Maintaining Computers Donated to Schools and Charities? 19
"As we all know, sooner or later older computers reach a point where they are useless for anything beyond the software of its era. I recently was called to help a fix a friend's granddaughter's computer. The problem? The computer worked perfectly, everything was fine. But it was OLD. A 1995 vintage Packard Bell with Pentium I, 75 MHz processor, 4x CD player, 6 MB RAM and 500 MB hard drive, bought right after they started shipping with Win 95 preinstalled, and cost them nearly $2000 when it was new. Obviously, they weren't too up to speed on computers, because they wanted to get on the internet, and tried to install AOL 6.0. Of course, the installer came up saying that the system didn't meet the requirements. That's when they called me. I spent the next hour trying to explain that it would be easier to buy a newer computer than to try to upgrade this one. This is exactly the type of computer that gets passed along to charity, one that still works but is just too old to keep up with today's MP3 playing, DVD viewing, CD burning, cable modem screaming, 3D graphics slinging supercomputers we all now have sitting on our desks.
Assuming this computer could be upgraded to the maximum allowed by its motherboard (maybe 32 MB RAM and 800 MB HD if the BIOS supports it, and Pentium 133 if it can be jumpered that fast), are there sites that deal exclusively with the care, feeding and uses of geriatric computers, like where to obtain parts, how to jumper old motherboards and just how much upgrading can be done without having to replace the motherboard (thus having to buy a video card, sound card, and modem, since they were often built into the mobo of these old systems- in short, an entirely new computer), and links to suppliers of legacy software (' abandonware') that can be accessed by a REALLY light web browser such as Opera?"
Re:Leading question (Score:1)
That's why you use fvwm(95 if you want that look) and Netscape 3. Opera for Linux is another option.
Re:How We Handle it in Charlottesville (Score:1)
Waldo
Re:How We Handle it in Charlottesville (Score:1)
Waldo
How We Handle it in Charlottesville (Score:2)
Our minumum specs, BTW, is a P133 w/ 16MB of RAM and a 1GB HDD. (I say 'our' -- I just volunteer there every week or two.) Most of the machines that we give out aren't much better than that. We put Win95 on most boxes (I'd love to put Linux on there, but we want these kids to know how to use systems as a eventual job skill, not as a primary skillset), which works just fine.
If the kids' machines break, they bring them back and a volunteer fixes it. Without a group like this, it would be pretty well impossible for systems to be effectively reused in central Virginia. But the result is that these kids have resources that they would never otherwise have access to.
Waldo
Re:This may not be what you want to hear... (Score:1)
Compaq has information and downloads for everything they've ever made - even back to system disks for the original 8088 luggables. On some IBM FTP server, I found a large cache of PCjr software. Etc etc -- just some of the benifits of buying/getting a name brand system.
On the other hand, I find dealing with older, unknown white box equipement more trouble than it's worth. Maybe that's a good motherboard, maybe it's one with some artifical RAM celing. What the hell is this soundcard? And so on - at least you can use the case for something.
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Re:Education is one key (Score:1)
I had to reply to this one, although I'm a little late in the conversation. Blame it on my current computer, a vintage pentium 75 (oc to 90Mhz, thank you very much). No, actually, blame it on my current schedule, because this computer is just fine.
When I bought it, back in 95, it came with a mail-in coupon to get a Windows 95 CD. Today, I'm running the last version released/patched. Of course, I had the insight of buying more memory back then, upgrading from the default 8MB to 24MB. And it runs rather smoothly.
Of course, I prefer Opera to MSIE when it comes to browsing. I even used to surf with any graphics, but that was with my 56k modem. Now with a 900Mb dsl connection, I can watch all the pretty pictures (yet I still disable animations, but that's just me.).
I use the Bat for email, never had much luck with Outlook personally. I also develop a bit, but I use gcc or bc5.5 for my c++ needs. I also have a tiny spreadsheet program, always come in handy. Oh, I also happen to run litestep for my shell (see my current desktop [waglo.com]), instead of the usual Explorer shell.
I'm not going to enumerate all the software I use (Paint Shop Pro 7 works, a little slow, but no trashing), I'm only going to add this: Apache/Perl.
(This scream *n*x or *bsd, I know, I'm just comfortable with this setup right now, and it can even stay up for a week at a time.) I got a domain [waglo.com] a little while ago, and now hosting a bunch of sites, like rymmarks [waglo.com], my bookmark search engine (I have > 14000 bookmarks).
Anyhow, my point is that old computers still work. It's a myth that a computer decreases is usefullnes. How can anybody not see thru this consumer hoax? If you can find the old software for your old machine, you should be just as happy as anyone else running the latest Word version.
And you know what? This is where the spirit of free software really shines - it makes it harder, I mean impossible, to call a computer obselete when it's running the software it was meant to be.
Re:How We Handle it in Charlottesville (Score:1)
In Edinburgh, Scotland, we will take any kit we can get - even non-complete.
Just last week I picked up a K6 300Mhz box, sans keyboard, mouse, and monitor - and I've just arranged to pick up a 14 inch monitor.
While it might save time for you I can't really see the justification in a minimum spec donation.
If you're in the area see FreeComputers.org.uk [freecomputers.org.uk].
Steve
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Re:How We Handle it in Charlottesville (Score:1)
Sure I can see how that would be usefull now.
In my case I would happily even take those 486's .. purely to use as routers/firewalls in my flat - or to give to other people for the same purpose.
It hadn't occured to me that you'd actually be attempting to install Windows on them - that would, quite clearly, be insane.
Incidently .. where are you getting the licenses for Windows from? (Or do they come with
an existing installation CD, from the donators?).
Steve
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Re:Leading question (Score:2)
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Some minimums ... (Score:2)
500mb of disk is a bit tight, but it might be enough if managed carefully (i.e. you don't install lots of junk.) If not, pull another 500mb disk out of another box and put it in here for a total of 1gb.
Don't try to use Office 2000. Find some old copies of Office 95. It'll do most of what everybody needs, and should work with 16mb of ram. The biggest problem with Office 95 is likely to be that it won't load Office 97 or Office 2000 files -- which may or may not be a problem.
Why these computers were donated (Score:2)
The best thing to do with these types of donations is to sell them as scrap, then take the money and apply it to the operations budget of the organization. Or take the money to a local computer shop that will sell you good useable hardware at cost (or less), with the understanding that profit and support will be considered a donation. Many times the computer shop is stuck with some of last year's models which would certainly be good enough for bookkeeping uses, will run current software, yet are "too old" for the computer store's normal customers.
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Re:Some minimums ... (Score:1)
I remember using the word 97 converter when I still used Office 95. (the last GOOD, FUNCTIONAL version of Office. This is the Office that made Office king.)
Somewhat offtopic, but.... (Score:2)
We all have cable modems? We do?! Unfortunately, not everyone can access cable or other high-speed forms of internet access. The majority of people still connect via dialup, and isn't going to change for years yet. The infrastructure just doesn't exist for everyone to be able to connect at 'decent' speeds.
Yes, I know dialup is obsolete. Yes, I know it's awful to use. But it's not going away, because a lot of people that want it can't get it, and a lot of people that can get it won't pay for it.
Slowly and sadly posted via a 56k modem by someone that would happily pay for something better...
Education is one key (Score:3)
Naturally this occurs on two sides: those who are giving and those who are receiving. Companies that can afford to upgrade their equipment probably want to offload their old equipment for a tax write-off. Heck, they probably take a write-off for what they originally paid for the equipment. They need to realize that, depending on the age of the equipment, they really aren't doing the receiving institution any favors by sending them equipment. Sure, a graphics design company might not have much use for last year's P-III 450s, but 486s, early pentiums, Mac classics, and older might prove to be too much trouble for exactly the reason brought up in this question.
The other people that need to be educated are the people accepting the equipment. I can't think of how many times we have had to explain to the administration around here that those old computers just weren't worth it, and that we couldn't make them good for anything. If they *could* be upgraded, and we were going to try, our money would be a lot better spent on purchasing newer machines.
Also, those who donate equipment, as this article mentions, need to donate it right away. In the given example, I wonder how many companies had computers sitting in back rooms and closets for over a year? I realize that donation can't always happen right after they upgrade to new eqipment, but all too often, stuff probably just gets forgotten about and then a year later it's even less worth the upgrade. At least the eqipment might be old when they donate it a little earlier, but it might still be viably (is that a word?) useful for someone, and there still may be some old accessories and software available.
Ok, maybe I should throw in some suggestions for use, too, if people really do want to hang onto this old stuff. I have seen smaller computer stores (not Best Buy or Wal-mart, mind you) and especially salvage parts suppliers carry older hardware and software that perhaps these old machines can use. If it's a school or other non-profit institution, and one copy of an older, useful application could be obtained, I bet if they'd write the software company, they could get permission to install older software. The software company could even consider it a donation, and it wouldn't even cost them anything. Also, older programs might be available via online auctions as well. Or even those reverse auctions where you mention what you want. I imagine there's tons of people out there that have old stuff sitting around in their basements, they just don't know anybody wants it.
"I say consider this day seized!" -Hobbes
This may not be what you want to hear... (Score:3)
The PB 75 MHz systems I've dealt with were all upgradeable to 166 MHz with no fuss, and upgradeable to 200 MHz if you updated the BIOS. Pentium 233 CPU's are still surprisingly easy to find
For complete manuals, BIOS updates, FAQ's and other support documents on older Packard Bell systems, take a look here:
Packard Bell support (via Priority One) [priorityonesupport.com]
They make you register, but doing is worth it (it was for me, anyway, given how many of these hateful things we have lying around).
Re:How We Handle it in Charlottesville (Score:1)
Anyway, I have a Compaq P-133 here with a manufacture date of 9/95 that had a OEM Win95 install running when I got it. Still too useful to give away, BTW.
Think about needs, and find a Geek. (Score:2)
In this case, the perfect candidate is someone in their mid teens that might not quite be old enough for a job, but is interested in a good letter of recommendation so they can work in a computer store instead of flipping burgers next summer. Or, they need some charitable work to put on a college application. This sort of nerd has the skills to get the system set up for the organization, and make sure it meets their needs.
For example, the aforementioned Pentium 75 is more than capable for straight web browsing, desktop publishing, mailing lists, contact management, and any number of other minor tasks. Windows 95 is perfect for that sort of thing. While I do have a new laptop, I'm typing this on my Pentium 100. It doesn't frag like it used to, but with a 4.x/5.x browser, it's perfect for the web. The trick is to get out the excess garbage.
Even very old machines can be useful as a learning tool. I have an old 42 MB hard drive that died about five years ago. Why I didn't throw it out is beyond me. I could replace the lid with a sheet of polycarbonate and give it to an elementary school. My favorite science teacher came equipped with a screwdriver.
I learned from my mistakes early on. Don't just show up with a Heath H89 and a Tandy TRS-80 Model IV. Ask them what sort of stuff they need and cater to that. That way, you'll both save a hernia.
Packard Bell Pentium 75? Could you imagine a Beowulf cluster of those things?
What's up with the moderating? (Score:1)
If you took two people completely unfamiliar with computers, sat one in front of Windows & the other in front of Linux (running KDE or Gnome), they would reach the same skill level simultaneously. Anyone who doubts this must not remember DOS or hasn't had a bad install of Windows/Office, crappy drivers, needed to change some esoteric Windows configuration, etc.
I can still run Debian on my LC II--no floppy, though. :-(
In this day of the $1K supercomputer, the average home user probably pays a 10% M$ tax. And then they're stuck with the OS on their machine!
New Deal (Score:1)