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Further Updates On Terrorist Attack
from the if-you're-type-o-you're-everybody's-type dept.
Contradicting earlier reports, reader Adam Brookman writes: "I can guarantee that no car bomb went off in front of the State Dept. in DC. My father is part of the critical personel at State dept. When I read that I called him. He said he heard the same thing and he also heard that the building was hit by a plane, but neither were true."
Worth reading is this analysis of the motives and some possible suspects in today's violence, at Jane's International Security News. They've picked three plausible attackers. Motive aside, Jack Bryar has a convincing take on who is really most hurt by the attacks today.
babyruth writes: "amazon.com has a Red Cross Relief fund set up on their homepage, where you can contribute online. Only several hundred have contributed so far, let the power of /. help!" Iridium provides a link straight to the donations page, noting that "All standard fees are waived -- all proceeds go directly to the Red Cross." Of course, the Red Cross is -still- in desperate need of blood. If you can donate, please call 1-800-HELP-NOW to find the donation center nearest to you.
iggyflashbulb writes: "CNN reports some oddball group not associated with bin Laden is attacking Kabul at night. Are they taking advantage of the NY situation or did they create it?"
An anonymous reader writes: "Following the sad (and outrageous) mess of these terrorist attacks, results are already starting to impact the country. When a RSM failed on one of our 5500 Ciscos, we recieved the following notice
'Due to a national emergency completion of your case, delivery of your parts or engineer will be delayed until further notice. Several areas of the country have restricted transportation and currently no air traffic is available. Cisco will notify you as soon a we are able to dispatch your order.'
There doesn't seem to any information on Cisco's site."
CERT is in action as well: SilentTone writes: "Ween Hall at Carnegie-Mellon University was evacuated today so the the Computer Emergency Response Team could go into action."
Many readers have been assembling mirrors for the overloaded news sites of the world. Jon Anhold writes: "I've compiled more photos and what not, mirrored many of the sites around to help the load. They're available here: http://ziggy.dreamland.net/wtc/"
Owen Bossola writes: "This is a simple webpage I put up with shots I took all day of the World Trade Center. I go to school across the river at Stevens Institute of Technology and I watched the whole thing from campus. It is absolutely nuts, I'm looking out my window and for the first time, downtown NYC is dark, and there aren't two large buildings gleaming back at me."
rhyder writes: "I was last in the World Trade Center and the attached World Financial Center on Saturday evening. Many people I know work in those buildings, even more live and work in the shadow of those 2 towers.
From the Port Authority of NY and NJ:
- The Port Authority
- Trade Center Concourse Level Map
- Trade Center Plaza Level Map
- Trade Center Complex Overview
- Area Map showing southern tip of Manhattan and the Trade Center location."
Anyone else able to confirm this rumor?
Jon Bishop asks: "Why Today? Why did this attack happen on September 11, 2001. Here is a guess. I played with the date commonly used for programming. YYYYMMDD returns 20010911. 911...in 2001. Is this play on numbers intentional or coincidence?" It may be significant that the anniversary of a Congressional resolution "favoring a Jewish homeland in Palestine" falls on this date. Then again, if you go back a century or two, you may find a lot of anniversaries that seem just as significant.
Carl Merritt writes: "Since many sites seem to be creaking under the load today I've dumped every relevant picture and video I can find onto my server, please feel free to suck up some of my unused bandwidth with downloads or links: http://www.binaryvista.com/WTC/ I'll probably leave it up for a couple weeks, or until CNN asks me to remove their pictures ;-)."
An Anonymous Coward writes "I just want to remind everyone that there is still active air cover over at least Chicago. A tanker is orbiting O'Hare and at least what appear to be two F-15s are making the rounds. If you would like more information including frequencies I suggest subscribing to the CARMA mailing list at QTH.net for up to date monitoring information."
Disheartening news from Egypt: soulflakes points to this story of some Egyptians celebrating the attacks today. Here's a BBC piece which indicates the feeling is shared in some other African countries. This doesn't mean that all or most people in any country feel the same way.
yoda389 writes: "I'm getting reports from friends that gas prices are jumping to as much as $5.00 a gallon. There are huge lines at all gas stations here in my hometown someplace in Wisconsin." And ikohl1 writes: "A friend just informed me of how gas prices were raised to $3.50 in a town near where i live. I didn't believe him at first but I found this article on Yahoo."
Gas prices may fluctuate in the short term, but in the long haul, effects on exports of goods physical and abstract may be affected just as drastically: elliotj writes: "MSNBC has a Steven Levy opinion piece on the possible implications of today's attack on America and governmental policy on encryption export restrictions. Personally, I think we need to determine exactly what happened before blaming physical or electronic security measures for a role in the tragedy. I heard the planes were hi-jacked with knives ... that doesn't sound very high-tech or a sign of significant security failings to me. It is the act itself that is so shocking and sickening."
The van (Score:5, Interesting)
Mirror For Video / Image Archive (Score:5, Informative)
Parent
Re:The van (Score:4, Interesting)
this page [aardvark.co.nz] which suggests that Microsoft's Flight Simulator might be the new terrorist training tool.
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Bullshit, while it might not require specific type training for the model of the jet it would take experience in flying a large jet to fly one into a building (according to aviation experts back here in europe).
Fact is that the original pilots did not crash the planes, they would not do it when they are going to die anyways they will rather dump the fuel and crash to the water, then at least some of the passengers would have a chance of surviving and the casualities in WTC would be avoided.
As for hijacking a plane, it is and will always be doable (the surity measures required to stop determined and smart hijacker would be a commercial disaster, there would not be enough passengers), normally the hijackers just have less drastic agendas and when the plane lands into a western airstrip it can be owned quickly (Germans have special force that can secure 747 in less than 17 seconds [minor hostage casualities allowed, the plane however will propably not fly again])
Parent
CNN newsfeed closed down. (Score:5, Informative)
Jeremy
Fox News' reasons for Sept. 11 (Score:5, Interesting)
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,34190,00.ht
September Anniversary of Several Past Attacks, Events
Tuesday, September 11, 2001
September marks the anniversary of several noted political events and terrorist attacks.
On Sept. 11, 1922, a British mandate was proclaimed in Palestine, despite Arab protests. It lasted until 1948, after the United Nations authorized a partition of the territory and the state of Israel was established.
On Sept. 6, 1970, three planes from TWA, Swissair and BOAC carrying more than 400 hostages were hijacked and ordered to the Jordanian airport by the PFLP, in what is known as "Skyjack Sunday." Another terrorist team tried to hijack an El Al Boeing over London but security staff foiled the attempt and captured one of the hijackers, Leila Khalid, alive. The German, Swiss and British Governments all agreed to the PFLP's demands and released a number of terrorists, including Khalid, held in their jails.
On Sept. 11, 1972, the troubled Munich Summer Olympics, also remembered as "the Olympics of Terror," ended. For 21 hours under live television cameras,hooded gunmen of the Palestinian faction "Black September" held Israeli athletes hostage, killing 11 of them duringa botched getaway and airport firefight with German antiterrorism squads.
On Sept. 28, 2000, the eve of Rosh Hashanah (the Jewish New Year), Ariel Sharon, then- leader of the opposition right-wing Likud party, visited the Temple Mount in the Old City of Jerusalem. Sharon, accompanied by an entourage of security officers, claimed he was exercising his right to visit the Mount, but his visit angered many Arabs, both Israeli and Palestinian. The day after the visit saw the beginning of what is known as the Al-Aqsa Intifada.
Re:Fox News' reasons for Sept. 11 (Score:5, Informative)
Parent
Re:Fox News' reasons for Sept. 11 (Score:4, Interesting)
Today is International World Peace day.
Parent
Re:The day vs. the date (Score:4, Interesting)
(The link is fairly slow but the entire article is worth reading.)
Parent
thoughts (Score:4, Interesting)
I'm not a religous person, but God be with the victims and protect the rescue workers as they do their best. I don't think I will ever forget the images of those people jumping from the top floors. I won't sleep well tonight.
God bless you all.
More on air cover in DC (Score:5, Informative)
2) This is a posting from the DC Police Scanner mailing list (qth.net). Very interesting on air cover over DC.
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FW:------
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All,
These are my own observations based only on my hand notes taken at the time.
I started listening to the events around 1030 EDT. The Trade Towers and the
Pentagon had already been attacked. By that time there was not a peep of
civil air traffic in the area. One of the first things I heard was Andrews
tower announcing on their VHF & UHF freqs that their airspace was closed and
that all intruders would be shot down. That certainly put an exclamation
point on what I was to hear for the rest of the day.
Throughout the day the Regan National controller (125.65) was the overall
controlling authority for the DC area. He authorized all departures and
entries into the Class B airspace. That role still remains as of 2200 EDT.
As of 2100 EDT Andrews is starting to return to normal with Airevacs and some
helos and VIP jets starting to fly in.
Fighters:
By 1030 there were two flights of DC ANG F-16s (Wild & Caps) up in Combat
Air Patrol (CAP). At that time there were news reports of another, missing
airliner, so I assume the F-16s were up protecting the DC area from that
possibility. Soon these F-16s were joined by three more F-16s from Langley,
North Dakota ANG aircraft normally deployed to Langley in an air defense
mode. The DC ANG flight leader assumed the role as CAP commander trying to
keep all the aircraft straight. DC ANG F-16s assumed control the airspace
below 23,000 ft and the Langley F-16s and alter, F-15s took the airspace
above that.
After about an hour, two Langley F-15s (First) joined the CAP and took up
position high above the area. They were also joined by some F-18s up from
Oceana. This caused some problems as far as refueling was concerned. The
KC-10s, who had the drogue capability, were ready to RTB and were out of
fuel. One of the KC-10s (Team 23) took it upon himself to set up to refuel
his aircraft from the available KC-135 (Tazz) so that he would be in a
position to refuel both the boom aircraft (F-16s & F-15s) and the drogue guys
(F-18s).
In the early afternoon, a flight of two VA ANG F-16s (Fury) came up to the DC
area to join the CAP group. The CAP commander later sent them back to the
Richmond area because there were too many aircraft in the DC area. After
about 30 minutes the VA ANG guys decided to end their CAP around Richmond and
RTB'ed to Harry Byrd International.
Tankers:
By 1030 there were two McGuire KC-10s (Team 23 & 24) up in the area. I'm not
sure if they were already in the general area when the events unfolded or
they were scrambled from McGuire. They started refueling the DC & Langley
F-16s so they could stay in the area. For awhile, in the morning, Team 23
also assumed the role of an AWACS giving target and vectoring information to
the CAP fighters. Team 23 eventually recovered at Andrews and refueled and
went back up in the late PM (1740). What a crew. They deserve a medal.
They've been up there since at least 1030 this morning.
Around the same time as the McGuire tankers were noted, two KC-135s from the
Maine ANG (Maine 85 & 86) were also in the area working with the McGuire
tankers. I believe that these guys had been up off the East Coast and were
diverted to the area to support operations.
Later in the morning and in the early afternoon two OH ANG KC-135s (Tazz &
Flop) and two PA ANG KC-135s (Steel) also joined the support crowd.
AWACS:
About an hour after I started listening, an AWACS (Bandsaw Kilo) was noted
off the MD/VA coast and started taking control of the airspace. However, the
DC ANG CAP commander continued to control the immediate airspace around
downtown DC. Later in the afternoon he was joined by another AWACS
(Chalice). I'm assuming that these aircraft were deployed from Langley or
possibly Seymour-Johnson. Bandsaw and Chalice were both in the area until
quite late in the evening.
Helos:
They were so many medevac helos trying to get into the Pentagon area to
extricate the wounded that I couldn't keep track of all of them.
Interspersed among the medevacs were several 1st Helo Sqdn (Mussels) getting
into the Pentagon area to take out some of the military VIPs (JCS).
There were also a couple of US Navy helos (HU-720) and another ) that came up
to Andrews from Norfolk. I'm assuming that these were carrying VIPs from
CincLant. News reports said that the area of the Pentagon that was struck by
the plane housed mostly USN & Marine offices.
Late in the PM there were several Nighthawk helos operating back & forth
between MCAF Quantico and Andrews. I'm assuming that they were shuttling
military VIPs.
NCS:
Huntress assumed NCS role sometime in the late morning and set up on 255.8,
228.9 & 234.6. Huntress assumed responsibility for designating targets and
releasing fighters to prosecute these targets.
The DC ANG F-16s and Langley F-15s as well as the AWACS and tankers have
been up continuously, -all day. They are still up and it's 2200 EDT. They
must be bushed.
These crews certainly have shown a very high level of professionalism and
devotion to duty. I for one am glad they are up there looking over us. Those
of you who support our military you can be VERY PROUD of their actions on
this day.
Did the Govt. have an idea about this? (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Did the Govt. have an idea about this? (Score:3, Interesting)
Jeremy
Re:Did the Govt. have an idea about this? (Score:4, Interesting)
I don't think the raid had any thing to do with these attacks. It came after weeks of investigation, and there was no mention of planned activities. However, I have read that there were interviews in recent weeks where a major attack was referered to by the Taliban and tacitly confirmed by Bin Ladin.
Parent
This was coming (Score:3, Informative)
The Afghanistan Explosions (Score:5, Informative)
The Northern Alliance (Score:3, Informative)
Re:The Afghanistan Explosions (Score:3, Informative)
from http://www.skyscraper.org/tallest/t_wtc.htm (Score:5, Informative)
World Trade Center History and Stats
The World Trade Center
Height: 1,368 and 1,362 feet (417 and 415 meters)
Owners: Port Authority of New York and New Jersey
Architect: Minoru Yamasaki, Emery Roth and Sons consulting
Engineer: John Skilling and Leslie Robertson of Worthington, Skilling, Helle and Jackson
Ground Breaking: August 5, 1966
Opened: 1970-73; April 4, 1973 ribbon cutting
The World Trade Center is more than its signature twin towers: it is a complex of seven buildings on 16-acres, constructed and operated by the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey (PANYNJ). The towers, One and Two World Trade Center, rise at the heart of the complex, each climbing more than 100 feet higher than the silver mast of the Empire State Building.
Construction of a world trade facility had been under consideration since the end of WWII. In the late 1950s the Port Authority took interest in the project and in 1962 fixed its site on the west side of Lower Manhattan on a superblock bounded by Vesey, Liberty, Church and West Streets. Architect Minoru Yamasaki was selected to design the project; architects Emery Roth & Sons handled production work, and, at the request of Yamasaki, the firm of Worthington, Skilling, Helle and Jackson served as engineers.
The Port Authority envisioned a project with a total of 10 million square feet of office space. To achieve this, Yamasaki considered more than a hundred different building configurations before settling on the concept of twin towers and three lower-rise structures. Designed to be very tall to maximize the area of the plaza, the towers were initially to rise to only 80-90 stories. Only later was it decided to construct them as the world's tallest buildings, following a suggestion said to have originated with the Port Authority's public relations staff.
Yamasaki and engineers John Skilling and Les Robertson worked closely, and the relationship between the towers' design and structure is clear. Faced with the difficulties of building to unprecedented heights, the engineers employed an innovative structural model: a rigid "hollow tube" of closely spaced steel columns with floor trusses extending across to a central core. The columns, finished with a silver-colored aluminum alloy, were 18 3/4" wide and set only 22" apart, making the towers appear from afar to have no windows at all.
Also unique to the engineering design were its core and elevator system. The twin towers were the first supertall buildings designed without any masonry. Worried that the intense air pressure created by the buildings' high speed elevators might buckle conventional shafts, engineers designed a solution using a drywall system fixed to the reinforced steel core. For the elevators, to serve 110 stories with a traditional configuration would have required half the area of the lower stories be used for shaftways. Otis Elevators developed an express and local system, whereby passengers would change at "sky lobbies" on the 44th and 78th floors, halving the number of shaftways.
Construction began in 1966 and cost an estimated $1.5 billion. One World Trade Center was ready for its first tenants in late 1970, though the upper stories were not completed until 1972; Two World Trade Center was finished in 1973. Excavation to bedrock 70 feet below produced the material for the Battery Park City landfill project in the Hudson River. When complete, the Center met with mixed reviews, but at 1,368 and 1,362 feet and 110 stories each, the twin towers were the world's tallest, and largest, buildings until the Sears Tower surpassed them both in 1974.
More Info on possible reasons the WTC Collapsed (Score:5, Insightful)
Im surprised how quick the response is to write these articles.
http://www.civil.usyd.edu.au/wtc.htm [usyd.edu.au]
Parent
The Sky Fell (Score:4, Interesting)
Condolences and Salon.com article (Score:3, Interesting)
With that said, I refer you to the excellent salon.com [salon.com]. Their coverage of this event has been extraordinary. I especially hope you read the first-person accounts of the terror. [salon.com] A number: that is difficult to identify with. A person, however, is much different. Remember each one of those thousands was a person, with his/her own life and nothing should be taken for granted.
Could this be left-wing extremists? (Score:5, Interesting)
Everyone just assumes this came from the Middle-East. That's what we thought when OKC happened, and it turned out to be something entirely different.
Re:Could this be left-wing extremists? (Score:4, Insightful)
Parent
Re:Could this be left-wing extremists? (Score:4, Insightful)
Non-experts like you talking out of their asses are just further confusing this issue. Note I'm not claiming to be any kid of expert - I'm just quoting the people who have some kind of relevant experience. Go to f-in CNN if you wan the details.
I wish to hell all you armchair commandos would stop blowing smoke about how easy this was. This was a very sophisticated military action and the sooner we abandon the isolated terrorist cell theory as the most viable option and start looking at the military reality (hint - only one nation has basically condemned the US and fully supported the action. Ends with a Q? anyone? Anyone?)
Parent
Business As Usual! (Score:5, Insightful)
If we get back to business and focus on providing support for families and blood for the wounded we will come out of this OK.
God Bless,
Jason Henriksen
Ever read a Tom Clancy novel? (Score:3, Interesting)
After all, if the NSA can probably defeat any encryption if they have reason to suspect they need to. It's nearly impossible to screen the entire Muslim/Islamic community for suspicious rug orders that may or not be instructions.
- JoeShmoe
Now for a Rationality Break from the JBS (Score:4, Interesting)
The approach recommended by Cohen, ironically, complements very well the classic strategy pursued by terrorists. Marxist militant Carlos Marighella, whose tactical blueprint has been followed by terrorists worldwide, explained that terrorists attack innocent people in order to provoke governments "to intensify repression. The police roundups, house searches, arrests of innocent people, make life unbearable.... Rejecting the 'so-called political solution,' the urban guerrilla must become more aggressive and violent, resorting without letup to sabotage, terrorism, expropriations, assaults, kidnappings, and executions, heightening the disastrous situation in which the government must act." Marighella went on to explain how this cycle continues until the existing political order is completely subverted, and a revolutionary regime takes power.
The gravest danger presented by today's terrorist attacks is that the effort to find and punish perpetrators will become a war upon the liberties of the American people. Yes, those responsible for the attacks must be found and punished with pitiless severity. But at the same time Americans must demand an immediate end to our interventionist foreign policy, which exacted such a tragic price in American blood on this terrible day.
Almost concrete proof of Bin Ladin Involvement... (Score:3, Informative)
http://us.news2.yimg.com/f/42/31/7m/dailynews.yah
Why the WTC towers collapsed. (Score:5, Informative)
What freaked me out was the collapse of the twin towers...I know a bit about structural engineering, and knew that these buildings were designed to withstand a passenger jet hitting them. But what really got to me is how they collapsed, like a controlled explosion where the fold the building in on itself.
One Declan McCullagh's mailing list, someone posted a much better analysis of the collapse than what has been seen in the media...most of the media engineers were mostly wrong. Take a gander at this url: http://www.pfarrell.com/rants/archtower.html [pfarrell.com].
This article talks about how the outside latticework of the WTC was actually a load-bearing member, and there were no internal support columns...and this explains why it collapsed the way that it did.
We can only theorize that the extreme heat of the jet fuel weaking the steel coupled with the fact that these jets were going fast enough to destroy the lattice work on almost all four sides of the structure where they hit caused the eventual collapse of the structures.We can only that what dieties you pray to that they fell in the manner the did...if they had fallen sidewas, in different directions...the death toll would have gone up by possibly an order of magnitutde!
ttyl, Farrell J. McGovern (No relation)
Twin Towers are designed for 2 hour fire (Score:5, Informative)
Kudos to slashdot and all of us, readers. (Score:5, Informative)
Slashdot has been my primary source of information, just about all the biggest news feed were jammed, didn't have any tv to watch, and the progress at which people posted here and all the links given, plus the overall stability of the site, I mean, I'm impressed.... I was sure at some point when the server started being overloaded that it would be down for hours, instead, it was just for minutes or simple slowdown but nothing critical like the big feeds which were totaly busted.
Unfortunately. this is not the kind of event you'd want to happen to test the overall stability of a server and the quality of it's content, but at least it hanged in there, where others that have way more financial power and supposely professionnal staff to do the job, failed.
Thanks to all the Slashdot team, and us, readers/contributors.
Let's Speculate (Score:3, Interesting)
We know that 4 planes were hijacked and 3 slammed into buildings.
Almost certainly all the hijackers on the planes are now dead as well as many many victims. By targeting the WTC and Pentagon they have attacked buildings with both actual and symbolic value to the American way of life. These are places presumably intended to produce as many casualties as possible and demonstrate the vulnerabilities of even our greatest organizations.
Clearly these people hate America and Americans and are perfectly happy to give their lives to hurt us and create terror. Multiple people prepared to give their lives in the assault suggest a religious group with beliefs that their souls will be honored after their death. Essentially all major religions (e.g. Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism) share a fundamental respect for life, but at many times and places their teachings have been corrupted to justify killing in God's name. In the current case Islam seems the most likely, not because they are especially vulnerable, but because people in Islamic regions seem the most likely to hate Americans at this point in history.
We must bear partial responsibility for the hate they feel towards us. At some point there was a failure to connect with these people and address their concerns in a reasonable way. Now the world has stepped down a path that will almost certainly lead to even greater destruction. Of course, our unseen attackers bear the greatest responsibility and will hopefully be called to account, but we must wonder if there was anything society could do to redress their grievances before they grew to the point that they perceived violence as their only option.
What does it take to do this? Most likely you need pilots trained on these planes or one's like them. This ensures that the pilot will in fact fly directly into the target, and minimized the chance of the original pilot conveying that something is wrong. Probably it would be easier to find suicide bombers and send them to flight school than to recruit pilots to be bombers.
Terrorists would also need weapons. This means either being able to conceal them through security or being able to go around security. If you have money it is probably easier to get weapons that can be walked through a metal detector than to research ways to breach security. This is especially true if you plan to go through more than one airport. Hard plastics and ceramics can be made into some nasty things if cost is not a concern. Alternatively, a sharp obsidian or glass knife with wooden handle could probably be made for a bargain.
Once on the plane you want to be able to take control and get into the locked cockpit. Threatening passengers might get one to open the cockpit but it's not totally reliable and they would certainly send distress signals first. More preferably one would want to practice breaking into cockpits and have a tool or ram that could do it quickly. A slightly modified piece of luggage might serve as a ram. (I don't know what the locking mechanisms are like but someone taking the time to train as a pilot certainly would have access to them and perhaps figure out how to quickly defeat them.)
A single terrorist is somewhat likely to be overpowered in the tight quarters of an airliner, and is at greater risk if he has to pilot the plane himself while in a cockpit that can no longer be secured properly. This suggests that you need multiple suicidal terrorists per plane. Two might be enough, but three would be safer because that still gives them a backup even after your pilot takes the controls.
To continue speculating, we are talking about 8-12 hijackers, at least 4 of which pilots. They would probably want some financial backers and other organizers. It would make sense to have associates to recruit the next generation of terrorists. If they're foreign nationals you need an identity and papers, or some other way to get into the country. Of course securing entrance into the country wouldn't require telling the person you get the false papers from what you intend to do. While they do want some people in support positions, they wouldn't want too many as it increases the opportunities of leaks that would kill the whole project. I'm guessing that somewhere between 10 and 30 people knew about this attack in advance.
The main cost is in preparation time and finding the right people to go through with it. The point is that you don't actually need an army, expensive weaponry, or lots of financial backing to accomplish this. Of course, having financial backing and encouragement is perhaps rather likely and would make things easier, especially if they come from third world nations where the relative income is quite low.
Obviously we will have to wait until the facts are known to see how accurate my speculations are, and truth is often stranger than imagination.
A Survivor Story (Score:5, Interesting)
She arrived at work on the 81st floor of the north tower at 8:45am EDT today. The first plane crashed into this tower at about 8:55am EDT about 5 floors above her. After the initial confusion and chaos, everybody on her floor headed towards the exits and began the slow evacuation down the stairs.
While the first building was being evacuated, the second plane hit the south tower at about 9:05am. An hour later while still making her way down the stairs of the north tower, the south tower collapses at 10:07am. 20 minutes after that at 10:27am, and nearly an hour and a half after the first plane crashed into her building, she makes it to the bottom floor as the north tower begins to collapse down onto her. (Sadly, I assume everybody in floors any higher than 81 probably didn't make it out of the building.)
She was one of the last people to make it out of the building, but she did not make it far before a door fell on top of her and pinned her to the ground. In retrospect, she was very lucky because the door shielded her from glass and other falling objects.
After the dust settled somewhat, she was discovered by police and taken to the hospital. She is in stable condition and is being treated for bruises, cuts, and broken bones.
I can only imagine how she must feel to have been at ground zero and still be alive to tell about it.
Afghanistan isn't a functioning country (Score:4, Insightful)
So there's no country to go to war with. It's another mess like Bosnia. There are 25 million people in an area the size of Texas, some of whom hate the US and some who don't. Now what?
Call to Words: How The Planes Fell From The Sky (Score:5, Interesting)
Formally submitting my first diff patch, I fired this letter off to the Federal Aviation Administration [faa.gov], the overbearing bureaucracy whose oversights led to four plane crashes and thousands killed. The trip I took was to Defcon 9.
I took a trip to Las Vegas in July. My flight from Phoenix went normally except for one serious, disturbing mistake made by Phoenix security checkpoint staff. I thought it was funny at first that such as a glaring lapse of policy occured, but after the tragic events in New York and Washington, I revistited this story and I wonder whether four lapses in "Airport Security" caused the deaths of so many people today.
Suitcasenuke is the name of a computer I jerryrigged in an old Samsonite suitcase for portability. I have edited this account for clarity, the original is at http://telconnect.net/~sean/suitcasenuke/ [telconnect.net]
Transporting:
The finished product is rather heavy and bulky--65 pounds give or take. It barely fit as a carryon. I took America West flight 113 from Phoenix Sky Harbor International to Las Vegas McCarran on a busy Thursday afternoon.
Approaching "SECURITY CHECKPOINT A," I cut in line by 10 people hollering out to the security staff that I could nto have suitcase nuke X-rayed as the machine is a very sensitive piece of electronic equipment.
Preparing for this, I had all the fixins to prove to them this frightening apparatus wasn't a bomb. Packed in there were my keyboard, mouse, power cord, vga cable so I could plug it into one of their terminals if need be. The screener blatantly ignores my request to pass it through and I'm eventually in front of the walk-through metal detector. This staffer does not understand English very will and I do not understand his natiove Swahili. Thankfully my brother had already gone through and was also trying to get through to the screener. Five minutes of this, and there are easily sixty people behind me in line.
Pressed with the queue, he grabbed the suitcase and fit it through the little gap between the metal detector and the X-ray machine and flailed his hand behind him, motioning me to 'go over there.'
I found myself staring at an unstaffed table with a plane to Vegas to catch, not blow out of the sky. My impatient brother didn't feel like further embattling the screeners and rigamorol. Off we went.
They didn't plug it in. They didn't swab it for explosive residue. They didn't even open it.
I smuggled--if that's the right word--a 70 pound suitcase right passed "Airport Security."
Makes me wish it were a suitcase nuke.
Now before you go out and arrest me, I beg of you to reconsider airport security policies. For example, arresting people who make bomb jokes at the gate is the embodiment of stupidity and maligned priorities. If I was really going to blow up the plane, would I be talking about it at the security checkpoint?
How hard would it be to smuggle an 18" polycarbonate machete onto a plane by maybe taping it to your thigh or sandwiching it in your suitcase between a lead plate? Even if I obviously brought contraband aboard, what's the chance the underpayed, undereducated, understaffed, and overly apathetic security screener overlook it or not know what it is? Or would he be too lazy and not even get up and make a fuss about it if he did recognize it? Don't say it's not possible. It happened to me. I did it at an airport with one of the best records in the industry. Phoenix Sky Harbor had two violations last year. Is this one Number 3? Which other violations do you not know about?
The FAA failed in its security measures four times the morning of 11th Septembenr and as a result, our nation mourns. Could that 18" polycarbonate machete worn by a survivalist or a law-abiding american concerned only with the defense of his legitimate fellow passengers ultimately ensure their safety? Barbara Olson's plane was taken down by two hijackers armed with cardboard cutters. Could a right to self-defense have saved United Flights 99 and 175 and American Airlines Flights 11 and 77 and prevented this atrocity?
Does the FAA honestly think it will stop a suicidal hijacker on a mission for Allah by having a ticket clerk ask "Have any unknown persons been in the possession of your baggage?"
Don't cast this off. Please. THe Administration's policies have failed America. I want to see them changed.
The rockets in Afghanistan are likely linked to... (Score:4, Interesting)
A Car in Boston Airport Was Found (Score:4, Informative)
"This is an act of war!" (Score:5, Insightful)
Americans probably won't find this very comforting right now, but I'll give a short newsbreak: Unless you haven't noticed, you are in war, have been for a long time!
Look, for the last 50 years, Americans have been bombing cities here and there all over the world, leaving hundreds of thousands if not millions people dead, charred, mothers and brothers wailing over their graves. Sure, Americans were always the good guys, and sure, American bombs only killed soldiers. But hey, even innocent people do die in wars. America just got it first civilian casualties in 50 years!
So, we can now wait to see how the American reaction will be different from the reaction of those rag-head mad-dog arabs, who cry for eternal revenge after their relatives have been killed and homes bombed to ground.
Really, get over it.
War where? Against whom? (Score:5, Informative)
1. US Citizens have not had war in their own continent/country for a few, what, hundred years. It shows somewhat in the shockedness of the commentary. Of course this is awful. It does not happen only to someone else somewhere else, neither is what happens to you unique in this day and age. A few surprise attacks and -strikes from last century come to mind. Some of them out of scale, some changing our world for ever.
2. JFK: one mad US citizen. OKC: a few mad US citizen. Yet every time the foreigners get blamed before the attackers are found.
I am shocked and afraid of the future now. I live on the other side of the world from there. Most of us do. Live in fear of the US reaction and what that will do for the world. The world we all have to live in. There is no escape from this planet just yet, not even for chosen few US citizens. We must get along. Focus on anything else, and the nature will take care of us for good.
Sorry if I hurt your feelings; this is just critique that comes to mind while trying to work over the shock by absorbing as much information and commentary about the situation as possible.
Hannan Ashrawi (sp?) talks (Score:4, Insightful)
She claimed the people shown celebrating and dancing are a *very* small minority group and do not in any way represent Palestinians as a whole. Moreover, though small groups of people may have been celebrating when they heard America was hit, celebrations soon subsided when it became clear that possibly thousands had been killed. The general attitude in the West Bank and Gaza is one of horror, disgust and sympathy with American victims.
Bear in mind that Ashrawi (I really should've looked this up, sorry) is one of the most moderate Palestinians around and that she's also one of very few Palestinians with some authority who's got any idea about pr Western style (as in, she knows it's not a good idea to scream "I will sacrifice *all* of my sons for Allah to make Israel suffer the way we suffer" when a suicide bomber's just blown up a kiddie disco in Tel Aviv - it doesn't do the Palestinian cause any good in the Western eye) so she's bound to say something like this.
However, if you think about it, she may, partly, be right. I myself have only seen that footage with the guy handing out free food to passersby (you know which footage I mean). Consider that in the 22 hrs since it happened, there hasn't been any new footage of Palestinians dancing in the street. It's always the same clip. If this celebration was going on on any substantial scale, I should think we would've seen more footage of it.
Disclaimer: I'm not Palestinian, nor am I Israeli, nor am I sympathetic to either cause (in the sense that I don't believe either people should be destroyed to give the other Lebensraum)
Passengers fought back on Pittsburgh flight? (Score:5, Interesting)
...
Dear Jerry,
Following is a message which my one of my best friends passed along with permission to distribute to those who might be interested. It fills in the details that I missed in my original conversation with him and attempted to relate to you.
Tom has given me permission to distribute the message - please feel free to post it if you deem it appropriate.
Sincerely,
Art Russell Major, US Army (Retired)
Message Follows:
Today was a tragedy for all of America and to my family, a very personal one. Lynn and my Niece Liz's husband, Jeremy Glick was on United flight 93 this morning. When the Hijackers took control of flight 93. Jeremy called my niece who in-turn conferenced him to 911. Jeremy relayed to the police what was happening as the hijacking unfolded. As our niece Liz listened, Jeremy told the police there were three Arab terrorists with knives and a large red box that they claimed contained a bomb. Jeremy tracked the second by second details and relayed them to the police by phone. After several minutes of describing the scene, Jeremy and several other passengers decided there was nothing to lose by rushing the hijackers. Although United Flight 93 crashed outside of Pittsburgh, with the loss of all souls. Jeremy and the other patriotic heroes saved the lives of many people on the ground that would have died if the Arab terrorists had been able to complete their heinous mission.
Please offer your prayers for all of those who perished or were injured in this tragic of all days and to our niece Liz Glick and her 2-month-old child, Emerson, who are left without their loving Husband and Father.
May we remember Jeremy and the other brave souls as heroes, soldiers and Americans' on United flight 93 whom so gallantry gave their lives to save many others.
Lynn, our four adult children and I are headed to New York to be with our family during this time of great sadness
All of my best,
Tom
We find
Re:E-word (Score:5, Insightful)
We must fight the good fight and not let people in congress pass new laws. "The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.".
It is a tragic and sad thing that has happened. This is an attack on humanity and civilization and the world as a whole, especially americans tne symbol of freedom and capitalism CANNOT bend, we cannot break, we cannot even flex.
Will I still fly American Airlines? Yep. I always have and always will.
I am not going to change my ways of exercising my freedoms for terroists, not now, not ever.
I think something like this should give everyone new perspective, but I don't think new laws will protect us at all. Just take away our freedoms and let the terrorists win.
Jeremy
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Re:oh boy.... read this: (Score:3, Informative)
Re:oh boy.... read this: (Score:5, Insightful)
Nostradamus wrote his "prophecies" in a language that only he knew in fear of death. Scholars have been trying to translate his ramblings for hundreds of years and every once in awhile they try and take their "translations" and compare them to modern events. Heck, most studies of his work said that he had no further predictions after 2000/05/05 which was widely viewed to be his prediction of the end of the world. Guess what? We're still here.
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This is not Nostradamus. (Score:5, Informative)
Here's the debunking [fury.com].
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Re:oh boy.... read this: (Score:3, Insightful)
City of God... Definately not NYC, Jerusalem is the city of God === Jerusalem
Where the two brothers... 3 buildings fell, and they weren't brothers, they were 1 center with MANY workers and separate offices, if you're going to follow that logic, the brothers must be the people at war. This could be the Palestinians vs Isreali, or perhaps the civil war being played out in Afghanistan. Brothers don't have to love each other, they are just "related" some how. (in prophecies at least, I love my brother) == Inconclusive, but it's 2 political factions
Fortress... Pentagon, eh, maybe, but that's an office building. Note that they didn't crash into a military BASE where there would be missiles and such to attack them. This is perhaps the US as a whole more accurately, since the US has not suffered an attack on their soil of this magnitude for a long time, but is a symbolically important target to many groups. Of course, the US is very open. Crossing boarders in other countries is much more difficult. Perhaps this could be viewed as the World Trade Center, the warground of what was until not long ago, and I am sure will remain the modern warfare, that is fought at a terminal in stock shares, not with guns. == Also inconclusive
Great Leader... GWB, Congress, The US... Keep giong, it could even be someone on the other side, the Great Leader of the attack (though I don't think he's so great) == Still inconclusive
Big City... Eh, NYC
Still, this is pretty ambiguous. I don't really follow nostradamus nor do I think that this is one of the signs of the end of the world. This is bad, this sucks, this is a shock to us, this isn't apocalyptic prophecy. OBL (not to cast this on him until it's known) is not the sort of charismatic leader to start the kind of war that gets printed in the bible in the end of days. Whoever did this will be brought to justice swiftly and forcefully. This isn't a war they can win. The one in the Bible is one that drags out and is fought hard by both sides. Not to sound overconfident, but I haven't seen the sort of military force yet that I would expect from such a power. Until planes fly over my house that aren't from the US, and start carrying out surgical strikes against us, I won't believe that it is that sort of war. This will not stand, they can not win. The sort of war in the bible, I would be standing out front with my hunting rifles right now gunning down an invasion.
Re:absolutely right (Score:5, Insightful)
Everyone claims that this was sophisticated, planned for months, etc.
If not for heightened security tomorrow, I could have pulled this off with 20 like minded and loyal friends. 5 per plane, and no flight crew of 3 pilots and 5 flight attendents would be able to stop me.
On top of that, with the people on board, the likely fact is that they probably didnt know what was going to happen. If I thought I was going to be okay and things would just work out ("I am not going to kill anyone of you, its only money" would convince me to sit down and ride it out - right into a building) then would I even consider being heroic? No.
Its clear to me that a few people went onto each plane with normal tickets and simply overpowered the flight crew, forced them into the rear, told them to wait it out it would be okay, and then proceeded to do the deed. Nothing, and I really mean that, could have stopped it once they were airborne.
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Re:Why? (Score:5, Interesting)
Because in the past fifty years, US government policy has killed millions of civilians worldwide, all to keep career politicians in office. Everything that you feel now, shock, revulsion, anger, is the same genuine feeling that has existed for years in Beiruit and Baghdad, in North Korea and Vietnam and Cuba, in every place else that has suffered US bombs and US sanctions.
Because the US parks carrier battle groups on peoples' doorsteps all over the world, threatens civilian populations, then hangs out the signs saying "Make us go away. Just try."
Because, in the cause of "freedom", the US supported a dictatorship (Iraq) against a theocracy (Iran) then switched sides to defend a monarchy (Kuwait) because it had more oil. There's no principle at work there, just cynical pragmatism.
I'd go on, but you either know this by now, or you don't. The US is hated on a deep and personal level by large parts of the world. Fear has kept them in check. Now you either need to crank up the fear again, or work on the hatred.
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Re:Fifth plane (Score:4, Informative)
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Re:Few things of the top of my head (Score:4, Insightful)
>>>>>>>>>>>
There is no way anybody can argue that this is not an act of a coward. I'm muslim, and I hate these terrorists for making all muslims out to be cowards. These people are cowards on several points:
A) They did not officially declare war. Attacking a country at peace is the act of a coward.
B) They attacked civilians who were just going to work in the morning. These people aren't the ones responsible for America's foreign policy, they aren't the ones championing capitalism all over the world. They were simply people going to work in the morning. Killing in war is something horrible, but maybe unavoidable. Killing in peace is just murder.
C) They might have had a clear head, but being smart (no doubt, whoever organized this was smart as hell) doesn't make one any less evil.
D) It takes no courage to take out ones anger on innocents. It takes real courage to stand up for one's self within the framework of society.
We don't live in a world anymore where violence is condoned. The majority of the civilized world has moved on to a point where violence isn't even considered. In the US, the worst thing that can happen to a politician is that some pundit calls him stupid on TV, or some cameraman catches him taking a shit. Being assasinated by an opposition party isn't even within the realm of thought. Those who still live by the baser human instincts of killing one's enemies should be "replaced", just as modern humans replaced their primitive ancestors.
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