepage Journal
          Because of the lack of GUI tools for every configuration I needed to make, I had to do it myself. Through this course I learned a whole lot more about the internal workings of Debian and Linux distros in general.

          I think there are two types of people who want to use Linux. Those who want to install it, and those who want to learn it. After many years of playing arround, installing, uninstalling all with a GUI, I decided to try and "learn" Linux. To that end I am installing Gentoo as we speak (emerging KDE @ home). I have learned more this week than I have in a few years of GUI installs. I think MDK, RH, SUSE are great for the people who want to install and run, and things like Debian, Gentoo, Slackware are for people who want to learn. This is the beauty of Linux. Just my 2 cents

      • except for Knoppix :) (Score:2, Interesting)

        by timothy ( 36799 )
        You wrote "Debian's good for people who already have some clue about Linux, or indeed experience with *nix-alike OSen."

        True, if you mean *installing* Debian, at least the Debian way :)

        But for testing out whether Linux could work on one's hardware, and to give a lot of software a spin, Live CDs (I'm partial to Knoppix, partly because a lot of others, including Gnoppix, which I'd otherwise love to love, don't work as well with my hardware) are an excellent beginner course and don't cost a hard drive (or re

      • Re:interesting.. (Score:4, Interesting)

        by robertsloan2 ( 766713 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @12:05PM (#8714580)
        As a relatively new Linux user coming from "intermediate" Windows usage, I have to agree with the Red Hat and Mandrake advocates. I may install Debian on another computer later on, but despite its advantages -- the main one I know about is that it updates itself automatically and grabs all the prerequisites for any software you install -- it seems to involve knowing all the commands with their special spelling before you can look up the command for what you want to do.

        I usually operate from the Gnome graphical interface and have trouble memorizing commands I don't use every day. So far I've been able to troubleshoot a couple of problems with help from friends, and the last time I solved it on my own by exploring menus and submenus.

        Linux Missionaries are right about one thing though: it runs better than Windows. It crashes less, and while it may just be a difference in attitude, I feel more empowered to experiment with Linux. Changes I made in Linux were more reversible than in any version of Windows that I ever used, and that helped a lot when I was trying to get this laptop networked with a Windows system in collaboration with the Windows guy who didn't know Linux and his friend the Linux guru who didn't know anything about my hardware.

        The other great advantage is that despite antivirus software, my Windows buddy has been hit once with a virus and maybe twice, but my laptop is safe. That would have made more trouble worthwhile, but at this point my Red Hat 9 system is stable and I'm happy with it.

        Since some more advanced Linux geeks all said that Dell was the friendliest hardware to Linux, the next level for me is to get a Dell when I upgrade and dual-boot it, trying Debian but keeping the graphical interface.

        Question about Debian and its automatic upgrades: since I am likely to go on using laptops, would Debian eventually evolve to the point hardware won't support it if I just keep running a stable system, or would it respond more by installing only the refinements to the version compatible with that generation of hardware?

        My Debian-using friend uses a p133 with relatively little RAM and manages to work from home on it, but it can't run at decent speed in graphical interface. What exactly happens when old hardware and current generation Linux come together?

        Robert and Ari >^..^

        • Re:interesting.. (Score:3, Informative)

          by Rysc ( 136391 )
          "Question about Debian and its automatic upgrades: since I am likely to go on using laptops, would Debian eventually evolve to the point hardware won't support it if I just keep running a stable system, or would it respond more by installing only the refinements to the version compatible with that generation of hardware?"

          You want to run Debian stable.

          Debian doesn't worry about hardware, so it might upgrade you to some software which would run unacceptably slow on your machine. However, if you run Debian s
      • I'm on Red Hat 9 on a Toshiba Tecra 8000 networked to a Windows PC. The one thing I hated about Linux was the black type on white background default in most of the themes. The only dark theme available was white on navy blue and clunky. On Windows, I could select colors for menu bars and choose icons and sounds while in use, on Linux, I can't do that on the fly. That sounds petty, but I used to change colors and themes constantly in any long work session to reduce eyestrain. I created color combinations a

    • Re:interesting.. (Score:3, Interesting)

      by dallaylaen ( 756739 )
      <IMHO>
      It's rather good to install some old slackware (1998 with a book is nice), toy around a week, wreck it, reformat & install $distro{$deity}.

      This way you'll know how system works and how to

      # man >> /dev/hands

      Oh, I see I'm too geeky too... Sorry, /. influence. I've tried Mandrake 9 and it's about fine but there're some annoying things to make me Ctrl-Alt-F1 and tellinit $GeekRunlevel myself.

      No matter, I'm home-linuxed. Cheers, OSS guys!

    • Re:interesting.. (Score:2, Interesting)

      by drdreff ( 715277 )
      You were reccomended Debian by a Masochist :)

      The best way to install Debian that I have found is Knoppix. I understand wanting to bake a distro until it's done but Debian Stable (woody) feels antique compared to recent MDK releases.

    • Re:interesting.. (Score:4, Interesting)

      by b12arr0 ( 3064 ) * on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @11:06AM (#8713878) Homepage
      If you're wanting a good debian based distro, there is Xandros. The installer asks you about 4 questions to do a full install.

  • theOpenCD (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Smallpond ( 221300 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @10:51AM (#8713712) Homepage Journal

    Let me be the first of many to mention TheOpenCD [sunsite.dk]. First switch to OSS under Windows. Once you're used to the apps, its easier to make the leap to a full Linux desktop.

    I have dual-boot RH9/Win at work now and have not booted the Windows OS in 2 months. Most of what I need is:

    Gnome
    Evolution
    OpenOffice

    • Re:theOpenCD (Score:5, Insightful)

      by cK-Gunslinger ( 443452 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @11:02AM (#8713826) Journal
      I'll second this comment. I've slowly migrated to almost 100% OSS apps on WinXP. OO.org, Firefox, Gimp, gVIm, etc. The only thing I'd miss is Outlook Express. *ducks* I just like the way it handles newsgroups. No other email/NG reader I've ever tries even comes close.

      • Re:theOpenCD (Score:5, Informative)

        by Sevn ( 12012 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @11:29AM (#8714125) Homepage Journal
        No other email/NG reader I've ever tries even comes close.

        Try "Pan" for news. It only does news, but it looks a lot like evolution. It's pretty badass.
        • I'll second that.

          Pan is the by far the best newsreader out there on any operating system. Outlook express doesn't even come close when it comes to handling multi-part attachments.

        • meh.. I don't do a *lot* of NG stuff (no binary groups). Most of what I like about OE has been duplicated by Thunderbird, but it's the little details that keep me with OE. Things like the ability to expand/collapse *parts* of a huge threaded message. So if any one sub-thread is spirling way off-topic, I can collapse that one part and keep reading the other sub-threads. And the ability to add a filter so that any message by me, or any reply to a message/thread started by me is highlighted in color (watc

        • Re:theOpenCD (Score:3, Funny)

          by gatesh8r ( 182908 )
          With a name like "Pimp Ass Newsreader" [gnu.org], it's gotta be good...

      • Re:theOpenCD (Score:2, Interesting)

        by robertsloan2 ( 766713 )
        Oh yeah. About the only Windows apps that I didn't find better Linux equivalents were the games that won't run on my laptop anyway. I haven't used Open Office much even though it installed as the default, because I prefer Abiword for word processing. Both of those will save a final manuscript in Word .doc format, which is good enough for me to print out manuscript submissions or burn to CD or save to floppy for publishers and editors. I write in .txt format and haven't figured out how to make emacs wrap t
      • I'll second the recommendation for Pan - it's a terrific newsreader and supports all the latest technologies.
        Otherwise, if you're already using Firefox, why don't you try Mozilla Thunderbird? It's a great email client and newsreader, and it's definitely far more featureful and secure than Outlook Express.

  • nice stuff (Score:4, Informative)

    by Is_907 ( 740638 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @10:52AM (#8713717)
    my compliments to the chef... er, writers! the guys at tom's have put together a good article there. to the previous reply: Mdk, RH, and Fedora are all considerably more "user-friendly" distributions. many of my friends dove in with Slackware or Debian and are extremely well versed in Linux now but for most people i still recommend RH or Mdk (i haven't tried Fedora yet)

  • Not much meat.... (Score:5, Informative)

    by hot_Karls_bad_cavern ( 759797 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @10:52AM (#8713725) Journal
    A somewhat helpful article, but not too much meat and i hate clicking through so many pages during one article.

    i still maintain the best way to learn is to sit and watch a linux-savy friend do a few installs, ask questions, take notes, and keep them near when you try it for the first time. Sorry, but that's the best way ;)

  • Confusion? (Score:4, Informative)

    by OwlWhacker ( 758974 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @10:53AM (#8713726) Journal
    they've even included a downloadable checklist for confused people.

    What if the confused people are too confused to understand how to download it?

    • Re:Confusion? (Score:5, Funny)

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @10:54AM (#8713747)
      They have a downloadable checklist for that too.
    • Then I don't think they should try Linux at all.
    • Am I the only person who finds that classification amusing?

      Son, folks who use Windows aren't really bad people... they're just confused.
    • What if the confused people are too confused to understand how to download it?

      I wouldn't be too concerned. How likely is it that people at that level will be reading Tom's Hardware Guide anyway? And I don't see a newbie going to their favorite Linux neighbor and being pointed to this guide: the Linux neighbor will most likely sit and help them out with it. Right?

      Which begs the question: exactly who is this aimed at? Or am I wrong in thinking that neophytes are unlikely to be reading THG?

  • hmmm (Score:2, Troll)

    by mirko ( 198274 )
    Using screenshots such as these [tomshardware.com] might not help convince Windows Users to switch : I do not mean to troll but I think Nero is quite unequaled under Linux, unless I missed something (which is possible since I switched to OSX)...

    • Re:hmmm (Score:3, Informative)

      by molarmass192 ( 608071 )
      Looking at the screenshots I was thinking the same thing! K3B [k3b.org] is probably the closest thing to Nero Linux has right now.

    • Re:hmmm (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @11:06AM (#8713869)
      nero is soooo yesterday. it's become a bloated piece of "ship it with every oem drive in existance", and add new trinket features and glitz but don't fix any of the bugs.

      nero was once good, 3 years ago, when they were still hungry.

      now it's rubbish.

      k3b.

      that's your nero under linux. burn cd data, cd audio, dvd data.

    • Re:hmmm (Score:2, Informative)

      by jponster ( 750086 )
      K3b does everything Nero did last time I used it, but then again I haven't used Nero for quite a while.

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by account_deleted ( 4530225 )
      Comment removed based on user account deletion

    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by account_deleted ( 4530225 )
      Comment removed based on user account deletion

    • Re:hmmm (Score:2, Interesting)

      by GirTheRobot ( 689378 )
      mkisofs && cdrecord is quite superior actually. I thought Nero was the shiznit until I started recording cd's at the command line under Linux. It is much faster and predictable. Just create a folder and copy files (or symlinks), and type a single command.

    • K3b (Score:4, Interesting)

      by CandyMan ( 15493 ) <[moc.ariednac] [ta] [reivaj]> on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @11:49AM (#8714400) Homepage
      I don't know in Gnome-land, but KDE has K3b [sourceforge.net], which gives Nero, in my humble opinion, a run for its money.

      Real life anecdote: two weeks ago I went to my friend Lorenzo's with a Knoppix disc, booted it and showed him. He liked it and wanted to keep it, but it was my only copy and I had deleted the ISO from my own hard drive. No problem. Mount his HD read/write, fire K3b, select the HD for temp storage of the iso, and rip/burn in under 30 minutes. Flawless.

      The operating system was running from the same CD we were copying, mind you. No hassle.

    • ...and the best part with K3B... (Score:4, Insightful)

      by DrYak ( 748999 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @11:51AM (#8714427) Homepage
      unlike all Windows based (*) burner software, but like all good linux software : They don't try to reinvent the wheel. K3B is just a simple (but really wonderful) newbie-friendly interface, that use the power of kickass application like cdparanoia, cdrecord, ... so you have all the niceties this program implements. The only thing I miss : - to be able to force a data compare for every imaginable step (like DiscJuggler does on Windows) - multiple session (no ! not mutlisession CDs, but multiple K3B running on several diffrent burners) - support for non standart formats (.NRG, .CDI, ...) the net is full of small tools that can do xyz->CUEBIN conversion. to bad K3B doesn't support them automatically in it's interface.

  • Livecd? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Killjoy_NL ( 719667 ) <slashdot@@@remco...palli...nl> on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @10:54AM (#8713745)
    Isn't it better to try a livecd first? There are enough out there at the moment.

    If you don't like it, then it's easier to switch back if you want to.

    That's how I'm gonna try it anyway.

  • Nice ending (Score:3, Funny)

    by Jim_Maryland ( 718224 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @10:57AM (#8713773)
    I especially liked the final note.

    Until then, say goodbye to your Windows OS, because its doom is approaching.

    I do fear that some readers would see this as a biased article with a statement like that though. Hopefully readers are aware of the THG's objective viewpoint in general.

  • THG on Windows - Linux migration? (Score:5, Funny)

    by Dark Lord Seth ( 584963 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @10:59AM (#8713794) Journal

    ... that's all fine but does it have bar graphs? Whenever I read anything at THG, my attention span flips over to "Goldfish" mode and I NEED the bar graphs! Nrrrgh! *twitch*

    • ... that's all fine but does it have bar graphs?

      I don't know. I didn't make it to the end. Halfway down the first page I realized this guy probably doesn't know what he is talking about. The page says "Most modern operating systems, which include Linux, are composed of two parts: a small central piece called the "kernel" and a larger piece that has the applications and drivers." Well, first of all, drivers are part of the kernel. So neither did he make the distinction right, nor did he tell us why it is

  • Mass Migration Feared (Score:4, Funny)

    by amigoro ( 761348 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @11:00AM (#8713796) Homepage Journal
    Microsoft Corp. announced today that it feared the Tom's Hardware Guide (THG) article on switching to Linux will prompt a mass migration of Windows users to Linux. The clearly and simply written article, even thought to be understandable to US President George W. Bush promises a the users who take the plunge a life without crashes, viruses and headaches.

    "This is a serious problem. We expect at least 80% of all windows users to move to Linux", said Steve Balmer, the CEO of Microsoft, at a hastily convened press conference. "This will be the beginning of the end of Windows"

    When asked how Microsoft plans to respond to the situation, Mr Balmber replied: "We have our methods".

    Meanwhile, Darl McBride, the C.E.O. of SCO today announced that the copyright tp the choosing a Linux distribution algorith belonged to them, and they would sue THG and any other users who followed THG advice over IP violation issues.


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  • This is a really great article. (Score:5, Interesting)

    by El Cubano ( 631386 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @11:01AM (#8713811)

    I was very impressed with the way that they explain the differences between distros. I.e., same kernel/under the hood with different apps on top.

    Although I am a diehard Debian user, I totally agree with the recommendation for RH, SUSE, or Mandrake. Personally, if I am helping the person migrate and doing the Linux install for them, I usually do Debian stable with GNOME or KDE backport, depending on the user's preferences. However, if they intend on doing it themselves I recommend RH, Mandrake or a Knopppix hard drive install.

    I am also impressed with the way in which they specify which apps work best for certain things. I.e., Evolution for email, OOo for office productivity. There wasn't any "you need to choose from one of these 50 email clients and one of these 5 office suites."

    Kudos to THG for a well thought out and well written article. Hopefully the rest of the articles in the series are as well written.

    • I have to agree with the above statements, this is a surprisingly well written article that assumes the person has never seen Linux before. Linux users tend to forget that even burning ISO images can be a bit daunting when you're first starting out.

      Also, yes, even as a slackware user, I wouldn't wish Slackware, Debian, Gentoo or the other niche distros (Vector, Arch, etc, etc) upon hapless newbies. Let them get their feet wet with Mandrake/SUSE/Fedora, and then give the more flexible stripped down distro

      • Now what I'd really like to see is a distribution called BeginnerLinux or something along those lines, maybe based off of one of the big distros, that works as a LiveCD and is specifically tailored to giving the new user a comprehensive walkthrough of Linux, from apps to everything under the hood, and then shows them how to move to a full blown distro.

        It already exists. It's called knoppix [knopper.net] and there are instructions [bofh.be] that allow you to turn it into a full blown system. [debian.org]

  • Tom's really knows how to write a page turner (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @11:02AM (#8713833)
    By putting so little on each individual page.

  • What about Xandros? (Score:2, Informative)

    by b12arr0 ( 3064 ) *
    I would actually recommend Xandros. Pity that there isn't a downloadable version yet. They are coming out with one though. It'll probably be without the crossover office stuff.

  • 9 Steps Windows-to-Linux roadmap (IBM) (Score:5, Informative)

    by Erik_ ( 183203 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @11:09AM (#8713912)
    IBM also published in yesterday's Red Book newsletter, a 9 steps program to learn how to migrate from Windows to Linux.
    Windows-to-Linux Roadmap [ibm.com]
  • In an article about migrating from Windows to Linux I get an ad for Windows XP Media Center.

    Hmmmm...

  • Help for even the confused?! (Score:3, Funny)

    by no longer myself ( 741142 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @11:11AM (#8713943)
    ...they've even included a downloadable checklist for confused people

    "Damn... It's in this weird PDF file format... PDF... Um... Penguinne Data File? Argh!!! I have to have Linux running before I can install it now!"

    Looking back, I was a waddling Linux basket case nightmare, and you guys spouting "RTFM" and slinging insults weren't exactly helpful either.

    Best experience a noob could have. Thanks. ;-)

    Today I know that Linux isn't just "good enough" or "free if your time is worthless". I didn't learn those lessons by someone daintily holding my hand and cooing nursery rhymes in my ears. I was subjected to inflamatory attacks and brutally senseless trolls.

    I also learned that Linux doesn't mean you have to be a total geekwad that couldn't get laid even by a concrete mixer... Although I'm under no obligations either.

    I learned everything a guy could ever hope to learn from the one true beacon of light and hope for all the world: Slashdot [slashdot.org].

    (No, seriously... no one put me up to this... What do you mean I've got something on my nose? Where?)

  • Definitely Mandrake (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Krik Johnson ( 764568 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @11:16AM (#8713996) Homepage
    Mandrake 10.0 is the distribution I'd recommend to anyone! It is still community, hence a bit buggy, but the official version will be out in May and will be ready for general use.

    I have tried many distros, including SuSE, Fedora, Severn, Slackware, Knoppix, Debian, Ark, Lindows, Phat, Dragon, LFS, G/CX and yes even FreeBSD which isn't even a "Linux", but out of all of those i chose Mandrake.

    Why? Because it works. My mouse, keyboard, desktop, cdrw, dvd-rw, printer, scanner, digital camera, sound, tv card, alien beacon, toothbrush and nuclear reactor all work with Mandrake linux. Tell that to XP, who BSOD'd on me when I plugged in my digital camera!

    Software is installed with ease, Hardware is configured with point and click! If you wanted the ultimate distro for both begginners AND experts (I have used linux for nearly three years) then get Mandrake!
    • I started on RH7.0, moved to 7.2 then 7.3, played with Mandrake 9 for a while until I wanted to bite out the eyes of whoever came up with their Satanic automounter - then when I built a new machine I decided to put the new monster CPU to good use and install Gentoo.

      Hell of a learning experience. Nice package management system. And you get used to sleeping with fans in the background.

      Now, though, I no longer have broadband, and Gentoo on dialup is no longer fun and geeky, it's horrible and masochistic in

  • What about Slackware (Score:4, Informative)

    by stecoop ( 759508 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @11:17AM (#8714008) Journal
    Back in the day (96'), I actually bought my first Linux distro that included 5 disk (~5 or ~10 bucks wasn't bad for dialup days) from Slackware [slackware.com] and it included the best tutorial [slackware.com] to date about how to install Linux. Yes it was hard because you had to follow directions and read but now, I can install any Linux distro from that knowledge. You will not fear what you understand.

    If starting out and you really want to know Linux then try the slackware installation then moving onto compiling your own kernel [linuxfromscratch.org] distro. If you just want to run linux than Redhat [redhat.com] is quite easy to install.
    • I agree, but it generally depends on who you are.

      If you just want to use your computer, go for an 'easy' distro like Red Hat Fedora or Mandrake.

      If you're a computer enthusiast who wants to get into Linux (not 'try', but you want to use it), installing from the ground up is a good idea. You get a solid foundation on what parts do what, who makes them and what your choices are. You're more likely to become a Linux guru sooner than if you go with an 'easy' distro which tempts you to stay in your comfy envi

  • THG? The Humble Guys? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by DR SoB ( 749180 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @11:19AM (#8714030) Journal
    My first thought, "Whoa, The Humble Guys, are doing hardware reviews on /. now??" I remember those guys!!

    www.TheHumbleGuys.com

  • omg wtf (Score:2, Informative)

    by WormholeFiend ( 674934 )
    this felt like reading a The Complete Idiot's Guide to...

    Here's a quick summary:

    Choose Mandrake, Fedora or Suse.
    Backup everything.
    Download, burn isos and install Linux
    List of hardware websites for drivers
    Goodbye Windows.

  • Still, there are major problems. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by don_carnage ( 145494 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @11:32AM (#8714160) Homepage

    This is my "switch" story: I just got a Dell Latitude C600 laptop. "Hey," I said to myself, "...why don't I try to install Linux on it?" So, I grabbed some RH 8.0 CD's that I had and set out to installing. The CD booted fine, I chose the standard workstation installation and off I went. When I got to the monitor / video card, I accepted the defaults and soon I was finished.

    Upon reboot, the screen flashed several times at the text login prompt and finally, a teal box with garbled characters appeared in the middle of the screen. Now, being an avid /. reader, I knew that this was a problem with my X configuration. So, I hit enter to get out of the garbled box, logged on as root and edited my XF86Config file with some suggestions from a forum that I found after searching Google. I typed "startx" and boom...I was in!

    So far, you would have lost the average user at the login prompt. I admit, installing on a laptop isn't always easy, but you shouldn't have to edit config files to change the "r128" to "vesa". [Relax, I'm venting here.]

    The second problem I had was with the Proxim Orinoco Wireless card. No network. Card not detected. Not even a selection to add it under "Network Devices". This time, the "how-to" that I found didn't help. Nothing that I could do could make the card work. And to top it off, Proxim doesn't provide Linux drivers.

    So I went with XP. One disc and everything worked.

    My point is not that Windows is better than Linux, because believe me, I would rather have gone with Linux on my laptop. However, until it's easy to install (you know, just go through the prompts and most everything works), you're not going to get anyone to switch.

    • -----
      config files to change the "r128" to "vesa".
      -----
      You're right. You shouldn't have to do that. You probably shouldn't do it at all. Using the VESA driver negates just about every performance optimization that you had.

      I see that there's a benefit to Linux not being easy to install. When Linux becomes easy to install then it will be just like Windows. The kernel will be generic (and huge) to account for all possible chipsets and drivers. Only one application will be installed for a given task. If

      • So you see, once the population has EasyInstallBigBrother-Linux, water-cooler gossips come to claim Debian.

        Wow...that's rather apocalyptic. "Easy to install" does not mean the end to open source, nor does it mean a huge generic kernel. It's not like I was adding hardware after the initial install. This was the initial install. The kernel should have been built to suit the needs of the hardware in the laptop. Later, if I wanted to install more hardware, then it could easily (relatively speaking of course

    • One of our LAN admins just got back from the Brainshare conference. He's got a Dell D600 too. When he came back to work, he was pretty thrilled to be able to show everyone in the office how he'd managed to get Red Hat installed on it, plus drivers for the built-in wireless networking and a beta of the GroupWise for Linux 6.5 client.

      It works, sure. He just had to go to a conference of other networking geeks to get the help he needed. A lot of hardware installs are like that.

      I don't think the argument that

    • My point is not that Windows is better than Linux, because believe me, I would rather have gone with Linux on my laptop. However, until it's easy to install (you know, just go through the prompts and most everything works), you're not going to get anyone to switch.

      Nonsense. You almost switched and if your wireless card had worked then you would have switched. You'd already invested effort into getting X working, proving that you wanted Linux and were willing to work at it.

      The problem is that the ba

  • No Access Advice (Score:4, Insightful)

    by ahg ( 134088 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @11:41AM (#8714292)
    THG writes: "Currently, no native Linux application will read the Access (.mdb) format."

    He makes this statement and then never follows through with any suggestions for Window users looking to make the switch. It would have been nice if he put together a cookbook recipe for transitioning Databases from Access to say a MySQL+Rekall solution.

    While there's plenty of advice out there [google.com] about migrating your data, (the easy part, IMHO) I have not seen any recipies for converting your forms and reports... (And as we're talking Desktop apps here, using MySQL as a backend with Access on the frontend isn't relevent)

    Is there any way other than recreating the forms/reports?

    I'm sure many Window users want to know.. and while I'm a seasoned Linux (as Desktop) user without any reliance on Access myself, I know of businesses that might convert if not for the Access hurdle. (So far I have had no useful advice for them)

    • "...transitioning Databases from Access to say a MySQL+Rekall solution."

      See, that's the problem: the plus sign in your statement. Most people just want quick and dirty. What they can't do with Excel, they hack out with Access (and I mean hack in a bad way.) Granted, I have seen my fair share of good Access applications but most are crap. Until you can provide a tool to do simple database, query, forms, and reports all in one package, then you're not going to get the masses to migrate, even if you provid

      • " Until you can provide a tool to do simple database, query, forms, and reports all in one package, then you're not going to get the masses to migrate, even if you provide a solution by combining 2 or more technologies."

        I agree with you, given the current state of things, people will not be migrating. However, I don't know that coming up with an Access clone for Linux is the way to go either. I think a sufficiently fleshed out frontend program can make the existence of a MySQL (or other RDBM) transparen
      • Until you can provide a tool to do simple database, query, forms, and reports all in one package, then you're not going to get the masses to migrate, even if you provide a solution by combining 2 or more technologies.

        In addition, you need to provide a way for people to trade data sets around without dumping them into spreadsheets or hiring a full-time DBA.

        MSAccess is extremely useful in that scenario because everything is self-contained in a single file. Want to work on a temp copy? Create a copy of t
    • You've completely missed the point of this article, which is targeted towards Windows desktop users. These people are not going to have the time, experience, or desire to learn how to use MySQL, let alone any non-point and click GUI database migration tools.

      How your post got moderated as Insightful, I've no clue.

  • A Good Guide, as long as everything works. (Score:3, Insightful)

    by rueger ( 210566 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @12:30PM (#8714893) Homepage
    Arrgh! Yet another guide to Linux that seems mostly to say "And then go and read this long and obscure web page to try and figure out if your hardware will work".

    My biggest criticism is that the article, like pretty much every similar one, does not warn the unsuspecting beginner that there is a significant likelihood that there will be at least one insoluble problem.

    Even though things have improved greatly in Linux installation, new people need to understand that one of either their video card, palm sync, scanner, or networking will not work out of the box, and that tracking down a solution can take hours or days.

    The last thing that Linux needs is more people throwing up their hands in despair after ten hours of an install gone horribly wrong. It's better to warn them right up front that things are still quite a bit less reliable than a Windows install.

  • dual boot (Score:3, Insightful)

    by InodoroPereyra ( 514794 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @12:31PM (#8714902)
    Even I failed to see it or it's not mentioned in the article. But anyways, never underestimate how much more comfortable the "switcher" will feel if (s)he keeps a win partition available.

    I did this at home. The computer came with Win98 at the time, I installed RedHat as dual boot, and for the first week or two my wife kept rebooting now and then, but very quickly she preferred to leave it running Linux, and that was it. This machine is now happily running Mandrake, with tipical uptimes of months.

  • I guess Tom's Hardware is now on SCO's black list.

    In Linux we trust!

  • The nice big windows media center edition ad in the middle of the windows to linux conversion article... granted the author of the article did not choose the ad.. but funny none the less.
  • Anybody else here immediately think "The Humble Guys" when they see THG?

  • a very comprehensive backup and preperation (Score:3, Insightful)

    by iceco2 ( 703132 ) <meirmaorNO@SPAMgmail.com> on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @03:22PM (#8717341)
    THG seems to be very very carefull about everything. I have migrated my share of Windows boxes to Linux but never done as carefull and systematic job of preparing for the install. Yet I have been sorry I missed any one of the steps suggested so I say: good job!
    anybody with mission critical data will probably want to use this guide, a home user converting his old desktop just to see how he likes it can probably find a much simpler guide.

    Me.

  • What about Dual Boot? (Score:3, Informative)

    by Ripplet ( 591094 ) on Tuesday March 30, 2004 @03:55PM (#8717741)
    Surely the best way to start out is to set your machine up with dual boot, so you can start using Linux, but still have access to all your Windows stuff if necessary. The article rather sounds as if you are going to completely blow away your windows installation, which I think is a very dangerous thing to do straight off as a newbie.
    All the backup stuff is good, but you should really be doing this anyway on a regular basis. Although a backup is certainly recommended before doing anything as heavy as a new O/S install, it's much safer just to resize your old partitions and use the empty space to install Linux in.
    This is what I did, and in fact I'm still using the FAT32 partition with most of my data on, simply because I can access it from both Linux and Windows. I haven't quite got replacements for all my standard Windows apps yet, so this way I can get the best of both worlds, and be safe. I'm surprised THG didn't recommend this.

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