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Hardware

Light Touch / Low Force Keyboards 24

Posted by michael from the they-don't-call-it-banging-the-keys-for-nothing dept.
buggedbug writes "My favorite old keyboard finally died, and all of the new keyboards I have tried have such a hard keypress that I get wrist pain. Can anyone suggest a good pc keyboard with a light touch / low-force keypress? I actually did try the Kinesis Classic which does have a good low force keypress (45 grams), but the contouring and relocated keys are driving me nuts and the contouring is more than I need to prevent the pain. I'd prefer to find a more standard keyboard... Any suggestions?" We've done plenty of keyboard questions, regarding durable keyboards, one-handed keyboards, ergonomic keyboards, etc. But I don't recall any on light-touch keyboards.
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Light Touch / Low Force Keyboards More

Light Touch / Low Force Keyboards

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  • Apple Pro USB keyboard (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward
    I recently bought the Apple Pro USB keyboard and found the keys to be too light for my taste. If you don't have a problem with using a USB keyboard on your system, check it out. It's the same keyboard used on the G4s, so you should be able to go to your local CompUSA, or whatever, and try it out. One nice feature you may also like is that it will lay flat on a desk, as opposed to slanting up/away like most keyboards do (which annoys the hell out of me).
  • not the keyboard on my thinkpad, it's the right size. I measured it one time and found out that it was just the same width as my regular keyboard, _to the millimetre_.
  • Ouch. The ZX81 was the first computer I built and own, but the membrane force needed to get reliable typing motivated me to search for an aftermarket keyboard. Back in those days, an aftermarket keyboard meant a bunch of keys on a plastic base that needed soldering and a case made for it.

    Unlike today's keyboards, the old ones had a distinctive solid feel through the heavy keys. Each key was its unique switch on a heavy plastic frame. The weight of they keys were nothing considering the lack of friction heavy construction provided. And this was a cheap keyboard in its day ($20.) More expensive models had a HAL effect switch for each key. Pressing a key had the smoothest action and least friction. Top of the line keyboards had a very light spring under tension to create a threshold that stimulated typing action.

    Today's keyboards just don't compare to the old clickety clunkers of yesterday. The keys in modern keyboards have a sloppy path of travel not staying level under the fingers, giving bad feedback. The keys on older keyboards stayed level under force and would travel an accurate straight path downwards when pressed. Good keyboard feedback is noticeable after a short time. Its a feel that can be compared with a car that wanders between lanes down the road with one that tracks the center on its own.

    Everyone needs to save those old junk keyboards, especially the ones made in the 70's. Gold connectors, HAL effect switches, and solid metal frames rival the finest precision machines known as typewriters they were to replace.
  • When I was 8 my first computer was a ZX81. It had (and still has!!!!) a touch sensative keyboard, which although crap for touch-typing was ok for the single-entry keyword system its BASIC used, was silent and was effortless to use. It was a simple membrane arrangement of wires and platic connected in a row/column matrix to the Z-80's IO bus.

    It also has a multi-tasking FORTH-83 ROM.

    That's right, multi-tasking (real time) in 8K of RON and 16K of RAM (4K minimum)
  • I don't know if they are still available, and it is a "wave" keyboard, but I like mine, and it is very light (much lighter than the MS keyboards I tried). Mine at work is actually a Dell OEM kbd, but I got one for home from CompUSA.
  • Boy, you ain't kidding about the Model M. I recently managed to snag one and it is wonderful. You forgot to mention the removeable keycaps, though.

    --
  • why not try a notebook? They tend to have more sensitive keypads, due to the lack of space
    They are also typically ergonomically disastrous, because they are designed to be compact and light, not ergonomically sound. I would definitely not advice anyone with bad wrists to use them. In fact, I would not advise anyone to use them as their main keyboard.
  • As another poster has pointed out, they usually suck. But the concept is sound. I've got an IBM Thinkpad A21p, and the keyboard is great. Full sized, no numeric keypad so the mouse is closer. and the trackpoint is good for quickly selecting windows (not so accurate for other stuff).

    The real problem that I see is that because the screen is connected to the keyboard, you can't get the screen a the right ergo-height without raising the keyboard to a bad ergo-height (and vice versa). If this was not the case, I wouldn't need this second keyboard :-(

    - Mike

  • Logitech (Score:3)

    by scotpurl ( 28825 ) on Thursday March 22, 2001 @12:33PM (#347517)
    I've got a Microsoft Natural, a Logitech Deluxe 104, a PC-Concepts i-MMT ($10), and a Honeywell 101WN sitting here. The Logitech has the lightest touch of all of them, even compared to the keyboard on my Dell laptop. I actually went to several office stores, and compared keyboards before I found one that I liked. Must confess that I fell in love with the Kinesis keyboard at a UW computer fair years ago, but could never bring myself to spend that much.

    You might also consider building forearm strength. It's easy to do, prevents carpal tunnel, reduces arthritis, and you'd have to actually work at it for a couple of years to get Popeye's forearms. I've known several women with incredible grip strength (one rock-climber, one nurse, and one pastry chef), and they all had slender arms. If you want some tips (clean ones, I promise), post back to the forum.
  • I like the keyboard myself -- I have one sitting in front of me in my cubicle. However, I would not recommend it for his purposes. Pressing the keys on that keyboard takes a bit more force than that of the Dell QuietKey that I'm typing this on, and even this keyboard might be a bit more than what he's looking for.

    They do sound, look, and feel good to me, but my favorite keyboards are still the old IBM PS/2 keyboards. You know the ones.. the ones that felt like they had bed springs under the keys? I loved the feel of them even though the noise they made meant that you couldn't use them at night when other people in the house might be sleeping.
  • So this is something which probably won't help you that much, but back in my university days I ended up working on quite a few keyboards (I'm currently addicted to the Kinesis, because my CTS got bad and my doctor "recommended" that I switch to something like that).

    The lightest touch I ever had was on the ones which Digital was selling with their Personal DECStation and original AlphaStation line. You could barely feel that the key had moved, and there was virtually 0 tactile feedback, the key action was so low. They stopped selling computers which used them a LONG time ago (when they went to a new generation of AlphaStations), and they didn't have standard keyboard attachments (some crazy DEC thing). However, it was the lightest touch ever. And if you wanted (I did) you could set it up to issue a very low click-style-electronic-sound when you hit a key, to get over the "did I really hit that key" effect you have with something like that.

    At one point I was using FreeBSD and SunOS, and I actually would telnet into the machine that I really needed to work on from the alpha box (even though the freebsd box was right next to it) just so that I could use that keyboard. You might be able to pick up a really cheap DECstation or AlphaStation (the really old ones that used the same chassis as the DECstation they replaced) on eBay or something for dirt cheap. Not the fastest machines in the world, but this stuff worked really well.

  • I'm not sure how light is light-touch. Though what I usually do when searching for a keyboard is go to a computer show and try various keyboards out until I find the one that gives the right feedback.
  • You might also consider building forearm strength. If you want some tips (clean ones, I promise), post back to the forum.
    Yes please!
  • Well, a few things first.

    Most people find themselves most comfortable on a mechanical keyswitch. The most common technologies are the ALPS mechanical keyswitches (found on SOME NMB keyboards) or the IBM mechanical keyswitches (OMNIKEY keyboards $$$).

    Per element, mechanical keyswitches cost a lot. Capacitive membranes are the cheapest, and the worst.

    I think the NMB mechanical keyboards are around $50 US - probably the least expensive ALPS keyswitch keyboard out there.

    Darwin Keyboards used to make a split keyboard with ALPS keyswitches that use 75% of the force of the NMB keyboards. Now datadesk carries them.

    <A href-"http://www.pcguide.com/ref/kb/const/switch_C ap.htm">Keyswitch technology review</A>

    <A href-"http://www.datadesktech.com/smartb.htm">C urrent home of Smartboard</A>

  • In my (relatively limited) experience, the best keyboard I've ever used is the keyboard made by SGI that comes with SGI workstations. They use a standard PC-style keyboard cable so you can use them with a PC, but they have a nice, solid, sharp click that is a pleasure to type with. Not to mention they look cool :) One word of advice though: if you get one of these, do NOT remove the space bar for cleaning, because it is impossible to get it back on!
  • I used one of those *things* when I had the old SGI in my cube, but I don't know why you've singled them out... They're no different than JoeMama's 104 key $9 replacement keyboard you can pick up at your local shop.

    And they look cool? They're gray with white buttons. It's just a standard OEM style keyboard.

  • I hand-wired an aftermarket keyboard to my Timex/Sinclair 1000 (Commerically assembled ZX81). I soon learned that there was another reason for the membrane keyboard - I could type faster than the computer could scan the keyboard.

    To try to add something relevant to the original discussion: If I was the original poster, I would go to a used computer store and try out everything they had till I found one I liked.

  • I have to agree with you that Dell QuietKey models absolutely rock. Whatever the OEM keyboard they include with their new GX110 workstations are, they are the best keyboard I've found so far. Nice tactile feel, low noise (which is a must in a multi-person apartment) and typing seems effortless.

    I recently spilled water on mine, so I swiched to a new IBM keyboard for a while, but I made so many typing errors that I never seem to make with the dell keyboard... Guess you just get used to one type of keyboard and always type best on that one =)

  • Background: My first computer keyboard was on a teletype, over 25 years ago, and I've used everything from card punches, DEC (Decwriters, VT05, VT50, VT52, VT100), Lear Siegler(sp?) (ADM3a), IBM (3270, 3278), and a bunch of proprietary terminals for a variety of minicomputers, Atari 800, Commodore 64, a bunch of unices (Sun, HP, SGI), and a bunch of PC keyboards, too. So, I have a little bit of experience. :)

    NOTE: What I liked best was not always what others preferred, and vice versa. (Though, there were some that were universally disliked.) Keyboard preferences can vary widely. I can certainly identify with the poster's desire for a light touch -- that's my preference, too!

    From my experience, the BEST keyboard I've ever used, bar none, was the one that came with an IBM PS2 Model P70. (That was a "portable" PC that weighed 20 pounds and had a gas plasma display and a 386 @ 20 MHz.)

    It had a very light touch but, I NEVER wondered if a keypress actually registered. It had: short key-travel, very light pressure, gentle tactile feedback, and was silent, and comfortable! Unfortunately, the keyboard cable went straight into the computer's case with no connectors at all. :(

    If I could find a keyboard today that matched the old PS2 P70's keyboard, I'd buy several in a heartbeat! They were that good! Do any /.'ers know of any keyboard available today that is comparable?

  • Avoid notebooks like the plague, the ergonomics are a pile of pants.
    However, if the style and lightness of touch appeal to you then try one of the compact keyboards from Sejin (about GBP 35) or from Electrone, especially the MINI-KB (about GBP 80) which fit all PS/2 or mini-din (with an adaptor of course) ports

    Both should be available worldwide.

    Ian

  • Not sure if anyone has posted this one, but use The Happy Hacking Keyboard [pfuca.com]!

    .kb
  • I love old keyboards, they don't make them like they used to. My personal favorite is the old IBM PS/2 Model M. You know, the ones that goes CLICK after every keypress. It's probably the exact opposite of what you need. However, I cannot use it at night becuase the GF says the CLICK keeps her up. SOOOoooo....

    I recommend the old Gateway AnyKey keyboards, you can find them on eBay. They are light and quiet. They also have the advantage of being programable. You can change the keys around, or program macros into a particular key, very helpful for coding or shells. You have to be careful though, Gateway has gone through many styles of keyboards. Be sure to get one with the F-Keys across the top and down the side, the Model # is 2191101-XX-XXX.

    Other options include this keyboard [globalamericaninc.com] from American Global. I know it's made from rack mounts, but it has a good light feel. Oh, and how could I forget the SUN Type 6 [memoryx.net] keyboards, small, light, and with that cool SUN logo. The Type 6 keyboard is probably better than the Gateway as far as touch and feel, but it does have two significant drawbacks: 1) I'm not sure it works on PCs, although it SHOULD. Even if it does, it doesn't support macros/keymaps. 2) the backspace key is in the "wrong" place. Petty I know, but after years of going back and forth from SUN to PC hour by hour, backspace placement gets REAL annoying.

    I should also mention this article [thingy.com] which, along with this one [essortment.com] have made claim that light-touch keyboards are contributing to wrist pain in the first place.
    --
    He had come like a thief in the night,
  • Hi there!

    I sort of agree with the poster who said you really should be able to use a keyboard with more resistance. It's a question of preference, of course, but you shouldn't get any muscular problems from a heavier touch sensitivity, unless you already have them from somewhere else.

    I am a piano player, and my experience is that high resistance can be confortable ... gives you more dynamic control ... but that wouln't be very useful for a keyboard would it? lol, it would be cool with a keyboard where you just punched harder for capital letters.

    Seriously, if you feel adventuresome, you might want to try out a Dvorak keyboard [mwbrooks.com]. They have a different keyboard layout, but are said to be very comfortable to use once you've aquired the knack. All right, so it's a bit eccentric, but if you use your own keyboard most of the time anyway it's worth a look.

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